CDZ Robert E. Lee is Not Our Heritage

[task0778]

Do you wish to remove the Jefferson Memorial? He had slaves?

Jefferson had several black children by his then slave Sarah I think her name was...so its not a great statue for the skinheads to love and worship.


.

Sally Hemings, I think that was her name. Didn't George Washington also have slaves at one time at Mount Vernon? Where do we draw the line between whose statues and memorials get torn down and whose doesn't? And will it make any real difference if a statue of Robert E. Lee remains or not? Whose life will get any better? It feels like political correctness run amok, almost totally for political reasons to appeal to the base of democratic voters. I don't think anyone else really gives a crap.

 

[Toronado3800]

Far as removing the other statues, in a documentary or display you can show more of a person's life. Frequently people aren't purely good or bad and it is good to recognize that. Maybe if we did there would be fewer followers and worshipers in America today.

 

[Fishlore]

There is a statute in Ohio from the Civil War that is our heritage. You can see it here: 4th amendment rooted in county « Harrison News Herald. America was founded on the belief that all men are created equal, it took a while to achieve that and some may say we still aren't there. Let's not go backward. White nationalists, white supremacists, the alt-right, and neo-Nazis do not represent the heritage that is America. The confederacy sought to destroy our heritage as Americans not support it, that much should be clear. Over six hundred thousand died to maintain America's dream of equality for all.

"It is a ‘white man’s government,’ is it? Why, the very first blood shed for the assertion of your independence and the establishment of your nationality, upon the field of Lexington, was the blood of a black citizen of Massachusetts. And when they came to the work, after the victory had been achieved, and the independence of the nation acknowledged, of organizing a constitutional government of the United States, in a majority of the States of the Union the black men voted with white men, and the man who denies it is simply ignorant of the history of his own country. . . .

Your armies bore witness that 175,000 of the black population, made free by the proclamation of liberty, were in the army of the republic. When you consider that the majority of the black population were the slaves of rebels, and within their territory, unable to signify to the United States Government their unwillingness to serve it, the fact that as large a population of the black population as of the free whites rushed to the defense of your flag, speaks well for their patriotism. . . "

Source: Balkinization, 'John Bingham on Racial Equality' Gerard N. Magliocca

"Bingham lived two more years and died in Cadiz on March 19, 1900. Bingham was interred in Union Cemetery in Cadiz. In 1901, the citizens of Harrison County, Ohio erected a bronze statue honoring Bingham in Cadiz." | Ohio Civil War Central

And there is a history and a heritage and it is not one we should be proud of.

"There is a crucial difference between leaders like Washington and Jefferson, imperfect men who helped create the United States, Ms. Gordon-Reed said, and Confederate generals like Jackson and Lee, whose main historical significance is that they took up arms against it. The comparison, she added, also “misapprehends the moral problem with the Confederacy.”" Historians Question Trump’s Comments on Confederate Monuments

"“We would not want to whitewash our history by pretending that Jim Crow and disenfranchisement or massive resistance to the civil rights movement never happened,” he said. “That is the part of our history that these monuments testify to.”" [from above]

States rights my....

John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' by Michael Kent Curtis :: SSRN

I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To: I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To – Form and Resonance – Medium


"Education is dangerous - every educated person is a future enemy." Hermann Goering

"Passionate hatred can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. Thus people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance." Eric Hoffer

This is a very good and informative post on the topic. Thanks.
Everybody has a "heritage" in this ^^^ sense, and all of them are myths. Myth is a powerful form of truth. Myth differs from scientific history a bit the way an X-ray differs from a photograph. An X-ray doesn't really "look like" the person, but it can reveal things that are really there but can't be seen in a photograph, even though the photo "looks like" the person much more than the x-ray.

Similarly, myth varies from fact, sometimes rather widely, but myth is based on why people believe and what they feel, both powerful factors in understanding factual history. We don't have a National Heritage Board that can stamp Robert E. Lee or anyone else as officially part of our heritage. Each of us has his or her own heritage just as we have our own families. Lee's importance today doesn't depend much on what he actually said and did; it depends of what people feel about what they think he said or did. Funny, huh?

 

[MarkDuffy]

You do not learn history by looking at statues. You learn history by reading literature and watching movies.

 

[depotoo]

Yep.
He admitted his views on slavery had been wrong. He did feel his fight for states rights was legitimate. But he also told the south the fight was over, and to come together as a nation.

I, Robert E. Lee of Lexington, Virginia do solemn, in the presence of Almighty God, that I will henceforth faithfully support, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States, the Union of the States thereafter, and that I will, in like manner, abide by and faithful support all laws and proclamations which have been made during the existing rebellion with reference to the emancipation of slaves, so help me God.
..
The duty of its citizens, then, appears to me too plain to admit of doubt. All should unite in honest efforts to obilterate the effects of the war and to restore the blessing of peace. They should remain, if possible, in the country; promote harmony and good feeling, qualify themselves to vote and elect to the State and general legislatures wise and patriotic men, who will devote their abilities to the interests of the country and the healing of all dissensions. I have invariably recommended this course since the cessation of hostilities, and have endeavoured to practise it myself.
..

Madam, don't bring up your sons to detest the United States government. Recollect that we form one country now. Abandon all these local animosities, and make your sons Americans.

"So far from engaging in a war to perpetuate slavery, I am rejoiced that slavery is abolished. I believe it will be greatly for the interests of the south. So fully am I satisfied of this, as regards Virginia especially, that I would cheerfully have lost all I have lost by the war, and have suffered all I have suffered, to have this object attained."

Is that a Lee quote? if so it seems he realized he was wrong to fight for the South?

 

[usmbguest5318]

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world.

Of course one can. Hindsight is 20/20.

 

[tinydancer]

There is a statute in Ohio from the Civil War that is our heritage. You can see it here: 4th amendment rooted in county « Harrison News Herald. America was founded on the belief that all men are created equal, it took a while to achieve that and some may say we still aren't there. Let's not go backward. White nationalists, white supremacists, the alt-right, and neo-Nazis do not represent the heritage that is America. The confederacy sought to destroy our heritage as Americans not support it, that much should be clear. Over six hundred thousand died to maintain America's dream of equality for all.

"It is a ‘white man’s government,’ is it? Why, the very first blood shed for the assertion of your independence and the establishment of your nationality, upon the field of Lexington, was the blood of a black citizen of Massachusetts. And when they came to the work, after the victory had been achieved, and the independence of the nation acknowledged, of organizing a constitutional government of the United States, in a majority of the States of the Union the black men voted with white men, and the man who denies it is simply ignorant of the history of his own country. . . .

Your armies bore witness that 175,000 of the black population, made free by the proclamation of liberty, were in the army of the republic. When you consider that the majority of the black population were the slaves of rebels, and within their territory, unable to signify to the United States Government their unwillingness to serve it, the fact that as large a population of the black population as of the free whites rushed to the defense of your flag, speaks well for their patriotism. . . "

Source: Balkinization, 'John Bingham on Racial Equality' Gerard N. Magliocca

"Bingham lived two more years and died in Cadiz on March 19, 1900. Bingham was interred in Union Cemetery in Cadiz. In 1901, the citizens of Harrison County, Ohio erected a bronze statue honoring Bingham in Cadiz." | Ohio Civil War Central

And there is a history and a heritage and it is not one we should be proud of.

"There is a crucial difference between leaders like Washington and Jefferson, imperfect men who helped create the United States, Ms. Gordon-Reed said, and Confederate generals like Jackson and Lee, whose main historical significance is that they took up arms against it. The comparison, she added, also “misapprehends the moral problem with the Confederacy.”" Historians Question Trump’s Comments on Confederate Monuments

"“We would not want to whitewash our history by pretending that Jim Crow and disenfranchisement or massive resistance to the civil rights movement never happened,” he said. “That is the part of our history that these monuments testify to.”" [from above]

States rights my....

John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' by Michael Kent Curtis :: SSRN

I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To: I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To – Form and Resonance – Medium


"Education is dangerous - every educated person is a future enemy." Hermann Goering

"Passionate hatred can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. Thus people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance." Eric Hoffer

Do you wish to remove the Jefferson Memorial? He had slaves?

They do. And Washingtons as well.

 

[tinydancer]

General Robert E Lee is a key figure in the history of America. Of that there is no doubt. Of that there is no argument. There was no choice for him but to fight first for his state and then for the Confederacy.

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world. One must judge a man's soul and character by the period of time he was living in.

Lee was a man of honor. And as such, when he was commissioned by the Governor of the state to be Commander of the army and the navy of Virginia he accepted the position. This was in April of 1861.

Civil war broke out in May. The troops were transferred to the Confederacy and he was appointed to full General status.

Now if one has a decent bone in their body to recognize the conditions at this time that General Lee was living under one would realize General Lee couldn't say...

"I QUIT".

General Lee was an honorable man fighting on the wrong side of history. But if one is to recognize truth, one has to recognize if the South had won, General Lee would have fought on the right side of history.

The Myth of the Kindly General Lee
The legend of the Confederate leader’s heroism and decency is based in the fiction of a person who never existed.

The Myth of the Kindly General Lee

I didn't say he was kind. I said he was honorable. He was called to duty. It's quite simple. As did Sherman. He was not a kind man either. They both did their duty for their respective sides.

General Sherman btw was a key player in the Indian wars. Despite fighting and winning for the Union should we now take down all memorials to Sherman for his wars against the First Nations?

 

[jasonnfree]

I wonder how much more history the far left thugs will want to erase after this Charleston episode. I'm thinking this is the start of a new industry, tearing down memorials and statues. On the other hand, it's actually been going on for quite awhile like when Tom Sawyer was taken out of many libraries because the word n i g g e r was in the book. The extreme left goons hate the word n i g g e r except when the rap music thugs use it a million times a day on t.v. and radio. Then they squeal and giggle with delight.

 

[tinydancer]

General Robert E Lee is a key figure in the history of America. Of that there is no doubt. Of that there is no argument. There was no choice for him but to fight first for his state and then for the Confederacy.

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world. One must judge a man's soul and character by the period of time he was living in.

Lee was a man of honor. And as such, when he was commissioned by the Governor of the state to be Commander of the army and the navy of Virginia he accepted the position. This was in April of 1861.

Civil war broke out in May. The troops were transferred to the Confederacy and he was appointed to full General status.

Now if one has a decent bone in their body to recognize the conditions at this time that General Lee was living under one would realize General Lee couldn't say...

"I QUIT".

General Lee was an honorable man fighting on the wrong side of history. But if one is to recognize truth, one has to recognize if the South had won, General Lee would have fought on the right side of history.

In 1861 America was actually last and behind in the laws of abolishing black slavery in Europe, how could America stand and call ourselves "The Land of The Free"

If the south had won, we would be America The Land of the Free..except for the black slaves we beat to wait on our asses, raise our children, pick our cotton to make our money..so we can sit on our asses and have them wait on us.

Documents show Lee was a cruel figure with his slaves and encouraged his overseers to severely beat slaves captured after trying to escape. One slave said Lee was one of the meanest men she had ever met.

Lee Wrote to his wife:
"The painful discipline they are undergoing is necessary for their instruction as a race... How long their subjugation may be necessary is known and ordered by a wise Merciful Providence," Lee wrote.





.

General Sherman who was the key player winning for the Union went on to the Indian Wars. Should we not eradicate his memory from history? If you want to begin with Lee we can dance on so many graves and tear down so many memorials if you wish.

Here's the Unions hero...For 15 years he worked diligently to eradicate First Nations.

At one point, when asked a question about "good Indians," he responded that, "The only good Indians I ever saw were dead," which became, "The only good Indian is a dead Indian" in popular vernacular.

General William Tecumseh Sherman | HistoryNet

ETA: slavery still exists. When Obama and Clinton "freed" Libya and turned over the country to various terror groups they assisted in the rise of slavery.

Notice few and far between American blacks ever campaign to end slavery any where else on the planet.

They are too busy crying victimhood daily.

Migrants from west Africa being ‘sold in Libyan slave markets’
UN migration agency says selling of people is rife in African nation that has slid into violent chaos since overthrow of Gaddafi

Migrants from west Africa being ‘sold in Libyan slave markets’

 

[MarkDuffy]

General Robert E Lee is a key figure in the history of America. Of that there is no doubt. Of that there is no argument. There was no choice for him but to fight first for his state and then for the Confederacy.

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world. One must judge a man's soul and character by the period of time he was living in.

Lee was a man of honor. And as such, when he was commissioned by the Governor of the state to be Commander of the army and the navy of Virginia he accepted the position. This was in April of 1861.

Civil war broke out in May. The troops were transferred to the Confederacy and he was appointed to full General status.

Now if one has a decent bone in their body to recognize the conditions at this time that General Lee was living under one would realize General Lee couldn't say...

"I QUIT".

General Lee was an honorable man fighting on the wrong side of history. But if one is to recognize truth, one has to recognize if the South had won, General Lee would have fought on the right side of history.

The Myth of the Kindly General Lee
The legend of the Confederate leader’s heroism and decency is based in the fiction of a person who never existed.

The Myth of the Kindly General Lee

I didn't say he was kind. I said he was honorable. He was called to duty. It's quite simple. As did Sherman. He was not a kind man either. They both did their duty for their respective sides.

General Sherman btw was a key player in the Indian wars. Despite fighting and winning for the Union should we now take down all memorials to Sherman for his wars against the First Nations?

We have quite a few with blemishes & I can understand the South's hatred of the evil that Sherman did to the South.

Neo-Nazis, white supremists, and their ilk co-opted the memories. The South needs much better cheerleaders for confederate statues in public & government sites. They belong on battlefields, museums and graveyards.

As I have posted before, I wait for Confederate reenactors in full uniforms to kick the asses of those Neo-Nazis, white supremists, and their ilk.

 

[tinydancer]

You do not learn history by looking at statues. You learn history by reading literature and watching movies.

I've been to many Civil War Museums and battlefields. Instead of going on a spring break to Daytona my father would take me to places like Gettysburg. My love of history comes from him.

In any nations life there have been periods of good and evil. One should not eradicate any memory of those times.

And some have gone so far as to demand the removal of the Confederate flag from a civil war museum of late. Rather than remove the flag, the curator closed the museum. How the hell do you have a civil war museum with eradicating the Confederacy?

But left wing loons thought it would be a swell idea. Idiots.

 

[MarkDuffy]

You do not learn history by looking at statues. You learn history by reading literature and watching movies.

I've been to many Civil War Museums and battlefields. Instead of going on a spring break to Daytona my father would take me to places like Gettysburg. My love of history comes from him.

In any nations life there have been periods of good and evil. One should not eradicate any memory of those times.

And some have gone so far as to demand the removal of the Confederate flag from a civil war museum of late. Rather than remove the flag, the curator closed the museum. How the hell do you have a civil war museum with eradicating the Confederacy?

But left wing loons thought it would be a swell idea. Idiots.

This one?

https://www.usnews.com/news/us/arti...useum-closes-after-feud-over-confederate-spat

http://www.salon.com/2017/05/27/geo...than-surrender-its-confederate-flags_partner/

That was clearly WRONG. Dee Clemmons is an imbecile

 

[Fishlore]

Calling those with whom you disagree about the issue of Civil War commemoratives "loons" and "idiots" doesn't enhance your credibility. You ask, "How the hell do you have a civil war museum with eradicating the Confederacy?," a question that further diminishes respect for your position and your analysis.

Here's why: no one is "eradicating the Confederacy" that happened in 1865. A museum devoted to that conflict can display artifacts such as flags without putting them to their original use, i.e. by flying them as a symbol of the organization for which they stand. Museums of WWII do not fly the Nazi flag, although they may display it in a case. There are a number of Holocaust Museums; none of them advocate for the Holocaust.

The Confederacy was a treasonous insurrection dedicated to preserving and extending the legal right of white people to sell black people like cattle. The subsequent efforts to sanctify the Confederacy as a monument to "the Southern way of life" was a propaganda of white supremacists. The American pea pull have seen through that charade and are bringing to a long-overdue end. That is how the hell you have a civil war museum without eradicating the Confederacy?

 

[task0778]

You do not learn history by looking at statues. You learn history by reading literature and watching movies.

I've been to many Civil War Museums and battlefields. Instead of going on a spring break to Daytona my father would take me to places like Gettysburg. My love of history comes from him.

In any nations life there have been periods of good and evil. One should not eradicate any memory of those times.

And some have gone so far as to demand the removal of the Confederate flag from a civil war museum of late. Rather than remove the flag, the curator closed the museum. How the hell do you have a civil war museum with eradicating the Confederacy?

But left wing loons thought it would be a swell idea. Idiots.

I think it's PC gone too far. Politics, playing to the left-wing base. Nobody else really care that much, but this way the Left gets to paint the Right with the broad brush of racism even though the WS is pretty much just a few fringe groups. Never mind the Antifa goons, that ain't important.

 

[IsaacNewton]

There is a statute in Ohio from the Civil War that is our heritage. You can see it here: 4th amendment rooted in county « Harrison News Herald. America was founded on the belief that all men are created equal, it took a while to achieve that and some may say we still aren't there. Let's not go backward. White nationalists, white supremacists, the alt-right, and neo-Nazis do not represent the heritage that is America. The confederacy sought to destroy our heritage as Americans not support it, that much should be clear. Over six hundred thousand died to maintain America's dream of equality for all.

"It is a ‘white man’s government,’ is it? Why, the very first blood shed for the assertion of your independence and the establishment of your nationality, upon the field of Lexington, was the blood of a black citizen of Massachusetts. And when they came to the work, after the victory had been achieved, and the independence of the nation acknowledged, of organizing a constitutional government of the United States, in a majority of the States of the Union the black men voted with white men, and the man who denies it is simply ignorant of the history of his own country. . . .

Your armies bore witness that 175,000 of the black population, made free by the proclamation of liberty, were in the army of the republic. When you consider that the majority of the black population were the slaves of rebels, and within their territory, unable to signify to the United States Government their unwillingness to serve it, the fact that as large a population of the black population as of the free whites rushed to the defense of your flag, speaks well for their patriotism. . . "

Source: Balkinization, 'John Bingham on Racial Equality' Gerard N. Magliocca

"Bingham lived two more years and died in Cadiz on March 19, 1900. Bingham was interred in Union Cemetery in Cadiz. In 1901, the citizens of Harrison County, Ohio erected a bronze statue honoring Bingham in Cadiz." | Ohio Civil War Central

And there is a history and a heritage and it is not one we should be proud of.

"There is a crucial difference between leaders like Washington and Jefferson, imperfect men who helped create the United States, Ms. Gordon-Reed said, and Confederate generals like Jackson and Lee, whose main historical significance is that they took up arms against it. The comparison, she added, also “misapprehends the moral problem with the Confederacy.”" Historians Question Trump’s Comments on Confederate Monuments

"“We would not want to whitewash our history by pretending that Jim Crow and disenfranchisement or massive resistance to the civil rights movement never happened,” he said. “That is the part of our history that these monuments testify to.”" [from above]

States rights my....

John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' by Michael Kent Curtis :: SSRN

I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To: I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To – Form and Resonance – Medium


"Education is dangerous - every educated person is a future enemy." Hermann Goering

"Passionate hatred can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. Thus people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance." Eric Hoffer

Do you wish to remove the Jefferson Memorial? He had slaves?

Ad Absurdum argument. Argue the reverse, "why aren't there statues of King George in every American town? Are you trying to erase history? I mean it's just history that England owned America". "Where are all the statues of Benedict Arnold? (the patron saint of conservative America) Other than a boot statue why keep all the statues of Benedict Arnold from being built?"

Cons you are like a drowning man flailing his arms trying to grasp at anything to keep from going under and to try to give cover to Trump who has now outed himself as a Nazi sympathizer. Stop while you are coughing up water.

 

[tinydancer]

You do not learn history by looking at statues. You learn history by reading literature and watching movies.

I've been to many Civil War Museums and battlefields. Instead of going on a spring break to Daytona my father would take me to places like Gettysburg. My love of history comes from him.

In any nations life there have been periods of good and evil. One should not eradicate any memory of those times.

And some have gone so far as to demand the removal of the Confederate flag from a civil war museum of late. Rather than remove the flag, the curator closed the museum. How the hell do you have a civil war museum with eradicating the Confederacy?

But left wing loons thought it would be a swell idea. Idiots.

This one?

https://www.usnews.com/news/us/arti...useum-closes-after-feud-over-confederate-spat

Georgia Civil War museum shuts down rather than surrender its Confederate flags

That was clearly WRONG. Dee Clemmons is an imbecile

Thank you. This is my greatest fear that people who are offended by history will attempt to eradicate any portion of it that they find appalling. That's not the way it's supposed to work.

 

[tinydancer]

There is a statute in Ohio from the Civil War that is our heritage. You can see it here: 4th amendment rooted in county « Harrison News Herald. America was founded on the belief that all men are created equal, it took a while to achieve that and some may say we still aren't there. Let's not go backward. White nationalists, white supremacists, the alt-right, and neo-Nazis do not represent the heritage that is America. The confederacy sought to destroy our heritage as Americans not support it, that much should be clear. Over six hundred thousand died to maintain America's dream of equality for all.

"It is a ‘white man’s government,’ is it? Why, the very first blood shed for the assertion of your independence and the establishment of your nationality, upon the field of Lexington, was the blood of a black citizen of Massachusetts. And when they came to the work, after the victory had been achieved, and the independence of the nation acknowledged, of organizing a constitutional government of the United States, in a majority of the States of the Union the black men voted with white men, and the man who denies it is simply ignorant of the history of his own country. . . .

Your armies bore witness that 175,000 of the black population, made free by the proclamation of liberty, were in the army of the republic. When you consider that the majority of the black population were the slaves of rebels, and within their territory, unable to signify to the United States Government their unwillingness to serve it, the fact that as large a population of the black population as of the free whites rushed to the defense of your flag, speaks well for their patriotism. . . "

Source: Balkinization, 'John Bingham on Racial Equality' Gerard N. Magliocca

"Bingham lived two more years and died in Cadiz on March 19, 1900. Bingham was interred in Union Cemetery in Cadiz. In 1901, the citizens of Harrison County, Ohio erected a bronze statue honoring Bingham in Cadiz." | Ohio Civil War Central

And there is a history and a heritage and it is not one we should be proud of.

"There is a crucial difference between leaders like Washington and Jefferson, imperfect men who helped create the United States, Ms. Gordon-Reed said, and Confederate generals like Jackson and Lee, whose main historical significance is that they took up arms against it. The comparison, she added, also “misapprehends the moral problem with the Confederacy.”" Historians Question Trump’s Comments on Confederate Monuments

"“We would not want to whitewash our history by pretending that Jim Crow and disenfranchisement or massive resistance to the civil rights movement never happened,” he said. “That is the part of our history that these monuments testify to.”" [from above]

States rights my....

John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' John Bingham and the Story of American Liberty: The Lost Cause Meets the 'Lost Clause' by Michael Kent Curtis :: SSRN

I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To: I Studied the Alt-Right So You Don’t Have To – Form and Resonance – Medium


"Education is dangerous - every educated person is a future enemy." Hermann Goering

"Passionate hatred can give meaning and purpose to an empty life. Thus people haunted by the purposelessness of their lives try to find a new content not only by dedicating themselves to a holy cause but also by nursing a fanatical grievance." Eric Hoffer

Do you wish to remove the Jefferson Memorial? He had slaves?

Ad Absurdum argument. Argue the reverse, "why aren't there statues of King George in every American town? Are you trying to erase history? I mean it's just history that England owned America". "Where are all the statues of Benedict Arnold? (the patron saint of conservative America) Other than a boot statue why keep all the statues of Benedict Arnold from being built?"

Cons you are like a drowning man flailing his arms trying to grasp at anything to keep from going under and to try to give cover to Trump who has now outed himself as a Nazi sympathizer. Stop while you are coughing up water.

Pffffft. To wish to keep Civil War monuments does not make one a Nazi or a Nazi sympathizer.

How absurd.



But on the other hand keep calling people names like you have before like racist, comrade, ignorant inbred rednecks, nazis and such. Because use of insults like Deplorables worked so well for you in 2016 didn't it?

 

[Eaglewings]

General Robert E Lee is a key figure in the history of America. Of that there is no doubt. Of that there is no argument. There was no choice for him but to fight first for his state and then for the Confederacy.

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world. One must judge a man's soul and character by the period of time he was living in.

Lee was a man of honor. And as such, when he was commissioned by the Governor of the state to be Commander of the army and the navy of Virginia he accepted the position. This was in April of 1861.

Civil war broke out in May. The troops were transferred to the Confederacy and he was appointed to full General status.

Now if one has a decent bone in their body to recognize the conditions at this time that General Lee was living under one would realize General Lee couldn't say...

"I QUIT".

General Lee was an honorable man fighting on the wrong side of history. But if one is to recognize truth, one has to recognize if the South had won, General Lee would have fought on the right side of history.

In 1861 America was actually last and behind in the laws of abolishing black slavery in Europe, how could America stand and call ourselves "The Land of The Free"

If the south had won, we would be America The Land of the Free..except for the black slaves we beat to wait on our asses, raise our children, pick our cotton to make our money..so we can sit on our asses and have them wait on us.

Documents show Lee was a cruel figure with his slaves and encouraged his overseers to severely beat slaves captured after trying to escape. One slave said Lee was one of the meanest men she had ever met.

Lee Wrote to his wife:
"The painful discipline they are undergoing is necessary for their instruction as a race... How long their subjugation may be necessary is known and ordered by a wise Merciful Providence," Lee wrote.





.

General Sherman who was the key player winning for the Union went on to the Indian Wars. Should we not eradicate his memory from history? If you want to begin with Lee we can dance on so many graves and tear down so many memorials if you wish.

Here's the Unions hero...For 15 years he worked diligently to eradicate First Nations.

At one point, when asked a question about "good Indians," he responded that, "The only good Indians I ever saw were dead," which became, "The only good Indian is a dead Indian" in popular vernacular.

General William Tecumseh Sherman | HistoryNet

ETA: slavery still exists. When Obama and Clinton "freed" Libya and turned over the country to various terror groups they assisted in the rise of slavery.

Notice few and far between American blacks ever campaign to end slavery any where else on the planet.

They are too busy crying victimhood daily.

Migrants from west Africa being ‘sold in Libyan slave markets’
UN migration agency says selling of people is rife in African nation that has slid into violent chaos since overthrow of Gaddafi

Migrants from west Africa being ‘sold in Libyan slave markets’

I understand that we still have slavery , children and women..very sad. but we are talking about the civil war here and the times of black slavery.

I actually visited Lee's home in Arlington in the 1980's, and I don't have a problem with Hero's or monuments. or flags because all war is ugly ... Most people didn't have a problem with them until the hate groups started arising especially since Trump won.
It is when these hateful groups use them as their own symbols, taking the memorial and using it for their own fucked up cause..Just like these fucked up people burning the cross, while calling themselves christians, hating on people.

I thought the BLM groups were dumb as hell, because all life's matter so I am not picking sides here..I don't see them charging out and burning down buildings for this young woman who died on Saturday, fighting for all colors freedom.

These skinheads are fighting for the federal flag, and these memorials not because of its honor, but for the fight to be an all white nation.

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[TheGreatGatsby]

General Robert E Lee is a key figure in the history of America. Of that there is no doubt. Of that there is no argument. There was no choice for him but to fight first for his state and then for the Confederacy.

One cannot judge that period in time by the minutes and hours of today's world. One must judge a man's soul and character by the period of time he was living in.

Lee was a man of honor. And as such, when he was commissioned by the Governor of the state to be Commander of the army and the navy of Virginia he accepted the position. This was in April of 1861.

Civil war broke out in May. The troops were transferred to the Confederacy and he was appointed to full General status.

Now if one has a decent bone in their body to recognize the conditions at this time that General Lee was living under one would realize General Lee couldn't say...

"I QUIT".

General Lee was an honorable man fighting on the wrong side of history. But if one is to recognize truth, one has to recognize if the South had won, General Lee would have fought on the right side of history.

Lee was fighting on the right side of history. The Confederacy just lost. The states had the right to secede. Lincoln did not respect that right to the detriment of generations of blood because he did not want to be the president that presided over the division of a nation. Lee's statue is well earned. Just because the South lost and the public indoctrination system pimps how great Lincoln was does not mean that Lee was not great.