New Website on the American Civil War

[gipper]

I have finally created a new website on the American Civil War. My site presents a view of the Civil War that is rarely discussed in our history books, a view that steers a middle course between the pro-Southern Lost Cause narrative and the standard pro-Northern narrative that dominates our history books.

The American Civil War: An Alternative View

It wasn’t a civil war in the true sense. The South had no intention of conquering the North. However the North had every intention of conquering the South.

The more appropriate name is The War of Northern Aggression.

 

[ding]

Thats literally what he did.

Racists often frame Booth as a patriot and Lincoln as a "tyrant."

 

[gipper]

Racists often frame Booth as a patriot and Lincoln as a "tyrant."

Do you deny Lincoln was a tyrant?

 

[mikegriffith1]

About what I expected
Crazy revisionist history

Uh-huh. And this coming from a far-left radical who is endorsing JoeB131's nuttiness. You and JoeB131 wouldn't know serious scholarship and real history if it sat on you.

 

[rightwinger]

Do you deny Lincoln was a tyrant?

I do, I do

 

[ding]

Do you deny Lincoln was a tyrant?

Yes, Abraham Lincoln is overwhelmingly considered one of the greatest American presidents by historians and the public because he saved the Union.

 

[gipper]

Yes, Abraham Lincoln is overwhelmingly considered one of the greatest American presidents by historians and the public because he saved the Union.

That should tell you something and it’s not good.

 

[ding]

That should tell you something and it’s not good.

What is it telling me and why isn't it good?

As for the link in your signature line, so you are saying they are like everyone else? Why is there an expectation for fairness in a Darwinian existence?

 

[JoeB131]

It wasn’t a civil war in the true sense. The South had no intention of conquering the North. However the North had every intention of conquering the South.

The more appropriate name is The War of Northern Aggression.

Nope, that's pretty dumb, actually.

The South fired the first shot. They started the war before Lincoln was even sworn in. (And James Buchanan, being the feckless idiot he was, did nothing about it.)

Let's focus on what the Civil war was about. It wasn't about State's Rights. It wasn't about tariffs. It was about the right of rich human beings to own other human beings.

Period.

Nobody should be proud of fighting for that.

Say what you want about Germany, Germans are generally ashamed of what their country did in WWII. As they should be.

We seem to want to keep glorifying the worst people in our history.

 

[JoeB131]

Not innocent. Justified.

How? The South had already surrendered at that point. If anything, killing Lincoln made the North more vengeful.

LOL what a crock. Lincoln didnt even free any slaves.
Lincoln WAS a tyrant. By any definition of the word.
Your copy/paste revisionism is revisionist, you militant pagan.

Not really. Lincoln held the country together when terrible people tried to tear it apart. We are all better off for it.

 

[TNHarley]

How? The South had already surrendered at that point. If anything, killing Lincoln made the North more vengeful.



Not really. Lincoln held the country together when terrible people tried to tear it apart. We are all better off for it.

So being a patriot and killing a tyrant only counts if the accused is in the process of said tyranny? Seriously?

 

[Quantrill]

Nope, that's pretty dumb, actually.

The South fired the first shot. They started the war before Lincoln was even sworn in. (And James Buchanan, being the feckless idiot he was, did nothing about it.)

Let's focus on what the Civil war was about. It wasn't about State's Rights. It wasn't about tariffs. It was about the right of rich human beings to own other human beings.

Period.

Nobody should be proud of fighting for that.

Say what you want about Germany, Germans are generally ashamed of what their country did in WWII. As they should be.

We seem to want to keep glorifying the worst people in our history.

No, Lincoln attacked the South which is why the South fired first. The South fired on the Star of the West sent by Buchannan to reinforce Sumpter with troops and ammunition. Which they tried to lie about saying they were sending only food. The South then found out that Lincoln had been lying to them and was sending several war ships with troops and munitions. Forcing them to fire on Fort Sumter. before the ships arrived. Lincoln started the war. It was what he wanted to do.

The South was definitely fighting for its way of life of which slavery was its economic life line. The North was not fighting to free the slaves. Lincoln could care less about the blacks. So don't pride yourself in thinking the North came down to free the slaves. The North came down to bring the South back into the Union.

I am very proud of the South and what they were fighting for.

Quantrill

 

[mikegriffith1]

Do you deny Lincoln was a tyrant? [In response to Ding: ding said:
Racists often frame Booth as a patriot and Lincoln as a "tyrant."]

I do not believe Lincoln was a tyrant. I agree that some of his actions against anti-war Northerners were unconstitutional and sometimes heavy handed, but I think his lenient and reasonable terms for Reconstruction prove he was no tyrant. Dr. David Donald, one of the foremost Lincoln historians of all time, makes a strong case that Lincoln would not have used force against the Confederacy if the Confederates had not bombarded and captured Fort Sumter.

 

[TNHarley]

I do not believe Lincoln was a tyrant. I agree that some of his actions against anti-war Northerners were unconstitutional and sometimes heavy handed, but I think his lenient and reasonable terms for Reconstruction prove he was no tyrant. Dr. David Donald, one of the foremost Lincoln historians of all time, makes a strong case that Lincoln would not have used force against the Confederacy if the Confederates had not bombarded and captured Fort Sumter.

Oh lord lol.
So trashing multiple constitutional amendments means nothing? Scorched earth was nothing?
The confederacy wouldnt have shot at the north if they minded their own business. They were well within their rights to secede.

 

[gipper]

I do not believe Lincoln was a tyrant. I agree that some of his actions against anti-war Northerners were unconstitutional and sometimes heavy handed, but I think his lenient and reasonable terms for Reconstruction prove he was no tyrant. Dr. David Donald, one of the foremost Lincoln historians of all time, makes a strong case that Lincoln would not have used force against the Confederacy if the Confederates had not bombarded and captured Fort Sumter.

Yeah he destroys the South using total war tactics, then after winning plays nice. You think this admirable.

I bet you get duped a lot.

 

[Quantrill]

I do not believe Lincoln was a tyrant. I agree that some of his actions against anti-war Northerners were unconstitutional and sometimes heavy handed, but I think his lenient and reasonable terms for Reconstruction prove he was no tyrant. Dr. David Donald, one of the foremost Lincoln historians of all time, makes a strong case that Lincoln would not have used force against the Confederacy if the Confederates had not bombarded and captured Fort Sumter.

Well, Lincoln did what tyrants do. Shut down free speech. Suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus so he could arrest anyone he wanted to at any time he wanted to. And leave the people void of any hope of release. He arrested the whole legislative body of Maryland knowing they would vote for secession. When Supreme Court Justice Taney warned Lincoln he crossed the line, Lincoln put out a warrant for his arrest. Oh yes, Lincoln was a dictator.

Lincoln planned on war with the South all along. He simply had to set up the situation where the South was the evil people and have them fire on the North. Which he did when he sent his ships to attack Sumter. Which was found out in a letter he had sent to Anderson at Sumter. Which showed that he and Seward were lying the whole time about abandoning Sumter.

Lincoln was a liar, and he planned on starting the war, with the South perceived as the aggressor. Which is so much bullshit.

And if you want to go farther back, the first shot of the War Between The States, was John Browns attack at Harpers Ferry. There John Brown wanted to create a slave insurrection to rise up and kill the Southern slaveholders. Which high up business men in the North supported, and later were rewarded in the North for their actions.

Quantrill

 

[gipper]

Well, Lincoln did what tyrants do. Shut down free speech. Suspended the writ of Habeas Corpus so he could arrest anyone he wanted to at any time he wanted to. And leave the people void of any hope of release. He arrested the whole legislative body of Maryland knowing they would vote for secession. When Supreme Court Justice Taney warned Lincoln he crossed the line, Lincoln put out a warrant for his arrest. Oh yes, Lincoln was a dictator.

Lincoln planned on war with the South all along. He simply had to set up the situation where the South was the evil people and have them fire on the North. Which he did when he sent his ships to attack Sumter. Which was found out in a letter he had sent to Anderson at Sumter. Which showed that he and Seward were lying the whole time about abandoning Sumter.

Lincoln was a liar, and he planned on starting the war, with the South perceived as the aggressor. Which is so much bullshit.

And if you want to go farther back, the first shot of the War Between The States, was John Browns attack at Harpers Ferry. There John Brown wanted to create a slave insurrection to rise up and kill the Southern slaveholders. Which high up business men in the North supported, and later were rewarded in the North for their actions.

Quantrill

Great post.

Anyone who doesn’t know Dishonest Abe was a tyrant is obviously uninformed.

 

[Mr Natural]

Great post.

Anyone who doesn’t know Dishonest Abe was a tyrant is obviously uninformed.

Which is why he’s on Mount Rushmore with the other tyrants.

 

[ding]

I have finally created a new website on the American Civil War. My site presents a view of the Civil War that is rarely discussed in our history books, a view that steers a middle course between the pro-Southern Lost Cause narrative and the standard pro-Northern narrative that dominates our history books.

The American Civil War: An Alternative View

Do you believe the Founding Fathers intended for slavery to perish?

 

[ding]

The North was not fighting to free the slaves. Lincoln could care less about the blacks.

He cared less for the slaves than he did for saving the Union. Which is why the preliminary Emancipation Proclamation allowed for states to keep slaves if they put down their arms.

The preliminary Emancipation Proclamation offered Confederate states a chance to keep their slaves if they laid down their arms and rejoined the Union by January 1, 1863, but they rejected the offer, leading to the final proclamation declaring slaves in rebellious states free. The proclamation, based on war powers, excluded loyal border states and Union-occupied areas, making its immediate effect dependent on Union military success, transforming the war's aim to include ending slavery.
Key Details of the Proclamation:

• The Offer: In September 1862, after the Battle of Antietam, Lincoln issued a preliminary proclamation giving Confederate states 100 days to return to the Union to avoid emancipation.
• The Condition: If states in rebellion (those not under Union control) did not comply by January 1, 1863, all enslaved people in those areas "shall be then, thenceforward, and forever free".
• Exclusions: It did not apply to slaveholding border states (like Kentucky, Maryland) that remained loyal to the Union, nor to parts of the Confederacy already under Union control, to avoid alienating them.
• Outcome: The Confederate states ignored the offer, so Lincoln issued the final Emancipation Proclamation on January 1, 1863, making freedom for enslaved people in rebellious territories a reality as Union forces advanced.
• Impact: The Proclamation fundamentally changed the war, adding the moral cause of ending slavery and allowing Black men to serve in the Union Army, significantly aiding the Union war effort.