Pro-"Palestinians"... is this what you want?

[Kondor3]

"...'Right of Return' is NEVER going to happen. It's completely out of the question. Palestinians and their supporters need to completely get that thought out of their head."

But they CAN'T get it out of their heads.

Those silly bastards - and their fellow travelers and sympathizers and apologists - have been living in the Land of Coulda-Shoulda-Woulda for 65 years now with no end in sight.... making foolish reliance upon cherry-picked aspects of both International Law and Ottoman provincial governance and phoney-baloney conclusions drawn from set-aside Mandate or League-of-Nations commentaries and other insubstantial and entirely insignificant and unenforceable and obsoleted understandings and interpretations.

They haven't got it IN them to get it out of their heads.

They'll still be grousing about it a hundred years from now after they've all been dispersed to the surrounding Arab countrysides and as all of this fades from living memory and becomes the stuff of urban legend and a minor footnote in history.

As some others here have already pointed-out over time... 1948 was a long time ago, and there is no Do-Over for this kind of stuff... coulda-shoulda-woulda... a total dead-end...

 

[toastman]

"...'Right of Return' is NEVER going to happen. It's completely out of the question. Palestinians and their supporters need to completely get that thought out of their head."

But they CAN'T get it out of their heads.

Those silly bastards - and their fellow travelers and sympathizers and apologists - have been living in the Land of Coulda-Shoulda-Woulda for 65 years now with no end in sight.... making foolish reliance upon cherry-picked aspects of both International Law and Ottoman provincial governance and phoney-baloney conclusions drawn from set-aside Mandate or League-of-Nations commentaries and other insubstantial and entirely insignificant and unenforceable and obsoleted understandings and interpretations.

They haven't got it IN them to get it out of their heads.

They'll still be grousing about it a hundred years from now after they've all been dispersed to the surrounding Arab countrysides and as all of this fades from living memory and becomes the stuff of urban legend and a minor footnote in history.

As some others here have already pointed-out over time... 1948 was a long time ago, and there is no Do-Over for this kind of stuff... coulda-shoulda-woulda... a total dead-end...

Palestinians and their supporters have 'living in the past' syndrome. Unfortunately, there is no cure in sight

 

[Hyrcanus]

What a load of crap. 'Swearing to live in peace' means nothing. If lets say a Palestinian is let back into Israel and his intentions are to commit terrorism against Israelis, do you think he is going to openly state his intention??
Right of return is just one of those things that you guys need to forget

Fine. How about you only allow back Palestinians who are 50 years or older.

Most terrorists are much younger than this.

 

[toastman]

LOL, it's not my choice though

 

[Hyrcanus]

It wouldn't be too difficult for the Israelis to interview refugees and weed out folks who mean to do harm.

 

[Kondor3]

"...Any refugees that are allowed to come back to Israel must swear to live at peace with their neighbors..."

Taqiyya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[toastman]

Sorry, but it's not going to happen. Its completely out of the question

 

[Hyrcanus]

"...Any refugees that are allowed to come back to Israel must swear to live at peace with their neighbors..."
Taqiyya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So you think all Muslims are liars?

That's pretty bigoted. Reminds me of the Neo-Nazis who complained that Joe Lieberman couldn't be trusted as Vice-President because as a Jew, he said the Kol Nidre which can be interpreted as saying that all promises & commitments made the previous year are null and void.

 

[Hyrcanus]

Sorry, but it's not going to happen. Its completely out of the question

I predict that any final peace treaty will include 100,000 Palestinians coming to Israel.

Regardless of what you want.

 

[toastman]

"...Any refugees that are allowed to come back to Israel must swear to live at peace with their neighbors..."
Taqiyya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

So you think all Muslims are liars?

That's pretty bigoted. Reminds me of the Neo-Nazis who complained that Joe Lieberman couldn't be trusted as Vice-President because as a Jew, he said the Kol Nidre which can be interpreted as saying that all promises & commitments made the previous year are null and void.

Where did he say that he thinks all Muslims are liars. You need to read posts more carefully

 

[Hyrcanus]

Where did he say that he thinks all Muslims are liars. You need to read posts more carefully

He implies it.

 

[Kondor3]

Where did he say that he thinks all Muslims are liars. You need to read posts more carefully

He implies it.

Wrong again.

 

[toastman]

Where did he say that he thinks all Muslims are liars. You need to read posts more carefully

He implies it.

NO, you just made that up. You're not in his head, you cannot tell me that he 'implies' it

 

[Hyrcanus]

"...Any refugees that are allowed to come back to Israel must swear to live at peace with their neighbors..."

Taqiyya - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Nice try, but Taqiyya is about hiding one's religious faith when one is in danger.

Now about hiding one's murderous intentions until one has the opportunity to act on them.

 

[Kondor3]

Sorry, but it's not going to happen. Its completely out of the question

I predict that any final peace treaty will include 100,000 Palestinians coming to Israel.

Regardless of what you want.

Pigs will fly, first...

Oh, and... based on your predictions... stay away from the poker tables at the casino...

 

[MHunterB]

Well, your cherry-picked one sided version of 'history' isn't any prize for accuracy, Jose.

I don't see any mention of the pogroms against the Jews of Hebron in 1929, for example.

Nor did you see fit to notice the 950,000 Arab Jews who were ethnically cleansed from various Arab nations.

Oh, and you 'forgot' to mention the ethnic cleansing of East Jerusalem in'49 when the Jewish families living in a number of neighborhoods were forced out at gunpoint.

What, do ONLY Palestinian refugees have rights? Does ONLY Israel have a duty to return what was taken?

I suppose that's a POV: but don't presume to claim that would be 'justice'.

I have a great idea!

Since we all respect the Right to Return to lands that were fled during armed conflict, all Jews who fled the Arabs states during the 1948 war should be allowed to return to their former lands.

And all Arabs who fled Israel during the same war will also have the right to return to Israel.

Does that satisfy you?

Your comparison between the 800,000 Arabs who fled/kicked out of Israel in 1948 to the 800,000 Jews who came to Israel during its first ten years, is absurd.

These 800,000 Jews don't want to go back to their former lands. If anything, all they want is their money back. While the Arabs DO want to return to their former lands, and many simply would not accept monetary compensation for their lost properties.

You see, unlike the Jewish refugees from the Muslim lands, the Arab refugees from Israel can't be bought and don't want to be bought.

Aside from the fact that I dispute your numbers - your sneering at the Jewish refugees is unconscionable. They were stripped of their citizenship and beggared and kicked out: if there is to be 'justice for refugees', there should be justice offered to ALL.

Some theoretical 'right of return' offered to people in a nation where they were overnight re-defined as 'hostile aliens' is hardly worth suggesting. Offering compensation to the Arab Jewish refugees isn't 'buying them off': it's redressing a wrong.

Why not let each of the 650,000 or so Arab Muslim/Christian refugees decide for themselves what they wish - to be loyal citizens of Israel with compensation for their property so they can buy a home there, OR to be citizens of a 'Palestine' with the same compensation package?

Hasn't there already been enough uprooting of people from their homes? If people shouldn't have to pay for other people's wrongs - then nobody should be forced to move out of anywhere to bring justice.

My personal preference would be for the various individual claims to be totaled up by nation, and then all the nations could pay each other settlements - including Palestine. Let's face it - they need a bankroll to develop infrastructure and build an economy. It'd probably be more efficient to have them administer funds for the citizens of former 'refugee' situation.

Sure, it'd be a ***** of a job, trying to settle all the claims. But if nobody gets penny one 'til everything is worked out with every group - that'd be incentive for everyone to get it over with and get on with normal things.

 

[Hyrcanus]

Aside from the fact that I dispute your numbers - your sneering at the Jewish refugees is unconscionable. They were stripped of their citizenship and beggared and kicked out: if there is to be 'justice for refugees', there should be justice offered to ALL....

#1. The majority of Jewish refugees were NOT forced out by govt. decree.

#2. No Jewish refugees want to return to their formers homes. Not one.

#3. Unlike the Palestinians refugees, who have been abused as political pawns for 65 years, the Jewish refugees were settled and assimiliated into Israeli society as full citizens.

Comparing the status of Palestinian refugees to Jewish refugees is dishonest and ignorant.

 

[Hyrcanus]

Pigs will fly, first...

If you will it, it is no dream.

 

[MHunterB]

What a load of crap. 'Swearing to live in peace' means nothing. If lets say a Palestinian is let back into Israel and his intentions are to commit terrorism against Israelis, do you think he is going to openly state his intention??
Right of return is just one of those things that you guys need to forget

Fine. How about you only allow back Palestinians who are 50 years or older.

Most terrorists are much younger than this.

That is very sad to contemplate : (( It just isn't right to deny all of those people a chance to be loyal Israeli citizens like the 20+percent of their relatives already living in Israel and serving as police, firemen, EMT's, doctors, nurses, judges - and diplomats, MK's and soldiers.

However, he raises a worthwhile question: what kind of 'guarantee' is a person's mere word against 2 lives, or a dozen, or two dozen and a hundred maimed for life? In THEORY it isn't right to ask for any more than an oath such as any immigrant might be required to take - but this hasn't been a 'usual' situation.

 

[Hyrcanus]

That is very sad to contemplate : (( It just isn't right to deny all of those people a chance to be loyal Israeli citizens like the 20+percent of their relatives already living in Israel and serving as police, firemen, EMT's, doctors, nurses, judges - and diplomats, MK's and soldiers.

However, he raises a worthwhile question: what kind of 'guarantee' is a person's mere word against 2 lives, or a dozen, or two dozen and a hundred maimed for life? In THEORY it isn't right to ask for any more than an oath such as any immigrant might be required to take - but this hasn't been a 'usual' situation.

For every settler that is allowed to stay in his home, one Palestinian refugee should be allowed to return to Israel.