Need to point fingers? Use the facts.

[NYcarbineer]

Not really.

In other words, you're confirming what I said yesterday,

which is that all this back and forth about whether or not Loughner listened to, watched, or read rightwing propaganda in the media is irrelevant,

because even if he did you'd still be denying he was influenced by any of it.

If you can show that he's seen any of it, you might have a point.

But you can't, can you?

I cited someone who was, and you denied it.

 

[cisz]

Their are still plenty of real Nazi's in the U.S. today, and you are not justified to kill them.

It seems to me that you're just arguing for the sake of trying to "win" an argument.

I already heard Beck speaking directly about the eugenics thing.

If those US Nazis were about to kill people, and the US government was in agreement with them, I think there would be alot of people who would be ready to take up arms against them.

If you actually believed that Nazis (or Progressives) in the US were looking to start a eugenics program that was coming to kill your grandmother, or retarded child -- and that they were about to succeed (or had already succeeded) in doing it -- would you not be wanting to arm yourself and others, to fight against them?

 

[daveman]

In other words, you're confirming what I said yesterday,

which is that all this back and forth about whether or not Loughner listened to, watched, or read rightwing propaganda in the media is irrelevant,

because even if he did you'd still be denying he was influenced by any of it.

If you can show that he's seen any of it, you might have a point.

But you can't, can you?

I cited someone who was, and you denied it.

I didn't deny he was exposed to it. And I haven't studied the case enough to determine if he was influenced by it. You'll understand if I don't your and the media's word for it.

 

[cisz]

I repeat: Are any of you idiots ever going to prove he was exposed to violent right-wing rhetoric, or are you just going to rely on the Big Lie strategy?

As you probably know, Loughner isn't talking. Supposedly, his parents told him not to. I wonder why? I wouldn't think it's because he might incriminate himself and everyone already thinks he's insane.

In any case, one of the things that is known about Loughner was that he was very concerned about the dollar not being backed by gold and becoming worthless which, according to - Glenn Beck - was going to bring about a "societal breakdown".

This was a main motive behind the Pittsburgh police killer who was very into Beck.

(This is from pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A86316):
Pittsburgh City Paper Claim: Accused Pittsburgh cop-killer "loved Glenn Beck"

Richard Poplawski, the man accused of gunning down three Pittsburgh police officiers, was a big fan of FOX News host/right-wing cult leader Glenn Beck. Will Bunch, a contributor to Media Matters and author of the popular Philadelphia Daily News blog Attytood, has the story:

This January, I spent several days in Pittsburgh investigating the Poplawski case and seeking to learn more about what really motivated him to kill three police officers. The research was for a chapter in my book, The Backlash: Right-Wing Radicals, High-Def Hucksters and Paranoid Politics in the Age of Obama, which comes out at the end of the month. I learned quite a bit ...

"Rich, like myself, loved Glenn Beck," Poplawski's best friend Eddie Perkovic told me during a long interview in his narrow rowhouse on the steep hill running down to the Allegheny ... Perkovic and his mom -- who also had a close relationship with the accused cop-killer, still awaiting trial -- told me that for months Poplawski had been obsessed with an idea -- frequently discussed by Beck, including in ads for his sponsor Food Insurance -- of the need to stockpile food and even toilet paper for a societal breakdown. Poplawski was also convinced that paper money would become worthless -- another claim given credence by the Fox News Channel host, particularly in close connection with his frequent shilling for the now-under-investigation gold-coin peddler Goldline International.

 

[daveman]

As you probably know, Loughner isn't talking. Supposedly, his parents told him not to. I wonder why? I wouldn't think it's because he might incriminate himself and everyone already thinks he's insane.

In any case, one of the things that is known about Loughner was that he was very concerned about the dollar not being backed by gold and becoming worthless which, according to - Glenn Beck - was going to bring about a "societal breakdown".

This was a main motive behind the Pittsburgh police killer who was very into Beck.

(This is from pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A86316):
Pittsburgh City Paper Claim: Accused Pittsburgh cop-killer "loved Glenn Beck"

Richard Poplawski, the man accused of gunning down three Pittsburgh police officiers, was a big fan of FOX News host/right-wing cult leader Glenn Beck. Will Bunch, a contributor to Media Matters and author of the popular Philadelphia Daily News blog Attytood, has the story:

This January, I spent several days in Pittsburgh investigating the Poplawski case and seeking to learn more about what really motivated him to kill three police officers. The research was for a chapter in my book, The Backlash: Right-Wing Radicals, High-Def Hucksters and Paranoid Politics in the Age of Obama, which comes out at the end of the month. I learned quite a bit ...

"Rich, like myself, loved Glenn Beck," Poplawski's best friend Eddie Perkovic told me during a long interview in his narrow rowhouse on the steep hill running down to the Allegheny ... Perkovic and his mom -- who also had a close relationship with the accused cop-killer, still awaiting trial -- told me that for months Poplawski had been obsessed with an idea -- frequently discussed by Beck, including in ads for his sponsor Food Insurance -- of the need to stockpile food and even toilet paper for a societal breakdown. Poplawski was also convinced that paper money would become worthless -- another claim given credence by the Fox News Channel host, particularly in close connection with his frequent shilling for the now-under-investigation gold-coin peddler Goldline International.

So...because one guy may have been influenced by Beck means Laughner was, too?

You sure you want to go with that?

 

[Quantum Windbag]

As you probably know, Loughner isn't talking. Supposedly, his parents told him not to. I wonder why? I wouldn't think it's because he might incriminate himself and everyone already thinks he's insane.

In any case, one of the things that is known about Loughner was that he was very concerned about the dollar not being backed by gold and becoming worthless which, according to - Glenn Beck - was going to bring about a "societal breakdown".

This was a main motive behind the Pittsburgh police killer who was very into Beck.

(This is from pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A86316):
Pittsburgh City Paper Claim: Accused Pittsburgh cop-killer "loved Glenn Beck"

Richard Poplawski, the man accused of gunning down three Pittsburgh police officiers, was a big fan of FOX News host/right-wing cult leader Glenn Beck. Will Bunch, a contributor to Media Matters and author of the popular Philadelphia Daily News blog Attytood, has the story:

This January, I spent several days in Pittsburgh investigating the Poplawski case and seeking to learn more about what really motivated him to kill three police officers. The research was for a chapter in my book, The Backlash: Right-Wing Radicals, High-Def Hucksters and Paranoid Politics in the Age of Obama, which comes out at the end of the month. I learned quite a bit ...

"Rich, like myself, loved Glenn Beck," Poplawski's best friend Eddie Perkovic told me during a long interview in his narrow rowhouse on the steep hill running down to the Allegheny ... Perkovic and his mom -- who also had a close relationship with the accused cop-killer, still awaiting trial -- told me that for months Poplawski had been obsessed with an idea -- frequently discussed by Beck, including in ads for his sponsor Food Insurance -- of the need to stockpile food and even toilet paper for a societal breakdown. Poplawski was also convinced that paper money would become worthless -- another claim given credence by the Fox News Channel host, particularly in close connection with his frequent shilling for the now-under-investigation gold-coin peddler Goldline International.

Seriously? Are you going to try to link this guy to Beck because he believes in the gold standard? MAybe you should do a little research into some of the things Laughner is actually known to have paid attention to. He was a big fan of The Zeitgesit movie. If you watch that you might end up thinking Glenn Beck is influenced by it, and not that Laughner somehow managed to hide his association with Beck.

 

[logical4u]

This fruitcake acted alone. He apparently was not influenced by anyone on either side of the political spectrum. Those are the facts.

Here are the perceptions. There are a great many on the right that have spoken in terms that are incendiary. First in suggesting that our government in this democracy is our enemy. Second, by stating that 2nd amendment solutions should be sought because a majority voted in someone they do not like. And third, by images and referances to crosshairs and guns. None of the people making these statements meant to actually carry them out. However, as we recoil in horror at the events in Tucson, we cannot but remember the rhetoric and images. This is the kind of horror that they were refering to, and it will be reflected in peoples attitudes towards those created the rhetoric and images.

I have noticed that more "hate" speech comes from the left: Obama referring to those that vote differently as enemies, those that wish Cheney "dead", those that wish Bush "dead" (even to the point of producing fictional assasinations to portray his end).
Look at public protests: which are more destructive? The left that leave mayhem in their wake of riot-like protests? The right that leave an area that is mostly clean with little or no police intervention?

When "the right" is asked what they want/think, there are fairly concise answers with explanations if needed. When "the left" is asked what they want/think, there are bigoted, hatefilled responses, usually followed by name-calling and devisive statements. If the left is pressured for a "practical" answer, there is a tantrum.

When these incidents happen (relatively infrequently for the size of the population), the finger pointing starts on the left. When the right brings in the facts, the left, suddenly, just wants to get along. Why don't folks on the left that are all about "facts" when it comes to evolution and global warming, mum when it comes to social problems and what the "facts" reveal?

 

[cisz]

So...because one guy may have been influenced by Beck means Laughner was, too?

You sure you want to go with that?

The point is that it's an obvious extreme right wing position which was espoused by Beck.

I'm not saying Loughner was necessarily into Beck, although that wouldn't be surprising. You were asking for evidence that Loughner was right wing.

So far, it sure looks like it.

 

[saveliberty]

As you probably know, Loughner isn't talking. Supposedly, his parents told him not to. I wonder why? I wouldn't think it's because he might incriminate himself and everyone already thinks he's insane.

In any case, one of the things that is known about Loughner was that he was very concerned about the dollar not being backed by gold and becoming worthless which, according to - Glenn Beck - was going to bring about a "societal breakdown".

This was a main motive behind the Pittsburgh police killer who was very into Beck.

(This is from pittsburghcitypaper.ws/gyrobase/Content?oid=oid%3A86316):
Pittsburgh City Paper Claim: Accused Pittsburgh cop-killer "loved Glenn Beck"

Richard Poplawski, the man accused of gunning down three Pittsburgh police officiers, was a big fan of FOX News host/right-wing cult leader Glenn Beck. Will Bunch, a contributor to Media Matters and author of the popular Philadelphia Daily News blog Attytood, has the story:

This January, I spent several days in Pittsburgh investigating the Poplawski case and seeking to learn more about what really motivated him to kill three police officers. The research was for a chapter in my book, The Backlash: Right-Wing Radicals, High-Def Hucksters and Paranoid Politics in the Age of Obama, which comes out at the end of the month. I learned quite a bit ...

"Rich, like myself, loved Glenn Beck," Poplawski's best friend Eddie Perkovic told me during a long interview in his narrow rowhouse on the steep hill running down to the Allegheny ... Perkovic and his mom -- who also had a close relationship with the accused cop-killer, still awaiting trial -- told me that for months Poplawski had been obsessed with an idea -- frequently discussed by Beck, including in ads for his sponsor Food Insurance -- of the need to stockpile food and even toilet paper for a societal breakdown. Poplawski was also convinced that paper money would become worthless -- another claim given credence by the Fox News Channel host, particularly in close connection with his frequent shilling for the now-under-investigation gold-coin peddler Goldline International.

Take two people who never met and make statements like this? Pretty weak argument. Also, the Tucson shooter didn't talk from the time of the shooting on. For your statement to be true, the parent would have to have had prior knowledge. If you mean after the fact, it is unlikely that the shooter would listen to them, as the media has painted the relationships as very strained. Can't really have it both ways bub.

 

[EriktheRed]

 

[logical4u]

The point is that it's an obvious extreme right wing position which was espoused by Beck.

I'm not saying Loughner was necessarily into Beck, although that wouldn't be surprising. You were asking for evidence that Loughner was right wing.

So far, it sure looks like it.

Is that because he looks like you in the mirror? You have to assign him to a group that where you have no comprehension? He is a wacko. The left is the one that implies that the actions of "one", can change the world (by force, by protests). The right has always known there is no "magic". Hard work, improving yourself, and great investments are the only way "forward". Where did Loughner demonstrate any of those?