Russia will never be awarded Ukraine territory gained by Russia's invasion

[kyzr]

Ukraine doesn’t need a deal to hand over to Russia its cities and disbanding their army while getting nothing in return.

Ukraine gets to stay an independent country when Putin desperately wants to keep it in Russia's sphere of influence. That would be a very big win, especially if the world helps Ukraine get back to prosperity.

 

[kyzr]

at what point would it not be “war time” with Putin next door wanting what he didn’t get the first time?

Where are the security guarantees? This deal specifically forbids NATO members from defending Ukraine.

My concern exactly. No NATO peacekeepers, no buffer zone, just "no mans land" like in 2014.

 

[Rogue AI]

Not only that, but they needed us to bail them out when they picked a fight in Libya as well.

Good call! I usually attribute our involvement in that to Obama's natural liberal bloodlust and innate love of terrorists. Perhaps I was blinded by partisanship, your point is quite true.

 

[AntonToo]

Ukraine gets to stay an independent country when Putin desperately wants to keep it in Russia's sphere of influence. That would be a very big win, especially if the world helps Ukraine get back to prosperity.

Ukraine doesn't get any of that in this ludecrous deal.

All it does is weaken Ukraine, lets Putin have cities he couldn't take in 12 years and sets him up to either take more later or to continiously coerce Ukraine with military threat as a gun to their head.

 

[Zavulon]

Europe realizes Putin remains a threat to everyone.
They understand this “peace deal” just cripples Ukraine and allows Putin to lick his wounds, rebuild and attack again

Trump just wants his damned Peace Prize

Of course Putin (and Trump, and Xi, and anybody else) is a treat to everyone. The only question is to make people be dangerous to your enemies not to you. Russians don't attack without pretty good (at least from their own point of view) reason. And officially declared goal of "decolonisation of Russia" (i.e. genocide of Russian people) is much more than just a good reason to eliminate a threat. If you want to live in peace with Russians, you shouldn't kill them. If you want to kill them - there is no force on this planet that can actually protect you. Even the USA won't be able to save you.

 

[AntonToo]

Russians don't attack without pretty good (at least from their own point of view) reason.

The only "good reasons" for Russia are Putin's own reasons, while bumpkins like you are carefully brainwashed by his propaganda to support the atrocities he signs up Russia for.

When are you going to wake up already?

 

[AntonToo]

If you want to live in peace with Russians, you shouldn't kill them.

Dummy nobody was killing Russians untill you RFers showed up with guns in Ukraine and started putting RF flags on their buildings.

Today thousands of Russians are dying every month and like a total idiot you support this lawless invasion of choice...while trying to say that Russians getting killed is bad, very bad.

 

[Zavulon]

The only "good reasons" for Russia are Putin's own reasons, while bumpkins like you are carefully brainwashed by his propaganda to support the atrocities he signs up Russia for.

When are you going to wake up already?

Yeah. That's my *****! Stupid racism and lack of both intellect and manners. By depicting Russians as a bunch of brainwashed goons lead by an irrational and evil dictator, you just confirm popular Russian opinion about negotiations with West: "There is nothing to talk about, no reason to talk and, actually, nobody to talk with".

There are some things you should take for given, if you want to negotiate with Russians (and survive next decades): 1) Russians are human beings, and as human beings they have all basic human rights; 2) Russians are as smart and as selfish as all human beings. 3) Russians are much better informed than you about what actually happens in Russia (including Ukraine). 4) Russians are not more violent than all other human beings.

If Americans were in Russia's place (and they were, say, during America-Mexican war, American Civil War or Cuban missile crisis) - they would act more or less the same way.

 

[Zavulon]

Dummy nobody was killing Russians untill you RFers showed up with guns in Ukraine and started putting RF flags on their buildings.

Plain lie. NATO have been killing Serbs (and Serbs are almost Russians) without any legal reason or provocation. And there is a difference between putting a flag on a building, defending your human right to speak your own language, and burning people alive, if you'd forgotten Odessa massacre.

Today thousands of Russians are dying every month and like a total idiot you support this lawless invasion of choice...while trying to say that Russians getting killed is bad, very bad.

Better thousands than millions and better millions than billions. And if we allow NATO to militarise Eastern Europe (and have their forces in Ukraine) - much larger war (may be, with billions killed) will be inevitable.

 

[AntonToo]

if we allow NATO to militarise Eastern Europe

Dummy Ukraine and EU have been doing nothing but de-millitarizing when you invaded them, annexed Ukraine and started taking over their eastern cities with hybrid forces.

YOU Rushists are the reason for militarization of Europe, not the other way around.

Isn't it funny how you consistently can't get timelines and cause-effect right? You think it's maybe because you are ******* brainwashed to hilt?

 

[Zavulon]

Dummy Ukraine has been doing nothing but de-millitarizing when you invaded them, annexed Ukraine and started taking over their eastern cities with hybrid forces.

YOU Rushists are the reason for militarization of Europe, not the other way around.

Isn't it funny how you consistently can't get timelines and cause-effect right? You think it's maybe because you are ******* brainwashed to hilt?

I don't talk about Ukraine only. It is just a little part of the militarisation of Eastern Europe. Poland, Romania, National ABD systems, attack against Russian citizens and Russian peacekeepers in South Ossetia and Abkhazia and a lot of other points.

 

[JWBooth]

Riddle me this. What us stopping Europe from driving Russia out of Ukraine militarily?

Aside from being ridiculous pretenders?
The Brits have some serious guys, as do the Germans, but they are only a miniscule part of the overall forces.

 

[GLASNOST]

Russia will never be awarded Ukraine territory gained by Russia's invasion​

.

1). Russia did not invade.
2). Donbas will be assisted by Russia and/or become a part of the Russian Federarion.
3). Ukraine will not join NATO.
4). Ukraine will be subjected to neutrality

 

[Fort Fun Indiana]

1). Russia did not invade.

Wow, if you aren't getting paid by Russia to embarrass yourself like this, then I feel bad for you

 

[Robert W]

1). Russia did not invade.
2). Donbas will be assisted by Russia and/or become a part of the Russian Federarion.
3). Ukraine will not join NATO.
4). Ukraine will be subjected to neutrality

Now tell us what will be imposed on Russia? Bear in mind, by Europe?

 

[eagle1462010]

Aside from being ridiculous pretenders?
The Brits have some serious guys, as do the Germans, but they are only a miniscule part of the overall forces.

Aka they been using us too long

 

[Robert W]

Europe is doing the same thing democrats do. When Russia invades their airspace they condemn it in the strongest possible terms.

True however Trump gave up leadership on this issue and Europe took charge.

 

[Robert W]

The same Eurotrash clowns that couldn't handle Kosovo on their own are going to handle Russia? Good luck with that. Your delusions are hilarious.

Clinton himself bombed Kosovo so yes, those clowns.

 

[GLASNOST]

1). Russia did not invade.
2). Donbas will be assisted by Russia and/or become a part of the Russian Federarion.
3). Ukraine will not join NATO.
4). Ukraine will be subjected to neutrality

Now tell us what will be imposed on Russia? Bear in mind, by Europe?

The cause of the war in Ukraine is due to the American MIC. Europe bought into it mostly because of previous American/NATO coercion but now that Trump seems to want out, Europe is left holding the bag. You can argue against Trumps roll if you want but the bottom line is that European leadership screwed over its population. Putin understands the NATO/EU plan and so he's now taking action against that plan. Do I think Russia was right to go into Donbas? Yes. Do I regard it as an invasion? No. And what about Russian conquering all of Ukraine? Yeah, what about it? Who says Russia wants all of Ukraine? Do I think Russia should take all of Ukraine? No. So, back to your question: Europe should not impose anything on Russia as long as Russia sticks to its fundamental plan. If you don't know what that plan is then you can ask me or just read again my 4 points in post #193.

 

[Deadstick]

My concern exactly. No NATO peacekeepers, no buffer zone, just "no mans land" like in 2014.

Did you not learn anything over the past ten years and even as far back as 2008? Russia have said time after time they will not tolerate Ukraine in Nato, that prospect was one of the main causes of the war.