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Reality check on electric card

Ordinary Guy

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REALITY CHECK: At a neighborhood BBQ I was talking to a neighbor, a BC Hydro Executive. I asked him how that renewable thing was doing. He laughed, then got serious "If you really intend to adopt electric vehicles, you have to face certain realities."

"For example, a home charging system for a Tesla requires 75 amp service. The average house is equipped with 100 amp service. On our small street (approximately 25 homes), the electrical infrastructure would be unable to carry more than three houses with a single Tesla each. For even half the homes to have electric vehicles, the system would be wildly over-loaded. This is the elephant in the room with electric vehicles. Our residential infrastructure cannot bear the load."

So, as our genius elected officials promote this nonsense, not only are we being urged to buy these things and replace our reliable, cheap generating systems with expensive new windmills and solar cells, but we will also have to renovate our entire delivery system! This later "investment" will not be revealed until we're so far down this deadend road that it will be presented with an 'OOPS...!' and a shrug.

Eric test drove the Chevy Volt at the invitation of General Motors and he writes, "For four days in a row, the fully charged battery lasted only 25 miles before the Volt switched to the reserve gasoline engine." Eric calculated the car got 30 mpg including the 25 miles it ran on the battery. So, the range including the 9-gallon gas tank and the 16 kwh battery is approximately 270 miles.

It will take you 4.5 hours to drive 270 miles at 60 mph. Then add 10 hours to charge the battery and you have a total trip time of 14.5 hours. In a typical road trip, your average speed (including charging time) would be 20 mph.

According to General Motors, the Volt battery holds 16 kwh of electricity. It takes a full 10 hours to charge a drained battery. The cost for the electricity to charge the Volt is never mentioned, so I looked up what I pay for electricity.

I pay approximately (it varies with amount used and the seasons) $1.16 per kwh. 16 kwh x $1.16 per kwh = $18.56 to charge the battery. $18.56 per charge divided by 25 miles = $0.74 per mile to operate the Volt using the battery. Compare this to a similar size car with a gasoline engine that gets only 32 mpg. $3.19 per gallon divided by 32 Mpg = $0.10 per mile.

The gasoline powered car costs about $25,000 while the Volt costs $46,000 plus. So, the Government wants us to pay twice as much for a car, that costs more than seven times as much to run and takes three times longer to drive across the country.

WAKE UP NORTH AMERICA!!!!!!!
 

Votto

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Not to worry, Biden says he will have people fly electric planes instead.

Besides, I'm sure he will still be able to drive the old fashion gas cars like the rest of the political elite.
 

Old Rocks

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REALITY CHECK: At a neighborhood BBQ I was talking to a neighbor, a BC Hydro Executive. I asked him how that renewable thing was doing. He laughed, then got serious "If you really intend to adopt electric vehicles, you have to face certain realities."

"For example, a home charging system for a Tesla requires 75 amp service. The average house is equipped with 100 amp service. On our small street (approximately 25 homes), the electrical infrastructure would be unable to carry more than three houses with a single Tesla each. For even half the homes to have electric vehicles, the system would be wildly over-loaded. This is the elephant in the room with electric vehicles. Our residential infrastructure cannot bear the load."

So, as our genius elected officials promote this nonsense, not only are we being urged to buy these things and replace our reliable, cheap generating systems with expensive new windmills and solar cells, but we will also have to renovate our entire delivery system! This later "investment" will not be revealed until we're so far down this deadend road that it will be presented with an 'OOPS...!' and a shrug.

Eric test drove the Chevy Volt at the invitation of General Motors and he writes, "For four days in a row, the fully charged battery lasted only 25 miles before the Volt switched to the reserve gasoline engine." Eric calculated the car got 30 mpg including the 25 miles it ran on the battery. So, the range including the 9-gallon gas tank and the 16 kwh battery is approximately 270 miles.

It will take you 4.5 hours to drive 270 miles at 60 mph. Then add 10 hours to charge the battery and you have a total trip time of 14.5 hours. In a typical road trip, your average speed (including charging time) would be 20 mph.

According to General Motors, the Volt battery holds 16 kwh of electricity. It takes a full 10 hours to charge a drained battery. The cost for the electricity to charge the Volt is never mentioned, so I looked up what I pay for electricity.

I pay approximately (it varies with amount used and the seasons) $1.16 per kwh. 16 kwh x $1.16 per kwh = $18.56 to charge the battery. $18.56 per charge divided by 25 miles = $0.74 per mile to operate the Volt using the battery. Compare this to a similar size car with a gasoline engine that gets only 32 mpg. $3.19 per gallon divided by 32 Mpg = $0.10 per mile.

The gasoline powered car costs about $25,000 while the Volt costs $46,000 plus. So, the Government wants us to pay twice as much for a car, that costs more than seven times as much to run and takes three times longer to drive across the country.

WAKE UP NORTH AMERICA!!!!!!!
What the fuck, man? First you talk about the Tesla, and then switch to the Volt. Two very different animals. Tesla has superchargers all over this nation that will charge your battery 80% in 30 minutes. You pay $1.16 per kw? Lordy, where the hell do you live. This is what we pay in Portland, Oregon;

Basic Service for residential and small business customers
On Basic Service, your electricity price equals your actual usage each month billed at the Basic Service rate: Up to 1000 kWh: 6.329 ¢ per kWh. 7.051 ¢ per kWh.

So for fully charging a 100 kw/hr Tesla S battery, that is $6.30. So you have an older Tesla, and only get 300 miles per charge. So you pay only a bit over 2 cents per mile. And no oil changes. Far less maintenance than and ICE.

At present, EV's are more expensive to purchase. However, by 2025, they will cost the same or even less than a ICE of equal class.
 

Old Rocks

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Not to worry, Biden says he will have people fly electric planes instead.

Besides, I'm sure he will still be able to drive the old fashion gas cars like the rest of the political elite.
Why should he drive anything but a Tesla S Plaid. Fastest production car on the planet, but a sweet pussy cat driving through the grocery store parking lot. Electric flying vehicle? Of course;

 
OP
Ordinary Guy

Ordinary Guy

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What the fuck, man? First you talk about the Tesla, and then switch to the Volt. Two very different animals. Tesla has superchargers all over this nation that will charge your battery 80% in 30 minutes. You pay $1.16 per kw? Lordy, where the hell do you live. This is what we pay in Portland, Oregon;

Basic Service for residential and small business customers
On Basic Service, your electricity price equals your actual usage each month billed at the Basic Service rate: Up to 1000 kWh: 6.329 ¢ per kWh. 7.051 ¢ per kWh.

So for fully charging a 100 kw/hr Tesla S battery, that is $6.30. So you have an older Tesla, and only get 300 miles per charge. So you pay only a bit over 2 cents per mile. And no oil changes. Far less maintenance than and ICE.

At present, EV's are more expensive to purchase. However, by 2025, they will cost the same or even less than a ICE of equal class.
no they won't will be even more expensive with inflation, tax credits, and pork spending
 

Tax Man

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Most everyone here has 200 amp service. I have solar that puts out 50 amps so my total capacity is 250 amps.
 

HenryBHough

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Most everyone here has 200 amp service. I have solar that puts out 50 amps so my total capacity is 250 amps.

Somehow the picture has not been painted so as to make it all clear.

In this instance adding a little more solar capacity would make sense - enough to run the charger sufficiently well to keep the vehicle usable. Who knows, maybe someday there'll be a mandate that every home be roofed with solar panels. What a great government giveaway......to the Chinese Solar Panel industry.

Moving right along....

Even the more typical American home with 100 Amp/240 Volt service would be challenged IF charging the typical electric vehicle of a winter evening when the electric stove is drawing about30-40 amps (burners,not oven) and you decide to dry a load of clothes.

But people do that and the 100 Amp main breaker doesn't pop. It may be close but it doesn't pop.

So that's a potential problem but not the hidden one.

In most subdivisions a much higher voltage is up there on the pole but it's transformed to a lower voltage - typically 240VAC - with higher available Amperage. That's distributed differently according to the age of the subivision. The variables are the capability of the transformer and the number of dwellings effectively served by each transformer (throw in the gauge of the connecting wires).

Design of that very local part of the system is NOT based on the idea that every served unit is going to be drawing its full 100-Amp load at the same time. That would be very expensive overkill.

In an area where 200-Amp service commonly is used per dwelling the sizing of the cabling and transformers will have taken that into account but still not based on 100% of the units running at 100% simultaneous capacity.

If/when local service areas (off the same transformer) routinely approach their design maximum load something has to give. It won't typically be the main breaker on the individual unit. The cabling to the pole (or underground connection) typically won't overheat. But the wires (OK, cables) from the transformer will heat. Most likely scenario: The cumulative load of all the units served by that transformer will exceed the capacity of the transformer. In almost all cases each transformer is protected by fuses right at the transformer.

Pop one of those and it's a job for a line crew.

It's not going to happen all at once but the number of fuses in need of replacement will slowly incease as cumulative loads grow.

It's something that could be dealt with IF anyone could accurately estimate the future capacity requirements; if the proper size transformers were available; if the utility could stand the cost of the upgrades OR whether government allowed the utilities to raise rated to cover those costs.

Experience: A facility I help maintain (pro-bono) recently had a transformer fail. Not overload. Age. The top rusted through and water got into the windings. Took about 3 hours from when utility was notified until they were on site to assess the problem. 5-minutes to find the problem.

Not a big problem since there was a backup generator on site. It ran for 5 solid days while the utility searched for a replacement transformer. Had to fill the tank (500-gallons - it's a big broadcast site) twice at huge cost. Finally a used transformer was found out-of-state and flown in. Installation took under an hour. But it's an OLD transformer that had been in a scrap pile. There was one. Just one. The other two transformers (it's 3-phase) are heavily rusted. Best the utility could do was spear the top with some fiberous roofing compound and hope for the best.

They're still trying to buy three new transformers (wouldn't even consider adding a fourth one to stock). It's been since June and cannot get any manufacturer to commit to delivery. Oh, the particular size transformer is no longer made in The U.S. Even China is backlogged.

Only advice I have been able to give without laughing is that the broadcaster buy a backup to the backup generator and get an additional 2,000 gallon fuel storage capacity. Now. Before winter closes the site. Strangely there are multiple generators of the right size in stock within 1,000 miles and a fabricator in-state says they have stock to turn out 4-500 gallon EPA compliant tanks within 10 days.

But nobody's buying - cost ridiculously out of signt.

Welcome to Xiden's New America!
 
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Natural Citizen

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Tax Man

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Most people have a backup generator and with 200 amp mains and solar with battery backup having an electric car here is not a problem.
 

HenryBHough

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Most people have a backup generator and with 200 amp mains and solar with battery backup having an electric car here is not a problem.
Back generators that run on pollution-free Unicorn farts? Or they just ordinary hypocrites?
 

Toffeenut Baconsmuggler

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Not to worry, Biden says he will have people fly electric planes instead.

Besides, I'm sure he will still be able to drive the old fashion gas cars like the rest of the political elite.


 

Toffeenut Baconsmuggler

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The solution isn't battery chargers/car chargers.........it's making the vehicle itself, charge itself while driving.

But they will NEVER do that, because they are making BILLIONS a year on this "green energy" bullshit, that pumps out more toxic chemicals into the environment than coal or oil ever did!!! At least coal and oil is "biodegradable".........plastics, battery acids, and other toxic things used in these cars and their batteries are not.......they are flat out deadly poisons.
 

miketex

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The solution isn't battery chargers/car chargers.........it's making the vehicle itself, charge itself while driving.
Yeah, I got an idea, why not put this thing on there that the motor turns and it creates electricity? We could even call it an alternator!
 

Rigby5

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What the fuck, man? First you talk about the Tesla, and then switch to the Volt. Two very different animals. Tesla has superchargers all over this nation that will charge your battery 80% in 30 minutes. You pay $1.16 per kw? Lordy, where the hell do you live. This is what we pay in Portland, Oregon;

Basic Service for residential and small business customers
On Basic Service, your electricity price equals your actual usage each month billed at the Basic Service rate: Up to 1000 kWh: 6.329 ¢ per kWh. 7.051 ¢ per kWh.

So for fully charging a 100 kw/hr Tesla S battery, that is $6.30. So you have an older Tesla, and only get 300 miles per charge. So you pay only a bit over 2 cents per mile. And no oil changes. Far less maintenance than and ICE.

At present, EV's are more expensive to purchase. However, by 2025, they will cost the same or even less than a ICE of equal class.

While the average cost for electricity is about 13 cents per kwatt, is still about $17 per charge, so is slightly more than a good mileage internal combustion car.
{...

Just How Much Does it Cost to Charge a Tesla at home?​

Utilizing a Level 1 or Level 2 battery charger to charge your Tesla in your home will cost about $15-$18 based upon the price that we set at approximately $0.14 per kWh. Bear in mind, this expense will depend upon your state’s electrical power rates, time of day, and just how much you charge.
...}

And the reality is that the faster the charge, the higher the cost and shorter the battery life span.

If EVs were to ever become popular, the price would greatly rise, not drop, because they are dependent upon many rare earth elements.

Nor is electrical production at all clean. Most electricity in CA for example, still comes from out of state coal power plants that CA leases over half their electricity from.

Natural gas power plants actually are even dirtier than coal, because natural gas fracking allows huge amount of natural gas to escape into the atmosphere.
 

Rigby5

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Most people have a backup generator and with 200 amp mains and solar with battery backup having an electric car here is not a problem.
Solar does not help because EVs need to charge at night.
Batteries have a 50% energy loss both in and out, so are very wasteful.
Having 200 amp mains does not help if most people start continuously drawing as much as EVs do.
The whole grid still has to more than double.
That 200 amp main is for short peaks, not continuous use like an EV would be.
 

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