Refuting Fear Based Motivation for Christian Morality

[BluePhantom]

The lesson of Noah you refer to is rendered moot by the sacrifice of Jesus according to Paul.

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Noah is The Commandment from God to humanity, the Triumph of Good vs Evil for its preservation or certain failure, punctuated by the brutality against sinners.

BP: Thus, Christian morality, when one follows the Bible at least, is for the sake or morality itself and a genuine love of mankind.

that's interesting you believe God changed the Commandment of Noah for the sake of modern christianity ... Christian morality based on universal sin.


Refuting Fear Based Motivation for Christian Morality

there should be fear for christians if they haven't any ....

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ok I see where you are coming from. I would make the following points.

- In regard to anything having to do with Noah, that would be before the original covenant. Once the covenant was made between God and the Jews, anything prior would no longer apply since a new contract had been hammered out.

- The old covenant was, according to Paul, rendered moot by the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus and replaced by the new covenant. The only requirement of the new covenant is the acceptance of grace.

Therefore, the lesson (or commandment if you wish) of Noah no longer applies.

 

[BreezeWood]

- In regard to anything having to do with Noah, that would be before the original covenant. Once the covenant was made between God and the Jews, anything prior would no longer apply since a new contract had been hammered out.

.
thanks,

I am neither Jewish nor Christian and by natural choice chose the original Commandment from God as the underlying religion for the purposes of Remission to the Everlasting by the Triumpth of Good vs Evil.

and by the "lesson" of Noah this is a requirement for all humanity to accomplish as an individuals Triumph is not enough for eternal salvation - the demise of sin, the Christians have capitulated against by misunderstanding the events and personage of Jesus of Nazareth.


" Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani " - 'My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?'


* the lesson for humanity is revealed by the history of the various religions and their persecutions or ignorance of those who have expressed a free Spirit against Dogma causing their immediate peril - the opposite of Noah, The Good Die Young.


yes, Christian Morality is fear, based by its errant motivation.

.

 

[BluePhantom]

- In regard to anything having to do with Noah, that would be before the original covenant. Once the covenant was made between God and the Jews, anything prior would no longer apply since a new contract had been hammered out.

.
thanks,

I am neither Jewish nor Christian and by natural choice chose the original Commandment from God as the underlying religion for the purposes of Remission to the Everlasting by the Triumpth of Good vs Evil.

and by the "lesson" of Noah this is a requirement for all humanity to accomplish as an individuals Triumph is not enough for eternal salvation - the demise of sin, the Christians have capitulated against by misunderstanding the events and personage of Jesus of Nazareth.


" Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani " - 'My God, My God, why have You forsaken Me?'


* the lesson for humanity is revealed by the history of the various religions and their persecutions or ignorance of those who have expressed a free Spirit against Dogma causing their immediate peril - the opposite of Noah, The Good Die Young.


yes, Christian Morality is fear, based by its errant motivation.

.

I am not following you. Maybe it's because I just woke up and have a mild hangover, but I am not seeing where you are going. Please explain

 

[sealybobo]

Sigh......do I really want to get into this? Oh what the hell. I will try to be brief.

A common criticism by atheists is that Christians only attempt to engage in moral behavior because of the fear of eternal punishment in hell. Thus, they argue, Christian morality is centered in spiritual self-preservation instead of a pure place of free choice. While this is commonly the case, and was certainly propagated by the Church during the Middle Ages, it's not actually what the Bible teaches. To understand, we must have a look at Paul starting with the concept of 'grace'.

Grace, very simply, is a gift that has been given without being earned. The grace of God is forgiveness for all sin according to the sacrifice of Jesus. Obedience to the Law and good works (let's refer to this as 'morality' for the sake of this discussion) do not bring one closer to righteousness. Indeed, righteousness cannot be obtained since all people are sinners and no one follows the Law in its entirety. (see Rom. 3:9-12, Rom. 4:24-25) Moral behavior, therefore, cannot gain righteousness or else forgiveness will have been earned. This violates the concept of grace; that of a free gift that has not been earned, and renders the sacrifice of Jesus irrelevant. (see Gal. 2:21)

However, when one lives within grace one will naturally engage in moral behavior because God is working within and through them. (see Rom. 6:15-18, 1 Cor. 15:10) Thus, morality is not embraced from a place of fear, spiritual self-preservation, or earning favor with God. It comes because God is revealing Himself within them and this is reflected in one's genuine inner nature which has been inspired toward righteousness through grace.

That's about as quick and to the point as I can make it. Thus, Christian morality, when one follows the Bible at least, is for the sake or morality itself and a genuine love of mankind.

Like the Jews mormons and Muslims do christians all need to get on the same page and agree with what is true and what is not. Come up with a final product. Protestants say this catholics Presbyterian greek orthodox baptist.

Oh wait we have Sunnis and Shiites and Jews dont all agree either. Maybe the Mormons are right.

 

[BluePhantom]

Sigh......do I really want to get into this? Oh what the hell. I will try to be brief.

A common criticism by atheists is that Christians only attempt to engage in moral behavior because of the fear of eternal punishment in hell. Thus, they argue, Christian morality is centered in spiritual self-preservation instead of a pure place of free choice. While this is commonly the case, and was certainly propagated by the Church during the Middle Ages, it's not actually what the Bible teaches. To understand, we must have a look at Paul starting with the concept of 'grace'.

Grace, very simply, is a gift that has been given without being earned. The grace of God is forgiveness for all sin according to the sacrifice of Jesus. Obedience to the Law and good works (let's refer to this as 'morality' for the sake of this discussion) do not bring one closer to righteousness. Indeed, righteousness cannot be obtained since all people are sinners and no one follows the Law in its entirety. (see Rom. 3:9-12, Rom. 4:24-25) Moral behavior, therefore, cannot gain righteousness or else forgiveness will have been earned. This violates the concept of grace; that of a free gift that has not been earned, and renders the sacrifice of Jesus irrelevant. (see Gal. 2:21)

However, when one lives within grace one will naturally engage in moral behavior because God is working within and through them. (see Rom. 6:15-18, 1 Cor. 15:10) Thus, morality is not embraced from a place of fear, spiritual self-preservation, or earning favor with God. It comes because God is revealing Himself within them and this is reflected in one's genuine inner nature which has been inspired toward righteousness through grace.

That's about as quick and to the point as I can make it. Thus, Christian morality, when one follows the Bible at least, is for the sake or morality itself and a genuine love of mankind.

Like the Jews mormons and Muslims do christians all need to get on the same page and agree with what is true and what is not. Come up with a final product. Protestants say this catholics Presbyterian greek orthodox baptist.

Oh wait we have Sunnis and Shiites and Jews dont all agree either. Maybe the Mormons are right.

Well I am not sure I buy into a religion that says God lives on a planet, blacks are descendants of the fallen angels and were turned black as a punishment, and the garden of Eden was in St. Louis, but what the heck, right?

I suppose we could solve the problem very easily. Everyone just accept what I tell them to accept, believe what I tell them to believe, and do what I tell them to do. Wait....that sounds like a Pope.

 

[JakeStarkey]

Sigh......do I really want to get into this? Oh what the hell. I will try to be brief.

A common criticism by atheists is that Christians only attempt to engage in moral behavior because of the fear of eternal punishment in hell. Thus, they argue, Christian morality is centered in spiritual self-preservation instead of a pure place of free choice. While this is commonly the case, and was certainly propagated by the Church during the Middle Ages, it's not actually what the Bible teaches. To understand, we must have a look at Paul starting with the concept of 'grace'.

Grace, very simply, is a gift that has been given without being earned. The grace of God is forgiveness for all sin according to the sacrifice of Jesus. Obedience to the Law and good works (let's refer to this as 'morality' for the sake of this discussion) do not bring one closer to righteousness. Indeed, righteousness cannot be obtained since all people are sinners and no one follows the Law in its entirety. (see Rom. 3:9-12, Rom. 4:24-25) Moral behavior, therefore, cannot gain righteousness or else forgiveness will have been earned. This violates the concept of grace; that of a free gift that has not been earned, and renders the sacrifice of Jesus irrelevant. (see Gal. 2:21)

However, when one lives within grace one will naturally engage in moral behavior because God is working within and through them. (see Rom. 6:15-18, 1 Cor. 15:10) Thus, morality is not embraced from a place of fear, spiritual self-preservation, or earning favor with God. It comes because God is revealing Himself within them and this is reflected in one's genuine inner nature which has been inspired toward righteousness through grace.

That's about as quick and to the point as I can make it. Thus, Christian morality, when one follows the Bible at least, is for the sake or morality itself and a genuine love of mankind.

Like the Jews mormons and Muslims do christians all need to get on the same page and agree with what is true and what is not. Come up with a final product. Protestants say this catholics Presbyterian greek orthodox baptist.

Oh wait we have Sunnis and Shiites and Jews dont all agree either. Maybe the Mormons are right.

Oh, no, they don't. The Restoration saints all fight like cats and dogs. It's like Assembly and Pentecostal trying to discuss the godhead.