Pluto and Surface Air Pressure

[EMH]

Any evidence that is the case for Earth?

It is the evidence. Earth SAP is higher when Earth is closer to Sun.... which is during Northern Hemisphere winter.

Any evidence to refute that?

No...

 

[EMH]

Pressure vs. longitude

Idiot.

360.... duh...

That's the orbit around the Sun, moron.

 

[EMH]

I guess Bing doesn't read her own citations

The chart doesn't match the verbiage.


The Mars SAP varies by distance to Sun in an elliptical orbit. The correlation is undeniable.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

It is the evidence. Earth SAP is higher when Earth is closer to Sun.... which is during Northern Hemisphere winter.

Any evidence to refute that?

No...

It is the evidence. Earth SAP is higher when Earth is closer to Sun.... which is during Northern Hemisphere winter.

Northern Hemisphere SAP isn't the same as Earth SAP.

How does Southern Hemisphere SAP change as the Earth gets closer to the Sun?
Why don't you post the monthly numbers, so we can double check your claim?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The Mars SAP varies by distance to Sun in an elliptical orbit. The correlation is undeniable.

Earth's SAP has declined over the last 60 years, because we're getting farther away from the Sun?

Have you told anyone else?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Pressure vs. longitude ... from Bing ... I am impressed ...

In Armstrong et. al. 2004 {partial}, we get "Thus, contrary to expectations, the martian atmospheric pressure is remarkable static over time, and decreases both at high and low obliquity." ...

I guess Bing doesn't read her own citations ... what a maroon ...

I wasn't sure how to break it to him that his chart didn't include temperature or distance from the Sun.

 

[EMH]

I wasn't sure how to break it to him that his chart didn't include temperature or distance from the Sun.

but it correlates to a high degree with both.... except the enlarged magnitude of the winter drop.... which is when the "sublime" stuff matters to the overall planetary SAP.... the rest proves SAP and temperature are correlated.

 

[EMH]

Earth's SAP has declined over the last 60 years, because we're getting farther away from the Sun?

Have you told anyone else?

Actually, what your Co2 FRAUD side argues is that Earth is

1. Warming
2. Experiencing an ongoing NET ICE MELT


which, if true, would push SAP higher, BOTH WOULD....


but, while Earth's orbit is unchanged for the past tens of millions of years, the climate on Earth does change, but Co2 has nothing to do with it....


EARTH SAP IS GOING DOWN SLIGHTLY BECAUSE EARTH IS NEITHER WARMING NOR EXPERIENCING AN ONGOING NET ICE MELT



and even you aren't able to articulate why that isn't the case.... because it is, and it is proven.

 

[EMH]

Northern Hemisphere SAP isn't the same as Earth SAP

Really, not sure that's true...

In the end, pressure fills out the atmosphere evenly, at least in theory.

Funny, that your side hasn't yet fudged Southern Hemisphere SAP for us. Why? Is it because Chris Wray has left the building, and y'all are getting real scared at just how many hits this topic has already....

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

but it correlates to a high degree with both.... except the enlarged magnitude of the winter drop.... which is when the "sublime" stuff matters to the overall planetary SAP.... the rest proves SAP and temperature are correlated.

You made a claim about temperature and distance from the sun and their influence on SAP.
Your evidence was a chart that shows pressure and latitude.

That's fucking hilarious!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Actually, what your Co2 FRAUD side argues is that Earth is

1. Warming
2. Experiencing an ongoing NET ICE MELT


which, if true, would push SAP higher, BOTH WOULD....


but, while Earth's orbit is unchanged for the past tens of millions of years, the climate on Earth does change, but Co2 has nothing to do with it....


EARTH SAP IS GOING DOWN SLIGHTLY BECAUSE EARTH IS NEITHER WARMING NOR EXPERIENCING AN ONGOING NET ICE MELT



and even you aren't able to articulate why that isn't the case.... because it is, and it is proven.

Actually, what your Co2 FRAUD side argues is that Earth is

1. Warming
2. Experiencing an ongoing NET ICE MELT


which, if true, would push SAP higher, BOTH WOULD....

Why would both? Where have they both caused that in Earth's history?
Are you basing your "melting ice raises SAP" claim on your very
scientific observation that "A foot of snow is one inch of water and 11 inches of gas"?

Does that mean a foot of ice contains 11 inches of gas?
Does a cubic mile of ice follow the same ratio?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Really, not sure that's true...

In the end, pressure fills out the atmosphere evenly, at least in theory.

Funny, that your side hasn't yet fudged Southern Hemisphere SAP for us. Why? Is it because Chris Wray has left the building, and y'all are getting real scared at just how many hits this topic has already....

Really, not sure that's true...

Why would SAP in Rio in summer be the same as SAP in Tokyo in winter?

Why would SAP in Tokyo in summer be the same as SAP in Rio in winter?

In the end, pressure fills out the atmosphere evenly, at least in theory.

Why isn't it the same everywhere all the time, in theory?

 

[EMH]

that shows pressure and latitude

Longitude... as in 360 degrees ... as in orbit of Sun .... duh....

Where have they both caused that in Earth's history?

Jurassic - warmer and higher SAP

Are you basing your "melting ice raises SAP" claim on your very
scientific observation that "A foot of snow is one inch of water and 11 inches of gas"?

Does that mean a foot of ice contains 11 inches of gas?
Does a cubic mile of ice follow the same ratio?

Glacier ice is about 10% air, with roughly 200 air bubbles per cubic centimeter. These bubbles are the same ones that are studied in ice cores to preserve ancient air.

THERE MAY ALSO BE GAS MOLECULES DISSOLVED IN THE H2O before it froze which do not register as gas bubbles.


Compressed air can be pressurized to a much higher level than atmospheric air. Atmospheric air has a pressure of 14 pounds per square inch (PSI), or 1 bar, but can be compressed to as much as 6,004 PSI, or 414 bar.

how much compressed air in ice Antarctica - Google Search

www.google.com

Glacier ice, including ice in Antarctica, contains about 10% air by volume:

• How it forms
  Glacier ice forms when snow is compacted, trapping air in the spaces between ice crystals.
  
  
  
  
• Air bubbles
  The air bubbles in glacier ice can contain liquid water or atmospheric gases. The air in the bubbles reflects the atmospheric concentrations when the ice formed.
  
  
  
  
• Ice core research
  The air bubbles in ice cores are useful for studying ancient air.
  
  
  
  
• Ice density
  The density of pure glacier ice is usually 917 kg m-3 at 0°C. However, the density may be greater at mid-depths in polar ice sheets, where there are no bubbles and temperatures are -20°C to -40°C.
  
  
  
  
• Ice layers
  Ice from 400–900 meters deep contains many compressed air bubbles, but the bubbles disappear completely by 1100 meters. This is likely due to gas molecules diffusing into the ice lattice

WOW!!!

 

[EMH]

Why isn't it the same everywhere all the time, in theory?

1. A hurricane is a good clue. In the center of a hurricane is a big drop in pressure. That is called WEATHER, and YOUR SIDE HAS NO EVIDENCE OF A BREAKOUT IN CANE ACTIVITY .... just for the record....


2. Altitude, duh... top of ice on Antarctica is 2 miles above sea level. Land in Asia is a mile above sea level, hopefully YOU HAVE LEARNED THAT BY NOW...

3. Ocean currents, yes them. Warm water emits more H2O into atmosphere than cold water. That may temporarily alter SAP right there.


Then there is the question of degree of the variance. We do not seem to have a great amount of SAP variance on Earth. Not without obvious reasons like altitude...

Indeed, your side is all excited about a 1% increase in SAP during northern hemisphere winter.... 1%... a big cane drops SAP 10% right there...

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Longitude... as in 360 degrees ... as in orbit of Sun .... duh....






Jurassic - warmer and higher SAP









Glacier ice is about 10% air, with roughly 200 air bubbles per cubic centimeter. These bubbles are the same ones that are studied in ice cores to preserve ancient air.

THERE MAY ALSO BE GAS MOLECULES DISSOLVED IN THE H2O before it froze which do not register as gas bubbles.


Compressed air can be pressurized to a much higher level than atmospheric air. Atmospheric air has a pressure of 14 pounds per square inch (PSI), or 1 bar, but can be compressed to as much as 6,004 PSI, or 414 bar.

how much compressed air in ice Antarctica - Google Search

www.google.com

Glacier ice, including ice in Antarctica, contains about 10% air by volume:

• How it forms
  Glacier ice forms when snow is compacted, trapping air in the spaces between ice crystals.
  
  
  
  
• Air bubbles
  The air bubbles in glacier ice can contain liquid water or atmospheric gases. The air in the bubbles reflects the atmospheric concentrations when the ice formed.
  
  
  
  
• Ice core research
  The air bubbles in ice cores are useful for studying ancient air.
  
  
  
  
• Ice density
  The density of pure glacier ice is usually 917 kg m-3 at 0°C. However, the density may be greater at mid-depths in polar ice sheets, where there are no bubbles and temperatures are -20°C to -40°C.
  
  
  
  
• Ice layers
  Ice from 400–900 meters deep contains many compressed air bubbles, but the bubbles disappear completely by 1100 meters. This is likely due to gas molecules diffusing into the ice lattice

WOW!!!

Longitude... as in 360 degrees ... as in orbit of Sun .... duh....

the angular distance of a place east or west of the meridian at Greenwich, England, or west of the standard meridian of a celestial object, usually expressed in degrees and minutes:

Are you sure it's "orbit of Sun"? LOL!

Jurassic - warmer and higher SAP

Allegedly. Where did the other 66%-80% of the air go? Link?

Glacier ice is about 10% air

That's much less than 11/12ths.

What's the total volume of glacier ice in the world?

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

1. A hurricane is a good clue. In the center of a hurricane is a big drop in pressure. That is called WEATHER, and YOUR SIDE HAS NO EVIDENCE OF A BREAKOUT IN CANE ACTIVITY .... just for the record....


2. Altitude, duh... top of ice on Antarctica is 2 miles above sea level. Land in Asia is a mile above sea level, hopefully YOU HAVE LEARNED THAT BY NOW...

3. Ocean currents, yes them. Warm water emits more H2O into atmosphere than cold water. That may temporarily alter SAP right there.


Then there is the question of degree of the variance. We do not seem to have a great amount of SAP variance on Earth. Not without obvious reasons like altitude...

Indeed, your side is all excited about a 1% increase in SAP during northern hemisphere winter.... 1%... a big cane drops SAP 10% right there...

A hurricane is a good clue.

A clue that SAP is the same all over the world at the same time?

Indeed, your side is all excited about a 1% increase in SAP during northern hemisphere winter.... 1%...

How much does it increase in the southern hemisphere during summer?

 

[EMH]

Are you sure it's "orbit of Sun"? LOL!

360 degrees.... notice the chart at the end matches the chart at the beginning.... duh...

and the big L has an "S" subscript, for SUN... DUH....

Glacier ice is about 10% air

That's much less than 11/12ths.

What's the total volume of glacier ice in the world?

Earth has approximately 9 million cubic miles of ice today.

The 10% figure on air in ice does not factor in COMPRESSION....

indeed the reason why there are ONLY 800k years of ice core data from AA is because the ice core layers about a mile down no longer have bubbles per the link above. The compression is so great it does what North American Ice Age did to hydrocarbon deposits, it pushed them into ROCK called SHALE which is why there is a need for FRACKING to get the hydrocarbons out...


The air pressure during the Jurassic period was much higher than it is today, estimated to be at least 3.2–5.0 bar, compared to the current 1 bar


That's what melting all or 99% of Earth ice today does to SAP....

 

[ding]

360 degrees.... notice the chart at the end matches the chart at the beginning.... duh...

and the big L has an "S" subscript, for SUN... DUH....







Earth has approximately 9 million cubic miles of ice today.

The 10% figure on air in ice does not factor in COMPRESSION....

indeed the reason why there are ONLY 800k years of ice core data from AA is because the ice core layers about a mile down no longer have bubbles per the link above. The compression is so great it does what North American Ice Age did to hydrocarbon deposits, it pushed them into ROCK called SHALE which is why there is a need for FRACKING to get the hydrocarbons out...


The air pressure during the Jurassic period was much higher than it is today, estimated to be at least 3.2–5.0 bar, compared to the current 1 bar


That's what melting all or 99% of Earth ice today does to SAP....

Can you show the calculation for atmospheric pressure?

 

[EMH]

Can you show the calculation for atmospheric pressure?

Post 271

Mars proves that definition is wrong.

Correct definition = (mass of gas column above pulled down by force of gravity) x (a planet atmosphere coefficient) x (temperature, likely scaled to specific gas, on Mars Co2, on Pluto N, on Earth a giant mess of derivates for each specific gas)

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The air pressure during the Jurassic period was much higher than it is today, estimated to be at least 3.2–5.0 bar, compared to the current 1 bar

You think 2.2/3.2 (68.75%) to 4/5 (80%) of the air from the Jurassic period is now trapped in ice?