My!! How the Dow has grown!!!

[TakeAStepBack]

I'm more concerned with deficits and reducing them. QE staved off 1930 type deflation, as Friedman predicted. However, as you posted the effect is to bubble equities, as the fed "buys" corporate bonds and real estate debt obligation bonds. An unintended effect is greater wealth disparity. If you want to give Obama credit for something he had nothing to do with, you prolly should give him credit for that as well.

Most local real estate markets are slowing recovering losses, and gnp and employment slowly recover. The fed will withdraw from buying securities. Among the uncertainties are: what will the effect be on retirement accounts which have seen reduced bond yields, which traditionally are the safe bet for old people who can't take the risk of equities. Equities will fall and bonds will rise. Will that increase wealth disparity even more? Yields on all bonds will rise, and I assume that will put upward pressure on debt we sell to finance deficits. At the same time, more boomers will retire. And public pensions are underfunded already.

No, it did not.

yes it did, now go dream about the gold standard.

No, it did not. Furthermore, it's illogical to even equate the great depression with the 2007 episode as monetary policy is entirely different. Not that I'd expect you to understand that.

 

[bendog]

The only reason the Stock Market is doing well is because the Federal Reserve is pumping 85 Billion into it every month.
The Dems are doing the same damn thing like they did to housing and this market bubble will eventual burst and cause an even worse recession than the housing bubble did.
This action is weakening our dollar amount and this causes inflation.
Just wait till this Stock Market Bubble bursts and we get extreme high inflation.
Yet people will continue to vote for the Dem's thinking that they are for the people and believing their lies that it is the Republican's fault, just like it was the housing bubble.

The DEMS and the housing bubble? I want two of what you're drinking. And while the fed may well be propping up the equities, if you've looked at real estate and the wealth of avg Americans, we're having deflation, not inflation.

The fed has held down inflation. Inflation is occurring in the private sector mainly through agricultural commodities which have increased approx 7 percent when indexed. That is striking. The fed should have raised rates 8, 9 years ago to suck some of the money back in order to stop the devaluation of the dollar.

I'm not sure there is anyway to hold down the price of agricultural commodities. Ethanol is about the dumbest thing I've seen, though. At least I've not seen a way to reduce rising costs, and the Economist predicted such a decade ago. The % of income Americans spend on food declined during the 80s and 90s. But, I admit I can't see why nations with increasing standards of living cannot raise more food.

The dollar reached overvalued status under Clinton. Not to give him credit or blame. A less valued dollar should encourage more maftr and agricultural productivity here.

But, as to the thread, when the Fed gets out of QE, or ends buying private debt, it seems to me that all interest rates will have to rise. Generally, when rates rise it corresponds with equities falling and the value of existing bonds will also drop. Rising rates also hurt employment. It's definitely a concern. LOL

 

[Google]

Has anyone noticed how the right has remained silent about how the Dow Jones Industrial Average has climbed since Obama took office. When bush left office the DJIA was around 8000. Under Obama it has doubled and is arround 16,500. So much for the right claiming that they are the party that will grow the economy.

Literally the wealthiest Americans are the ones prospering under this administration. Reality does not reflect the peachy growth of the stock market. We have a record number of Americans out of the workforce, on government assistance, wages are decreasing, quality of jobs are decreasing--and the left wants everyone to celebrate because the stock market is surging.

Economic growth is and has been anemic.

Do you know what the Fed's QE program is and how that has effected stock market growth?

 

[Synthaholic]

 

[Google]

The DEMS and the housing bubble? I want two of what you're drinking. And while the fed may well be propping up the equities, if you've looked at real estate and the wealth of avg Americans, we're having deflation, not inflation.

The fed has held down inflation. Inflation is occurring in the private sector mainly through agricultural commodities which have increased approx 7 percent when indexed. That is striking. The fed should have raised rates 8, 9 years ago to suck some of the money back in order to stop the devaluation of the dollar.

I'm not sure there is anyway to hold down the price of agricultural commodities. Ethanol is about the dumbest thing I've seen, though. At least I've not seen a way to reduce rising costs, and the Economist predicted such a decade ago. The % of income Americans spend on food declined during the 80s and 90s. But, I admit I can't see why nations with increasing standards of living cannot raise more food.

The dollar reached overvalued status under Clinton. Not to give him credit or blame. A less valued dollar should encourage more maftr and agricultural productivity here.

But, as to the thread, when the Fed gets out of QE, or ends buying private debt, it seems to me that all interest rates will have to rise. Generally, when rates rise it corresponds with equities falling and the value of existing bonds will also drop. Rising rates also hurt employment. It's definitely a concern. LOL

The Fed enacted emergency powers that do not seem as if they will ever end. They have intertwined themselves so much with QE tampering that ending it will quickly deflate this illusion of a robust economy. Shocking that such sweeping and unprecedented action like QE would have such 'unintended' consequences.

Add to that the complete lack of true oversight and accountability the Federal Reserve has to Congress, and you have perpetual Fed policies that were never intended to be permanent.

 

[LordBrownTrout]

You mean the fed has monetized 4 trillion dollars worth of govt obligations....in essence, nothing has been created. Shhhhh.

 

[Google]

You mean the fed has monetized 4 trillion dollars worth of govt obligations....in essence, nothing has been created. Shhhhh.

Oh, it has been "created". Literally fabricated out of thin air. The Fed does not even print the money, the money exists only on computers. $4,000,000,000,000 created to sustain the government's mind boggling debt obligations.

China does not hold the majority of US debt--our own central back does!

 

[Google]

Where has 95% of that "created" wealth gone?

Obama admits 95% of income gains gone to top 1% - Sep. 15, 2013

 

[Stephanie]

The natural result of Federal Reserve pump priming. All that Monopoly money going to institutions without improving the overall economy gives the illusion that happy days are here again.

that will burst their bubble of how that Obama is the best thing ever sent from the heavens above.

anyone been grocery shopping lately? my gawd barley afford hamburger, toilet paper we'll be using old newspapers soon...
gas again up to almost $3.50 a gallon...but the dow is up

 

[bendog]

The fed has held down inflation. Inflation is occurring in the private sector mainly through agricultural commodities which have increased approx 7 percent when indexed. That is striking. The fed should have raised rates 8, 9 years ago to suck some of the money back in order to stop the devaluation of the dollar.

I'm not sure there is anyway to hold down the price of agricultural commodities. Ethanol is about the dumbest thing I've seen, though. At least I've not seen a way to reduce rising costs, and the Economist predicted such a decade ago. The % of income Americans spend on food declined during the 80s and 90s. But, I admit I can't see why nations with increasing standards of living cannot raise more food.

The dollar reached overvalued status under Clinton. Not to give him credit or blame. A less valued dollar should encourage more maftr and agricultural productivity here.

But, as to the thread, when the Fed gets out of QE, or ends buying private debt, it seems to me that all interest rates will have to rise. Generally, when rates rise it corresponds with equities falling and the value of existing bonds will also drop. Rising rates also hurt employment. It's definitely a concern. LOL

The Fed enacted emergency powers that do not seem as if they will ever end. They have intertwined themselves so much with QE tampering that ending it will quickly deflate this illusion of a robust economy. Shocking that such sweeping and unprecedented action like QE would have such 'unintended' consequences.

Add to that the complete lack of true oversight and accountability the Federal Reserve has to Congress, and you have perpetual Fed policies that were never intended to be permanent.

Well, I'm not sure the Fed doesn't have the power to even pay money to people to borrow money. But, I agree that I am not sure where it will end. At some pt, real estate will recover to the extent the Fed stops buying real estate securities. When that happens, I'm not sure what will happen. It seems logical that money will flow from equities back to real estate securities, and rates will rise. Whether the whole house of card falls, I dunno. But I do know that the economy is no more, or less, a house of cards than it was in 1910 or 1930, and the Fed today has more knowledge and tools to keep the deck in the air. And, I'm concerned. LOL

 

[Luddly Neddite]

During the Reagan years, the Bush 41 and Bush 43 years, all we heard from the left was the old mantra:

"The rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer!"

How come they're all silent when the entire country is getting poorer????
68% of Americans believe we are still in a recession. Auto sales are increasing only because cars wear out and now you can get financing as long as 84 months.

I congratulate any wealthy person who can insulate himself from this debacle we have in Washington.

Its the poor and middle class who are helpless.

Not the wealthy.

 

[Google]

There is a breathtaking disconnect between partisan leftists and the reality working Americans are living. This is why, after the midterm elections, they are going to be left stunned and unable to recognize why the country is turning away from politicians that are equated with this administration. They will say "but the stock market is through the roof!!!".

 

[Oldstyle]

Has anyone noticed how the right has remained silent about how the Dow Jones Industrial Average has climbed since Obama took office. When bush left office the DJIA was around 8000. Under Obama it has doubled and is arround 16,500. So much for the right claiming that they are the party that will grow the economy.

Gee, six years of unabated quantitative easing by the FED...essentially giving interest free money to those wealthy enough to borrow and leaving the Lower and Middle Classes sitting on the sidelines as they watched the rich get richer? All done because it was the only thing keeping the economy from cratering after the Obama Stimulus fizzled out and Barry had no other ideas?

Yes, the stock market has doubled since Obama took office. Barry allowed the rich to have a field day while the rest of American took it in the ass with higher prices and lower wages.

What's REALLY ironic is now Obama and the Democrats are going to run on "income inequality"...something that has happened at an unprecedented rate since THEY controlled the country!

 

[blackhawk]

Has anyone noticed how the left has suddenly stopped trashing Wall Street during that same time frame something they did regularly under Bush?

 

[salem.hills]

Devaluing the dollar through printing but making millions for the elite at the cost of the little guy. Obama is the biggest corporate fascist in history lol you libtards hated that until now its your guy. *cheers ring out "collapse us Barack!" *

 

[bendog]

Has anyone noticed how the left has suddenly stopped trashing Wall Street during that same time frame something they did regularly under Bush?

I seem to recall not much growth in my IRA during the BushII years. That's not to blame BushII entirely, though the tax cuts, deficits and resulting bubble in the real estate market didn't help. But, the good years when Slick lucked out were pretty much set up by BushI fiscal conservatism in raising taxes in the face of deficits and getting the Savings and Loan Debacle behind us. And after 80-2000, you gotta figure on lean years. I just wish the public pension managers had so figured.

 

[Oldstyle]

Talk about your misleading use of statistics! The stock market was over 14,000 before the crash in '08...saying that Obama "created" as much wealth as all the other Presidents combined is laughable. The market rebounded as the market always does. Of course it helps if you can do non-stop quantitative easing for six years to keep that bubble getting bigger and bigger! So what happens when THAT stops? Every time the FED even hints at raising interest rates the markets drop hundreds of points over night. What's going to happen when they actually RAISE rates?

 

[Google]

Has anyone noticed how the left has suddenly stopped trashing Wall Street during that same time frame something they did regularly under Bush?

The left sounded like Ron Paul Libertarians under Bush. Where are the anti-war protests?

What kills me is the audacity of the left to claim the criticism and scrutiny of Obama's presidency is unprecedented, as if they were afflicted from amnesia from suddenly getting hit on the head from a coconut--I am pretty sure that is how it happens. Sitting senators openly questions Bush's legitimacy, and there was an actual Supreme Court decision confirming Bush's presidency.

The things that were said and the way Bush was treated WAS unprecedented, and honestly I say Conservatives have been profoundly reasonable in their condemnation of this administration. If only for the sheer feigned incompetency of Obama.

 

[Mac1958]

Its the poor and middle class who are helpless.

Not the wealthy.

Yikes.

Fortunately, there are many Americans who are poor or middle class who don't feel helpless. They will ignore such ridiculous talk and will work hard and sacrifice, and they'll do well.

The last thing these people are going to do is whine and complain and play the victim; they know that a life spent waiting for someone else to make things "fair" is a wasted life, indeed.

.

 

[Google]

Has anyone noticed how the left has suddenly stopped trashing Wall Street during that same time frame something they did regularly under Bush?

I seem to recall not much growth in my IRA during the BushII years. That's not to blame BushII entirely, though the tax cuts, deficits and resulting bubble in the real estate market didn't help. But, the good years when Slick lucked out were pretty much set up by BushI fiscal conservatism in raising taxes in the face of deficits and getting the Savings and Loan Debacle behind us. And after 80-2000, you gotta figure on lean years. I just wish the public pension managers had so figured.

Please explain how increasing income taxes would have helped retirement investments? How did cutting taxes across the board hinder your personal retirement investments?