Obama plans major address in Islamic capital: interview

[WillowTree]

there is a HUGE difference between a man reciting his name in our presidential tradition and a bunch of angry right wingers trying to invoke the memory of Saddam.. I'd say about a 364 to 174 difference.

 

[Tech_Esq]

I'm sure all of that information could have been easily gathered via tapped phone lines anyway.

You tryin' to scare Dillo?

 

[AllieBaba]

I, for one, can't wait for that illusion of a "christian nation" to be dropped like the hood of a klansman in a police lineup.

We aren't a "Christian nation" except as pertains to the prevalent religion of our voters.

Iraq is a "Muslim nation". Sudan is a "Muslim nation". Saudi Arabia is a "Muslim Nation". But they are considered those nations because they are true THEOCRACIES, not republics.

If you honestly think we're a theocracy, I recommend you go live in a country where the religion of the day dictates the laws. Where they use their own interpretation of scripture to justify things like public beheadings of women who are raped, honor killings, female circumcision and the random beating of the vulnerable by groups of men unknown to them. All covered by the "law" of course.

The fact is it's because of our Christianity that the US has managed to keep religion out of government. It's a Christian tenet, moron.

 

[Shogun]

Seriously though, this is such bullshit. The idea that making some speech or conciliatory gesture or gift or anything else will help change things with the Islamic countries. It's so uber-chauvinistic.

The thinking behind it relies on the believe that the Middle East is only reacting to our stimuli. Utterly nonsensical.

They have an agenda of their own. It runs counter to our agenda. They are just as responsible for generating the friction vis-a-vis the US as the US is for generating friction through its actions. There is no reason to believe that they will change their desires to achieve their agenda no matter what Obama says.

indeed, who wouldn't love to be treated like we treat muslims in the mid east? Shit, if only we had someone to come along and create an israel out of one of our state while bombing the shit out of north carolina.

Are you a christian, by chance?

 

[Shogun]

We aren't a "Christian nation" except as pertains to the prevalent religion of our voters.

Iraq is a "Muslim nation". Sudan is a "Muslim nation". Saudi Arabia is a "Muslim Nation". But they are considered those nations because they are true THEOCRACIES, not republics.

If you honestly think we're a theocracy, I recommend you go live in a country where the religion of the day dictates the laws. Where they use their own interpretation of scripture to justify things like public beheadings of women who are raped, honor killings, female circumcision and the random beating of the vulnerable by groups of men unknown to them. All covered by the "law" of course.

The fact is it's because of our Christianity that the US has managed to keep religion out of government. It's a Christian tenet, moron.

hey, i have no illusions about the US being secular. I suggest you point that little vexing cannon at the thumpers who think that our nation was founded for the sake of christianity.


The fact is it's because of our Christianity that the US has managed to keep religion out of government. It's a Christian tenet, moron.

And, excuse me while I laugh my ass off.

 

[Tech_Esq]

indeed, who wouldn't love to be treated like we treat muslims in the mid east? Shit, if only we had someone to come along and create an israel out of one of our state while bombing the shit out of north carolina.

Are you a christian, by chance?

Trite.

You can blame us for a lot of things, but we did not create the middle east and its particular stew of woes. That's the British, go beat up on them. We support who we support, but we didn't make the ************.

No Pagan, why? You have an axe to grind?

 

[AllieBaba]

You need to do some more research, bozo.
Jefferson wanted religion included in the Constitution. It was because of BAPTIST activists that he came around and the separation of church and state was instilled as a necessity for a free nation.

 

[Shogun]

Trite.

You can blame us for a lot of things, but we did not create the middle east and its particular stew of woes. That's the British, go beat up on them. We support who we support, but we didn't make the ************.

No Pagan, why? You have an axe to grind?

Well, no in actuality, given our western 1948 lines on the map, we did create a HUGE issue with the middle east. You really want to toss the blame at England when we all know who gave whom the secret nukes to fend off evil muslims?


Say, pagan, how did Englands pagans react to Christian Romans on the march?

 

[Shogun]

You need to do some more research, bozo.
Jefferson wanted religion included in the Constitution. It was because of BAPTIST activists that he came around and the separation of church and state was instilled as a necessity for a free nation.

see, THAT is the kind of shit that makes you such an easy target.


Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state


Jefferson's Wall of Separation Letter - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net


separation a christian concept.. good grief. As if a great portion of our history isn't the product of dogma junkies trying to apply their religious opinions onto the rest of us. Prop 8 rng a ******* bell?

 

[Tech_Esq]

Well, no in actuality, given our western 1948 lines on the map, we did create a HUGE issue with the middle east. You really want to toss the blame at England when we all know who gave whom the secret nukes to fend off evil muslims?


Say, pagan, how did Englands pagans react to Christian Romans on the march?

Our western???? what are you talking about???

When people say things like, "We all know...." it usually means they are saying something specious that nobody would grant them if they actually made the accusation. So just go ahead say what you mean plainly and I'll react to it.

Could you possibly ask a less relevant question than how England's pagan's reacted to Christian Romans?

 

[Tech_Esq]

see, THAT is the kind of shit that makes you such an easy target.


Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state


Jefferson's Wall of Separation Letter - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net


separation a christian concept.. good grief. As if a great portion of our history isn't the product of dogma junkies trying to apply their religious opinions onto the rest of us. Prop 8 rng a ******* bell?

I had no idea a letter has the weight of a founding document of the country. That's pretty stupid when you think about it, isn't it. Jefferson had his shot. He wrote the Declaration of Independence. He and his Anti-Federalists wrote the Bill of Rights. The Wall O' Separation wasn't in either place. Not even in the two amendments that didn't make it into the Bill of Rights. Nope, it's in a letter. Now we use it to beat religion into submission.

Interesting. A concept whose only basis lies in the letter of an ex-president, is used to subvert rights guaranteed by the First Amendment. I guess it's a good thing Jefferson didn't say there is a wall of separation between free speech and government.

 

[Lycurgus]

Obama also said he would be sworn on January 20 using his full name, Barack Hussein Obama.

now the slimey worm eaten little coward wants to use his middle name!

LOL ............ Considering through the race anyone who mentioned it was labeled a racist by his team or the media.

The only part of this article worth reading is about the address abroad. It could be a really good step forward. However, there are many variables and I doubt we will know or have any remote idea until after the fact.

Other than that, this article partisan press bull shit.

 

[dilloduck]

Well, no in actuality, given our western 1948 lines on the map, we did create a HUGE issue with the middle east. You really want to toss the blame at England when we all know who gave whom the secret nukes to fend off evil muslims?


Say, pagan, how did Englands pagans react to Christian Romans on the march?

You may wanna take another look at all the countries that participated in the division of the spoils of war. And some individuals too. If there were no Israel there would be no need to defend it.

 

[Gord]

maybe he'll make farther strides in finding peace with them since blind support of israel and bombing the shit out of muslim countries hasn't been working very well.

Well let's see where the mainline Muslim countries of the world align themselves:

Afghanistan: Mostly friendly - still occupied and unstable. Certainly more friendly than seven years ago.

Albania: Very friendly - they love president Bush.

Algeria: Somewhat friendly - not a serious problem at any rate.

Azerbaijan: Friendly.

Bahrain: Friendly.

Bangladesh: Friendly.

Bosnia and Herzegovina: Friendly.

Brunei: Friendly.

Egypt: Friendly.

Indonesia: Friendly.

Iran: A friend until Jimmy Carter screwed it up.

Iraq: Friendly, but still occupied and unstable.

Jordan: Friendly.

Kazakhstan: Friendly.

Kosovo: Friendly.

Kuwait: Friendly, especially since being liberated from Saddam Hussein in the Gulf War.

Kyrgyzstan: Friendly.

Lebanon: Mostly friendly, but unstable.

Libya: Friendly since voluntarily giving up its nuclear weapons program (more mature than Iran's and unknown to Western intelligence) to the USA after the invasion of Iraq. Muammar al-Gaddafi said he did not want to be the next country Bush invaded. Gaddafi's son who is slated to take over rule from his father has stated his interest in making Libya a democratic republic based on the American model. This conversion from a nuclear, terrorist threat to a friendly, potentially democratic nation can be solely attributed to Bush's invasion of Iraq.

Malaysia: Friendly.

Morocco: Friendly.

Oman: Friendly.

Pakistan: Officially friendly, but obviously with extremist pockets in the north and the west of the country, which has not changed for two decades.

Qatar: Friendly.

Saudi Arabia: Friendly.

Somalia: Lawless country.

Syria: Has been an adversary for many decades.

Tajikistan: Lawless country.

Turkey: Friendly.

Turkmenistan: Questionable.

United Arab Emirates: Friendly.

Uzbekistan: Questionable.

West Bank and Gaza: Basket case.

Yemen: Questionable.

Unlisted African nations range from lawless to insignificant.

Seems like American foreign policy toward Muslim nations has been quite productive.

 

[AllieBaba]

see, THAT is the kind of shit that makes you such an easy target.


Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man & his god, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof, thus building a wall of separation between church and state


Jefferson's Wall of Separation Letter - The U.S. Constitution Online - USConstitution.net


separation a christian concept.. good grief. As if a great portion of our history isn't the product of dogma junkies trying to apply their religious opinions onto the rest of us. Prop 8 rng a ******* bell?

Jefferson came to those beliefs after spending a huge amount of time with a Baptist preacher who convinced him that religion had no place in any government, even a democracy.

Once again, I adjure you to read up on the subject.

 

[Shogun]

Jefferson came to those beliefs after spending a huge amount of time with a Baptist preacher who convinced him that religion had no place in any government, even a democracy.

Once again, I adjure you to read up on the subject.

sure, baba.. SUUUUUUUUUURE. and wtiting his own bible nixing out all the miracles just proves that he was a devout southern baptist. YOu can ignore whatever direct quote you need to.




It's still an knee slapping ******* joke that youd even try to pretend that it's the dogma junkies who WANT the separation of church and state instead of the exact opposite.

 

[Toro]

I always knew Hussein Obama was a terrorist. This proves it.

 

[Shogun]

to appeal for peace with islam is terrorist?

 

[KGB]

Well, no in actuality, given our western 1948 lines on the map, we did create a HUGE issue with the middle east. You really want to toss the blame at England when we all know who gave whom the secret nukes to fend off evil muslims?


Say, pagan, how did Englands pagans react to Christian Romans on the march?

you need a history lesson....

The Middle East conflict—a brief background — Global Issues

 

[KGB]

. I guess it's a good thing Jefferson didn't say there is a wall of separation between free speech and government.

see the Fairness Doctrine....