OPINION: Why mRNA Vaccines are failing.

[LordBrownTrout]

Because it reduces hospitalization and death at up to 95%, that's why. The majority of the ppl dying from covid breakthroughts are typically severely immunocompromised and hospitalizations are usually from those same ppl. This one simple fact doesn't seem to get through to you ppl because you're so invested in your moronic lies spanning anywhere from claims of 5G tapping in vaccines to magnets to how it alters your dna, etc, etc.. You are a bunch of children, too afraid to get a needle shot, and are making up stories to justify why you can't get it. It's really sad, like seriously.

Nope, the injection hasn't been through the proper clinical trials which usually take 8-12 years. This one took 6 months and already there are tens of thousands of deaths and hundreds of thousands of injuries. No thanks.

 

[Rigby5]

Because it reduces hospitalization and death at up to 95%, that's why. The majority of the ppl dying from covid breakthroughts are typically severely immunocompromised and hospitalizations are usually from those same ppl. This one simple fact doesn't seem to get through to you ppl because you're so invested in your moronic lies spanning anywhere from claims of 5G tapping in vaccines to magnets to how it alters your dna, etc, etc.. You are a bunch of children, too afraid to get a needle shot, and are making up stories to justify why you can't get it. It's really sad, like seriously.

Sure the mRNA injections reduce death for the compromised.
But for the uncompromised who are 400 times less likely to die from infection, they actually increase the death rate.
Read something about the mRNA injections.
They can kill or maim in many ways, over 10 times more dangerous than any previous vax.
They can cause anaphylactic shock, they can migrate and kill you if the immune system finds them in the brain or heart, they can cause extremity amputation if they migrate to extremities, etc.
And they CAN'T produce long term immunity.
For that, immunity info has to be stored in T-cell memory.
And there is nothing for our immune system to store from mRNA injections.
It can't store a response to spike proteins because our own exosomes have to use spike proteins for ACE2 receptor access.

 

[Rigby5]

Wrong

You said boosters. Boosters are not part of the initial vaccine dosing of two shots.

Sinovac is no more special at this than any other covid vaccine including the MRNA ones. However with Sinovac's failure to even produce enough antibodies to adequately protect ppl in the first place raises a lot more questions about it's overall efficacy than MRNA ever would. I'm not surprised that you would gravitate towards the most questionable vaccine out of all of them.

Wrong.
Sinovac does not use boosters like the mRNA vax does.
The Sinvac simply spreads out the injection over multiple shots to reduce side effects.
The mRNA needs boosters because it is temporary, transient, and has no long term T-cell memory.

Efficacy is irrelevant since covid is not a serious threat.
All you really want to do is to prevent the fatal over reaction by the immune system, the deadly cytokine storm.

No vaccine "protects" a person from getting infected.
That is not how vaccines or any immune system works.

Sinovac IS special, in that it contains REAL covid virus.
The immune system knows how to store long term immunity information about a REAL virus.
The immune system does NOT know how to store long term immunity information about an mRNA injection that just gets your own cells to grow spike proteins.

There is nothing questionable about a vaccine containing REAL virus.
We know that works.
What is questionable is a vax that only generates spike proteins in our own cells.
That is ridiculously dangerous, and has no means of being stored in long term memory.

 

[ClaireH]

Wrong!

LOL. Aside from the lie that ppl are taking 3 BOOSTERS of Sinovac, I gotta say, making such a claim actually makes any argument for Sinovac much worse. Taking 3 boosters is essentially equivalent to overdosing yourself, and you're telling ppl that Sinovac has achieved 90% efficacy as a result., lmao, good one. Sinovac has never achieved 90% efficacy at preventing covid infection, ever. Stop the junk science and lies.

As of right now, Pfizer produces 10x more antibodies than Sinovac after the second dose. After 6 months, antibodies in ppl vaccinated with Sinovac are at near undetectable levels in the vast majority of ppl. So much for your claim that traditional vaccines are better.

BioNTech Shot Produces 10 Times More Antibodies Than Sinovac, Study Finds

There is a substantial gap in the amount of antibodies that mRNA and inactivated vaccines can generate against the virus that causes Covid-19, according to a Hong Kong study, in the latest finding on what may have contributed to the varied outcomes following mass vaccination using different...

www.bloomberg.com

Antibodies from Sinovac's COVID-19 shot fade after about 6 months, booster helps - study

Antibodies triggered by Sinovac Biotech's (SVA.O) COVID-19 vaccine declined below a key threshold from around six months after a second dose for most recipients, but a third shot had a strong booster effect, a lab study showed.

www.reuters.com

As for Moderna, it produces significantly more than twice the number of antibodies as the Pfizer vaccine. Moderna is so strong it's even nearly 87% effective against delta infection still.

Moderna Vaccine Highly Effective Against Delta—But Protection Against Infection May Wane Over Time, New Data Suggests

The company said it believes booster shots are necessary “to maintain high levels of protection” as it saw 36% more “breakthrough infections” in people who got the vaccine last year.

www.forbes.com

Moderna's COVID-19 vaccine proves effective against multiple SARS-CoV-2 variants, including delta

Researchers in the United States have demonstrated the real-world effectiveness of Moderna’s mRNA-1273 vaccine at protecting against infection with severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) and preventing hospitalization due to coronavirus disease 2019 (COVID-19).

www.news-medical.net

Moderna vs. Pfizer: Is One Vaccine Stronger Against the Delta Variant?

With many now able to choose which COVID vaccine they receive, questions surrounding which offers better protection against the now-surging delta variant have spiked.

www.nbcchicago.com

MRNA is the future.

They absolutely made a mistake for profit motive and rushed trusting with targeting memory B cells when targeting T cells was the solution.

It’s not worth arguing over whether its 4 or 6 months “protection” when protection is defined as increased antibodies that can only reduce symptoms, not prevention. How can you claim these ineffective products are effective?

The populace at large will soon have access to a true vaccine for prevention from coronaviruses, and it’s predicted to work equally to its success with influenza to the tune of 17 years of real protection. 17 years, that’s all I need to know.

T cell-oriented strategies for controlling the COVID-19 pandemic - Nature Reviews Immunology

This Comment article proposes that T cell-oriented vaccine strategies should be considered to control the COVID-19 pandemic in the longer term, given declining levels of neutralizing antibodies with time after vaccination or infection and the emergence of viral escape variants.

www.nature.com

 

[Billy_Bob]

You're not anti vaxxer????

Pull the other leg son. It plays jingle bells.

You obviously don't have a clue how the human bodies immune system works...

 

[Colin norris]

You obviously don't have a clue how the human bodies immune system works...

And you're an expert on it Dr. Billy Bob?

 

[krichton]

They absolutely made a mistake for profit motive and rushed trusting with targeting memory B cells when targeting T cells was the solution.

It’s not worth arguing over whether its 4 or 6 months “protection” when protection is defined as increased antibodies that can only reduce symptoms, not prevention. How can you claim these ineffective products are effective?

The populace at large will soon have access to a true vaccine for prevention from coronaviruses, and it’s predicted to work equally to its success with influenza to the tune of 17 years of real protection. 17 years, that’s all I need to know.

T cell-oriented strategies for controlling the COVID-19 pandemic - Nature Reviews Immunology

This Comment article proposes that T cell-oriented vaccine strategies should be considered to control the COVID-19 pandemic in the longer term, given declining levels of neutralizing antibodies with time after vaccination or infection and the emergence of viral escape variants.

www.nature.com

The article you link argues that both infection and the mrna vaccines elicit t cell responses equally. Thank you for proving yourself wrong with your own link. The article mentions that there are other vaccines in the works that will target more than the spike protein for a broader t cell response, but I literally have no idea where you are getting the whole "17 years of protection from influeza." No vaccine exists against influenza which doesn't require a yearly flu shot in the arm. What a strange lie to make up. There is no "true" vaccine. Even in the article you linked says, herd immunity is unlikely and we must continue our current vaccine programs. Do you even read any of this stuff?

Here's some additional reading about mrna and tcell response for anyone who can read properly

T-Cells & COVID-19: Penn Study Shows Robust T-Cell Response to Vaccine

Messenger-RNA (mRNA) vaccines against the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 provoke a swift and strong response by the immune system’s T cells—the heavy armor of the immune system—according to a study from researchers in the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania.

www.pennmedicine.org

Do mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines induce memory T cell response similar to natural infection?

A team of scientists from the United States has recently compared the epitope-specific T cell response after natural severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection or vaccination in both naïve and previously infected individuals.

www.news-medical.net

 

[krichton]

Wrong.
Sinovac does not use boosters like the mRNA vax does.
The Sinvac simply spreads out the injection over multiple shots to reduce side effects.
The mRNA needs boosters because it is temporary, transient, and has no long term T-cell memory.

Efficacy is irrelevant since covid is not a serious threat.
All you really want to do is to prevent the fatal over reaction by the immune system, the deadly cytokine storm.

No vaccine "protects" a person from getting infected.
That is not how vaccines or any immune system works.

Sinovac IS special, in that it contains REAL covid virus.
The immune system knows how to store long term immunity information about a REAL virus.
The immune system does NOT know how to store long term immunity information about an mRNA injection that just gets your own cells to grow spike proteins.

There is nothing questionable about a vaccine containing REAL virus.
We know that works.
What is questionable is a vax that only generates spike proteins in our own cells.
That is ridiculously dangerous, and has no means of being stored in long term memory.

Wrong

You specifically said Sinovac has achieved 90% efficacy by way of 3 boosters. I can't even tell you how much wrong there is in that one statement. lol.

Dont need boosters you say? I thought you said you needed 3 boosters. Several countries are already issuing out sinovac boosters because antibodies from that vaccine has literally plummeted so dramatically. When your original efficacy was 50%, I'm not surprised to read that antibodies are nearly undetectable in some ppl. Tcell memory of covid infection and vaccination have been studied and the conclusion over and over is that they are the same. Stop it with all the junk science.

 

[ClaireH]

The article you link argues that both infection and the mrna vaccines elicit t cell responses equally. Thank you for proving yourself wrong with your own link. The article mentions that there are other vaccines in the works that will target more than the spike protein for a broader t cell response, but I literally have no idea where you are getting the whole "17 years of protection from influeza." No vaccine exists against influenza which doesn't require a yearly flu shot in the arm. What a strange lie to make up. There is no "true" vaccine. Even in the article you linked says, herd immunity is unlikely and we must continue our current vaccine programs. Do you even read any of this stuff?

Here's some additional reading about mrna and tcell response for anyone who can read properly

T-Cells & COVID-19: Penn Study Shows Robust T-Cell Response to Vaccine

Messenger-RNA (mRNA) vaccines against the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 provoke a swift and strong response by the immune system’s T cells—the heavy armor of the immune system—according to a study from researchers in the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania.

www.pennmedicine.org

Do mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines induce memory T cell response similar to natural infection?

A team of scientists from the United States has recently compared the epitope-specific T cell response after natural severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection or vaccination in both naïve and previously infected individuals.

www.news-medical.net

If you expected I wouldn’t respond to your deliberate falsehoods you are mistaken. Your very first sentence is a blatant lie.

Tip to all readers: read the article and take what you will from it; always avoid any middleman’s intention to falsify primary sources such as this Kritchton character.

Had the three vaccine amateur pharmaceutical companies gone the route of targeting T cells instead of only specific areas on Spike and focus on memory B cell, The data supports that 17 years and still going strong for H1N1 protection.

 

[Billy_Bob]

They absolutely made a mistake for profit motive and rushed trusting with targeting memory B cells when targeting T cells was the solution.

It’s not worth arguing over whether its 4 or 6 months “protection” when protection is defined as increased antibodies that can only reduce symptoms, not prevention. How can you claim these ineffective products are effective?

The populace at large will soon have access to a true vaccine for prevention from coronaviruses, and it’s predicted to work equally to its success with influenza to the tune of 17 years of real protection. 17 years, that’s all I need to know.

T cell-oriented strategies for controlling the COVID-19 pandemic - Nature Reviews Immunology

This Comment article proposes that T cell-oriented vaccine strategies should be considered to control the COVID-19 pandemic in the longer term, given declining levels of neutralizing antibodies with time after vaccination or infection and the emergence of viral escape variants.

www.nature.com

IF you really want to get down to brass tacks on this, the Modified messenger RNA shot does not meet the clinical criteria for a vaccine. They do not allow full cell mapping by the human immune system. This means your immune system will never learn this virus and you will always be at risk from it. Endless shots to keep some form of antibodies makes big pharma hugely profitable while the virus keeps the pandemic going for control purposes.

 

[Billy_Bob]

If you expected I wouldn’t respond to your deliberate falsehoods you are mistaken. Your very first sentence is a blatant lie.

Tip to all readers: read the article and take what you will from it; always avoid any middleman’s intention to falsify primary sources such as this Kritchton character.

Had the three vaccine amateur pharmaceutical companies gone the route of targeting T cells instead of only specific areas on Spike and focus on memory B cell, The data supports that 17 years and still going strong for H1N1 protection.

Correct;

Spike proteins target the B memory cell.

The human immune system is triggered by mass. Consider the mass of the spike proteins' vs the virus, 1 vs 1/100, this is why the immune system takes so long to trigger. Secondly, the Partial cell is not learned and the body never responds to it. This means no long-term immunities are built.

Once the man-made antibodies are gone so are your protections. Endless big pharma shots every 4-6 months and the virus continues unabated. This is why Europe is having its fourth major wave of infections...

 

[badger2]

If you expected I wouldn’t respond to your deliberate falsehoods you are mistaken. Your very first sentence is a blatant lie.

Tip to all readers: read the article and take what you will from it; always avoid any middleman’s intention to falsify primary sources such as this Kritchton character.

Had the three vaccine amateur pharmaceutical companies gone the route of targeting T cells instead of only specific areas on Spike and focus on memory B cell, The data supports that 17 years and still going strong for H1N1 protection.

Fau Chi is the pivot between HIV-1 T cells and influenza T cells.

 

[badger2]

Correct;

Spike proteins target the B memory cell.

The human immune system is triggered by mass. Consider the mass of the spike proteins' vs the virus, 1 vs 1/100, this is why the immune system takes so long to trigger. Secondly, the Partial cell is not learned and the body never responds to it. This means no long-term immunities are built.

Once the man-made antibodies are gone so are your protections. Endless big pharma shots every 4-6 months and the virus continues unabated. This is why Europe is having its fourth major wave of infections...

But mRNA forces the cell to produce Chinese virus parts, and these parts are suspect in causing thrombosis.

 

[Billy_Bob]

But mRNA forces the cell to produce Chinese virus parts, and these parts are suspect in causing thrombosis.

Women are most at risk due to the RH factors. A lot of things the mRNA experiments do to the human body were not foreseen. They didn't even know that they block the human immune system from forming long term protections. IF they did know, it makes the mandates a purposeful way to keep killing people. I know many of those left-wing folks want population control and have for decades. but that is sinical bordering on criminal if you can prove it.

 

[Rigby5]

And you're an expert on it Dr. Billy Bob?

You do not need to be an expert in order to know that vaccines have to have real virus so that the immune system can remember something about that caused the past threat, for reference in the future.
And if you were to claim the immune system used spike proteins as identifiers instead, that also can't work because our own exosomes have to use those same spike proteins.

There is no way these mRNA injections could possibly work, and everyone knows it.

 

[Rigby5]

The article you link argues that both infection and the mrna vaccines elicit t cell responses equally. Thank you for proving yourself wrong with your own link. The article mentions that there are other vaccines in the works that will target more than the spike protein for a broader t cell response, but I literally have no idea where you are getting the whole "17 years of protection from influeza." No vaccine exists against influenza which doesn't require a yearly flu shot in the arm. What a strange lie to make up. There is no "true" vaccine. Even in the article you linked says, herd immunity is unlikely and we must continue our current vaccine programs. Do you even read any of this stuff?

Here's some additional reading about mrna and tcell response for anyone who can read properly

T-Cells & COVID-19: Penn Study Shows Robust T-Cell Response to Vaccine

Messenger-RNA (mRNA) vaccines against the coronavirus that causes COVID-19 provoke a swift and strong response by the immune system’s T cells—the heavy armor of the immune system—according to a study from researchers in the Perelman School of Medicine at the University of Pennsylvania.

www.pennmedicine.org

Do mRNA-based COVID-19 vaccines induce memory T cell response similar to natural infection?

A team of scientists from the United States has recently compared the epitope-specific T cell response after natural severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2) infection or vaccination in both naïve and previously infected individuals.

www.news-medical.net

Wrong.

There is nothing in these mRNA injections the immune system can store in T-cells.
If there was any T-cell response, then there would no need for any boosters at all, in less than a range like 5 years at least.
T-cell memory is usually good for over 30 years.

All the influenza vaccines are life long.
You get different influenza vaccination because there is not one influenza, but hundreds of different pathogens we collectively call influenza.
Anyone who claims flu shot loose effectiveness over time, do not at all know what they are talking about.

Anyone questioning herd immunity is an idiot.
Clearly if herd immunity did not work, was not effective, could not be relied on, etc., then all living species would have gone extinct, hundreds of millions of years ago. Herd immunity is what has historically always worked and was the only solution for hundreds of millions of years. And even though vaccines were invented about 200 years ago, they also still rely on herd immunity, since not everyone can be vaccinated.

 

[Rigby5]

Wrong

You specifically said Sinovac has achieved 90% efficacy by way of 3 boosters. I can't even tell you how much wrong there is in that one statement. lol.

Dont need boosters you say? I thought you said you needed 3 boosters. Several countries are already issuing out sinovac boosters because antibodies from that vaccine has literally plummeted so dramatically. When your original efficacy was 50%, I'm not surprised to read that antibodies are nearly undetectable in some ppl. Tcell memory of covid infection and vaccination have been studied and the conclusion over and over is that they are the same. Stop it with all the junk science.

Wrong.

Incredibly ignorant.
There is a huge difference between dividing a single vaccination process into 3 shots, and the mRNA situation where you need another shot every 4 months, forever.

Immunity is stored in T-cells, so can not be measured in any passive way.
Detecting antibodies does NOT tell you anything about immunity, at all, in any way.

The only way to tell what sort of T-cell memory the immune system has stored is to deliberately reinfect a person.
Such a study has NOT ever been done.
Anyone claiming proof that mRNA injection provides any long term T-cell memory is lying.

All they have ever tested is the statistics on breakthrough infection, of people infected after injection
And that is pointless since there is temporary immunity from short term antibody stimulation.

 

[ClaireH]

Wrong.

There is nothing in these mRNA injections the immune system can store in T-cells.
If there was any T-cell response, then there would no need for any boosters at all, in less than a range like 5 years at least.
T-cell memory is usually good for over 30 years.

All the influenza vaccines are life long.
You get different influenza vaccination because there is not one influenza, but hundreds of different pathogens we collectively call influenza.
Anyone who claims flu shot loose effectiveness over time, do not at all know what they are talking about.

Anyone questioning herd immunity is an idiot.
Clearly if herd immunity did not work, was not effective, could not be relied on, etc., then all living species would have gone extinct, hundreds of millions of years ago. Herd immunity is what has historically always worked and was the only solution for hundreds of millions of years. And even though vaccines were invented about 200 years ago, they also still rely on herd immunity, since not everyone can be vaccinated.

The decision to intentionally enforce a lengthier time period for viral activity was directly caused by Fauci and NIH heads in flattening the curve. They knowingly (unless completely unfamiliar with pandemic response measures) skipped home care/public health education information,
exasperated public panic by telling sick people to stay home because the hospitals were out of PPE. These people cannot be this stupid given their field of supposed expertise. Skipping Tier 2 altogether at the early stages of a pandemic plan going directly into Tier 3 with a fake vaccination mode was the worst decision possible. This decision prevented the window of herd immunity which was still possible at that time- early 2020. Unqualified and uninformed people making decisions for the masses never results in a good outcome. The individuals who made that decision should have been fired.

 

[Colin norris]

You do not need to be an expert in order to know that vaccines have to have real virus so that the immune system can remember something about that caused the past threat, for reference in the future.
And if you were to claim the immune system used spike proteins as identifiers instead, that also can't work because our own exosomes have to use those same spike proteins.

There is no way these mRNA injections could possibly work, and everyone knows it.

Unless you're an expert you're talking shit.. youre not everybody

 

[Rigby5]

Unless you're an expert you're talking shit.. youre not everybody

I am not a medical expert, but I work on pacemakers, have to keep up on all the medical literature, and can easily read and understand medical books.
And I know what I am talking about.
You can too, if you bother to do the research.
These mRNA injections simply cannot work.
The immune system has to have something to remember in T-cells.
The mRNA injections do not have anything that can be remembered.