Saudi prince: Maybe the Palestinians should’ve taken the deals they were offered

[rylah]

You seem to be the only one who does not know that.

Go and look up the "Country" of Palestine before WWI yourself.

Decisions of international and national tribunals
The U.S. State Department Digest of International Law says that the terms of the Treaty of Lausanne provided for the application of the principles of state succession to the "A" Mandates. The Treaty of Versailles (1920) provisionally recognized the former Ottoman communities as independent nations. It also required Germany to recognize the disposition of the former Ottoman territories and to recognize the new states laid down within their boundaries. The Treaty of Lausanne required the newly created states that acquired the territory to pay annuities on the Ottoman public debt, and to assume responsibility for the administration of concessions that had been granted by the Ottomans. A dispute regarding the status of the territories was settled by an Arbitrator appointed by the Council of the League of Nations. It was decided that Palestine and Transjordan were newly created states according to the terms of the applicable post-war treaties. In its Judgment No. 5, The Mavrommatis Palestine Concessions, the Permanent Court of International Justice also decided that Palestine was responsible as the successor state for concessions granted by Ottoman authorities. The Courts of Palestine and Great Britain decided that title to the properties shown on the Ottoman Civil list had been ceded to the government of Palestine as an allied successor state.[25]

State of Palestine: Difference between revisions - Wikipedia

Oh, yeah..... the Treaty you just don't understand.

So I should believe an internet troll over all those posted above? Not!

Believe is the main word here.
I would say even religious about it.

Still no links, huh?

To what dude?

You seem to end up chasing the same tail in every thread.
Forgetting that there's a real world going around You.

Abd al-Hamid (manager of Saudi research center):



"We're to recognize that Jerusalem is a religious symbol of the Jews, and it is sacred to them as Mecca and Medina to Muslims.
Therefore the Arab attitude must free itself from the idea that passed from generation to generation in Christianity and the Political Islam within its 2 streams - Sunni and Shia - an idea that was installed for solely political needs: culture of hatred of Jews and denial of their historic rights in the region.

When we need to argue with the Israeli side in negotiations..."

Interviewer: "Are You saying Palestinians should forget about a capital in East Jerusalem?"

Abd al-Hamid: "I meant that Palestinians, the Arabs and the Arab community, when they managing a negotiation with the Israelis, they must accept the fact, which source is in sacred writings and history of the place: Jews are a part of this region and its history. And the State of Israel is a result of this historic right of the Jews in the region. When we manage the negotiation with this understanding, that the Israeli side is a partner to the history of this region, whether from rulers perspective, the peoples or the cultural aspects this will ease a lot and enable flexibility in order to reach peace."

 

[Billo_Really]

Um. Have you read 242? Where does it delineate an international border between Israel and "Palestine?" (It doesn't).

What it discusses is the relationship between the states in the dispute. Those states were Israel, Jordan and Egypt. The dispute between those states has been resolved in its entirety.

The Arab Palestinians, seeking independence and sovereignty, were not a Party to that resolution in that time. (Though I certainly do not dispute their current claims).

On the contrary, every country in the world agrees with me that the border between Israel and a future Palestine is a matter to be solved only through negotiation. Hence the entire idea of a peace process.

242 is very clear. It tells Israel they have to give up the land they took in war. They know what land they took, well, get the **** off it! You're not going to keep any of it. You can spin this until the cows come home, in the end, you WILL be off that land.

The world didn't allow Hitler to keep Poland and its not going to allow you to annex the West Bank.

So you say every country agrees with you? I'll make it easy on ya. Name one country, just one, that has come out and publicly stated Israel's right to that land. Just one.

 

[USAF 2023]

Um. Have you read 242? Where does it delineate an international border between Israel and "Palestine?" (It doesn't).

What it discusses is the relationship between the states in the dispute. Those states were Israel, Jordan and Egypt. The dispute between those states has been resolved in its entirety.

The Arab Palestinians, seeking independence and sovereignty, were not a Party to that resolution in that time. (Though I certainly do not dispute their current claims).

On the contrary, every country in the world agrees with me that the border between Israel and a future Palestine is a matter to be solved only through negotiation. Hence the entire idea of a peace process.

242 is very clear. It tells Israel they have to give up the land they took in war. They know what land they took, well, get the **** off it! You're not going to keep any of it. You can spin this until the cows come home, in the end, you WILL be off that land.

The world didn't allow Hitler to keep Poland and its not going to allow you to annex the West Bank.

So you say every country agrees with you? I'll make it easy on ya. Name one country, just one, that has come out and publicly stated Israel's right to that land. Just one.

Another stupid ASSHOLE comment. Hitler INITIATED the War. That is the difference . Get. It? Of course not!! “ International Law” is a joke, like YOU!
Please tell us why Egypt blocked the Straits of Tiran, Israel appealed to the U.N. and they did Nothing!
Better yet, tell us why the U.N. left just before the 67 War broke out . If the Arabs had won, does anyone in their right mind believe that land would have been given back? He stated his goal was the destruction of Israel. He also stated that with “ Right of Return” Israel will cease to co exist. **** YOU and the U. N!!!!! What you think ???

 

[toomuchtime_]

A bigot is some one who holds strong opinions that are not based on facts, his posts clearly demonstrate that his opinions are not based on facts, indeed, the show he has no interest in the facts, so calling him a bigot is properly descriptive.

Aside from the links I provide, there are no facts.

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Israel did leave, unfortunately, and the Palestinian terrorists used trees and buildings in what is now the buffer zone to shoot and fire rockets into Israel, necessitating the creation of the buffer zone. As always, the Palestinians create their own problems and then try to blame them on Israel.

 

[toomuchtime_]

It's not a question of disagreeing, you simply have not posted one honest word in this exchange. No ruling was issued by the ICJ or ICC on the Gaza fence or buffer zone. The advisory opinion you are referring to was about the barrier between pre 1967 and Judea and Samaria. The Gaza fence and buffer zone are nowhere near the barrier the ICJ was talking about. Again, you show yourself to be so ignorant tha if you had any personal integrity, you would acknowledge you do not know enough to hold any opinion at all.

It was a ruling and it was issued. You're just too ***** to admit it. Furthermore, 85% of that illegal Iron Curtain, is in the West Bank, which is land Israel DOES NOT OWN!

What would you do if someone tried to build a fence on your front lawn?

It was not a ruling, it was an advisory opinion and it was not about the Gaza fence or buffer zone, it was about the barrier along the "green line" far away from Gaza. Why do you keep repeating these lies?

 

[Shusha]

Um. Have you read 242? Where does it delineate an international border between Israel and "Palestine?" (It doesn't).

What it discusses is the relationship between the states in the dispute. Those states were Israel, Jordan and Egypt. The dispute between those states has been resolved in its entirety.

The Arab Palestinians, seeking independence and sovereignty, were not a Party to that resolution in that time. (Though I certainly do not dispute their current claims).

On the contrary, every country in the world agrees with me that the border between Israel and a future Palestine is a matter to be solved only through negotiation. Hence the entire idea of a peace process.

242 is very clear. It tells Israel they have to give up the land they took in war. They know what land they took, well, get the **** off it! You're not going to keep any of it. You can spin this until the cows come home, in the end, you WILL be off that land.

The world didn't allow Hitler to keep Poland and its not going to allow you to annex the West Bank.

So you say every country agrees with you? I'll make it easy on ya. Name one country, just one, that has come out and publicly stated Israel's right to that land. Just one.

242 is utterly and completely irrelevant today because the States who were Parties to the conflict have resolved the conflict and signed peace treaties which have the effect of law.

There is no legal agreement which creates an international boundary between Israel and "Palestine". (Unless you want to talk Oslo).

You can "spin this" til the cows come home but you will not find any document which creates an international boundary between Israel and "Palestine".

Every county agrees that a peace process must occur to settle the problem. The idea that no negotiations are neede because the conflict has already been resolved is absurd. No country agrees with this. (Not that international law is a popularity contest, btw)

 

[Markle]

A bigot is some one who holds strong opinions that are not based on facts, his posts clearly demonstrate that his opinions are not based on facts, indeed, the show he has no interest in the facts, so calling him a bigot is properly descriptive.

Aside from the links I provide, there are no facts.

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

 

[P F Tinmore]

Aside from the links I provide, there are no facts.

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

 

[P F Tinmore]

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

 

[Markle]

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

Why did terrorist Yasser Arafat walk away from the deal brokered by President Bill Clinton giving Palestine 95% of what they demanded?

 

[USAF 2023]

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

Israel withdrew from Gaza in 2005. In 2006 1247 Rockets and 48 Mortars we’re fired into Israel. They are not under any obligation to give up more land while being fired upon. Look it up.

 

[USAF 2023]

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

Why did terrorist Yasser Arafat walk away from the deal brokered by President Bill Clinton giving Palestine 95% of what they demanded?

For the same reason Abbas rejected Olmert’s plan

 

[danielpalos]

Saudi prince: Maybe the Palestinians should've taken the deals they were offered
Ed MorrisseyPosted at 12:01 pm on April 30, 2018
Or maybe they should stop sucking up to Iran. That’s the real subtext of the surprising rhetoric coming from Mohammed bin Salman, the young crown prince of Saudi Arabia who’s rewriting the Middle East script after seizing power in a family feud last year. Barak Ravid reports for Axios that MBS, as he’s colloquially known, told representatives of Jewish groups last month that while Saudi Arabia still wants a just and lasting settlement for the Palestinians, they could have gotten that themselves.

Now, MBS says, it’s time to make a deal or “shut up and stop complaining”:


According to my sources, the Saudi Crown Prince told the Jewish leaders:

“In the last several decades the Palestinian leadership has missed one opportunity after the other and rejected all the peace proposals it was given. It is about time the Palestinians take the proposals and agree to come to the negotiations table or shut up and stop complaining.”

MBS also made two other points on the Palestinian issue during the meeting:

1. He made clear the Palestinian issue was not a top priority for the Saudi government or Saudi public opinion. MBS said Saudi Arabia “has much more urgent and important issues to deal with” like confronting Iran’s influence in the region.
2. Regardless of all his criticism of the Palestinian leadership, MBS also made clear that in order for Saudi Arabia and other Gulf states to normalize relations with Israel there will have to be significant progress on the Israeli-Palestinian peace process.

Under MBS’ leadership since taking effective power in June 2017, Saudi Arabia has aligned itself far more with the West. Decrees from the royal palace are now allowing women to drive and to dress in something other than black abayas and niqabs while in public. MBS has opened cinemas in Saudi Arabia for the first time in decades. He’s either cleaning up corruption or purging dissidents and hardliners, but either way MBS is making sure that he directs public policy for Saudi Arabia for the next several decades, and directs it to come closer to the West.

The main intention of all this appears to be an effort to isolate Iran, which has become an existential threat to Sunni power in the region. Our invasion and then abandonment of Iraq didn’t help in that effort, which is why even the previous crown prince took a distinctly cool approach to Barack Obama at the end of his presidency. MBS knows that he’ll have to modernize in order to make Western nations comfortable with any partnership for the region, and that the glut on oil markets means that the Saudis can’t simply use energy as leverage any more.

Unfortunately for the Palestinians, they’ve been playing footsie with Tehran more than Riyadh, and now they’re going to pay for it. Choosing sides has consequences, and with the stakes as high as they are now, the Saudis see the Palestinians as dispensable. They’d rather ally openly with Israel to keep Iran at bay, and the best way to do that is for the Palestinians to take a deal and get on with their lives.

Unfortunately again for the Palestinians, they still can’t decide what they want, or even how to discuss it:

A powerful but rarely convened assembly that calls itself the Palestinian “supreme authority” meets for the first time in 22 years on Monday, but boycotts and rifts suggest it will struggle to achieve its stated goal of unity against Israel and the United States.

President Mahmoud Abbas is expected to use the four-day Palestinian National Council (PNC) meeting to renew his legitimacy and to install loyalists in powerful positions to begin shaping his legacy.

Abbas has billed the meeting of the Palestinian National Council (PNC), the de facto parliament of the Palestinian Liberation Organization, as a chance to establish a united front against Israel and the United States, after President Donald Trump’s recognition of Jerusalem as Israel’s capital.

The hardline Islamists in Hamas and Islamic Jihad, both of which are aligned with Iran, have boycotted the event, ostensibly because its West Bank location puts them at risk of arrest by Israel. But Reuters notes that three factions of the PLO are also boycotting, in part because they believe Abbas hasn’t been open enough to working with IJ or Hamas. The event is seen as an anachronism by other Palestinians, a desperate attempt by Abbas to emphasize his legitimacy as the Palestinian Authority leader while being largely ignored by all sides.

The Saudis have had enough. Perhaps Abbas should take MBS’ advice and cut a deal while he still can.

Anyone want to, "sponsor" a Dey? It seems, this is a delicate operation, concerning peace in Palestine.

 

[toomuchtime_]

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

It appears you made it up.

 

[skye]

I agree with the Saudi Prince

Palestinians should have taken the deals they were offered.

End of story.

 

[Kondor3]

This was Saudi Arabia's way of saying: "Phukk the goddamned Palestinians... we've wasted enough time on them already."

 

[P F Tinmore]

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

It appears you made it up.

The Palestinian people were among the few peoples in the world that the United Nations had recognized as being entitled to use all means necessary to achieve their self-determination.

Human Rights Council adopts resolution calling for cessation of Israeli mlitary attacks in OPT and of firing of crude rockets - Human Rights Council 7th Session (6 March, pm session) - Press release (excerpts) (10 March 2008)

 

[toomuchtime_]

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

In fact, there is nos such right. You just like the Idea of killing Jews and you think everyone should have the right to kill some Jews.

It appears you did not look it up.

It appears you made it up.

The Palestinian people were among the few peoples in the world that the United Nations had recognized as being entitled to use all means necessary to achieve their self-determination.

Human Rights Council adopts resolution calling for cessation of Israeli mlitary attacks in OPT and of firing of crude rockets - Human Rights Council 7th Session (6 March, pm session) - Press release (excerpts) (10 March 2008)

The UN Human Rights Council has no authority to bestow rights on anyone. It's complete function is to produce propaganda statements, mostly about Israel, that no one pays attention to. To the extent there is any international law, it is determined by the Geneva Conventions and the Rome Statute.

All that said, the fact is, you're lying. The resolution does not say the Palestinians are entitled to use all rights necessary to fight against Israel. Even the clowns on the Human Rights Council are not that crazy.

 

[rylah]

Including the links you provide, you present no facts. For example, you claim the ICC ruled that the buffer zone is not under Israeli jurisdiction and then provide a link that the ICJ made such a ruling and then lie and claim the ICJ and the ICC are the same organization. On top of that you demonstrate how utterly ignorant you are of the all the facts, since the ICJ made no such ruling but offered an advisory opinion on the barrier between Judea and Samaria and pre 1967 Israel and not on the Gaza fence or buffer zone.

The buffer zone is territory in Gaza controlled by Israel after they lied about leaving.

Link?

Where does Israel get its "right" to shoot Palestinians on Gaza land?

Where do Palestinians get the "right" to send, train and pay suicide bombers and launch rockets into Israel?

The Palestinians have the right to resist occupation by all means necessary.

Look it up.

No they don't.

But if You choose so - then it works both ways.
And if so - then Your team has whole countries under the rule of their families', don't forget for a moment that this is common knowledge in the middle east, even admitted by Hamas:

Tribes of Arabia Tamimi tribe

"Hamas and PA leaders with al-Thani Tamimi Emir of Qatar"

The tribe of Banu Tamim (Arabic: بـنـو تـمـيـم‎) or Bani Tamim (Arabic: بـني تـمـيـم‎) is one of the main tribes of Arabia.

Today, descendants from the tribe live in the Arabian Peninsula and neighboring countries such as Saudi Arabia,[1][2] India, Iraq, Kuwait, Jordan, Syria, Qatar, Oman, Yemen, Bahrain, United Arab Emirates, Iran, Lebanon and Palestine. The word Tamim in Arabic means strong and solid. It can also mean perfection.[3]

Dynasties[edit]

• The Aghlabid dynasty
• The Al Thani, ruling family of Qatar. (See House of Thani)
• The Al ash-Sheikh family of the Grand Muftis of the Emirate of Diriyah, then the Emirate of Najd and now modern day Saudi Arabia (Religious Dynasty).
• Al Khater – a prestigious family of the middle east based primarily in Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and Bahrain

PA chief Abbas: Hamas leader Mashaal is a liar
Qatar coordinated payment of salaries with Israel, PA

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Again - Arabs initially tried to cede the land and control to an Emir from Arabia,
You have no reason to complain about it when it goes that way.