Russian provocation, lets see what Obama does if Russia moves

[JakeStarkey]

Chamberlain said exactly the same about the Sudetenland.

Derative false analogy. (1) Putin is not Hitler. (2) Ukraine is not Sudentenland. (3) Russia and Ukraine do not affect our national security.

1. No one said he was.
2. No one claimed it was
3. Austria and Poland didn't effect our national security either, until Hitler declared war on us.

The analogy is spot on. The same situation is happening in the exact same way.

Putin will go into the Ukraine. He will go into Georgia. He will keep going until suddenly we are in another war to end all wars.

Nonsense, Avatar, that is exactly what TR was implying.

There is no accurate analogy.

We are in a different world completely. Ukraine has been in Russia's sphere of influence for centuries.

Geo-hubris to suggest that we can do anything more than economic sanctions, if that.

 

[The Rabbi]

I disagree.
Obama will wag his finger scoldingly and declare he "means it" and he will draw a red line for Russian behavior. When the RUssians cross that red line he will declare someone else must have done that.
The most incompetent president in history faces probably the most competent Russian leader since Peter the Great. The world will be laughing at us for years.

Aaannd, did I call it or what? The most predictably incompetent president in history. The Kremlin is laughing its drunken ass off at that clown.
Obama warns Russia of 'costs' for any Ukraine intervention

What did you call?

That Obama would wag his tongue and Putin would laugh in his face.
I see from the news tonight I continue to be correct. Obama warned of consequences. Let's see what he does now that RUssian has sent troops. Again, I think he will wag his finger some more and then call for a UN meeting to denounce the move.
Most. Incompetent. President. Ever.

 

[percysunshine]

Derative false analogy. (1) Putin is not Hitler. (2) Ukraine is not Sudentenland. (3) Russia and Ukraine do not affect our national security.

1. No one said he was.
2. No one claimed it was
3. Austria and Poland didn't effect our national security either, until Hitler declared war on us.

The analogy is spot on. The same situation is happening in the exact same way.

Putin will go into the Ukraine. He will go into Georgia. He will keep going until suddenly we are in another war to end all wars.

Nonsense, Avatar, that is exactly what TR was implying.

There is no accurate analogy.

We are in a different world completely. Ukraine has been in Russia's sphere of influence for centuries.

.

Oops.....third party geopolitics;

"The reference to this claim is the “Küçük Kaynarca” (Karlowitz I) signed 230 years ago. As per this agreement, signed by the Russian Tsarina Catherine II on April 19, 1783, the Crimean Peninsula was taken away from the dominion of the Ottomans and handed over to Russia. However, one of the most important provisions of this treaty was the debarment of independence for the Peninsula and outlawing its submission to a third party: Should any such attempt be made, then Crimea would automatically have to be returned to the sovereignty of Turkey."

http://english.alarabiya.net/en/vie...ey-caught-in-the-Russia-Crimea-snowstorm.html

 

[usmcstinger]

Cutting back our military to Pre WWII levels only will encourage Putin will do whatever he wants. Our Commander and Chief makes only vail threats.

The Russian Economy is not in great shape. President Reagan made the the Soviets increase there military spending. Freezing their assets and getting NATO to reduce trade with them could very well put them in a "hurt locker" this time.

 

[Indofred]

Armed men seize government building in Ukraine's Crimea-Interfax

Russia claims to be worried about Crimea. By supporting Russian separatists that seize the Buildings, if the Ukraine reacts as expected with force, the Russians can claim they must act to protect Russians.

We will see what Obama and Kerry do now. They both warned Russia not to violate the Ukraine's territory.

You realise there was a coup, don't you.
It could be claimed, the "separatists" are really loyalists, protecting their rights from coup leaders who removed the democratically elected government.

I thought the U.S. was pro democracy - you should be supporting Russia in this matter.

 

[Kondor3]

If our esteemed Muslim colleague from Indonesia wants us to back Russia, then I'm sure we're on the right track, in opposing Russian intervention in the Ukraine...

 

[Avatar4321]

Derative false analogy. (1) Putin is not Hitler. (2) Ukraine is not Sudentenland. (3) Russia and Ukraine do not affect our national security.

1. No one said he was.
2. No one claimed it was
3. Austria and Poland didn't effect our national security either, until Hitler declared war on us.

The analogy is spot on. The same situation is happening in the exact same way.

Putin will go into the Ukraine. He will go into Georgia. He will keep going until suddenly we are in another war to end all wars.

Nonsense, Avatar, that is exactly what TR was implying.

There is no accurate analogy.

We are in a different world completely. Ukraine has been in Russia's sphere of influence for centuries.

Geo-hubris to suggest that we can do anything more than economic sanctions, if that.

For being a completely different world, things seem to be happening exactly the same way.

 

[Geaux4it]

You know its getting bad when CNN spends the day talking about Obama being a paper tiger

Good times

-Geaux

 

[Indeependent]

You know its getting bad when CNN spends the day talking about Obama being a paper tiger

Good times

-Geaux

I guess CNN is as hungry for a war as any other news outlet.

 

[Geaux4it]

You know its getting bad when CNN spends the day talking about Obama being a paper tiger

Good times

-Geaux

I guess CNN is as hungry for a war as any other news outlet.

I see it differently.. They have been pointing out Obama's ineptness as it pertains to foreign policy.

-Geaux

 

[Animus]

I'll be the first person to say that Europe needs to settle it's own mess and that we don't have the $$$$ to fight another war, let alone a potential mass war. But man is Obama pissing me off here. He needs to stop issuing "stern warnings" that he has no intentions and/or means of enforcing. What's next, North Korea threatens to invade SK and he issues another "Red Line". Come on Obama, I'm all for diplomacy and even sanctions, but you're playing checkers while the rest of the world is playing chess.

 

[Decus]

Friggin Yanukovych bled the Ukraine dry as one of the most corrupt politicians in history. This was a problem for Ukrainians who couldn't see a future for their country and the only option was to kick Yanukovych out. The US and EU were minor players. The real problem was the massive corruption and Yanukovych having bankrupted the Ukraine.

.

 

[Decus]

I do believe that this is the EU's problem to fix and not the US. Part of this problem goes back to the creation of Kosovo and the creation of an independent territory without agreement from the sovereign nation it was drawn from. Russia in fact used Kosovo to justify its actions in Georgia and is now using the same excuse for the Crimea.
.

 

[Eugene]

In fact this problem can be easyly and fairly solved by Russia if US and EU do not interfere.
Russian army in blue helmets with UN mandat can finish that political collapse with minimum victims. It will eliminate terroristic facist organisation Right Sector and organise (under EU&US monitoring) fair clear election and referendum.

But EU&US will never allow Russia to do that as they wish to tear Ukraine away from Russia and they know that the majority of people in Ukraine do not want to go to EU. So EU&US will never agree for such kind of risk, they will act for sure - war in Ukraine and blaming Russia.

 

[Decus]

In fact this problem can be easyly and fairly solved by Russia if US and EU do not interfere.
Russian army in blue helmets with UN mandat can finish that political collapse with minimum victims. It will eliminate terroristic facist organisation Right Sector and organise (under EU&US monitoring) fair clear election and referendum.

But EU&US will never allow Russia to do that as they wish to tear Ukraine away from Russia and they know that the majority of people in Ukraine do not want to go to EU. So EU&US will never agree for such kind of risk, they will act for sure - war in Ukraine and blaming Russia.

Too funny. Elections in the Ukraine on May 25th were announced a few days ago. Who is afraid of new elections? Certainly not Ukrainians.

 

[JWBooth]

In fact this problem can be easyly and fairly solved by Russia if US and EU do not interfere.
Russian army in blue helmets with UN mandat can finish that political collapse with minimum victims. It will eliminate terroristic facist organisation Right Sector and organise (under EU&US monitoring) fair clear election and referendum.

But EU&US will never allow Russia to do that as they wish to tear Ukraine away from Russia and they know that the majority of people in Ukraine do not want to go to EU. So EU&US will never agree for such kind of risk, they will act for sure - war in Ukraine and blaming Russia.

Too funny. Elections in the Ukraine on May 25th were announced a few days ago. Who is afraid of new elections? Certainly not Ukrainians.

Elections are meaningless when the results can be overturned by mob action.

 

[Decus]

In fact this problem can be easyly and fairly solved by Russia if US and EU do not interfere.
Russian army in blue helmets with UN mandat can finish that political collapse with minimum victims. It will eliminate terroristic facist organisation Right Sector and organise (under EU&US monitoring) fair clear election and referendum.

But EU&US will never allow Russia to do that as they wish to tear Ukraine away from Russia and they know that the majority of people in Ukraine do not want to go to EU. So EU&US will never agree for such kind of risk, they will act for sure - war in Ukraine and blaming Russia.

Too funny. Elections in the Ukraine on May 25th were announced a few days ago. Who is afraid of new elections? Certainly not Ukrainians.

Elections are meaningless when the results can be overturned by mob action.

Mob rule was not the impetus behind the protests. Massive corruption was. The Ukraine has been drained of its wealth by Yankovych and faced the prospect of being indebted to the Russians. They had enough of the theft and didn't want to owe a loan shark. Seems normal.

.

 

[Eugene]

Elections in May is nonsense!
Reasons are:
1. Ukraine today is separated and it is impossible to elect 1 candidate who would satisfy both sides.
2. Ukranian people do not feel themselves free to express their opinion.
3. Pro-western politics control almost everything and do not allow other opinion to be said on TV, written in newspapers...
4. South-Eastern regions of the country do not obbey to interim government.

First country should become calm and stabile evrywhere.
Than it should be federalised in 3 states so that each could regulate its own policy in both political and economical affairs (taxes, police, customs, budget).
Only after that it would be possible to talk about elections of real president and well-balanced government.

 

[Decus]

Here is a Swedish economist's view of corruption under Yankovych's presidency:

"For the past four years Mr Yanukovich’s sole ambition has been to enrich his family and cronies. A reasonable estimate of the family’s wealth is $12bn."

"Since 2010, government procurement has been infested with corruption. Mr Yanukovich handed contracts to his family and cronies on ludicrously favourable terms, paying approximately twice the market price. Competitive public procurement must be introduced."

Ukraine can now fix its economy ? if it moves fast - FT.com

What would we do in the US if our president emptied Fort Knox of its gold for his personal use? Would we protest???

.

 

[Decus]

Elections in May is nonsense!
Reasons are:
1. Ukraine today is separated and it is impossible to elect 1 candidate who would satisfy both sides.
2. Ukranian people do not feel themselves free to express their opinion.
3. Pro-western politics control almost everything and do not allow other opinion to be said on TV, written in newspapers...
4. South-Eastern regions of the country do not obbey to interim government.

First country should become calm and stabile evrywhere.
Than it should be federalised in 3 states so that each could regulate its own policy in both political and economical affairs (taxes, police, customs, budget).
Only after that it would be possible to talk about elections of real president and well-balanced government.

I can understand that being pro-Russian leaves you with the difficult task of trying to defend Yanukovych's horribly corrupt regime. All you can do is try to spin the truth. I am sorry for you.

.