Quid Pro Joe- Busted!!

[sakinago]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

Lol, fake news.

I’d be shocked if this was fake. Again leaked by a Ukrainian member of parliament.

 

[Rambunctious]

Barr should tear into this like a monkey on a cupcake....but he won't...

I'm not so sure about that. I think Biden is probably guilty of Abuse of Office (imagine that) but as we know, that ain't a crime. Rudy Giuliani turned over a bunch of information to the DOJ, there might not be a prosecutable crime to charge Biden with, but I suspect that one way or another we're gonna find out what the facts and details were. And I believe the Senate is looking into the Ukraine affair too.

As long as the truth comes out before the election...

 

[Coyote]

He was investing Hunter Biden's company, therefore he was corrupt. Pretty much as simple as that.

No he wasn’t.

 

[Rambunctious]

This is what they accused Trump for....and all we will get are Lindsey side show hearings until it goes away.....

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

No, there isn't.

“The recordings don’t appear to contain anything that would incriminate Biden or his son and were seen by some observers as a political effort to help U.S. President Donald Trump’s reelection bid.

The Ukrainian investigation was opened on treason and abuse of office charges, indicating it was mostly directed against former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Poroshenko rejected the tapes as a fabrication by pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.

There was no immediate sign that the probe could be directed against Biden. The Prosecutor General’s Office gave no further details.”

Ukraine to investigate leaked tapes with ex-president, Biden

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said Wednesday that prosecutors have opened a criminal inquiry into leaked tapes that allegedly feature the country's former leader discussing conditions for a $1 billion loan with former U.S.

apnews.com

Of course, most on the reprehensible right will attempt to twist, spin, and distort the truth into some ridiculous lie conservatives will seek to propagate.

 

[Oddball]

I totally believe this because it's on creativedestructionmedia.com and no place else

He is on tape here too- bragging about it...



you can choose to believe what you want. The man is corrupt.

He is bragging about forcing Ukraine to get rid of a corrupt prosecutor under orders from the President of the United States and the US Congress. What you showed was a first class statesman in action. You had damn well better hope that one doesn't show up to the Debates.

The US Congress does not get to decide anyway. That just proves your stupidity at making up excuses.

Congress can remove the funds. Even the President can't do that. Just proves that you are trying to rewrite the Constitution for your own ends.

I totally believe this because it's on creativedestructionmedia.com and no place else

He is on tape here too- bragging about it...



you can choose to believe what you want. The man is corrupt.

He is bragging about forcing Ukraine to get rid of a corrupt prosecutor under orders from the President of the United States and the US Congress. What you showed was a first class statesman in action. You had damn well better hope that one doesn't show up to the Debates.

Heard that leftbat blabbering point a hundred times....How are Ukrainian internal affairs any of the meat puppet ******'s business?

When we are funding their government, that’s when dumb ass.

Oh, so "quid pro quo".

Sound familiar?....Isn't that what you moonbats were shitting chickens about Trump doing just a few short months ago?

Trump was using a quid pro quo to attack his political rival. Corrupt.

Biden was using a quid pro quo to get a corrupt prosecutor removed from a country that badly needs justice reform. Good governance.

Y’all never seemed to grasp the difference.

Quid pro quo is frequently used in diplomatic negotiations. Where it gets you in trouble is when it's used to leverage personal gain. They don't seem to get that distinction.

Yet you freaks shit chickens for weeks on end about Trump engaging in the "frequently used" behavior.

Were it not for double standards, you'd have no standards at all.

Standards are pretty clear in this regard. Personal gain - ie - using the power of your office to leverage dirt on your personal political opponent vs. acting on behalf of US policy and interests.

That's why Trump got convicted in the Senate and removed from office.

Oh wait.

 

[sakinago]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

No, there isn't.

“The recordings don’t appear to contain anything that would incriminate Biden or his son and were seen by some observers as a political effort to help U.S. President Donald Trump’s reelection bid.

The Ukrainian investigation was opened on treason and abuse of office charges, indicating it was mostly directed against former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Poroshenko rejected the tapes as a fabrication by pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.

There was no immediate sign that the probe could be directed against Biden. The Prosecutor General’s Office gave no further details.”

Ukraine to investigate leaked tapes with ex-president, Biden

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said Wednesday that prosecutors have opened a criminal inquiry into leaked tapes that allegedly feature the country's former leader discussing conditions for a $1 billion loan with former U.S.

apnews.com

Of course, most on the reprehensible right will attempt to twist, spin, and distort the truth into some ridiculous lie conservatives will seek to propagate.

I posted the tape, listen for yourself.

Also, this article is some grade A BS. No mention of the fact there is an “American 1” in the case that they listed as a possible defendant, and they basically admit that it’s Biden. They also go with what the main guy being investigated, Poroshenko, claims as evidence. Of course he’s going to claim it’s fake, he’s basically admitting to his crime on that tape. Great journalism. OJ says he didn’t kill Nicole, case closed. It doesn’t talk about how POROSHENKO HIMSELF ADMITS SHOKIN COMMITED NO WRONGDOING. It also says, “nothing appears to be incriminating in the call”...when it’s a pretty clear quid pro quo

 

[Coyote]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

 

[Coyote]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

No, there isn't.

“The recordings don’t appear to contain anything that would incriminate Biden or his son and were seen by some observers as a political effort to help U.S. President Donald Trump’s reelection bid.

The Ukrainian investigation was opened on treason and abuse of office charges, indicating it was mostly directed against former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Poroshenko rejected the tapes as a fabrication by pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.

There was no immediate sign that the probe could be directed against Biden. The Prosecutor General’s Office gave no further details.”

Ukraine to investigate leaked tapes with ex-president, Biden

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said Wednesday that prosecutors have opened a criminal inquiry into leaked tapes that allegedly feature the country's former leader discussing conditions for a $1 billion loan with former U.S.

apnews.com

Of course, most on the reprehensible right will attempt to twist, spin, and distort the truth into some ridiculous lie conservatives will seek to propagate.

I posted the tape, listen for yourself.

It is heavily edited, any chance of getting it in entirety?

 

[Kilroy2]

smoking gun

An audio tape has been released by a Ukrainian politician which details conversations between corrupt and discredited former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko and U.S. presidential candidate Joe Biden. John Kerry is also on the audio tape. The men discuss the firing of then Prosecutor Shokin for corrupt reasons, in order to prevent an investigation into Biden’s son, Hunter Biden, and other criminal actions.

Here is where the messed up in there story. Skokin was suppose to investigate the OWNER of the company. This was because of funds sent to the company by the European community to help Ukraine. The money disappeared. The world community tried to get the Ukraine government to investigate and get information about what happen to this money. Ukraine did not cooperate and the money got moved out of Ukraine into personal accounts of the Owner in some country.

Hunter was not under investigation in 2016. The investigation was into the owner of the company. This is your story that can't even get the facts straight.

They have this tape that no one has seen or heard. Much of the article is on stuff already known. Recordings containing edited conversations between the two while in office published by Ukrainian associate of Rudy Giuliani

Biden was under Obama orders was to get them to start an investigation on the owner of the company that Biden son worked for. They were holding up funds until they could get the investigation started but it never was and the money disappeared.

The difference between Biden and Trump. Biden was working to start an investigation on the employer of his son.

Trump was working to get an investigation on Biden who was his political opponent in the US election.

See the difference.

 

[sakinago]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

No, there isn't.

“The recordings don’t appear to contain anything that would incriminate Biden or his son and were seen by some observers as a political effort to help U.S. President Donald Trump’s reelection bid.

The Ukrainian investigation was opened on treason and abuse of office charges, indicating it was mostly directed against former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Poroshenko rejected the tapes as a fabrication by pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.

There was no immediate sign that the probe could be directed against Biden. The Prosecutor General’s Office gave no further details.”

Ukraine to investigate leaked tapes with ex-president, Biden

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said Wednesday that prosecutors have opened a criminal inquiry into leaked tapes that allegedly feature the country's former leader discussing conditions for a $1 billion loan with former U.S.

apnews.com

Of course, most on the reprehensible right will attempt to twist, spin, and distort the truth into some ridiculous lie conservatives will seek to propagate.

I posted the tape, listen for yourself.

It is heavily edited, any chance of getting it in entirety?

Would love that myself. But that’s def Biden. Deep fakes are pretty good, but not that good. Heavily edited is also such a BS line you could use for anything. You could say that about any article, or almost any piece of media. The question is not editing, it’s content and context. Both don’t look pretty as of now, but yes, I would love to hear/read the full transcripts.

 

[sakinago]

I totally believe this because it's on creativedestructionmedia.com and no place else

It’s on multiple places.

 

[task0778]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

What court order was that? From what I saw, the investigation was dormant, meaning it wasn't concluded. And that's according to one Ukrainian guy, who knows what the truth really is over there? Here's what I do know for certain: Hunter Biden was paid a shitload of money to be on Bruisma's Board, despite the fact that he didn't know diddly about natural gas or about Ukraine. But what he did know was his father's phone number, that was the only thing of value he had to that company, and they used it to avoid any investigations.

Funny thing - Congress passes an appropriation of $1 billion in aid to Ukraine but Biden strong-arms the Ukrainians to fire Shokin within 6 hours or they don't get the money. Doesn't that sound like the exact same thing the democrats accused Trump of and impeached him for? Abuse of office, quid pro quo indeed. Since when do we conduct foreign affairs that way? What was the rush, where was the fire? If Biden got Shokin fired for not investigating corruption as he says, then why did he have to get rid of the guy that quickly? There were other avenues of communication that the US Gov't could have used, no?

I think there had to be a reason for Biden to take the action he did. Maybe Shokin was investigating Burisma or about to, maybe not but I think the message had to be sent: leave my son's company alone or else you ain't getting money from us. That whole country was one big cesspool of corruption, probably still is. It's way of life in some places, for all I know maybe Shokin was trying to shake the Burisma company down and so Hunter go on the phone with dad and Shokin got stomped on.

 

[Coyote]

It’s actually happening. And there’s a recording of Biden on the phone with the Ukrainian president asking if the AG was fired, the president responds that yes he is, but the AG didn’t do anything wrong.

Would someone care to tell me how this AG was corrupt?

No, there isn't.

“The recordings don’t appear to contain anything that would incriminate Biden or his son and were seen by some observers as a political effort to help U.S. President Donald Trump’s reelection bid.

The Ukrainian investigation was opened on treason and abuse of office charges, indicating it was mostly directed against former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko. Poroshenko rejected the tapes as a fabrication by pro-Russian forces in Ukraine.

There was no immediate sign that the probe could be directed against Biden. The Prosecutor General’s Office gave no further details.”

Ukraine to investigate leaked tapes with ex-president, Biden

MINSK, Belarus (AP) — Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy said Wednesday that prosecutors have opened a criminal inquiry into leaked tapes that allegedly feature the country's former leader discussing conditions for a $1 billion loan with former U.S.

apnews.com

Of course, most on the reprehensible right will attempt to twist, spin, and distort the truth into some ridiculous lie conservatives will seek to propagate.

I posted the tape, listen for yourself.

It is heavily edited, any chance of getting it in entirety?

Would love that myself. But that’s def Biden. Deep fakes are pretty good, but not that good. Heavily edited is also such a BS line you could use for anything. You could say that about any article, or almost any piece of media. The question is not editing, it’s content and context. Both don’t look pretty as of now, but yes, I would love to hear/read the full transcripts.

I would say the question is also editing - what's taken out? What gaps are there that add add context? For example is this Biden carrying out the foreign policy objectives of the administration?

 

[Coyote]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

What court order was that? From what I saw, the investigation was dormant, meaning it wasn't concluded. And that's according to one Ukrainian guy, who knows what the truth really is over there? Here's what I do know for certain: Hunter Biden was paid a shitload of money to be on Bruisma's Board, despite the fact that he didn't know diddly about natural gas or about Ukraine. But what he did know was his father's phone number, that was the only thing of value he had to that company, and they used it to avoid any investigations.

...a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016 because no evidence of wrongdoing had been presented.

Funny thing - Congress passes an appropriation of $1 billion in aid to Ukraine but Biden strong-arms the Ukrainians to fire Shokin within 6 hours or they don't get the money. Doesn't that sound like the exact same thing the democrats accused Trump of and impeached him for? Abuse of office, quid pro quo indeed. Since when do we conduct foreign affairs that way? What was the rush, where was the fire? If Biden got Shokin fired for not investigating corruption as he says, then why did he have to get rid of the guy that quickly? There were other avenues of communication that the US Gov't could have used, no?

Biden was carrying out the administrations foreign policy objectives at the time - supported, might add, by Congressional Republicans as well as EU, IMF, and Ukraine's anti-corruption groups. It wasn't hidden, it was perfectly transparent. In fact - it wasn't a "6 hr" thing - it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics. Good timeline here: timeline-trump-giuliani-bidens-and-ukrainegate

Now...you want to talk about Trump's phone call to Ukraine? How transparent it was? How it was just carrying out US policy with bipartisan support? Something like that?

I think there had to be a reason for Biden to take the action he did. Maybe Shokin was investigating Burisma or about to, maybe not but I think the message had to be sent: leave my son's company alone or else you ain't getting money from us. That whole country was one big cesspool of corruption, probably still is. It's way of life in some places, for all I know maybe Shokin was trying to shake the Burisma company down and so Hunter go on the phone with dad and Shokin got stomped on.

Yes there was a reason. US Foreign Policy. Making aid to Ukraine contingent on fighting corruption (otherwise it's just wasted). Hunter is just a red herring. Foreign Soviet Bloc countries will often try to hire people with influential ties - either to create the impression they are above board and honest or as a way of seeking influence. Corruption is a huge issues in all those countries.

 

[IM2]

FLASHBACK: Audio Tape Released Between Corrupt Former Ukrainian President Poroshenko And Joe Biden Discussing Corrupt Activities. John Kerry Also On Tape. - CDM - Human Reporters • Not Machines

BREAKING: Audio Tape Released Between Corrupt Former Ukrainian President Poroshenko And Joe Biden Discussing Corrupt Activities. John Kerry Also On Tape.

creativedestructionmedia.com

on tape bragging before cameras about getting the Ukrainian prosecutor fired concerning his son's investigation at few years back.

Except that is not what was done.

 

[IM2]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

What court order was that? From what I saw, the investigation was dormant, meaning it wasn't concluded. And that's according to one Ukrainian guy, who knows what the truth really is over there? Here's what I do know for certain: Hunter Biden was paid a shitload of money to be on Bruisma's Board, despite the fact that he didn't know diddly about natural gas or about Ukraine. But what he did know was his father's phone number, that was the only thing of value he had to that company, and they used it to avoid any investigations.

...a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016 because no evidence of wrongdoing had been presented.

Funny thing - Congress passes an appropriation of $1 billion in aid to Ukraine but Biden strong-arms the Ukrainians to fire Shokin within 6 hours or they don't get the money. Doesn't that sound like the exact same thing the democrats accused Trump of and impeached him for? Abuse of office, quid pro quo indeed. Since when do we conduct foreign affairs that way? What was the rush, where was the fire? If Biden got Shokin fired for not investigating corruption as he says, then why did he have to get rid of the guy that quickly? There were other avenues of communication that the US Gov't could have used, no?

Biden was carrying out the administrations foreign policy objectives at the time - supported, might add, by Congressional Republicans as well as EU, IMF, and Ukraine's anti-corruption groups. It wasn't hidden, it was perfectly transparent. In fact - it wasn't a "6 hr" thing - it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics. Good timeline here: timeline-trump-giuliani-bidens-and-ukrainegate

Now...you want to talk about Trump's phone call to Ukraine? How transparent it was? How it was just carrying out US policy with bipartisan support? Something like that?

I think there had to be a reason for Biden to take the action he did. Maybe Shokin was investigating Burisma or about to, maybe not but I think the message had to be sent: leave my son's company alone or else you ain't getting money from us. That whole country was one big cesspool of corruption, probably still is. It's way of life in some places, for all I know maybe Shokin was trying to shake the Burisma company down and so Hunter go on the phone with dad and Shokin got stomped on.

Yes there was a reason. US Foreign Policy. Making aid to Ukraine contingent on fighting corruption (otherwise it's just wasted). Hunter is just a red herring. Foreign Soviet Bloc countries will often try to hire people with influential ties - either to create the impression they are above board and honest or as a way of seeking influence. Corruption is a huge issues in all those countries.

The Ukrainian RADA, or Parliament voted Shokin out as well.

 

[task0778]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

What court order was that? From what I saw, the investigation was dormant, meaning it wasn't concluded. And that's according to one Ukrainian guy, who knows what the truth really is over there? Here's what I do know for certain: Hunter Biden was paid a shitload of money to be on Bruisma's Board, despite the fact that he didn't know diddly about natural gas or about Ukraine. But what he did know was his father's phone number, that was the only thing of value he had to that company, and they used it to avoid any investigations.

...a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016 because no evidence of wrongdoing had been presented.

Funny thing - Congress passes an appropriation of $1 billion in aid to Ukraine but Biden strong-arms the Ukrainians to fire Shokin within 6 hours or they don't get the money. Doesn't that sound like the exact same thing the democrats accused Trump of and impeached him for? Abuse of office, quid pro quo indeed. Since when do we conduct foreign affairs that way? What was the rush, where was the fire? If Biden got Shokin fired for not investigating corruption as he says, then why did he have to get rid of the guy that quickly? There were other avenues of communication that the US Gov't could have used, no?

Biden was carrying out the administrations foreign policy objectives at the time - supported, might add, by Congressional Republicans as well as EU, IMF, and Ukraine's anti-corruption groups. It wasn't hidden, it was perfectly transparent. In fact - it wasn't a "6 hr" thing - it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics. Good timeline here: timeline-trump-giuliani-bidens-and-ukrainegate

Now...you want to talk about Trump's phone call to Ukraine? How transparent it was? How it was just carrying out US policy with bipartisan support? Something like that?

I think there had to be a reason for Biden to take the action he did. Maybe Shokin was investigating Burisma or about to, maybe not but I think the message had to be sent: leave my son's company alone or else you ain't getting money from us. That whole country was one big cesspool of corruption, probably still is. It's way of life in some places, for all I know maybe Shokin was trying to shake the Burisma company down and so Hunter go on the phone with dad and Shokin got stomped on.

Yes there was a reason. US Foreign Policy. Making aid to Ukraine contingent on fighting corruption (otherwise it's just wasted). Hunter is just a red herring. Foreign Soviet Bloc countries will often try to hire people with influential ties - either to create the impression they are above board and honest or as a way of seeking influence. Corruption is a huge issues in all those countries.

So, a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016, but Shokin was fired in March 2016 and you're saying "The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired." Now who's lying?

According to Biden himself, it WAS a 6-hr thing, I'm sure you've heard him bragging about it on a video tape. "it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics", what a bunch of crap. There was pressure to fix the corruption but there wasn't a long series of tactics to get Shokin fired. Shokin said he was about to go after Burisma, somone else says he wasn't. It's real convenient to say well this guy is telling the truth cuz he fits my narrative but this other guy isn't cuz he doesn't.

Was that Biden's call to make? Or Obama's? Congress appropriated the aid right? Is was their job to delay or cancel it if they weren't satisfied with the efforts to fight corruption in Ukraine, not Biden's. Nice try to distinguish Biden's actions from Trump's, though. You're saying Biden had no personal reasons for doing what he did, I'm saying something really fishy was going on and Hunter Biden was in the middle of it. Honestly, Biden tells them to fire somebody in 6 hours or they don't get the appropriated aid, and you don't see that as questionable?

 

[Coyote]

Why do Trumpkins lie so much? The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired. There was zero evidence it was being reopened at that time either. So why tbe incessant lying?

Timeline: Trump, Giuliani, Bidens, and Ukraine (updated)

A chronology of "Ukrainegate" and the Trump-Giuliani pressure on Ukraine to investigate former Vice President and 2020 presidential candidate Joe Biden.

www.justsecurity.org

What court order was that? From what I saw, the investigation was dormant, meaning it wasn't concluded. And that's according to one Ukrainian guy, who knows what the truth really is over there? Here's what I do know for certain: Hunter Biden was paid a shitload of money to be on Bruisma's Board, despite the fact that he didn't know diddly about natural gas or about Ukraine. But what he did know was his father's phone number, that was the only thing of value he had to that company, and they used it to avoid any investigations.

...a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016 because no evidence of wrongdoing had been presented.

Funny thing - Congress passes an appropriation of $1 billion in aid to Ukraine but Biden strong-arms the Ukrainians to fire Shokin within 6 hours or they don't get the money. Doesn't that sound like the exact same thing the democrats accused Trump of and impeached him for? Abuse of office, quid pro quo indeed. Since when do we conduct foreign affairs that way? What was the rush, where was the fire? If Biden got Shokin fired for not investigating corruption as he says, then why did he have to get rid of the guy that quickly? There were other avenues of communication that the US Gov't could have used, no?

Biden was carrying out the administrations foreign policy objectives at the time - supported, might add, by Congressional Republicans as well as EU, IMF, and Ukraine's anti-corruption groups. It wasn't hidden, it was perfectly transparent. In fact - it wasn't a "6 hr" thing - it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics. Good timeline here: timeline-trump-giuliani-bidens-and-ukrainegate

Now...you want to talk about Trump's phone call to Ukraine? How transparent it was? How it was just carrying out US policy with bipartisan support? Something like that?

I think there had to be a reason for Biden to take the action he did. Maybe Shokin was investigating Burisma or about to, maybe not but I think the message had to be sent: leave my son's company alone or else you ain't getting money from us. That whole country was one big cesspool of corruption, probably still is. It's way of life in some places, for all I know maybe Shokin was trying to shake the Burisma company down and so Hunter go on the phone with dad and Shokin got stomped on.

Yes there was a reason. US Foreign Policy. Making aid to Ukraine contingent on fighting corruption (otherwise it's just wasted). Hunter is just a red herring. Foreign Soviet Bloc countries will often try to hire people with influential ties - either to create the impression they are above board and honest or as a way of seeking influence. Corruption is a huge issues in all those countries.

So, a court in Kyiv ordered the case closed in September 2016, but Shokin was fired in March 2016 and you're saying "The Burisma investigation was long concluded, per a court order, by the time the prosecutor was fired." Now who's lying?

You're right - it was dormant, but - it was Shokin who was stymying corruption investigations and it was dormant at the time Biden issued the ultimatum. From the same link:

Vitaliy Kasko, a former deputy prosecutor general who had worked under Shokin and resigned in frustration at his stymying of corruption investigations, told Bloomberg News (in a May 2019 interview) that the office’s probe into Burisma Holdings had been long dormant by the time Joe Biden issued his ultimatum in 2016. “There was no pressure from anyone from the U.S. to close cases against” Burisma owner Zlochevskiy, Bloomberg quoted Kasko as saying. “It was shelved by Ukrainian prosecutors in 2014 and through 2015,” Kasko said.

“Shokin was not investigating. He didn’t want to investigate Burisma,” Daria Kaleniuk a leading Ukrainian anti-corruption advocate, told the Washington Post. “And Shokin was fired not because he wanted to do that investigation, but quite to the contrary, because he failed that investigation.”

According to Biden himself, it WAS a 6-hr thing, I'm sure you've heard him bragging about it on a video tape. "it was the end point of a long series of pressure tactics", what a bunch of crap. There was pressure to fix the corruption but there wasn't a long series of tactics to get Shokin fired. Shokin said he was about to go after Burisma, somone else says he wasn't. It's real convenient to say well this guy is telling the truth cuz he fits my narrative but this other guy isn't cuz he doesn't.

According to Biden the ultimatum was. You're ignoring all the lead up to it, a quite extensive lead up. Shokin was NOT going after Burisma, or pretty much anyone. That was the problem. It's not just "someone" saying it, it's multiple people saying it including leading anti-corruption activists. So...who's being convenient here?

Was that Biden's call to make? Or Obama's? Congress appropriated the aid right? Is was their job to delay or cancel it if they weren't satisfied with the efforts to fight corruption in Ukraine, not Biden's. Nice try to distinguish Biden's actions from Trump's, though. You're saying Biden had no personal reasons for doing what he did, I'm saying something really fishy was going on and Hunter Biden was in the middle of it. Honestly, Biden tells them to fire somebody in 6 hours or they don't get the appropriated aid, and you don't see that as questionable?

Again - you have no idea of the lead up to this or, probably, how international negotiations work. You are just assuming he did this on his own without providing any evidence to support the claim.

I'm saying if you think Biden has personal gain - you need to prove it. And you haven't. All you've done is said - essentially - the optics look bad.

Hunter Biden was given a lucrative position. Ok. So what? I have no doubt he was given it in hopes that Burisma could get some influence with Biden. That sort of things goes on all the time. But that's a far cry from saying something criminal happened.

Provide facts not speculation.

 

[sakinago]

smoking gun

An audio tape has been released by a Ukrainian politician which details conversations between corrupt and discredited former Ukrainian President Petro Poroshenko and U.S. presidential candidate Joe Biden. John Kerry is also on the audio tape. The men discuss the firing of then Prosecutor Shokin for corrupt reasons, in order to prevent an investigation into Biden’s son, Hunter Biden, and other criminal actions.

Here is where the messed up in there story. Skokin was suppose to investigate the OWNER of the company. This was because of funds sent to the company by the European community to help Ukraine. The money disappeared. The world community tried to get the Ukraine government to investigate and get information about what happen to this money. Ukraine did not cooperate and the money got moved out of Ukraine into personal accounts of the Owner in some country.

Hunter was not under investigation in 2016. The investigation was into the owner of the company. This is your story that can't even get the facts straight.

They have this tape that no one has seen or heard. Much of the article is on stuff already known. Recordings containing edited conversations between the two while in office published by Ukrainian associate of Rudy Giuliani

Biden was under Obama orders was to get them to start an investigation on the owner of the company that Biden son worked for. They were holding up funds until they could get the investigation started but it never was and the money disappeared.

The difference between Biden and Trump. Biden was working to start an investigation on the employer of his son.

Trump was working to get an investigation on Biden who was his political opponent in the US election.

See the difference.

...shokin was going to subpoena Hunter Biden for questioning. Now that doesn’t mean Hunter is also guilty of corruption but it’s funny that that’s when Biden wanted to oust him, and admittedly held up 1 billion in aid to do so. All after his administration praised Skokins plan. It’s also funny how the investigation into the burisma oligarch disappeared after Shokin was ousted. The strawman that leftist media keep pushing is that the claim is Hunter was part of the corruption, which is not the claim. The claim is that hunter and his last name were used to shield burisma from investigations. Investigations that were active from Shokin in Feb 2016. Whatever you’re reading is either a lie or referring to the UK investigation. Like one guy in the Ukraine says the investigation was dormant and the media runs with it as “factual”. Crazy.

Court seizes property of ex-minister Zlochevsky in Ukraine

The movable and immovable property of former Minister of Ecology and Natural Resources of Ukraine Mykola Zlochevsky in Ukraine has been seized, according to the press service of the Prosecutor General's Office of Ukraine (PGO).

en.interfax.com.ua

Cleary the investigation was active in 2016, and Shokin claims hunter Biden was to be questioned. Around that time American burisma lobbyist petition state department to pressure an end to the burisma investigation.

Bluestar Novelli Contacts | PDF

February 2016 State Department memos released under FOIA showing efforts by Karen Tramontano to seek a meeting about Burisma corruption allegations.

www.scribd.com

And then Biden pressures the Ukraine to fire Shokin.

And again I haven’t heard the slightest indicator that Shokin was corrupt. On the tape poroshenko says he’s not, again it’s not a validated tape, but I doubt deep fakes are that good yet. Shokin also claims he has plenty of evidence from his government showing he’s not corrupt. And let’s not forget, the Ukrainian equivalent to the DOJ is actually investigating this and names “American 1”, basically admitted is Biden, as a possible defendant. So there’s something substantial there