Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians

RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ et al,

IF the US were to decide to "reshape" the aid package to Arab Palestine, it has to be compatible and coordinated with the Arab Palestinians "transformation" away from the lawless and violent people they are and the corrupt people they support.

I always thought of Trump as a loose cannon. (Even before the election.) He just does without any detectable thought process.

The "deal of the century" is just another flop in the works.
(COMMENT)

The Arab Palestinians are caught in an endless inward swirl of generationally transferred hatred. In order for any real success → the culture must eradicate its intense emotional need for conflict with the Israelis. The Arab Palestinians must make a High-G turn away from their "dependency" on the socially driven objective to neutralization of the Jews (Zionist or whatever) → 180º from the abhorrence of the Jews and focus that energy towards the development in a multinational effort in nation-building.

But that is not happening anytime soon. No one trusts anyone else.

Most Respectfully,
R
And the programs that foster such trust are included in the cuts, which is why I think aid should be cut strategically not petulantly.
 
RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ et al,

The US needs to discontinue any and all USAID and Security Assistance packages with the Arab Palestinians and any donation supporting NGOs and UN Activities that operate within the territories.

Agree. The question then is whether continued aide supports this transformation or detracts from it.
(COMMENT)

This is a backaway strategy until a clear path and plan can be devised with some reasonable expectation of successful. IF the US continues on the current course of support to the Arab Palestinians, we are just throwing more money after bad. We might as well just burn here. We should step back from the Arab Palestinians, and all those that support the Arab Palestinians, and wait for it to implode. It is what they want. They are of that mindset.

Most Respectfully,
R
 
RE: Reshaping US aid to the Palestinians
※→ et al,

The US needs to discontinue any and all USAID and Security Assistance packages with the Arab Palestinians and any donation supporting NGOs and UN Activities that operate within the territories.

Agree. The question then is whether continued aide supports this transformation or detracts from it.
(COMMENT)

This is a backaway strategy until a clear path and plan can be devised with some reasonable expectation of successful. IF the US continues on the current course of support to the Arab Palestinians, we are just throwing more money after bad. We might as well just burn here. We should step back from the Arab Palestinians, and all those that support the Arab Palestinians, and wait for it to implode. It is what they want. They are of that mindset.

Most Respectfully,
R

How do you know that is what they want? We should not support NGOs even? Your plan would create yet another humanitarian crisis in an area already rife with such, and make the area ripe for far more extreme terrorist groups to gain a foothold.
 
There cannot be a

There certainly can be. It's foolish to take actions with out some sort of long term strategy. I get that you hate Muslims.
Being called a terrorist, while defending themselves from barbarian Arabs, and uncaring English, is not the same as people from a religion, taught to hate you, and intent in never wanting you to have your own country on your own ancient homeland ARE two totally different issues.

You do not realize that the Arabs from 1920 on have been wanting to not only destroy Israel but kill, or subjugate all the Jews, just as they had them before......as second class citizens known as Dhimmis.

Your knowledge of history continues to be thin.

The Palestinians today are not Nazis.
They are a totally different group of terrorists, like the Nazis, who want to have power over land which does not belong to them, and over the indigenous people on those lands.

The ones who started with the Nazi comparison were the Arab Palestinians.

They will use any comparison against the Jews and Israel which will help make them look like the victims they are truly not.

Bullshit. Bombing open market places and civilian bus's is terrorism plain and simple. You're trying to make distinctions that aren't there. Which is why I say Israel can do no wrong - you just find a way to justify it and white wash the less savory elements of your own history.

As far as the Nazi comparison from Netanyahu? It was highly inappropriate, and even many Jews were angered over it. But you will support it and justify it won't you?


Yes, 1600 Jews were angered by it. The 16 million who know real history, however, weren't.

Al Husseini collaborated directly with the Nazis, and his nephew just happens to be a fellow who changed his name to Arafat.

I realize that you know extremely little and all you do is repeat all the talking points and language you find at Islamist sites, but are you actually trying to deny that?

Link to that 16 million? Or did you pull it out of your ass? Many were angered, particularly at the misuse of the Holocaust for political purposes. That is what it is. A lot of people collaborated with the Nazi's to serve their own nationalist goals. To equate the Palestinians with Hitler's actions is false moral equivalency (maybe your "Standford" education missed that bit). The Palestinians did not kill 2/3 of Europe's Jews.
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Egypt barricading Gaza?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Syria taking over Lebanon and displacing millions of Lebanese?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Jordan asking Israel to keep Palis out of Jordan?
Are you even aware that these are just a few of the problems plaguing the Arab world?

And I’d like to know why you clicked a Smiley concerning the Rothschilds purchasing tons of land from Arabs.
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.
 
Yes, 1600 Jews were angered by it. The 16 million who know real history, however, weren't.

Al Husseini collaborated directly with the Nazis, and his nephew just happens to be a fellow who changed his name to Arafat.

I realize that you know extremely little and all you do is repeat all the talking points and language you find at Islamist sites, but are you actually trying to deny that?

Link to that 16 million? Or did you pull it out of your ass? Many were angered, particularly at the misuse of the Holocaust for political purposes. That is what it is. A lot of people collaborated with the Nazi's to serve their own nationalist goals. To equate the Palestinians with Hitler's actions is false moral equivalency (maybe your "Standford" education missed that bit). The Palestinians did not kill 2/3 of Europe's Jews.
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Egypt barricading Gaza?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Syria taking over Lebanon and displacing millions of Lebanese?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Jordan asking Israel to keep Palis out of Jordan?
Are you even aware that these are just a few of the problems plaguing the Arab world?

And I’d like to know why you clicked a Smiley concerning the Rothschilds purchasing tons of land from Arabs.
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The US regards the aid to the PA and Gaza as helping terrorists who are usually gleeful every time they kill a Jew, or think they have killed one.

What aid should be given by the US to people like that?

And let us not forget that the population does not suffer from any taking away of US aid, it suffers from the endless corruption being inflicted on them by their leaders who are nothing but very fat cows.
 
Yes, 1600 Jews were angered by it. The 16 million who know real history, however, weren't.

Al Husseini collaborated directly with the Nazis, and his nephew just happens to be a fellow who changed his name to Arafat.

I realize that you know extremely little and all you do is repeat all the talking points and language you find at Islamist sites, but are you actually trying to deny that?

Link to that 16 million? Or did you pull it out of your ass? Many were angered, particularly at the misuse of the Holocaust for political purposes. That is what it is. A lot of people collaborated with the Nazi's to serve their own nationalist goals. To equate the Palestinians with Hitler's actions is false moral equivalency (maybe your "Standford" education missed that bit). The Palestinians did not kill 2/3 of Europe's Jews.
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Egypt barricading Gaza?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Syria taking over Lebanon and displacing millions of Lebanese?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Jordan asking Israel to keep Palis out of Jordan?
Are you even aware that these are just a few of the problems plaguing the Arab world?

And I’d like to know why you clicked a Smiley concerning the Rothschilds purchasing tons of land from Arabs.
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The problem lies in the fact that FlaCalTenn has already stated quite eloquently...your ignorance of history and current events in the subject is stunningly obvious.
You can’t solve a problem that no nation in the region cares about, especially when they’re all at war with each other.
 
Link to that 16 million? Or did you pull it out of your ass? Many were angered, particularly at the misuse of the Holocaust for political purposes. That is what it is. A lot of people collaborated with the Nazi's to serve their own nationalist goals. To equate the Palestinians with Hitler's actions is false moral equivalency (maybe your "Standford" education missed that bit). The Palestinians did not kill 2/3 of Europe's Jews.
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Egypt barricading Gaza?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Syria taking over Lebanon and displacing millions of Lebanese?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Jordan asking Israel to keep Palis out of Jordan?
Are you even aware that these are just a few of the problems plaguing the Arab world?

And I’d like to know why you clicked a Smiley concerning the Rothschilds purchasing tons of land from Arabs.
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The problem lies in the fact that FlaCalTenn has already stated quite eloquently...your ignorance of history and current events in the subject is stunningly obvious.
You can’t solve a problem that no nation in the region cares about, especially when they’re all at war with each other.
So...no long term strategy at play here and you are stating there is no need for such?
 
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Egypt barricading Gaza?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Syria taking over Lebanon and displacing millions of Lebanese?
When’s the last time you lost sleep over Jordan asking Israel to keep Palis out of Jordan?
Are you even aware that these are just a few of the problems plaguing the Arab world?

And I’d like to know why you clicked a Smiley concerning the Rothschilds purchasing tons of land from Arabs.
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The problem lies in the fact that FlaCalTenn has already stated quite eloquently...your ignorance of history and current events in the subject is stunningly obvious.
You can’t solve a problem that no nation in the region cares about, especially when they’re all at war with each other.
So...no long term strategy at play here and you are stating there is no need for such?
Let's look at the overall context...
I already asked you questions in a comprehensive post about the entire regions apathy/hostility towards each other.
You didn't respond to the post.

Are you expecting the US to strong arm 21 nations plus Israel?
Prove you're not allowing your emotions to control your attitude by answering that question and the ones already posted.
 
The smilie was laughing over the claim that most of the land was purchased. While some, maybe much was, much was confiscated under the various absentee land owner laws. But that would be a discussion for another topic.
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The problem lies in the fact that FlaCalTenn has already stated quite eloquently...your ignorance of history and current events in the subject is stunningly obvious.
You can’t solve a problem that no nation in the region cares about, especially when they’re all at war with each other.
So...no long term strategy at play here and you are stating there is no need for such?
Let's look at the overall context...
I already asked you questions in a comprehensive post about the entire regions apathy/hostility towards each other.
You didn't respond to the post.

Are you expecting the US to strong arm 21 nations plus Israel?
Prove you're not allowing your emotions to control your attitude by answering that question and the ones already posted.

I am not required to answer your every question particularly when it is typically a one way street with my remaining unanswered. Show me there is a coherent strategy at play.
 
Most of the land was purchased.
And let’s be honest, you laugh at a lot of others posts.

Nope. I am very selective. My record is easy to see. Look at it. I never laugh at those I respect including many who are of opposing opinions. I also get laughed at a lot ;). If you want to discuss it start a topic outside of IP.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
The problem lies in the fact that FlaCalTenn has already stated quite eloquently...your ignorance of history and current events in the subject is stunningly obvious.
You can’t solve a problem that no nation in the region cares about, especially when they’re all at war with each other.
So...no long term strategy at play here and you are stating there is no need for such?
Let's look at the overall context...
I already asked you questions in a comprehensive post about the entire regions apathy/hostility towards each other.
You didn't respond to the post.

Are you expecting the US to strong arm 21 nations plus Israel?
Prove you're not allowing your emotions to control your attitude by answering that question and the ones already posted.

I am not required to answer your every question particularly when it is typically a one way street with my remaining unanswered. Show me there is a coherent strategy at play.
I am not required to show you there is a coherent strategy at play until you can prove there's a context for one.
I will have to assume that you want the US to either bribe or militarily enforce your will upon the entire globe.
Feel free to send a check.

I think I will follow flacaltenn and bow out of this pointless "discussion".
 
RE: Off Topic x On Topic
Coyote, et al,

I use the laugh ping a bit differently. In my case I see it neighteras good nor bad. At least people know I saw it and gave it some appreciation.

But to get back on topic, is there any evidence of an American foreign policy strategy in the total cessation of aid?
(RESPONSE)

No. In my opinion there is now. Maybe some cuts but no real indication it is a threat with teeth.

Just My Thought,
R
 
Of course there is a strategy at play here. It's not an especially pleasant one for the Arab Palestinians. But the hope is to move them out of the status quo comfort zone into actually governing its citizens.
 
Of course there is a strategy at play here. It's not an especially pleasant one for the Arab Palestinians. But the hope is to move them out of the status quo comfort zone into actually governing its citizens.


Their single biggest industry is propaganda, and while that propaganda brings in the most money for them, it is not sustainable as far as an economy is concerned.

Who knows -- if they stopped trying to kill Jews while pouring so much of their resources into their massive propaganda efforts, and started building an actual country, instead, who knows -- they might actually get one.
 
There is a lot of anti-Palestinian propaganda at work as well. For example, why do Palestinian successes receive so little attention? Unlike the Israeli’s, Palestinian farmers face far more obstacles to success and it is not just from their own government as some would have you believe.

Small farmers struggle worldwide, but Palestinian farmers really have it rough
JALUD, West Bank — Palestinian farmer Fawzi Ibrahim is proud of his heirloom corn, whose kernels ripen in iridescent shades of red, blue and gold like jewels.

But what makes it priceless are the obstacles he faces to grow his crops.

Small farmers struggle worldwide. But international experts say Palestinian farmers face disabling odds in the 60 percent of the West Bank that is under full Israeli control and is home to some 400,000 Jewish settlers.

As settler agricultural start-ups get prioritized access to water, export markets and development rights, the Israeli occupation is roiling the centuries-old pastoral life of Palestinian farmers, experts say, adding fuel to a conflict in which land is a trigger.


For years, Israeli settlers have chased Ibrahim’s tractor, threatened him, yelled at his Israeli soldier escorts, tried to burn his fields and warned that letting him farm would risk bloodshed, according to the Israeli group Rabbis for Human Rights.

....A recent U.N. report said the Israeli occupation has set off a “continuous process of de-agriculturization” in the Israeli-controlled West Bank, depriving the Palestinian economy of potential agriculture revenue of $700 million, by World Bank estimates, as Israeli settlers bar Palestinians from crops, grazing lands and springs.

The World Food Program is providing food assistance to 75,000 Palestinians in Area C, according to local spokesman Raphael du Boispean.

A December report by the Israeli human rights group B’Tselem said Israeli settlements have overtaken a half-million acres of former Palestinian lands in Israel-controlled Area C, which was placed under full Israeli control in 1990s accords. B’Tselem said 200,000 to 300,000 Palestinians live in Area C.


“What the Israeli settlers are doing in those areas is a disaster,” said Avshalom Vilan, executive director of Israel’s powerful Farmers Federation, a mainstream private farmers group. “They’re stealing from the lives of their Palestinian neighbors, and making their lives impossible.

If they were able to farm, maybe they would not need as much aid.
 
Let PCFF do whatever they feel needs to be done. But it’s absurd for them to argue that they are entitled to US government funding. If their work produces an acceptable return on investment, however that’s defined, funders will seek them out. The broader issue though is about how large bodies, often controlled by governments, use sometimes-vast aid funds to influence and even change the political landscape in other countries.

Jerusalem-based NGO Monitor is mentioned in Jeffay’s article. I play a tiny committee-member’s role there that gives me some insight into the distortions and the double standards that are often part of the funding industry. A notorious illustration: the Abbas regime’s rewards-for-terror stipends scheme has produced a devastating harvest of deaths and blighted lives on both sides since Arafat’s time.The PA has for all practical purposes been insolvent through all those years. Those stipends and that hideous scheme are made possible only by foreign funding. Let it be critically reviewed widely, often, transparently and with vigour.

(full article online)

This Ongoing War: A Blog: 04-Oct-18: Entitlement, transparency and foreign aid: Responding to Parents Circle
 
There is a lot of anti-Palestinian propaganda at work as well. For example, why do Palestinian successes receive so little attention? Unlike the Israeli’s, Palestinian farmers face far more obstacles to success and it is not just from their own government as some would have you believe.

Small farmers struggle worldwide, but Palestinian farmers really have it rough
JALUD, West Bank — Palestinian farmer Fawzi Ibrahim is proud of his heirloom corn, whose kernels ripen in iridescent shades of red, blue and gold like jewels.

But what makes it priceless are the obstacles he faces to grow his crops.

Small farmers struggle worldwide. But international experts say Palestinian farmers face disabling odds in the 60 percent of the West Bank that is under full Israeli control and is home to some 400,000 Jewish settlers.

As settler agricultural start-ups get prioritized access to water, export markets and development rights, the Israeli occupation is roiling the centuries-old pastoral life of Palestinian farmers, experts say, adding fuel to a conflict in which land is a trigger.

For years, Israeli settlers have chased Ibrahim’s tractor, threatened him, yelled at his Israeli soldier escorts, tried to burn his fields and warned that letting him farm would risk bloodshed, according to the Israeli group Rabbis for Human Rights.

....A recent U.N. report said the Israeli occupation has set off a “continuous process of de-agriculturization” in the Israeli-controlled West Bank, depriving the Palestinian economy of potential agriculture revenue of $700 million, by World Bank estimates, as Israeli settlers bar Palestinians from crops, grazing lands and springs.

The World Food Program is providing food assistance to 75,000 Palestinians in Area C, according to local spokesman Raphael du Boispean.

A December report by the Israeli human rights group B’Tselem said Israeli settlements have overtaken a half-million acres of former Palestinian lands in Israel-controlled Area C, which was placed under full Israeli control in 1990s accords. B’Tselem said 200,000 to 300,000 Palestinians live in Area C.


“What the Israeli settlers are doing in those areas is a disaster,” said Avshalom Vilan, executive director of Israel’s powerful Farmers Federation, a mainstream private farmers group. “They’re stealing from the lives of their Palestinian neighbors, and making their lives impossible.

If they were able to farm, maybe they would not need as much aid.


But this is an(other) example of double standards being applied to Israel. The objective question is whether or not it is incumbent upon a State to maintain a subsistence level agriculture for its citizens.

This has NOTHING to do with "settlers" or the conflict. But people make it about those things in order to unfairly demonize Israel.
 
If this is to be an Islamist site where people are not free to oppose Islamist based terrorism, would you please at least have the decency to state this right up front?

People who oppose terrorism against Jews are getting threatened in this thread, the management of this site is mocking their points of view by laughing at them and it as heavy handed as all get up.

Normally, This would deleted and a warning issued for discussing a moderation directive in thread. The rules CLEARLY state... Do NOT REPLY, Do not Discuss. NOT BECAUSE IT CAN'T BE DISCUSSED, but because in the middle of topical threads is no place to toss a fit and get an audience.

There NEVER been any prohibition at ALL on USMB about "opposing Islamic terrorism".. NEVER A SINGLE WARNING issued for taking that opinion and stance in the PROPER thread. But that's not what's going on here.

When you target USMB members and make allegations against them PERSONALLY --- that's flaming. And on its own, without relevance to specific title/OP, its taunting and illegal post content. If it becomes a personal exchange, it will be deleted and warned.

Take the shots bearing on the specific TOPIC -- and it's legal. It's that simple. If you have a vendetta or grudge that needs to be aired -- use the Taunting Forums.

If you have moderation gripes, contact any Staff member and include myself and AyeCantSeeYou in the PM.

Don't reply to this message. Open a PM.. Bring a friend, a lawyer, whomever you like. Just make sure it's not about your personal dislike or animosity for a member of Staff without concrete evidence that their actions are "harassing members"..

 
Last edited:
There is a lot of anti-Palestinian propaganda at work as well. For example, why do Palestinian successes receive so little attention? Unlike the Israeli’s, Palestinian farmers face far more obstacles to success and it is not just from their own government as some would have you believe.

Small farmers struggle worldwide, but Palestinian farmers really have it rough
JALUD, West Bank — Palestinian farmer Fawzi Ibrahim is proud of his heirloom corn, whose kernels ripen in iridescent shades of red, blue and gold like jewels.

But what makes it priceless are the obstacles he faces to grow his crops.

Small farmers struggle worldwide. But international experts say Palestinian farmers face disabling odds in the 60 percent of the West Bank that is under full Israeli control and is home to some 400,000 Jewish settlers.

As settler agricultural start-ups get prioritized access to water, export markets and development rights, the Israeli occupation is roiling the centuries-old pastoral life of Palestinian farmers, experts say, adding fuel to a conflict in which land is a trigger.

For years, Israeli settlers have chased Ibrahim’s tractor, threatened him, yelled at his Israeli soldier escorts, tried to burn his fields and warned that letting him farm would risk bloodshed, according to the Israeli group Rabbis for Human Rights.

....A recent U.N. report said the Israeli occupation has set off a “continuous process of de-agriculturization” in the Israeli-controlled West Bank, depriving the Palestinian economy of potential agriculture revenue of $700 million, by World Bank estimates, as Israeli settlers bar Palestinians from crops, grazing lands and springs.

The World Food Program is providing food assistance to 75,000 Palestinians in Area C, according to local spokesman Raphael du Boispean.

A December report by the Israeli human rights group B’Tselem said Israeli settlements have overtaken a half-million acres of former Palestinian lands in Israel-controlled Area C, which was placed under full Israeli control in 1990s accords. B’Tselem said 200,000 to 300,000 Palestinians live in Area C.


“What the Israeli settlers are doing in those areas is a disaster,” said Avshalom Vilan, executive director of Israel’s powerful Farmers Federation, a mainstream private farmers group. “They’re stealing from the lives of their Palestinian neighbors, and making their lives impossible.

If they were able to farm, maybe they would not need as much aid.


But this is an(other) example of double standards being applied to Israel. The objective question is whether or not it is incumbent upon a State to maintain a subsistence level agriculture for its citizens.

This has NOTHING to do with "settlers" or the conflict. But people make it about those things in order to unfairly demonize Israel.

How is it double standards? The state, as you put it, encourages and subsidizes settler agriculture and puts substantial obstacles in way of Palestinian farmers. Where is the double standard exactly? It is here.

They mention heirloom corn. There is a potential market in heirloom varieties that could be exploited.
 

Forum List

Back
Top