Published 1 day ago Marines say they're being 'crushed' over vaccine refusal: 'A political purge'

My point is that Social Norms have trumped Religious freedom more than once.

But let’s take Religious Freedom to the current situation. 32 Naval Service Members which includes the Marines have been granted an exception by a Judge based upon Religious Beliefs. Would you trust those people in a combat job? Say as a line Rifleman or a SEAL?
That doesn't make it right. And in this case, it's not only unconstitutional, it's pointless because the vaccine doesn't keep people from getting infected. Hence the, "combat readiness" logic falls flat on its face

Whether, or not I trusted those troops on the battlefield would be based on a hell of a lot more than their willingness to take a vaccine. Anyone who would used that, alone, as a determining factor is a moron and certainly can't be trusted on the battlefield. That person will obviously hold animosity toward his fellow soldiers and couldn't be trusted to have their backs in a firefight. That person is no different than someone who wouldn't trust his fellow soldiers because of their race, or ethnicity, or national origin.
 
That doesn't make it right. And in this case, it's not only unconstitutional, it's pointless because the vaccine doesn't keep people from getting infected. Hence the, "combat readiness" logic falls flat on its face

Whether, or not I trusted those troops on the battlefield would be based on a hell of a lot more than their willingness to take a vaccine. Anyone who would used that, alone, as a determining factor is a moron and certainly can't be trusted on the battlefield. That person will obviously hold animosity toward his fellow soldiers and couldn't be trusted to have their backs in a firefight. That person is no different than someone who wouldn't trust his fellow soldiers because of their race, or ethnicity, or national origin.

No that is where you are wrong. You see let’s remember this was based upon a religious exemption. Every Religious Leader in the world endorsed getting the Vaccine. But these folks decided, based upon their own interpretation of Scripture, that it was a violation of their Christian Beliefs.

What else will they decide is a violation of their Christian Beliefs? We can’t really say can we? They aren’t following the determination of Religious Leaders are they? Will they decide one day that they can’t kill? Will they decide that America is bad because it is not following their Extremist Religious Beliefs? Will they abandon their fellow troops just when they are needed most because they believe God wants them too?

You can’t say they won’t. I would be unwilling to risk it. I’d send them to work in whatever non combat job was available. Cooks or supply. Perhaps mechanics. Point is. They don’t need to be on the front line.
 
No that is where you are wrong. You see let’s remember this was based upon a religious exemption. Every Religious Leader in the world endorsed getting the Vaccine. But these folks decided, based upon their own interpretation of Scripture, that it was a violation of their Christian Beliefs.

What else will they decide is a violation of their Christian Beliefs? We can’t really say can we? They aren’t following the determination of Religious Leaders are they? Will they decide one day that they can’t kill? Will they decide that America is bad because it is not following their Extremist Religious Beliefs? Will they abandon their fellow troops just when they are needed most because they believe God wants them too?

You can’t say they won’t. I would be unwilling to risk it. I’d send them to work in whatever non combat job was available. Cooks or supply. Perhaps mechanics. Point is. They don’t need to be on the front line.
Seals who have been in combat for years in the Sand box arent qualified to fight because of a jab that doesnt work?????

What the hell are you smoking?
 
how about quote just one??

Oh, I can quote many SCOTUS cases.

I can start with Reynolds v. US, which confirmed that the Government does have the right to forbid bigamy, even though it was not ever forbidden in the Constitution, and several religions claim it is their right to do so.

In Braunfeld v. Brown, they refused to strip away a "blue law" as it was based on secular reasons, and did nothing to interfere with the free exercise clause.

One of the most important is Estate of Thornton v. Calador Inc, where employees were given the absolute right to not work on Sabbath days. The court ruled that the law was unconstitutional because it gave religions automatic control over all secular interests at the workplace and to no consideration for the employer or other employees.

In Employment Division v. Smith, a man claimed that his termination for smoking peyote was illegal because it was done for religious reasons. The court did not agree, stating that a religion does not give the one to violate the laws or rules of a state and company.

Christian Legal Society v. Martinez was a case where at the Hastings College of Law (University of California) where students wanted to establish a chapter of the Christian Legal Society as a student group. This was refused because the group wanted to be entirely inclusive and only allow Christians and those they "accepted" as members. In a lower court ruling against the group their claim was rejected, but if they welcomed in all students it would be allowed. They pushed it to the Supreme Court and lost again.

In Locke v. Davey, the state of Washington's issuing of scholarships to students of public and private higher education but not to divinity schools was Constitutional. As it imposed no criminal or civil sanctions on religious institutes, and all students were still free to attend one at their own choice. And it was the right of the state to not fund such institutions.

And directly to the military, Goldman v. Weinberger, which was a challenge of a Jewish serviceman wearing his yarmulke in uniform on duty. Quite specifically the court stated “review of military regulations challenged on First Amendment grounds is far more deferential than constitutional review of similar laws or regulations designed for civilian society” and that “to accomplish its mission, the military must foster instinctive obedience, unity, commitment, and esprit de corps.” And that the Air Force’s purpose in its dress regulations is uniformity, and it “reasonably and evenhandedly regulate dress in the interest of” that need. Thus, the First Amendment does not prohibit the Air Force from applying the challenged regulation to the wearing of a yarmulke by a soldier on duty and in uniform, even though that effectively restricts the wearing of headgear required by one’s religious beliefs.

Do you want more? Because I can give you more if you want. That is only 7 after all, want more of them? But the last is the most telling, because it pretty much said that in a case of religious rights against the military, unless there is an overwhelming issue at stake the military wins.

Held: The First Amendment does not prohibit the challenged regulation from being applied to petitioner, even though its effect is to restrict the wearing of the headgear required by his religious beliefs. That Amendment does not require the military to accommodate such practices as wearing a yarmulke in the face of its view that they would detract from the uniformity sought by dress regulations. Here, the Air Force has drawn the line essentially between religious apparel that is visible and that which is not, and the challenged regulation reasonably and evenhandedly regulates dress in the interest of the military's perceived need for uniformity.

But there, I cited you several. One specifically about the military itself, where SCOTUS clearly stated that the needs of the military come first.

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Which is where we are at Now they have to try and overturn it in a higher court.

Oh, they will easily, and with many grounds.

Goldman v. Weinberger, the ACA stay by the same judge, this case stinks of the court overstepping its bounds.

SCOTUS has clearly shown over and over in many cases where when push comes to shove, the needs of the military outweigh "personal liberties", especially if it could put others at risk through inaction.
 
Oh, I can quote many SCOTUS cases.

I can start with Reynolds v. US, which confirmed that the Government does have the right to forbid bigamy, even though it was not ever forbidden in the Constitution, and several religions claim it is their right to do so.

In Braunfeld v. Brown, they refused to strip away a "blue law" as it was based on secular reasons, and did nothing to interfere with the free exercise clause.

One of the most important is Estate of Thornton v. Calador Inc, where employees were given the absolute right to not work on Sabbath days. The court ruled that the law was unconstitutional because it gave religions automatic control over all secular interests at the workplace and to no consideration for the employer or other employees.

In Employment Division v. Smith, a man claimed that his termination for smoking peyote was illegal because it was done for religious reasons. The court did not agree, stating that a religion does not give the one to violate the laws or rules of a state and company.

Christian Legal Society v. Martinez was a case where at the Hastings College of Law (University of California) where students wanted to establish a chapter of the Christian Legal Society as a student group. This was refused because the group wanted to be entirely inclusive and only allow Christians and those they "accepted" as members. In a lower court ruling against the group their claim was rejected, but if they welcomed in all students it would be allowed. They pushed it to the Supreme Court and lost again.

In Locke v. Davey, the state of Washington's issuing of scholarships to students of public and private higher education but not to divinity schools was Constitutional. As it imposed no criminal or civil sanctions on religious institutes, and all students were still free to attend one at their own choice. And it was the right of the state to not fund such institutions.

And directly to the military, Goldman v. Weinberger, which was a challenge of a Jewish serviceman wearing his yarmulke in uniform on duty. Quite specifically the court stated “review of military regulations challenged on First Amendment grounds is far more deferential than constitutional review of similar laws or regulations designed for civilian society” and that “to accomplish its mission, the military must foster instinctive obedience, unity, commitment, and esprit de corps.” And that the Air Force’s purpose in its dress regulations is uniformity, and it “reasonably and evenhandedly regulate dress in the interest of” that need. Thus, the First Amendment does not prohibit the Air Force from applying the challenged regulation to the wearing of a yarmulke by a soldier on duty and in uniform, even though that effectively restricts the wearing of headgear required by one’s religious beliefs.

Do you want more? Because I can give you more if you want. That is only 7 after all, want more of them? But the last is the most telling, because it pretty much said that in a case of religious rights against the military, unless there is an overwhelming issue at stake the military wins.



But there, I cited you several. One specifically about the military itself, where SCOTUS clearly stated that the needs of the military come first.

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a pattern I see in all of those is they had outside effect on other people,, the vaccine exemption doesnt its limited to just yourself and your life,,
 
It isn't just the Marines. It's all services and they are purging them from the Executive order of the Imbecile N Chief. 7 ongoing cases right now in the Federal courts over it..........But in many of those even under litigation they are being forced out after fighting for this country for over a decade in the Middle East.

BOHICA

True.
George Soros and Company (including Biden) are slowly rotting America's core defenses so ultimately the takeover will go as planned.
Americans are stupid sheep willfully following the flock to the slaughter with out any resistance at all.

You could almost say they will get exactly what they deserve.
The historic inflation, soaring prices, shortages and loss of freedoms we are seeing today are only a taste of what is to come.
They want America decimated......and they are winning hands down. No one in opposition to say otherwise.
 
a pattern I see in all of those is they had outside effect on other people

Even in Goldberg v. Weinberger?

This is laughable because it is repeated all to often in here.

Somebody challenges me, as if I had not already done my homework. And because I have I can give off several specific cases, and then they dismiss them saying they do not apply. Without comment, simply outright dismissing them.

In other words, asking for more proof, then plugging their ears with their fingers and screaming once again they do not want to hear it.

So laughingly predictable.
 
The Liberal filth is working hard to turn the military into the Brownshirts of the Democrat party.

That is what you get when you let the bastards steal an election.
 
Seals who have been in combat for years in the Sand box arent qualified to fight because of a jab that doesnt work?????

What the hell are you smoking?

OK, let’s play. His Religion is obviously very important to him. So important that he decided to risk his own life, and the lives of his fellow SEAL’s by refusing the Jab. His right, according to the Judge.

So he is in the Sandbox. On a mission behind the lines. They’re held up during daylight hours, and a 14 year old kid, a boy, unarmed, is herding goats nearby. The kid notices them. If the Religious Man does not violate the Ten Commandments, the team dies. If he doesn’t kill that boy, the boy will sound the alarm and others will come and kill the SEAL’s. What does this Religious Man do? He says he will kill the boy, but are you certain? Are you willing to risk the lives of the rest of the SEAL’s in the team on what he will decide his Religion tells him to do at that moment? If he kills the boy, can he claim Religious Exemption for the shot? He committed a mortal sin. He committed Murder, by killing an unarmed child.

I don’t know what he’ll do in that situation. And it is far from fanciful. That is one of a thousand scenarios where his religious ideals may conflict with mission objectives. YOU might be willing to risk the team on him. I would not. I bet the Navy would be reluctant, and I bet some of his fellow SEAL’s will be reluctant. What do you say to them? Fuck off and shut the hell up and get out there and do your duty? What do you say to their families if he lets them down? I respected his choices and supported him and you know what? Your husbands are a small price to pay to show Biden what we really think of him?

Nope. You can’t risk it. You have to pull him. I don’t know what his rating was before he was a SEAL, but that’s where he would be headed back to about a week later, as soon as the paperwork could be completed.
 
And having some vaccinated and others not could not do that?
that would be true if vaccinated people didnt transmit the covid just as easy as unvaccinated do,, but they do,, and because the vaccine reduces symptoms the vaccinated can spread it more because they may not know they are infected and go out in public and spread it,,
 
that would be true if vaccinated people didnt transmit the covid just as easy as unvaccinated do,, but they do,, and because the vaccine reduces symptoms the vaccinated can spread it more because they may not know they are infected and go out in public and spread it,,

yadda-yadda-yadda

Which has exactly what to do with it is a military regulation?

Military duties are traditionally not performed from Friday evening through Monday morning. Traditionally, because "The Big Man" said various religions take from Friday night to Monday off. What is the scientific basis for this?

None, but it is done anyways.

I love hoe people in here spin, challenge, get smacked with facts, then just spin all over again. You just ignored the fact that in fact the SCOUTS has said the needs of the military are more important, and you just spin into how it does not work.

I could not care if they were ordered to take sugar pills and do 5 minutes of deep breathing. Be in compliance, or GTFO.
 
yadda-yadda-yadda

Which has exactly what to do with it is a military regulation?

Military duties are traditionally not performed from Friday evening through Monday morning. Traditionally, because "The Big Man" said various religions take from Friday night to Monday off. What is the scientific basis for this?

None, but it is done anyways.

I love hoe people in here spin, challenge, get smacked with facts, then just spin all over again. You just ignored the fact that in fact the SCOUTS has said the needs of the military are more important, and you just spin into how it does not work.

I could not care if they were ordered to take sugar pills and do 5 minutes of deep breathing. Be in compliance, or GTFO.
why are you ignoring the facts I presented??

all I did was downplay one of your examples..
 
OK, let’s play. His Religion is obviously very important to him. So important that he decided to risk his own life, and the lives of his fellow SEAL’s by refusing the Jab. His right, according to the Judge.

So he is in the Sandbox. On a mission behind the lines. They’re held up during daylight hours, and a 14 year old kid, a boy, unarmed, is herding goats nearby. The kid notices them. If the Religious Man does not violate the Ten Commandments, the team dies. If he doesn’t kill that boy, the boy will sound the alarm and others will come and kill the SEAL’s. What does this Religious Man do? He says he will kill the boy, but are you certain? Are you willing to risk the lives of the rest of the SEAL’s in the team on what he will decide his Religion tells him to do at that moment? If he kills the boy, can he claim Religious Exemption for the shot? He committed a mortal sin. He committed Murder, by killing an unarmed child.

I don’t know what he’ll do in that situation. And it is far from fanciful. That is one of a thousand scenarios where his religious ideals may conflict with mission objectives. YOU might be willing to risk the team on him. I would not. I bet the Navy would be reluctant, and I bet some of his fellow SEAL’s will be reluctant. What do you say to them? Fuck off and shut the hell up and get out there and do your duty? What do you say to their families if he lets them down? I respected his choices and supported him and you know what? Your husbands are a small price to pay to show Biden what we really think of him?

Nope. You can’t risk it. You have to pull him. I don’t know what his rating was before he was a SEAL, but that’s where he would be headed back to about a week later, as soon as the paperwork could be completed.
How? The vaccine doesnt stop you from getting or transmitting the virus. That Federal case is about to throw down. 1 of 6 still pending . We shall see.
 
yadda-yadda-yadda

Which has exactly what to do with it is a military regulation?

Military duties are traditionally not performed from Friday evening through Monday morning. Traditionally, because "The Big Man" said various religions take from Friday night to Monday off. What is the scientific basis for this?

None, but it is done anyways.

I love hoe people in here spin, challenge, get smacked with facts, then just spin all over again. You just ignored the fact that in fact the SCOUTS has said the needs of the military are more important, and you just spin into how it does not work.

I could not care if they were ordered to take sugar pills and do 5 minutes of deep breathing. Be in compliance, or GTFO.
Court order says different at the moment. Brandon is on trial. Not the seals....and he is losing in the courts.
 
How? The vaccine doesnt stop you from getting or transmitting the virus. That Federal case is about to throw down. 1 of 6 still pending . We shall see.

I notice you ignored everything else. So you admit that these religious exemptions are unsuitable for front line duties.
 
I notice you ignored everything else. So you admit that these religious exemptions are unsuitable for front line duties.
How so? These guys arent Amish. They have all been fighting on the front lines...many for over a decade.

They dont object to killing our enemies, just a jab fr a Banana Republic CNC who mamdated a vaccine that doesnt work.
 
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