Patriots Super Bowl ring

[Oldstyle]

I mean would you appeal a lower court decision if the same judge was going to hear the case at the next level? It's absurd.

 

[Papageorgio]

How does this "investigation" make anything come out right? Goodell looks like an idiot. Ted Wells looks incompetent. Robert Kraft tries to play peacemaker...gets screwed by Goodell and now want's Goodell's head on a platter. Tom Brady has to spend time in a court room instead of on the practice field doing his job. The fans of football get to watch the Pittsburg Steelers and the New England Patriots kick off the year with Jimmy Garapolo under center instead of one of the all time great quarterbacks turning what should be a good game into a possible stinker. Who wins from this? Teams that suck so bad that they think the only way they stand a chance against a team like the Patriots is to try and handicap them? The precedence this sets is SO bad that it most likely will lead to a revamping of the Commissioner's powers. Goodell has proven repeatedly that he doesn't have a clue what he's doing when it comes to enforcing NFL rules.

No one wins, the fans don't win. Brady should have cooperated to the fullest extent and kicked Goodell's ass instead of tampering with evidence and now we still have this mess because of him. For Kraft's part he should not have tried to buy off Goodell by paying the million dollar fine. He did not do any justice to his fan base, the fan base as whole or the NFL.

You mean turning over his cell phone so obsessive idiots like you can pour through his private life looking for something to smear him with? Like showing a picture of his nanny showing off Brady's Super Bowl rings and claiming that Brady was boinking her? Brady knew EXACTLY what would come from "cooperating to the fullest" with an NFL office in New York that is blatantly anti-New England Patriots.

As for Kraft? Oh, he's learned his lesson! At this point Roger Goodell could be on fire and Robert Kraft wouldn't piss on him to put it out! Start looking for other work, Roger...your time is about over at the NFL.

True, nothing in the CBA allows the Commissioner to seize or search personal property.

I never said that and that was not an issue until Brady offered several incorrect version of what happened to the phone to begin. At that point Brady looked very wrong on this.

Looking wrong and being wrong are entirely different. The NFL though they didn't need to, should have conducted an independent investigation.

 

[Alex.]

The NFL claims Brady broke his phone, also the NFL said they did not want the phone. Just give them the relevant phone numbers. So why does the NFL care what was done with the phone.

Both sides are lying, I find neither side credible.

I look at the standard applied by the NFL and am satisfied they have met their burden. Brady is a liar and a con artist. I liked Brady before this, an underdog who worked hard to achieve greatness. Now he is just a 6th round draft pick who manipulated and broke the rules to get ahead. No more than a man who was ruled by his character defects to get ahead and could not give one **** about the institution or the people he crapped on.

Too bad he doesn't realize that it would be better for him to resign now rather than leave the league w/ egg on his face

Resign? WTF? You equate him with a politician?

If the Pats let him go, several teams would sign him right away. The Pats won't let him go because he is good.

Goodell has lied and pushed the issue with Brady, if anyone is going to resign, it's Goodell.

The whole idea is really stupid.

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

"Q. And when you provided it to your assistant, did you provide it to your assistant for the purpose of it being disposed of?

A. Yes"

 

[Alex.]

I mean would you appeal a lower court decision if the same judge was going to hear the case at the next level? It's absurd.

This is not court it is an arbitration guided by the rules in the CBA.

 

[Papageorgio]

I look at the standard applied by the NFL and am satisfied they have met their burden. Brady is a liar and a con artist. I liked Brady before this, an underdog who worked hard to achieve greatness. Now he is just a 6th round draft pick who manipulated and broke the rules to get ahead. No more than a man who was ruled by his character defects to get ahead and could not give one **** about the institution or the people he crapped on.

Too bad he doesn't realize that it would be better for him to resign now rather than leave the league w/ egg on his face

Resign? WTF? You equate him with a politician?

If the Pats let him go, several teams would sign him right away. The Pats won't let him go because he is good.

Goodell has lied and pushed the issue with Brady, if anyone is going to resign, it's Goodell.

The whole idea is really stupid.

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

"Q. And when you provided it to your assistant, did you provide it to your assistant for the purpose of it being disposed of?

A. Yes"

The NFL didn't want the phone, therefore there was no destroying of evidence.

 

[Alex.]

Too bad he doesn't realize that it would be better for him to resign now rather than leave the league w/ egg on his face

Resign? WTF? You equate him with a politician?

If the Pats let him go, several teams would sign him right away. The Pats won't let him go because he is good.

Goodell has lied and pushed the issue with Brady, if anyone is going to resign, it's Goodell.

The whole idea is really stupid.

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

"Q. And when you provided it to your assistant, did you provide it to your assistant for the purpose of it being disposed of?

A. Yes"

The NFL didn't want the phone, therefore there was no destroying of evidence.

The phone was the only location where the texts were stored they sure did want that.

 

[Oldstyle]

I mean would you appeal a lower court decision if the same judge was going to hear the case at the next level? It's absurd.

This is not court it is an arbitration guided by the rules in the CBA.

What is arbitration? It's a neutral party both sides agree to, looking at the facts and deciding one way or the other. Roger Goodell is in no way shape or form a "neutral party"...he's the guy who made the initial ruling!

 

[Oldstyle]

Who would be so incredibly stupid that they would declare themselves the arbiter to a case that they have already ruled on?

 

[Unkotare]

Who would be so incredibly stupid that they would declare themselves the arbiter to a case that they have already ruled on?

Roger

 

[Papageorgio]

Resign? WTF? You equate him with a politician?

If the Pats let him go, several teams would sign him right away. The Pats won't let him go because he is good.

Goodell has lied and pushed the issue with Brady, if anyone is going to resign, it's Goodell.

The whole idea is really stupid.

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

"Q. And when you provided it to your assistant, did you provide it to your assistant for the purpose of it being disposed of?

A. Yes"

The NFL didn't want the phone, therefore there was no destroying of evidence.

The phone was the only location where the texts were stored they sure did want that.

The NFL and Wells both said they didn't need the phone. They would take records that he would provide. Also, what right does the NFL have to take a person's cell phone? Nothing illegal happened and they had no right to it.

 

[Oldstyle]

Who would be so incredibly stupid that they would declare themselves the arbiter to a case that they have already ruled on?

Roger

Seriously, what was he thinking? Who in their right mind would not see how ridiculous it is to "self arbitrate"? I'm making that word up I'm pretty sure because nobody would be stupid enough to attempt that.

 

[Alex.]

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

"Q. And when you provided it to your assistant, did you provide it to your assistant for the purpose of it being disposed of?

A. Yes"

The NFL didn't want the phone, therefore there was no destroying of evidence.

The phone was the only location where the texts were stored they sure did want that.

The NFL and Wells both said they didn't need the phone. They would take records that he would provide. Also, what right does the NFL have to take a person's cell phone? Nothing illegal happened and they had no right to it.

Try again Brady screwed himself when he gave several stories about where the texts were stored, that would be the phone.

 

[Alex.]

Who would be so incredibly stupid that they would declare themselves the arbiter to a case that they have already ruled on?

"in the NFL, any reviews of Commissioner Goodell’s actions are only reviewable to him."

http://scholarship.law.berkeley.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1041&context=bjesl

 

[Papageorgio]

Again, Wells and the NFL said they did not need the phone. The bigger issue is they had no right to the phone in the first place. The NFL did not own the phone, it is personal property. What is on that phone is no ones business but Brady's. He has no obligation to hand over his personal property to anyone without a warrant. Since nothing illegal happened it was not the NFL or Wells right to take, seize or look at the phone.

 

[Alex.]

Again, Wells and the NFL said they did not need the phone. The bigger issue is they had no right to the phone in the first place. The NFL did not own the phone, it is personal property. What is on that phone is no ones business but Brady's. He has no obligation to hand over his personal property to anyone without a warrant. Since nothing illegal happened it was not the NFL or Wells right to take, seize or look at the phone.

Illegal is not the standard. Otherwise yes they wanted the texts.

 

[Oldstyle]

Who would be so incredibly stupid that they would declare themselves the arbiter to a case that they have already ruled on?

"in the NFL, any reviews of Commissioner Goodell’s actions are only reviewable to him."

http://scholarship.law.berkeley.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1041&context=bjesl

From that same Berkeley article: "
Commissioner Goodell has the broadest powers of any of the four
professional league commissioners. As detailed above, in each of the
three other sports, the commissioners’ power to review and discipline a
re subject to arbitration review for most, but not all decisions. For example, appeals of
discipline in the MLB go to either a neutral arbitrator or a tripartite arbitrationreview panel.
While in the NBA, only the economic impact of a disciplinary action can
be appealed to an arbitrator, whereas in the NFL, any reviews of Commissioner
Goodell’s actions are only reviewable to him. The NFL systemis clearly the
worst system of the four. It provides no independent review and grants
Commissioner Goodell near unlimited power. The “BountyGate” scandal
is a perfect example of how Commissioner Goodell’s nearly unlimited disciplinary
power is problematic and requires reform."

Note that opinion was made BEFORE the debacle now known as "DeflateGate" took place! Even back then it was a considered legal opinion that what Goodell was allowed to do was the "worst system" of the four major professional leagues.

 

[Oldstyle]

"p]layer . . . acknowledges his awareness that if [the player] is guilty of any other form of conduct reasonably judged by the League Commissioner to be detrimental to the League or profession football, the Commissioner will have the right . . after giving [the] Player the opportunity for a hearing . . . to suspend Player for a period certain or indefinitely . . ."

Here's my problem with what has transpired with this case. Has Roger Goodell in fact "reasonably judged" the conduct when the investigation by Ted Wells turned up no proof that anyone from the Patriots deliberately deflated game balls to levels below what was deemed legal by the referee who inspected the balls pre-game? How can it be "reasonable" to fine the Patriots a million dollars and two draft picks when the penalty for tampering with equipment was established at $25,000? How can it be "reasonable" to suspend Tom Brady for four games, costing him nearly 5 million when absolutely no proof was ever provided by the Wells investigation that Brady was involved in deflating balls to illegal levels?

Yes...Roger Goodell has near unlimited power to discipline players...but he is also required by the CBA to be a "reasonable" judge...which he has failed at MISERABLY in this case!

 

[Dot Com]

Brady and Kraft should have stood tall and beat the NFL according to the rules ion the CBA instead of paying the fine and crying about it and destroying evidence and failing to cooperate.

^ that

 

[Dot Com]

Brady was told by the other side that they did NOT need his phone. His legal team turned over hundreds of pages of text and data anyway. Brady getting a new phone was in no way "tampering with evidence." The lies being thrown about over this are ridiculous, and the NFL is guilty of knowingly promoting such lies.

ummm..... yeah. I'm going to ask you for a link doodie boi even though you shouldn't have to be asked.

 

[Dot Com]

First off, there is no proof that Brady destroyed his phone, only the NFL said he destroyed the phone.

Secondly, according to Wells and the NFL they said they didn't need the phone and told Brady to give them any relevant communication that had to do with deflated footballs, so there isn't any evidence destroyed.

Third, he could have erased text messages instead of destroying his phone and it would have the same effect.

Fourth, Brady said he provided the calls and texts numbers.

Again, no evidence destroyed, no evidence provided that Brady did anything wrong. I believe he knew something. The NFL has been inconsistent with its discipline and although Goodell has a lot of power, him overstepped and made an issue that a simple fine would have sufficed.

link, link, link, & link. k? thanks