Obama freezes unfriendly coverage

[Immanuel]

Is pointing out the inconsistencies of a double standard adversial?

Actually, if you ask me, it is welcomed as long as you are willing to listen to the other side's point of view when you bring up those inconsistencies.

Immie

 

[Oldandtired]

Oldand tired - didn't we engage in a conversation yesterday in which you claimed that Obama should be held accountable for things he DID NOT SAY - because you claimed - people being people, they are going to HEAR a different message and Obama is at fault for NOT accounting for that?

And today you are trying to defend "ploys," omissions, and delayed "fessing up" by FOX news and implying that they should NOT be held accountable?????????

The last FOX news poll shows Obama's approval rating at 50% for and 42% against. Count up the people they quote - are 50% expressing favorable views of Obama and 42% expressing negative views of Obama?

Count up the opinions reflected in their ticker below the screen - again, are 50% expressing approval and 42% disapproval?

Watch who you want to watch, agree with who you want to agree with, and encourage others to agree with you to your heart's content. But don't ever try to sell that "balanced and fair" fantasy to me unless you are ready to get the door slammed in your face.

I do not support misleading in anyway whatsoever...

I was disturbed by their leaving out the "dropping of charges"...but it was done on Beck and I give little credence to his show anyway....

We can change the channel if the news is not accurate.

Decisions are made based on the accuracy of what a President says.

You can not compare the two.

but again....WHEN DID THEIR NEWS REPORTING LIE?


You will get a better debate from me...and an honest one...if you did not come across so adversarial. Just a little advice.

Is pointing out the inconsistencies of a double standard adversial?

Nope. Not at all.
But you know that already.....and you know what I was referring to.

 

[nodoginnafight]

Is pointing out the inconsistencies of a double standard adversial?

Actually, if you ask me, it is welcomed as long as you are willing to listen to the other side's point of view when you bring up those inconsistencies.

Immie

I agree - and in one sense, debate in and of itself is an adversial activity. I'm a strong proponent of respectful debate and listening is part of that respect.

 

[Immanuel]

Is pointing out the inconsistencies of a double standard adversial?

Actually, if you ask me, it is welcomed as long as you are willing to listen to the other side's point of view when you bring up those inconsistencies.

Immie

I agree - and in one sense, debate in and of itself is an adversial activity. I'm a strong proponent of respectful debate and listening is part of that respect.

To me the important thing about it is that when you point out the double standards that because of my experiences, I missed, I might just see part of the story that I missed.

Also, there is nothing wrong with taking an adversarial point of view towards something as long as you don't allow hate to dictate your position.

Immie

 

[Oldandtired]

Is pointing out the inconsistencies of a double standard adversial?

Actually, if you ask me, it is welcomed as long as you are willing to listen to the other side's point of view when you bring up those inconsistencies.

Immie

I agree - and in one sense, debate in and of itself is an adversial activity. I'm a strong proponent of respectful debate and listening is part of that respect.

Reading into what one is saying and finding a way to say it is inconsistant is not being genuine....

Yes, you could have read it that way...itf you really wanted to...but since I nowhere said I SUPPORTED THE ACTION..and actually compared it to NBC.....then I saw it as inciting....not debating.

 

[Coyote]

I agree that Fox news has a tendancy to OVER report on Obama gaffes and snafus....they enjoy driving it home just as the rest of the media drove home the Palin wardrobe "scandal.

But Fox news does not OMIT positive Obama news.

MSNBC, and NBC seem to leave out the less flattering news about Obama AND liberal organizations no matter how important it is. For exaqmple...it took them a week to report on the Acorn scandal.

But will someone please offer me examples as to where Fox News has outright lied?

Fox presents very little positive Obama news. I don't watch MSNBC much but I think of them as simply the Leftwing Fox. Fox also reports on very little conservative dirt - nothing like it does with liberals. Interesting read: The Most Biased Name in News

I did that earlier in this thread - in their reporting of Jennings (covering up the "rape" of a "minor" and implying he supports NAMBLA for one example, reporting that Obama was a muslim or claiming that Van Jones was involved in the Rodney King riots and arrested for it....or that he is (not was) a communist). Even with the Acorn scandal they lied - they claimed for example that their reporters had never been turned away, and then they carried the claim that one of the Acorn women had murdered her husband as news without ever checking to verify it. As has been pointed out - Dan Rather was promptly fired for this, his long and distinquished career forever blackened in his eagerness for political dirt over veracity and journalistic integrity.

Who funds fair.org?

Fair.org is the leftwing counter-balance to Accuracy in Media (AIM). But it certainly makes some good points. In addition, through out this thread - it is interesting that no one on the right seems to be condemning Fox's lies and lapses in journalistic integrity. Why is that somehow different from, say Dan Rather?

 

[Coyote]

I agree that Fox news has a tendancy to OVER report on Obama gaffes and snafus....they enjoy driving it home just as the rest of the media drove home the Palin wardrobe "scandal.

But Fox news does not OMIT positive Obama news.

MSNBC, and NBC seem to leave out the less flattering news about Obama AND liberal organizations no matter how important it is. For exaqmple...it took them a week to report on the Acorn scandal.

But will someone please offer me examples as to where Fox News has outright lied?

Fox presents very little positive Obama news. I don't watch MSNBC much but I think of them as simply the Leftwing Fox. Fox also reports on very little conservative dirt - nothing like it does with liberals. Interesting read: The Most Biased Name in News

I did that earlier in this thread - in their reporting of Jennings (covering up the "rape" of a "minor" and implying he supports NAMBLA for one example, reporting that Obama was a muslim or claiming that Van Jones was involved in the Rodney King riots and arrested for it....or that he is (not was) a communist). Even with the Acorn scandal they lied - they claimed for example that their reporters had never been turned away, and then they carried the claim that one of the Acorn women had murdered her husband as news without ever checking to verify it. As has been pointed out - Dan Rather was promptly fired for this, his long and distinquished career forever blackened in his eagerness for political dirt over veracity and journalistic integrity.

I watch Fox news (as if you are suprised).
They did not report on the woman murdering her husband...they simply reported on the woman claiming to have done so...the report was on the film clip...not the murder itself.

They did not report it as unverified - both Beck and Rove, for example - talked about it on - on multiple shows - as if it were true. That's tabloid - not journalism.

As for the "turning away" part...the filmers first IMPLIED they were never turned away...and the very next day FOX made it clear that they could not back up the claim.

They should not have made the claim before it could be verified. Again - that's what got Dan Rather in trouble.

He WAS arrested at the King riots...but charges were dropped....yes, fox did not mention charges were dropped...but that is not a lie...it is a ploy used by NBC as well for sensationalism.

No he wasn't. The riots were in Los Angeles.

This is what really happened. On May 8, 1992, the week AFTER the Rodney King disturbances, I sent a staff attorney and Van out to be legal monitors at a peaceful march in San Francisco. The local police, perhaps understandably nervous, stopped the march and arrested hundreds of people -- including all the legal monitors.

The matter was quickly sorted out; Van and my staff attorney were released within a few hours. All charges against them were dropped. Van was part of a successful class action lawsuit later; the City of San Francisco ultimately compensated him financially for his unjust arrest (a rare outcome).

So the unwarranted arrest at a peaceful march -- for which the charges were dropped and for which Van was financially compensated -- is the sole basis for the smear that he is some kind of dangerous criminal.

Fox NEVER siad he supported NAMBLA...they reported that he suported a book written by a man who supports NAMBLA...and he did by writing the forward.

The implication was clear. Perhaps it wasn't an outright lie (like their lie about the 15 year old) but when you are talking about child molestation/rape types of crimes even an implication is as good as guilt in the eyes of some people. Again - not responsible journalism or even reporting of the news - instead, tabloid.

Rather was fired for reporting on a memo without checking the validity of the memo....FOx checked the validity of the Acorn film before reporting on it.
Not the same by any means.
But where has fox LIED is my question?

Fox did not verify the validity of all it's facts before reporting on them - as you just noted, they did not verify the validity of the claim that the reporters had "never" been rebuffed. As to lie - well, for starters, that the boy in the Jennings smear was 15 and an under-age minor. That's just the most recent one. Go back and look at their claims that Obama is a muslim during the election cycle.

 

[California Girl]

Fox presents very little positive Obama news. I don't watch MSNBC much but I think of them as simply the Leftwing Fox. Fox also reports on very little conservative dirt - nothing like it does with liberals. Interesting read: The Most Biased Name in News

I did that earlier in this thread - in their reporting of Jennings (covering up the "rape" of a "minor" and implying he supports NAMBLA for one example, reporting that Obama was a muslim or claiming that Van Jones was involved in the Rodney King riots and arrested for it....or that he is (not was) a communist). Even with the Acorn scandal they lied - they claimed for example that their reporters had never been turned away, and then they carried the claim that one of the Acorn women had murdered her husband as news without ever checking to verify it. As has been pointed out - Dan Rather was promptly fired for this, his long and distinquished career forever blackened in his eagerness for political dirt over veracity and journalistic integrity.

Who funds fair.org?

Fair.org is the leftwing counter-balance to Accuracy in Media (AIM). But it certainly makes some good points. In addition, through out this thread - it is interesting that no one on the right seems to be condemning Fox's lies and lapses in journalistic integrity. Why is that somehow different from, say Dan Rather?

I'm aware of Fair, and AIM, but I'd never link to either to back up an argument.

I've said elsewhere but I'll add it again here - no news station is beyond reproach. There is no point in singling out one when all are guilty.

Journalistic integrity is non existent these days. The problem does seem to me to be an inability to distinguish between 'news' and 'comment'.

 

[nodoginnafight]

Old and Tired - I think it is disengenious to expect someone to "read between the lines" and understand what you intended to say rather than just commenting on face value of what you actually wrote. And what you actually wrote was a rationalization of a double standard imho.
I'm sorry if I conveyed that in a way that you find offensive - to offend is not MY intent, but if I unintenionally conveyed that, I am truly sorry.

 

[Coyote]

Who funds fair.org?

Fair.org is the leftwing counter-balance to Accuracy in Media (AIM). But it certainly makes some good points. In addition, through out this thread - it is interesting that no one on the right seems to be condemning Fox's lies and lapses in journalistic integrity. Why is that somehow different from, say Dan Rather?

I'm aware of Fair, and AIM, but I'd never link to either to back up an argument.

I've said elsewhere but I'll add it again here - no news station is beyond reproach. There is no point in singling out one when all are guilty.

Journalistic integrity is non existent these days. The problem does seem to me to be an inability to distinguish between 'news' and 'comment'.

I actually agree, unfortunately. But outright lies and character smearing should be called out. The Dan Rather incident was a huge and glaring indicator of that decline. In addition - the viral nature of the the internet in disseminating opinion/inuendo/rumor almost instantaneously further obscures the difference between fact and opinion, news and comment. There is less and less in-depth coverage of important issues and more and more sensationalism. Ann Nicole Smith and Michael Jackson merit more coverage than Afghanistan or health care.

 

[nodoginnafight]

And NOW, can someone explain to me how FOX news can call themselves "Fair and Balanced" when the views they choose to broadcast stray so very far from Fair and Balanced."

No one has been able to explain to me why the opinions they choose to broadcast do not reflect the 50% favorable 42% unfavorable that their own polling indicates would be an accurate reflection of public opinion.

Or even if you argue - public opinion be damned - 50-50 is "Fair and Balanced" then how can they miss that mark by such a wide margin and STILL claim fairness and balance.

Don't take mine or anyone else's word for it - do it yourself. Just get a pad of paper and put a tick mark under favorable or unfavorable at every quote, every opinion, every ticker item, that this network choose to broadcast. Then do the math.

 

[Oddball]

I actually agree, unfortunately. But outright lies and character smearing should be called out. The Dan Rather incident was a huge and glaring indicator of that decline. In addition - the viral nature of the the internet in disseminating opinion/inuendo/rumor almost instantaneously further obscures the difference between fact and opinion, news and comment. There is less and less in-depth coverage of important issues and more and more sensationalism. Ann Nicole Smith and Michael Jackson merit more coverage than Afghanistan or health care.

Thing is that Rather had completely fabricated parts of a big story out of whole cloth before.

Anne Morse on Rathergate & Vietnam on National Review Online

 

[Lonestar_logic]

And NOW, can someone explain to me how FOX news can call themselves "Fair and Balanced" when the views they choose to broadcast stray so very far from Fair and Balanced."

No one has been able to explain to me why the opinions they choose to broadcast do not reflect the 50% favorable 42% unfavorable that their own polling indicates would be an accurate reflection of public opinion.

Or even if you argue - public opinion be damned - 50-50 is "Fair and Balanced" then how can they miss that mark by such a wide margin and STILL claim fairness and balance.

Don't take mine or anyone else's word for it - do it yourself. Just get a pad of paper and put a tick mark under favorable or unfavorable at every quote, every opinion, every ticker item, that this network choose to broadcast. Then do the math.

Short list of liberals that appear on Fox either as contributors or guest.

Ellis Heinican, Susan Estrich, Chris Wallace, Geraldo Rivera, Alan Colmes, Bernie Sanders, John Edwards, Mark Mellman, Terry McAuliffe, Rev. Al Sharpton, Rev. Jesse Jackson, Sen. Dennis Kucinich, Rep. Charles Rangle, Minister Hashim Nzinga, Geraldine Ferraro, Bob Beckel, Lanny Davis, Joe Lieberman, Tammy Bruce, Pat Caddell, Neal Gabler, Jane Hall, Jeff Cohen, Juan WIlliams, Mara Liason, Morton Kondracke, Rosie O'Donnell, Ed Asner, Steven Baldwin, Alec Baldwin, Matt Damon, Mile Farrell etc. etc. etc.....

I would argue that Fox News has more liberals on than MSNBC or the CNN has Republicans/conservatives probably combined.

 

[rdean]

I don't think you can blame the Obama administration for just speaking the truth, though it seems you try.

It is, as it is. We've known for years, since Outfoxed, that the network takes its talking points directly from the republican party, at least, as they say on FAUX "Some people say," that is true.

Hell, never a good word about Clinton, never a bad word about Bush. What conclusion could anyone come up with. Even MSNBC doesn't have that bias, since it has Scarborough, and other right-wingers on, and they use the truth, while FAUX uses rhetoric.

No wonder so many rail against their own economic security, considering they watch a network that has no compunction to tell the truth.

Never a bad word about Bush? I see you never watch Fox news.
Fox reported numbers dead in Iraq daily......Seems no one is dying in A-stan...at least according to NBC....
Fox reported on Sanford
Fox reported on Haliburton
Fox reported on Cheney's hunting accident
Fox reported on Palins wardrobe
Fox reported onBush's use of the "mission accomplished" banner too soon
Fox reported on Rumsfeld and his ineptness
Foix reported on Rove
Rove is a guest of FOx often buyt they still report on his subpeonae, etc..

I can go on...but it is quite clear you do not watch fox news......instead yoiu read blogs.

Go for it.

I don't believe it. I watch Fox for as long as I can stomach it because it's important to keep track of what the enemies of America are up to.

Just saying "Fox reported..." doesn't mean jack squat.

How many times has Fox reported that Jeremiah Wright:
Served in the Marines and after six years received an Honorable Discharge
Was awarded three White House Commendations
Was part of the team that operated on President L. B. Johnson
Was Class Valedictorian from the Navy Medical Corps

How many times did Fox Report that John McCain:
Graduated 5th from the bottom from 899 Cadets from the Naval Academy
Got in because his father pulled strings (he said it so it's not news)
Divorced his wife after she was crippled in a car accident
Keating 5

You see, you can change the report just by what you leave out.

 

[nodoginnafight]

I would argue that Fox News has more liberals on than MSNBC or the CNN has Republicans/conservatives probably combined.

I would argue that your argument is completely wrong. Fox is to the right what MSNBC is to the left.

And having someone on your show so that you can interupt them after 5 seconds and launch a 5 minute monologue as to all the reasons they are wrong doesn't earn "fair and balanced" points on MY grading scale.

But like I said - do your own study. Pad and pen - tick mark under favorable or unfavorable - I believe folks who do this honestly will NEVER mislabel them Fair and Balanced again. But trust your own tally.

 

[Coyote]

I don't think you can blame the Obama administration for just speaking the truth, though it seems you try.

It is, as it is. We've known for years, since Outfoxed, that the network takes its talking points directly from the republican party, at least, as they say on FAUX "Some people say," that is true.

Hell, never a good word about Clinton, never a bad word about Bush. What conclusion could anyone come up with. Even MSNBC doesn't have that bias, since it has Scarborough, and other right-wingers on, and they use the truth, while FAUX uses rhetoric.

No wonder so many rail against their own economic security, considering they watch a network that has no compunction to tell the truth.

Never a bad word about Bush? I see you never watch Fox news.
Fox reported numbers dead in Iraq daily......Seems no one is dying in A-stan...at least according to NBC....
Fox reported on Sanford
Fox reported on Haliburton
Fox reported on Cheney's hunting accident
Fox reported on Palins wardrobe
Fox reported onBush's use of the "mission accomplished" banner too soon
Fox reported on Rumsfeld and his ineptness
Foix reported on Rove
Rove is a guest of FOx often buyt they still report on his subpeonae, etc..

I can go on...but it is quite clear you do not watch fox news......instead yoiu read blogs.

Go for it.

I don't believe it. I watch Fox for as long as I can stomach it because it's important to keep track of what the enemies of America are up to.

Just saying "Fox reported..." doesn't mean jack squat.

How many times has Fox reported that Jeremiah Wright:
Served in the Marines and after six years received an Honorable Discharge
Was awarded three White House Commendations
Was part of the team that operated on President L. B. Johnson
Was Class Valedictorian from the Navy Medical Corps

How many times did Fox Report that John McCain:
Graduated 5th from the bottom from 899 Cadets from the Naval Academy
Got in because his father pulled strings (he said it so it's not news)
Divorced his wife after she was crippled in a car accident
Keating 5

You see, you can change the report just by what you leave out.

Not even the mainstream media reported that....how sad.

 

[Oldandtired]

I don't think you can blame the Obama administration for just speaking the truth, though it seems you try.

It is, as it is. We've known for years, since Outfoxed, that the network takes its talking points directly from the republican party, at least, as they say on FAUX "Some people say," that is true.

Hell, never a good word about Clinton, never a bad word about Bush. What conclusion could anyone come up with. Even MSNBC doesn't have that bias, since it has Scarborough, and other right-wingers on, and they use the truth, while FAUX uses rhetoric.

No wonder so many rail against their own economic security, considering they watch a network that has no compunction to tell the truth.

Never a bad word about Bush? I see you never watch Fox news.
Fox reported numbers dead in Iraq daily......Seems no one is dying in A-stan...at least according to NBC....
Fox reported on Sanford
Fox reported on Haliburton
Fox reported on Cheney's hunting accident
Fox reported on Palins wardrobe
Fox reported onBush's use of the "mission accomplished" banner too soon
Fox reported on Rumsfeld and his ineptness
Foix reported on Rove
Rove is a guest of FOx often buyt they still report on his subpeonae, etc..

I can go on...but it is quite clear you do not watch fox news......instead yoiu read blogs.

Go for it.

I don't believe it. I watch Fox for as long as I can stomach it because it's important to keep track of what the enemies of America are up to.

Just saying "Fox reported..." doesn't mean jack squat.

How many times has Fox reported that Jeremiah Wright:
Served in the Marines and after six years received an Honorable Discharge
Was awarded three White House Commendations
Was part of the team that operated on President L. B. Johnson
Was Class Valedictorian from the Navy Medical Corps

How many times did Fox Report that John McCain:
Graduated 5th from the bottom from 899 Cadets from the Naval Academy
Got in because his father pulled strings (he said it so it's not news)
Divorced his wife after she was crippled in a car accident
Keating 5

You see, you can change the report just by what you leave out.

Fox news had no reason to report on Wrights military experience as that was not what the story had to do with.
I mean....no one discussed the great things that Madoff did as Presidnet of Nasdaq....as it was not the story.
Keating 5? Huh? McCain never denied his association and gave a full account of it...and he was found to NOT be liable for any wrongdoing....why would they bring it up? It was not a story for this campaign. Father pulled strings to get into military? Why is that a story? I mean...obviously SOMEONE pulled strings for Obama to get into an Ivy League school...afterall, they do not give academic scholarships and he was not an athlete and he was by no means wealthy.....so...who cares....that is not a story either. Pu;llimng strings is a way of liofe in America

But for Obama to deny that he ever heard a radical word from Wright? THAT is a story. The DENIAL was the story becuase either he is lying or he is completely dead between the ears.......20 years with an obvious radical and not once realizing it? THAT is a story.

The wife divorce? That is not a story as no one really knows the story...or cares...Just like many right wingers want to make Obama's brother s story...but it is not.

SO if you look at your exxamples....you are asking why Fox did not report on NON stories.....and seem to be OK with other news groups reporting on NON STORIES but NOT reporting on relevant stories.

Interesting.

 

[Oldandtired]

Never a bad word about Bush? I see you never watch Fox news.
Fox reported numbers dead in Iraq daily......Seems no one is dying in A-stan...at least according to NBC....
Fox reported on Sanford
Fox reported on Haliburton
Fox reported on Cheney's hunting accident
Fox reported on Palins wardrobe
Fox reported onBush's use of the "mission accomplished" banner too soon
Fox reported on Rumsfeld and his ineptness
Foix reported on Rove
Rove is a guest of FOx often buyt they still report on his subpeonae, etc..

I can go on...but it is quite clear you do not watch fox news......instead yoiu read blogs.

Go for it.

I don't believe it. I watch Fox for as long as I can stomach it because it's important to keep track of what the enemies of America are up to.

Just saying "Fox reported..." doesn't mean jack squat.

How many times has Fox reported that Jeremiah Wright:
Served in the Marines and after six years received an Honorable Discharge
Was awarded three White House Commendations
Was part of the team that operated on President L. B. Johnson
Was Class Valedictorian from the Navy Medical Corps

How many times did Fox Report that John McCain:
Graduated 5th from the bottom from 899 Cadets from the Naval Academy
Got in because his father pulled strings (he said it so it's not news)
Divorced his wife after she was crippled in a car accident
Keating 5

You see, you can change the report just by what you leave out.

Not even the mainstream media reported that....how sad.

To talk about the great things a racist did in the past is not relevant.

FOX...and other outlets I am sure.....mentioned his bio as a marine and such...but there was no reason to play on it as it was his actions of today that were relevant.

OJ Simpson....many outlets talked of his career in football as part of his bio...BUT PLAYED ON TGHE MURDERS as THAT was the story.

We heard as part of his Bio that Madoff was president of Nasdaq.....but the bulk of the reporting was his scheme.

If the guy that kidnapped and raped that girl for 18 years was a marine years ago...should they have played on that?

I do not think you are seeing this logically.

 

[Ame®icano]

They did not report it as unverified - both Beck and Rove, for example - talked about it on - on multiple shows - as if it were true. That's tabloid - not journalism.

Coyote, I quoted above what you wrote. Did you wrote that? Yes.

FoxNews reported what that woman said. Can you write in your own words what that woman said?

 

[Coyote]

They did not report it as unverified - both Beck and Rove, for example - talked about it on - on multiple shows - as if it were true. That's tabloid - not journalism.

Coyote, I quoted above what you wrote. Did you wrote that? Yes.

FoxNews reported what that woman said. Can you write in your own words what that woman said?

I'm not sure why you are asking me to do that.

She claimed to have killed her husband.

They reported it as if she did kill her husband - not with any sort of statement indicating that this was not yet verified.