francoHFW
Diamond Member
ACA includes them too. Transparent competition in exchanges, standards they have to follow, guarantees, annual caps, coverage. ACA is the whole system, dupe.
RWs, how do we fix our shitty healthcare system?
- Thread starter Billy000
- Start date
francoHFW
Diamond Member
Now we do- except in many Red states and areas. Before, so many falling between the cracks. Pre-existing people, poor workers, people cut off by scam GOP plans etc etc.
Maryland Patriot
Gold Member
- Jun 10, 2015
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you do understand that the insurance and medical industries were never government right? you keep referring to the superior system as a GOP plan, just not sure you understand that
Clementine
Platinum Member
- Dec 18, 2011
- 12,919
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Obamacare is falling apart, as designed. No one likes it. No one was supposed to really like it because it was designed to fail so they could go to single payer. No point in defending Obam
Obamacare was designed to fail and it is failing big time. Useless to defend it since it was merely a stepping stone to single payer.
The health care system is messed up because of government. They've been making the rules and they made rules that favored big pharms and shut out competition. Auto insurance, home insurance and others were allowed to compete across state lines and it resulted in lower prices with more benefits. Government kept a tight reign on health insurers, tied them to employers, didn't allow competition and over the year, health insurance has had to cover every tiny thing. No one wanted to pay for an aspirin tablet. People bitched about copays. Big pharms and medical suppliers started charging outrageous prices because insurance had to pay.
Insurance companies were vilified when it was actually government regulations and big pharms responsible for the worst problems.
Maryland Patriot
Gold Member
- Jun 10, 2015
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What part of people that provide for themselves do not want anything to do with the ACA do you have a hard time following.
Before the ACA, everything worked just fine. Good care, reasonable premiums, not deductibles, low co-pay.
People want nothing to do with the ACA. Im responsible and dont need the government to care for me.
Arianrhod
Gold Member
- Jul 24, 2015
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healthmyths
Diamond Member
- Sep 19, 2011
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NOT one refutation of the FACT that there were less then 4 million people that truly wanted and needed coverage!
10 million not citizens. 14 million all need to do is register with Medicaid. Covered. 18 million didn't want or need as under 34 make over $50k.
Leaves 4 million!
Why are you so in favor of lawyers making billions off of frivolous lawsuits that cause doctors to have to practice defensive medicine that costs $850 billion a year?
You are too dumb to be a lawyer. So why are you protecting them when 10% of their revenue would provide all the health insurance for the truly 4 million that need it?
Why are you against taxing lawyers to help those that need it???
Where is your compassion? More importantly cut the $850 billion down by say $250 billion means insurance companies have to present lower premiums to state
regulators to get them passed. Geez are you that dumb not to understand that insurance companies simply pass on claim costs? Cut the costs of premiums and you cut the lower costs of insurance. Are you against that?
- Moderator
- #88
I can sum it up easily:
Get government out
Get government out
- Thread starter
- #89
Oh really? And why would prices fall on their own?
francoHFW
Diamond Member
18% of GDP, 45k dead/year, millions with pre-existing unable to get insurance, millions forced to quit work to go on welfare to get Medicaid, businesses giving up on care because of cost, 500k people WITH (CRAP) insurance going bankrupt/year. Check out the world beyond the end of your nose sometime.
the_human_being
Gold Member
- Sep 8, 2014
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I'm 72 years old and I have had major medical insurance coverage since I was eighteen years of age except for my stint in the Army. I've never had a problem.
beagle9
Diamond Member
- Nov 28, 2011
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A true story... My daughters husband to be, developed a cist on his butt... He has no insurance because he just transfered his job to a manufacturer job from his construction job. He is a temp and can't afford healthcare insurance yet or he isn't offered healthcare as a temp in the situation. Not sure what the deal is, but here is what this guy just went through because of his unfortunate circumstances. He first went to a medical practice where they charged him for the visit, gave him some medicine that done no good, charged him $ 145.00 for the visit and meds, and then told him the cist was two hard to cut at this time. Then he went at 1:30 in the morning after he got off work, to a small hospital where they admitted him with the infected cist. At 3:00 in the morning they cut this cist out, but used minimal services to help in the process. They couldn't numb the cist deep enough, and didn't give him any oral medicine to counter the situation. They proceeded to cut the cist out while my son&law grip the rails of the bed like an old Western movie. My daughter thinks he got a basically raw treatment because he didn't have the insurance needed to cover better services than what he got... My daughter said she had a similar thing done at the same hospital, and they gave her morphine in an iv before they cut her. He is going back as we speak to get the packing changed out, but is a bit worried about how that will go. He called another local hospital to see if he could go there instead, but they told him it was super busy, and the wait would be very long. This guy is one of the hardest workers I know, and he ain't no dependent government entitlement eating citizen, but rather he is a hard worker in an unfair system where just because he changed job's leaving him without insurance, then he is seen as a bum by these service providers? He is taken advantage of by the providers or was given less than quality healthcare because of his status in life ?
- Thread starter
- #94
Your anecdotal story does nothing to disprove the statistics of our healthcare system
healthmyths
Diamond Member
- Sep 19, 2011
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ONLY if claim costs go down! And the reason if you knew anything about health insurance is that each year insurance companies have to be approved to sell insurance in each state. Insurance premiums are regulated.
If the state regulators see any insurance premiums claims to premiums ratio going down, in other words say the Claims for Insurance Co A for 2014 were
$800,000 that would be 80% of the the premiums i.e. $1 million.
BUT if the claims went down to $600,000 that would be 60%. The state regulators would say...wait a minute... your claim costs going down but you are still charging
$1 million. Give us a good reason we should approve the $1 million when you really could have premiums of $800,000?
That's what most people don't understand. States regulate premiums and based on how much the insurance companies' claims are is what the premiums will be!
So if lawyers saw their revenue reduced by 10% (of which at their current gross is $270 Billion) and that $27 billion paid for the 4 million uninsured.. believe me
as it has been proven "Defensive Medicine" costs would go down!
Again read the facts:
The 1946 Tort Act forbids lawsuits against doctors that are under federal contract!
FACTS as doctors who attest to this:
http://www.jacksonhealthcare.com/media/8968/defensivemedicine_ebook_final.pdf
90% of physicians surveyed say they order $850 billion a year in wasted duplicate tests, referrals all out of FEAR of being SUED!
--- Emergency medicine, primary care, and OB/GYN physicians are most likely to practice defensive medicine.
--- 79 to 83% of surgeons and OB/GYNs have been named in lawsuits.
"Physicians contracted by the federal government practice significantly less defensive medicine as they are protected against lawsuits by the
1946 Federal Tort Claims Act. "
-- BUT........Only 48% practice defensive medicine compared to 92% of non-government physicians.
Consider that fact that of the physicians interviewed 52% DID NOT practice defensive medicine!
Who were they? Doctors contracted by federal government!
WHY did these doctors NOT practice "defensive medicine"??? 1946 Tort reform!
healthmyths
Diamond Member
- Sep 19, 2011
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NOT one of your statements is true!
More importantly where did you get your information? NOT ONE link that I can verify but just your guesses!!!
David Himmelstein and colleagues recently contended that medical problems contribute to 54.5 percent of personal bankruptcies and threaten the solvency of solidly middle-class Americans. They propose comprehensive national health insurance as a solution. A reexamination of their data suggests that medical bills are a contributing factor in just 17 percent of personal bankruptcies and that those affected tend to have incomes closer to poverty level than to middle class. Moreover, for national health insurance to have an impact, it would have to define “medical” expenses in a much broader way than is now typical of either private or government-funded plans.
This response to a widely cited paper by David Himmelstein and colleagues challenges the basis of its conclusions.
The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie—deliberate, contrived and dishonest—but the myth: persistent, persuasive and unrealistic.—President John F. Kennedy, Commencement Address at Yale University, 11 June 1962.
Medical Bankruptcy: Myth Versus Fact
There has been some criticism of the study, along with reports that have echoed, and others that have contradicted, the Harvard findings.
Gail Heriot, a law professor at the University of San Diego, took issue with the relatively low level of out-of-pocket costs that could qualify as a cause of a "major medical bankruptcy." In February 2005, she wrote for the National Review:
Heriot: Buried in the study is the fact that only 27 percent of the surveyed debtors had unreimbursed medical expenses exceeding $1,000 over the course of the two years prior to their bankruptcy. … Nobody likes to pay $1,000 in medical expenses even when they get two years to do it in, but for most Americans (particularly those with enough at stake to seek the protection of bankruptcy) it is not catastrophic.
In fact, the study said that the out-of-pocket costs cited by those interviewed were "often below levels that are commonly labeled catastrophic." The authors hypothesized that other related factors, such as the loss of a job, helped push families into bankruptcy: "Presumably, such costs were often ruinous because of concomitant income loss or because the need for costly care persisted over several years."
The No-Nonsense Truth About Medical Bankruptcy | GiveForward
healthmyths
Diamond Member
- Sep 19, 2011
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March 2015 Bankruptcy Filings Down 12 Percent
17% of non-business bankruptcies or 170,000 due to Health care costs.
Again... cut the wasteful spending of $850 billion a year due to doctors fearful of be sued by 30% and you save $250 billion.
Save $250 billion a year means lower insurance premiums. Lower premiums mean more savings to everyone...except lawyers whose 10% tax would pay the
premium of 4 million people that truly need health insurance!!!
Problem solved!
17% of non-business bankruptcies or 170,000 due to Health care costs.
Again... cut the wasteful spending of $850 billion a year due to doctors fearful of be sued by 30% and you save $250 billion.
Save $250 billion a year means lower insurance premiums. Lower premiums mean more savings to everyone...except lawyers whose 10% tax would pay the
premium of 4 million people that truly need health insurance!!!
Problem solved!
Maryland Patriot
Gold Member
- Jun 10, 2015
- 9,966
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I can see past beyond the end of my nose, Know what I see lately? My earned income flying away to some ungrateful piece of crap that doesnt deserve shit.
If you dont plan properly in life and you dont have insurance, Im sorry about your luck when you get sick, my family is taken care of. I suggest others do the same.
Or, those that think its ok for someone to leach off of your income should just go ahead and write a big check to cover those families.
If Im already paying to keep my family from mooching off of the public, why should I have to contribute to keep some street hooker and her 10 illegitimate kids or the corner crack dealer alive.
the_human_being
Gold Member
- Sep 8, 2014
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I could care less. I have insurance.
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