percysunshine
Diamond Member
As the body count goes up, just keep telling yourself that.
Russian provocation, lets see what Obama does if Russia moves
- Thread starter RetiredGySgt
- Start date
As the body count goes up, just keep telling yourself that.
Sunshine
Trust the pie.
- Dec 17, 2009
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Particularly now that they have a stronger, economically and militarily viable China to whom we currently owe our very asses on their side.
Kondor3
Cafeteria Centrist
Yeah, you're probably right. I mean, it would have been nice to have the Ukraine as a big-ass buffer-state, friendly to the West, and eventually integrated into the European Union, NATO, etc., to ensure for generations to come that Russia could not threaten and absorb and pseudo-enslave eastern (or all?) of Europe, and it would have been nice to have had the foresight to help the Ukraine avoid its usurpation and subversion by more directly engaging with it on the political and economic fronts, and it would have been nice to manifest some better sort of backbone as a response to this invasion of a potentially friendly and highly valuable partner on the world stage, but... what the hell... nothing that actually matters, I guess.
To be very honest, at this juncture, I don't know what we CAN do, of a positive nature, given that we're already beset with this advance state of affairs and developments, but I don't think what we're doing now is either adequate nor wise, and, armchair-quarterbacking, we've probably made a great many stupid mistakes and omissions in our dealings with that (now ) beleaguered and sad people.
percysunshine
Diamond Member
And, of course, our vaunted intelligence services saw this one coming a mile away....
"American intelligence has concluded that Russia won't openly invade Ukraine, despite a massive military exercise on the border and the armed takeover of local airports.
U.S. intelligence estimates conclude that Russia has no intention of invading Ukraine. This, despite the launch of a massive, new Russian military exercise near Ukraine’s border and moves from armed men to seize two key airports in the country's Crimea region....The assessment is based in part on the fact that not enough medical units have been ordered to accompany the Russian troops to the Ukrainian border to suggest preparation for war, according to one Congressional staffer who has seen intelligence on Russia. This source also said no signal intercepts have detected plans for an invasion.
On Thursday, Secretary of State John Kerry acknowledged that he had been assured in conversations with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov that Russia respected the territorial integrity of Ukraine.'
Putin?s Bluff? U.S. Spies Say Russia Won't Invade Ukraine - The Daily Beast
"American intelligence has concluded that Russia won't openly invade Ukraine, despite a massive military exercise on the border and the armed takeover of local airports.
U.S. intelligence estimates conclude that Russia has no intention of invading Ukraine. This, despite the launch of a massive, new Russian military exercise near Ukraine’s border and moves from armed men to seize two key airports in the country's Crimea region....The assessment is based in part on the fact that not enough medical units have been ordered to accompany the Russian troops to the Ukrainian border to suggest preparation for war, according to one Congressional staffer who has seen intelligence on Russia. This source also said no signal intercepts have detected plans for an invasion.
On Thursday, Secretary of State John Kerry acknowledged that he had been assured in conversations with Russian Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov that Russia respected the territorial integrity of Ukraine.'
Putin?s Bluff? U.S. Spies Say Russia Won't Invade Ukraine - The Daily Beast
percysunshine
Diamond Member
Yep ... much ado about nothing.
HenryBHough
Diamond Member
Which will be more tempting?
Start World War III and resolve the unemployment problem/get the economy in gear?
A golf course in Hawaii?
Start World War III and resolve the unemployment problem/get the economy in gear?
A golf course in Hawaii?
Trajan
conscientia mille testes
Admin officials tell CNN's Barbara Starr this is an "uncontested arrival" not necessarily "an invasion" and that this distinction is "key."
2:13 PM - 28 Feb 2014
not as catchy as "overseas contingency operations", but they'll work on it I am sure.
heres the thing, the Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych was elected with 53% of the vote in a closely watched/internationally monitored election, pronounced by one and all as the cleanest election in any former soviet republic.
So, no matter what side you come down on, the protestors or Yanukovychs, his being chased from office was a coup, which begs the question- why is Obama spptting this?
Ponder this; Putin is taking actions to secure Russian citizens in an area of a country (58% Russian) which is in upheaval, obama is sppting an overthrow, those are the facts. As far as Putin trying to bribe Ukraine to not take a EU deal etc. so what,? We have done it, we do it , we use money and trade deals as leverage all the time.
percysunshine
Diamond Member
Admin officials tell CNN's Barbara Starr this is an "uncontested arrival" not necessarily "an invasion" and that this distinction is "key."
2:13 PM - 28 Feb 2014
not as catchy as "overseas contingency operations", but they'll work on it I am sure.
heres the thing, the Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych was elected with 53% of the vote in a closely watched/internationally monitored election, pronounced by one and all as the cleanest election in any former soviet republic.
So, no matter what side you come down on, the protestors or Yanukovychs, his being chased from office was a coup, which begs the question- why is Obama spptting this?
Ponder this; Putin is taking actions to secure Russian citizens in an area of a country (58% Russian) which is in upheaval, obama is sppting an overthrow, those are the facts. As far as Putin trying to bribe Ukraine to not take a EU deal etc. so what,? We have done it, we do it , we use money and trade deals as leverage all the time.
Obama is not supporting anything. Not really.
Putins claim of ethnicity trumping sovereignty is convenient for the Ukraine, but not so much for the Caucasus.
JWBooth
Diamond Member
I'd vote for the war if only keyboard warriors were hunted down and made to go first.
JWBooth
Diamond Member
No problem, so long as there are no US troops in that body count.
HenryBHough
Diamond Member
Without consulting Reverend Wright?
But wait....there's MORE!
Today it's being discussed that Your New Messiah may cancel His planned trip to Russia in retaliation for the moves in Ukraine.
Wow!
He couldn't find His way to Russia to show support for U.S. Olympics athletes; left that to Russian President Putin. How could He possibly find it in Himself to do it now? No, best He just leave all that to someone competent.
Now if Ukraine had a really nice golf course might it all turn out differently?
Probably.
Last edited:
Kondor3
Cafeteria Centrist
Fair enough.
Old Drill Sergeant wisdom says: Never ask your people to do anything you can't or won't do yourself - and better, preferably.
Trajan
conscientia mille testes
Admin officials tell CNN's Barbara Starr this is an "uncontested arrival" not necessarily "an invasion" and that this distinction is "key."
2:13 PM - 28 Feb 2014
not as catchy as "overseas contingency operations", but they'll work on it I am sure.
heres the thing, the Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych was elected with 53% of the vote in a closely watched/internationally monitored election, pronounced by one and all as the cleanest election in any former soviet republic.
So, no matter what side you come down on, the protestors or Yanukovychs, his being chased from office was a coup, which begs the question- why is Obama spptting this?
Ponder this; Putin is taking actions to secure Russian citizens in an area of a country (58% Russian) which is in upheaval, obama is sppting an overthrow, those are the facts. As far as Putin trying to bribe Ukraine to not take a EU deal etc. so what,? We have done it, we do it , we use money and trade deals as leverage all the time.
Obama is not supporting anything. Not really.
Putins claim of ethnicity trumping sovereignty is convenient for the Ukraine, but not so much for the Caucasus.
We supported EU sweetening the deal and the IMF's stepping up inducements to lure Ukraine into the EU orbit, he warned Yanukovych not to use force and go along with the opposition who were rioting in obection to a deal Yanukovych would sign with Russia.
I have not heard obama denounce the forced change of gov. anywhere.
You are right! Maidan is neofashists who are common to destabilise the situation near Russian border and make a war. It is very simply. They are not lrgislative. New Ucraine authorities not legislative. The agreement that was signed by German Poland France and Ucraine on 21st of February was not formed by neo fashists government. Thats why they are not legislative. And it is very funny to see BBC news and comments that make US people fool. BBC News - Russian parliament approves troop deployment in Ukraine[/url] - there is a photo with neonacists that was beaten by Hurkov sitizens, and below is BBC comment "But the protests turned bloody in Kharkiv after these pro-Kiev activists clashed with Russian supporters who were trying to enter an administrative office". Actually Hurkov sitizens "Russian supporters" expelled Nazis from state institutes, because they don't want chaos in their Motherland.
rightwinger
Award Winning USMB Paid Messageboard Poster
- Aug 4, 2009
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What Obama should do is let the EU handle it
It is easy. Obama not only supporting this coup, he organise it, to make another Syria with terrorists (neo Naciz) on tje Russian border to involve Russia to bloody war. Why? To make Russia weaker. But in the nearest future such approach of your government to the global politics can give to normal americans big problrems all over the world.Admin officials tell CNN's Barbara Starr this is an "uncontested arrival" not necessarily "an invasion" and that this distinction is "key."
2:13 PM - 28 Feb 2014
not as catchy as "overseas contingency operations", but they'll work on it I am sure.
heres the thing, the Ukrainian president Viktor Yanukovych was elected with 53% of the vote in a closely watched/internationally monitored election, pronounced by one and all as the cleanest election in any former soviet republic.
So, no matter what side you come down on, the protestors or Yanukovychs, his being chased from office was a coup, which begs the question- why is Obama spptting this?
Ponder this; Putin is taking actions to secure Russian citizens in an area of a country (58% Russian) which is in upheaval, obama is sppting an overthrow, those are the facts. As far as Putin trying to bribe Ukraine to not take a EU deal etc. so what,? We have done it, we do it , we use money and trade deals as leverage all the time.
Obama is not supporting anything. Not really.
Putins claim of ethnicity trumping sovereignty is convenient for the Ukraine, but not so much for the Caucasus.
We supported EU sweetening the deal and the IMF's stepping up inducements to lure Ukraine into the EU orbit, he warned Yanukovych not to use force and go along with the opposition who were rioting in obection to a deal Yanukovych would sign with Russia.
I have not heard obama denounce the forced change of gov. anywhere.
Trajan
conscientia mille testes
I bet you said that right up until operation Operation Deliberate Force 
frankly, obama has no play, he has exhausted his ability to influence events via Putin unless its to bend over again.
- Feb 12, 2007
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