PIZZA JOINT vs. U.S. GOVERNMENT.

[Mr Natural]

I suppose the guy's a pretty good salesmen if he could pass that shit off as pizza.

 

[ScreamingEagle]

BULLSHIT!

Building a business "from nothing" is not taking over management of over 800 franchise stores!

And losing market share is not building an "empire."

Stopping a company from losing money by DOWNSIZING is not "building" anything!!!!

BULLSHIT yourself....ya got a lot to learn....

A company almost ready to go bankrupt is pretty much worth "nothing" in the business world...

Streamling a company from 725 units (stores) to only 525...yet maintaining the SAME total amount in sales.....is called SUCCESS by any other name in the business world....

Under Cain the average Godfather sales per unit INCREASED....even in a very competitive market against national chains like Pizza Hut and Dominoes...this is called "building" a good company....

Now if Cain could only apply this to the Government world......he could downsize government "units".....yet double their effectiveness.....and so dramatically cut costs....

I find it interesting that even though you provide no links, Jarhead has not demanded that you back your claims with links like he did me!!!! It's pretty obvious who has a double standard here!

Since you provided no links, I need no links to contradict you.

Godfather's was not ready to go bankrupt, troubled yes, but they were not ready to prepare any bankruptcy papers when Pilsbury bought them. Like everything else you posted, an exaggeration.

There were over 800 "units" when Pilsbury bought the franchise, and there are 620 now. During Cain's reign it did not outpace Pizza Hut or Domono's. By closing the poorer performing "units" Cain was able to stabilize the chain, but that was it. He couldn't grow it, kinda like Obama stabilizing the failed and troubled Bush economy but not being able to grow it, so if stabilizing Godfather's makes Cain a super businessman, then Obama stabilizing the economy makes him a super president. If Obama stabilizing the economy but failing to grow it makes Obama a failure as president, then failing to grow Godfather's after stabilizing it makes Cain a failure as a businessman.

Any claims of increased profitability cannot be confirmed because the chain did not report its profits as a stand alone unit. All their numbers show is their place in the market in comparison to their competition. For anyone to claim anything beyond that means they must have access to data not available to researchers in the restaurant industry, which means they are full of shit.

Basically, Cain was a motivational speaker for the franchise. That's what the people in the chain remember him most for, not as a brilliant businessman. Like Obama, Cain is all talk.

sorry i neglected to post my source so here it is.....now how about yours....?

After Pillsbury acquired Godfather’s Pizza and put Cain in charge, he set about reforming the chain’s management priorities: Cain wanted to measure success not by the number of Godfather’s units operating, but rather by the average sales of each unit, which Cain saw as more important for long-term success. So he closed unprofitable restaurants, reducing the number of Godfather’s units from 725 at the time of his 1986 takeover to about 525 by 1995. And Cain’s emphasis on quality over quantity proved effective. Nation’s Restaurant News reported that while the system-wide sales of the 725 units totaled approximately $260 million in 1986, by 1995 the much smaller network of 525 Godfather’s restaurants was making $250 million annually.

In 1988, Pillsbury decided not to remain in the pizza business, so Cain and his senior management took over the chain in a $50 million leveraged buyout, and were excited to do so. While Godfather’s had suffered an $8 million net loss in the year prior to Cain’s appointment in 1986, it would boast a $4 million profit by the end of fiscal year 1988. As CEO, Cain maintained the reforms that had gotten Godfather’s cooking again.

Herman Cain CEO « Herman Cain News

 

[Oldstyle]

You gotta just love CON$ervative rationalizations. Without a source a CON$ervative claimed Cain started Godafther's "from nothing," and created a pizza "empire." I pointed out that when Plilsbury put him in charge there were over 800 franchise stores and during his reign Godfather's lost market share. To CON$ that makes me a liar because I didn't post any links, even though the actual liar didn't post any either.

Another liar posted without links that Godfather's maintained the same level of sales even though there were fewer "units" selling pizza. Mind you, the liar not only had no links, he had no numbers, but told me to check the figures. I posted the figures which showed that Cain did not maintain the same sales volume, but again I am called a liar because I didn't post a link.

Now even without posting a link, the liar "knows" my source is a Cain hater rather than a truth seeker. If the liar knows my source already, why do I have to post it??? The liar should post it!!!

I just asked what your restaurant industry sources were, Ed...now why is it again that you don't want to divulge that? Because someone else is a liar? Dude, the more you try and waffle on this the worse you look. Just admit that you didn't use industry sources and move on. I know you didn't...you know you didn't...and anyone with a whit of sense knows you didn't. Calling everyone else on the board a liar isn't going to make you LESS of one.

To make matters worse whatever site you DID use fed you bad info. Cain was talked into taking on Godfather's Pizza because he'd done such a great job on the Burger King franchises he'd run. When he took over Godfather's the company was close to going under. He restructured, fired up the employees and turned the company around so it was making a profit. As for your claim that it had lost market share by the time he left the company in 1996? That's because Cain stopped handling day to day operations of the company in 1994. That info comes from PolitiFact.

PolitiFact | Did Herman Cain turn around Godfather's Pizza?

Regarding your edited post, politifact is ONE of my sources!!! It is good to know that you think they are a good source of info and not an anti-Cain site since they do not agree with your highlighted claims.

The chain wasn’t literally preparing paperwork for bankruptcy, but it was widely considered troubled.

Politifact says the franchise was "troubled" but not "close to going under." The "trouble" was mainly a lawsuit that was settled before Cain took over.

And regarding your "making a profit" claim, politifact says this:

Cain has said that the chain returned to profitability within 14 months of his arrival. That number wasn’t possible for PolitiFact to independently confirm because the chain did not report its profits as a stand-alone unit, but industry analysts do not dispute that Cain stabilized the company.

Technomic, a research and consulting firm focused on the restaurant industry, has research data on Godfather’s going back to the 1970s. At PolitiFact’s request, vice president Darren Tristano examined the revenues and franchise numbers for Godfather’s during the time Cain headed it from 1986 to 1995.
It's not possible to determine profitability from those numbers, but they do show Godfather's place in the market, particularly in comparison with its competitors.
"It’s really hard from that period to find a strong positive or a strong negative. It’s more like ‘steady the course,’" Tristano said.

Gee, Ed...if you got your facts from PolitiFact then why are you telling us you got them from restaurant industry sources? So now that we've established that it was actually PolitFact that was "one" of your sources, did you want to divulge the others? Or are you going to keep on stonewalling on that topic?

As for what they "agree" with? I'm baffled by what you found in the PolitiFact piece that contradicts what I stated. Herman Cain took over a troubled business that was going up against fierce competition and turned it around so that it was profitable and kept it so for a ten year period. I hate to point out the obvious here but "your" source proves "my" point.

 

[edthecynic]

I just asked what your restaurant industry sources were, Ed...now why is it again that you don't want to divulge that? Because someone else is a liar? Dude, the more you try and waffle on this the worse you look. Just admit that you didn't use industry sources and move on. I know you didn't...you know you didn't...and anyone with a whit of sense knows you didn't. Calling everyone else on the board a liar isn't going to make you LESS of one.

To make matters worse whatever site you DID use fed you bad info. Cain was talked into taking on Godfather's Pizza because he'd done such a great job on the Burger King franchises he'd run. When he took over Godfather's the company was close to going under. He restructured, fired up the employees and turned the company around so it was making a profit. As for your claim that it had lost market share by the time he left the company in 1996? That's because Cain stopped handling day to day operations of the company in 1994. That info comes from PolitiFact.

PolitiFact | Did Herman Cain turn around Godfather's Pizza?

Regarding your edited post, politifact is ONE of my sources!!! It is good to know that you think they are a good source of info and not an anti-Cain site since they do not agree with your highlighted claims.



Politifact says the franchise was "troubled" but not "close to going under." The "trouble" was mainly a lawsuit that was settled before Cain took over.

And regarding your "making a profit" claim, politifact says this:

Cain has said that the chain returned to profitability within 14 months of his arrival. That number wasn’t possible for PolitiFact to independently confirm because the chain did not report its profits as a stand-alone unit, but industry analysts do not dispute that Cain stabilized the company.

Technomic, a research and consulting firm focused on the restaurant industry, has research data on Godfather’s going back to the 1970s. At PolitiFact’s request, vice president Darren Tristano examined the revenues and franchise numbers for Godfather’s during the time Cain headed it from 1986 to 1995.
It's not possible to determine profitability from those numbers, but they do show Godfather's place in the market, particularly in comparison with its competitors.
"It’s really hard from that period to find a strong positive or a strong negative. It’s more like ‘steady the course,’" Tristano said.

Gee, Ed...if you got your facts from PolitiFact then why are you telling us you got them from restaurant industry sources? So now that we've established that it was actually PolitFact that was "one" of your sources, did you want to divulge the others? Or are you going to keep on stonewalling on that topic?

As for what they "agree" with? I'm baffled by what you found in the PolitiFact piece that contradicts what I stated. Herman Cain took over a troubled business that was going up against fierce competition and turned it around so that it was profitable and kept it so for a ten year period. I hate to point out the obvious here but "your" source proves "my" point.

Well, at least you backed away from the "close to going under" crap and now you admit the franchise was only troubled, but you still lie about it being "profitable" when YOUR own source says It's not possible to determine profitability.

You gotta just admire a CON'$ tenacity for duplicity, no matter how clearly their own source says it is NOT possible to determine profitability, they claim the source proves their point that the franchise was profitable!

 

[edthecynic]

BULLSHIT yourself....ya got a lot to learn....

A company almost ready to go bankrupt is pretty much worth "nothing" in the business world...

Streamling a company from 725 units (stores) to only 525...yet maintaining the SAME total amount in sales.....is called SUCCESS by any other name in the business world....

Under Cain the average Godfather sales per unit INCREASED....even in a very competitive market against national chains like Pizza Hut and Dominoes...this is called "building" a good company....

Now if Cain could only apply this to the Government world......he could downsize government "units".....yet double their effectiveness.....and so dramatically cut costs....

I find it interesting that even though you provide no links, Jarhead has not demanded that you back your claims with links like he did me!!!! It's pretty obvious who has a double standard here!

Since you provided no links, I need no links to contradict you.

Godfather's was not ready to go bankrupt, troubled yes, but they were not ready to prepare any bankruptcy papers when Pilsbury bought them. Like everything else you posted, an exaggeration.

There were over 800 "units" when Pilsbury bought the franchise, and there are 620 now. During Cain's reign it did not outpace Pizza Hut or Domono's. By closing the poorer performing "units" Cain was able to stabilize the chain, but that was it. He couldn't grow it, kinda like Obama stabilizing the failed and troubled Bush economy but not being able to grow it, so if stabilizing Godfather's makes Cain a super businessman, then Obama stabilizing the economy makes him a super president. If Obama stabilizing the economy but failing to grow it makes Obama a failure as president, then failing to grow Godfather's after stabilizing it makes Cain a failure as a businessman.

Any claims of increased profitability cannot be confirmed because the chain did not report its profits as a stand alone unit. All their numbers show is their place in the market in comparison to their competition. For anyone to claim anything beyond that means they must have access to data not available to researchers in the restaurant industry, which means they are full of shit.

Basically, Cain was a motivational speaker for the franchise. That's what the people in the chain remember him most for, not as a brilliant businessman. Like Obama, Cain is all talk.

sorry i neglected to post my source so here it is.....now how about yours....?

After Pillsbury acquired Godfather’s Pizza and put Cain in charge, he set about reforming the chain’s management priorities: Cain wanted to measure success not by the number of Godfather’s units operating, but rather by the average sales of each unit, which Cain saw as more important for long-term success. So he closed unprofitable restaurants, reducing the number of Godfather’s units from 725 at the time of his 1986 takeover to about 525 by 1995. And Cain’s emphasis on quality over quantity proved effective. Nation’s Restaurant News reported that while the system-wide sales of the 725 units totaled approximately $260 million in 1986, by 1995 the much smaller network of 525 Godfather’s restaurants was making $250 million annually.

In 1988, Pillsbury decided not to remain in the pizza business, so Cain and his senior management took over the chain in a $50 million leveraged buyout, and were excited to do so. While Godfather’s had suffered an $8 million net loss in the year prior to Cain’s appointment in 1986, it would boast a $4 million profit by the end of fiscal year 1988. As CEO, Cain maintained the reforms that had gotten Godfather’s cooking again.

Herman Cain CEO « Herman Cain News

Interesting how your right-wing National Review article uses 1985 to make a claim about profitability compared to profitability once Cain took over, even though it has already been established that it is not possible to determine profitability with the numbers available to the public, when trying to claim that Cain was able to maintain the same sales with less units they started with 1986 rather than 1985. In 1985, the year before Cain took over the total sales for 720 units was $325 million, according to the trade publication "Restaurant Business." So rather than maintaining the same sales volume with less units, sales declined by $75 million from the year before Cain took control over Cain's 10 years. And that is not accounting for inflation over those 10 years.

What is also interesting is that Pilsbury was estimated to have paid $100 to 150 million for Godfather's, it was part of a deal that included 300 Burger King units so the exact price is unknown, and after Cain had supposedly made it "profitable" by 1988, Pilsbury sold it in 1988 at a steep loss!!!! Something does not add up about the Godfather's turn around by 1988 under Cain. Godfather's has grown in number of units and sales after Cain left. Your own 1986 to 1995 numbers show a record of stagnant sales that couldn't even keep up with inflation during Cain's tenure as CEO.

 

[Oldstyle]

Regarding your edited post, politifact is ONE of my sources!!! It is good to know that you think they are a good source of info and not an anti-Cain site since they do not agree with your highlighted claims.



Politifact says the franchise was "troubled" but not "close to going under." The "trouble" was mainly a lawsuit that was settled before Cain took over.

And regarding your "making a profit" claim, politifact says this:

Gee, Ed...if you got your facts from PolitiFact then why are you telling us you got them from restaurant industry sources? So now that we've established that it was actually PolitFact that was "one" of your sources, did you want to divulge the others? Or are you going to keep on stonewalling on that topic?

As for what they "agree" with? I'm baffled by what you found in the PolitiFact piece that contradicts what I stated. Herman Cain took over a troubled business that was going up against fierce competition and turned it around so that it was profitable and kept it so for a ten year period. I hate to point out the obvious here but "your" source proves "my" point.

Well, at least you backed away from the "close to going under" crap and now you admit the franchise was only troubled, but you still lie about it being "profitable" when YOUR own source says It's not possible to determine profitability.

You gotta just admire a CON'$ tenacity for duplicity, no matter how clearly their own source says it is NOT possible to determine profitability, they claim the source proves their point that the franchise was profitable!

Why would I back away from saying Godfather's Pizza was close to going under? That's what "troubled" means. Or do you think that description denotes health in a business? How is it that I'm lying about Cain making Godfather's profitable? I'll give you a suggestion, Ed...go back and read the article and focus on what the franchise owner said about Cain. Does that sound like a man who was unhappy? Someone who lost his shirt? The guy thinks Herman Cain was the best thing to happen to Godfather's Pizza since the invention of pepperoni. It's quite obvious that Cain turned things around. You just won't admit it because (gasp) he's a conservative and (gasp) he's critical of Barack Obama.

Still don't want to reveal your "industry sources"...do you? Too funny...

 

[edthecynic]

Gee, Ed...if you got your facts from PolitiFact then why are you telling us you got them from restaurant industry sources? So now that we've established that it was actually PolitFact that was "one" of your sources, did you want to divulge the others? Or are you going to keep on stonewalling on that topic?

As for what they "agree" with? I'm baffled by what you found in the PolitiFact piece that contradicts what I stated. Herman Cain took over a troubled business that was going up against fierce competition and turned it around so that it was profitable and kept it so for a ten year period. I hate to point out the obvious here but "your" source proves "my" point.

Well, at least you backed away from the "close to going under" crap and now you admit the franchise was only troubled, but you still lie about it being "profitable" when YOUR own source says It's not possible to determine profitability.

You gotta just admire a CON'$ tenacity for duplicity, no matter how clearly their own source says it is NOT possible to determine profitability, they claim the source proves their point that the franchise was profitable!

Why would I back away from saying Godfather's Pizza was close to going under? That's what "troubled" means. Or do you think that description denotes health in a business? How is it that I'm lying about Cain making Godfather's profitable? I'll give you a suggestion, Ed...go back and read the article and focus on what the franchise owner said about Cain. Does that sound like a man who was unhappy? Someone who lost his shirt? The guy thinks Herman Cain was the best thing to happen to Godfather's Pizza since the invention of pepperoni. It's quite obvious that Cain turned things around. You just won't admit it because (gasp) he's a conservative and (gasp) he's critical of Barack Obama.

Still don't want to reveal your "industry sources"...do you? Too funny...

Anecdotal evidence is worthless. Godfather's sales dropped to the bottom his first year and stayed there his whole time as CEO and while he was on the management board. After he stepped down from the board, sales finally went back over $300 million where they were before Cain had anything to do with Godfather's.