Reason and Experience tell us that there is Evidence for a Creator

[ding]

I'm ok with you seeing it that way. I've accomplished what I set out to do.

Huh. You set out to fail? Congratulations. Personally, I like to set my own sights a little higher.

Anything else?

Well, since you';re content with failure, I guess that would be up to you?

Is that it, or do you have something else to add?

LOL. You just need to feel like you got the last word in, don't you? Go ahead, prove me right by replying again.

No. I'm waiting for you to finish so that it will be my turn

 

[MisterBeale]

"Science" is not much better than a religion. When the ultimate truth is finally understood, we will find that the source, what ever you want to call it, God, Allah etc. and what Science worships, are one and the same.

Science "worships" nothing, so I would agree. your "source" will turn out to be exactly what science worships - nothing.

That's a load of shit.

Folks that are obsessed with science are obsessed with the material world.


However, folks stuck worshiping science, believing the material world is the whole of existence will come to understand what under-girds reality.

Eventually they will find out that the material world is based on energy, and energy on consciousness, IOW, thought.

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

I already have, it was wonderful.

 

[Czernobog]

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

 

[Czernobog]

Science "worships" nothing, so I would agree. your "source" will turn out to be exactly what science worships - nothing.

That's a load of shit.

Folks that are obsessed with science are obsessed with the material world.


However, folks stuck worshiping science, believing the material world is the whole of existence will come to understand what under-girds reality.

Eventually they will find out that the material world is based on energy, and energy on consciousness, IOW, thought.

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

I already have, it was wonderful.

And this is the point at which I call you either a liar, or a madman. Gravity is. It always is. So anyone who claims that they have suspended gravity is a liar. What to prove me wrong? Post a video of you suspending gravity.

 

[MisterBeale]

That's a load of shit.

Folks that are obsessed with science are obsessed with the material world.


However, folks stuck worshiping science, believing the material world is the whole of existence will come to understand what under-girds reality.

Eventually they will find out that the material world is based on energy, and energy on consciousness, IOW, thought.

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

I don't believe in the Hegelian dialectic. It does not, at all times, necessarily have to be one or the other.

I am intelligent enough to not believe in an Anthropocentric God. I know that the inspiration and reason for the foundation of Abrahamic religions, were, at one time, both spiritual and political. Is the mind of "God" in them? Sure. But any competent anthropologist would tell of you of their links to the law of Hammurabi.

I have studied theosophy and the occult to know what the limits of the human thought on the physical world are.

That said, OTH, I do believe it is possible to spirit walk and accomplish pretty much the same thing if you are very well trained. Certain tribes in South America believe THIS is the unreality, and when we sleep, THAT is the reality.

Your arrogance in the belief that YOUR reality is the only acceptable POV is immature. Go back and read what I posted from Kierkegaard.

 

[ding]

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

 

[MisterBeale]

That's a load of shit.

Folks that are obsessed with science are obsessed with the material world.


However, folks stuck worshiping science, believing the material world is the whole of existence will come to understand what under-girds reality.

Eventually they will find out that the material world is based on energy, and energy on consciousness, IOW, thought.

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

I already have, it was wonderful.

And this is the point at which I call you either a liar, or a madman. Gravity is. It always is. So anyone who claims that they have suspended gravity is a liar. What to prove me wrong? Post a video of you suspending gravity.

No it's not. Certain physical laws do not affect different planes of reality in the same way as they do in the third dimension. Your thinking is so limited. Likewise, you cannot operate certain terrestrial technologies on those planes of existence. Also, not everyone has an equal ability to perceive those different planes of reality. All of this you will refute, discard, throw aside. IN ancient days, this would have been taken on. . . hmmm. . what did they call it? Oh yeah, faith.

I don't suppose you have ever wondered why you have never seen a decent picture of a ghost, angel or UFO? Nope, you just think every one is bat shit crazy who claims they have seen them and they don't exist. You haven't seen it, our technology has a hard time capturing it, therefor, it stands to reason in your teeny tiny limited reasoning, it just doesn't exist. Isn't that right? Millions and millions of folks throughout history are nuts, and your world view can't be challenged.

. . . and you don't have a god you're defending.

There are certain realms where our technology doesn't work. i.e., where your ancestors currently dwell.

 

[Czernobog]

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

 

[Czernobog]

You mean that we are obsessed with reality? Yes. Yes, we are.

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

I already have, it was wonderful.

And this is the point at which I call you either a liar, or a madman. Gravity is. It always is. So anyone who claims that they have suspended gravity is a liar. What to prove me wrong? Post a video of you suspending gravity.

No it's not. Certain physical laws do not affect different planes of reality in the same way as they do in the third dimension. Your thinking is so limited. Likewise, you cannot operate certain terrestrial technologies on those planes of existence. Also, not everyone has an equal ability to perceive those different planes of reality. All of this you will refute, discard, throw aside. IN ancient days, this would have been taken on. . . hmmm. . what did they call it? Oh yeah, faith.

I don't suppose you have ever wondered why you have never seen a decent picture of a ghost, angel or UFO? Nope, you just think every one is bat shit crazy who claims they have seen them and they don't exist. You haven't seen it, our technology has a hard time capturing it, therefor, it stands to reason in your teeny tiny limited reasoning, it just doesn't exist. Isn't that right? Millions and millions of folks throughout history are nuts, and your world view can't be challenged.

. . . and you don't have a god you're defending.

There are certain realms where our technology doesn't work. i.e., where your ancestors currently dwell.

Oh! So you dreamed that you could fly. Well, I once dreamed that I had sex with Angelina Jolie. That's how objective reality is different than our dreams, and imagination - I will never have the opportunity to have sex with Angelina Jolie in the real world.

 

[ding]

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Is it my turn now? I think it is awesome that you are finally embracing your militant atheism. Now you don't have to amend your position from there is no baby in the bathwater to religion has done some good because the logical conclusion of your argument is to ban religion. Now you can just come right out and push for banning religion because religion is evil. Never again will you get trapped by saying you only ridicule someone if they start talking about their religion. Now when you troll religious forums for that very purpose, you can be proud that you are doing it. I couldn't be happier that you have come out of the closet. Now you can openly disparage America's founding fathers while embracing the atheist dogma of the founding fathers of communism.

 

[MisterBeale]

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Do you know what happened in Spain when they stopped respecting each other?

If the spiritual folks of this nation decided that respect were not important for others beliefs, and they called what beliefs were really stupid, they would come out and say how stupid and morally degenerate, how absolutely dangerous the atheists were being to have around our kids. Schools would be back in the hands of local control we would be back to having prayer in school within the year.


But Americans do have a tradition of respecting the spiritual beliefs of one another. You are in the minority. That is the problem with some atheists, their overt arrogance.

 

[Czernobog]

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Is it my turn now? I think it is awesome that you are finally embracing your militant atheism. Now you don't have to amend your position from there is no baby in the bathwater to religion has done some good because the logical conclusion of your argument is to ban religion. Now you can just come right out and push for banning religion because religion is evil. Never again will you get trapped by saying you only ridicule someone if they start talking about their religion. Now when you troll religious forums for that very purpose, you can be proud that you are doing it. I couldn't be happier that you have come out of the closet. Now you can openly disparage America's founding fathers while embracing the atheist dogma of the founding fathers of communism.

You are entitled to believe that.

 

[ding]

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Is it my turn now? I think it is awesome that you are finally embracing your militant atheism. Now you don't have to amend your position from there is no baby in the bathwater to religion has done some good because the logical conclusion of your argument is to ban religion. Now you can just come right out and push for banning religion because religion is evil. Never again will you get trapped by saying you only ridicule someone if they start talking about their religion. Now when you troll religious forums for that very purpose, you can be proud that you are doing it. I couldn't be happier that you have come out of the closet. Now you can openly disparage America's founding fathers while embracing the atheist dogma of the founding fathers of communism.

You are entitled to believe that.

 

[MisterBeale]

So, you are under the delusion that your reality is the same as every other creature in the universe eh?

Is your reality the same as someone who is blind, deaf and dumb?

Is it the same as that of an ant? How about for a dolphin which has more sensory organs and a much larger brain than you?


Your perspective on the universe is so very limited. You probably cannot even conceive of the fact that the ground you stand on, or the seat you sit upon has an awareness of it's own, can you?

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

Somehow I think you and ding would come into conflict about the supposed objective "reality" of AGW. That is just but one example.

Damn, you are so full of yourself.

If reality were actually objective, this forum would be no fun at all. . .


I step outside, I say it's cold, my son says it's hot.

You think reality is objective huh?

 

[ding]

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

Somehow I think you and ding would come into conflict about the supposed objective "reality" of AGW. That is just but one example.

Damn, you are so full of yourself.

If reality were actually objective, this forum would be no fun at all. . .


I step outside, I say it's cold, my son says it's hot.

You think reality is objective huh?

I have no doubt we would. I find it hard to believe that he is arguing against subjective reality and for objective reality when he has no clue about how to be objective.

 

[Czernobog]

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Do you know what happened in Spain when they stopped respecting each other?

If the spiritual folks of this nation decided that respect were not important for others beliefs, and they called what beliefs were really stupid, they would come out and say how stupid and morally degenerate, how absolutely dangerous the atheists were being to have around our kids. Schools would be back in the hands of local control we would be back to having prayer in school within the year.


But Americans do have a tradition of respecting the spiritual beliefs of one another. You are in the minority. That is the problem with some atheists, their overt arrogance.

"Spiritual people' of this nation aren't trying to do that?!?! Really? Shall I show you all of the stories about parents having to sue school districts because school personnel keep attempting to do just that?!?! Please. The reason we don't have prayer in school, and teach creationism in our classrooms, is because we have a secular guarantee of the separation of church and state, not because we have respectful religious people who don't try to force religion on all our children.

 

[Czernobog]

Are you under the illusion that reality is subjective? Yell you what. Pray to your God to let you fly, believe with all your heart that gravity is not real, then step off your roof. Then come on back at let us all know how many times you were able to control that subjective reality of yours.

The consequences of breaking physical laws of nature are immediate. Not so for the consequences of violating moral laws of nature. Often times the consequences are not immediately felt. But rest assured that predictable surprises will eventually happen when a deviance is normalized. For instance someone who goes around trolling religious forums, like yourself, for the express purpose of actively seeking out Christians to mock them for their beliefs will inevitably suffer consequences of normalizing failed behaviors.

Your post has absolutely nothing to do with the point I was making in response to misterbeale. Either reality is objective, or subjective. My experiment is meant to demonstrate which.

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

Somehow I think you and ding would come into conflict about the supposed objective "reality" of AGW. That is just but one example.

Damn, you are so full of yourself.

If reality were actually objective, this forum would be no fun at all. . .


I step outside, I say it's cold, my son says it's hot.

You think reality is objective huh?

It doesn't matter what I think. Reality is what it is. That is the beauty of reality. It is, whether you believe in it, or not.

 

[ding]

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Do you know what happened in Spain when they stopped respecting each other?

If the spiritual folks of this nation decided that respect were not important for others beliefs, and they called what beliefs were really stupid, they would come out and say how stupid and morally degenerate, how absolutely dangerous the atheists were being to have around our kids. Schools would be back in the hands of local control we would be back to having prayer in school within the year.


But Americans do have a tradition of respecting the spiritual beliefs of one another. You are in the minority. That is the problem with some atheists, their overt arrogance.

"Spiritual people' of this nation aren't trying to do that?!?! Really? Shall I show you all of the stories about parents having to sue school districts because school personnel keep attempting to do just that?!?! Please. The reason we don't have prayer in school, and teach creationism in our classrooms, is because we have a secular guarantee of the separation of church and state, not because we have respectful religious people who don't try to force religion on all our children.

 

[MisterBeale]

Sure it did, it addressed your breaking physical laws argument and contrasted that with your breaking moral laws as an example. Breaking both laws have consequences. It's just that one is immediate and the other isn't.

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Do you know what happened in Spain when they stopped respecting each other?

If the spiritual folks of this nation decided that respect were not important for others beliefs, and they called what beliefs were really stupid, they would come out and say how stupid and morally degenerate, how absolutely dangerous the atheists were being to have around our kids. Schools would be back in the hands of local control we would be back to having prayer in school within the year.


But Americans do have a tradition of respecting the spiritual beliefs of one another. You are in the minority. That is the problem with some atheists, their overt arrogance.

"Spiritual people' of this nation aren't trying to do that?!?! Really? Shall I show you all of the stories about parents having to sue school districts because school personnel keep attempting to do just that?!?! Please. The reason we don't have prayer in school, and teach creationism in our classrooms, is because we have a secular guarantee of the separation of church and state, not because we have respectful religious people who don't try to force religion on all our children.

Sure, I'm game.

I thought it was the other way around. I thought it was the godless that were suing school districts that had prayer.


On top of that, the Constitution only guarantees that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT would have no established religion.

According to the tenth amendment, it is supposed to leave the states alone.

 

[ding]

This is why the post was not directed to you. You recognise that reality is objective. Misterbeale clearly does not. Which was the point of the post.

lol, you are on your own. I don't attack the beliefs of others, just the bullies that do.

Do you know what happened in Spain when they stopped respecting each other?

If the spiritual folks of this nation decided that respect were not important for others beliefs, and they called what beliefs were really stupid, they would come out and say how stupid and morally degenerate, how absolutely dangerous the atheists were being to have around our kids. Schools would be back in the hands of local control we would be back to having prayer in school within the year.


But Americans do have a tradition of respecting the spiritual beliefs of one another. You are in the minority. That is the problem with some atheists, their overt arrogance.

"Spiritual people' of this nation aren't trying to do that?!?! Really? Shall I show you all of the stories about parents having to sue school districts because school personnel keep attempting to do just that?!?! Please. The reason we don't have prayer in school, and teach creationism in our classrooms, is because we have a secular guarantee of the separation of church and state, not because we have respectful religious people who don't try to force religion on all our children.

Sure, I'm game.

I thought it was the other way around. I thought it was the godless that were suing school districts that had prayer.


On top of that, the Constitution only guarantees that the FEDERAL GOVERNMENT would have no established religion.

According to the tenth amendment, it is supposed to leave the states alone.

I'm impressed. Not many people know what the establishment clause was really about. Would you believe me if I told you that he went to Seminary School?