Minimum Wage Increase: They Never Talks About the SALES

[LOki]

Yeah I hear ya. The idea is to temporarily jack up labor costs for leaner businesses to shut them down.

You can't pay someone Minimum Wage, you're out. Sorry, but it just wasn't meant to be for you. No one is forced to hire workers. That's a choice. Don't wanna pay, just shut up and do the work yourself. Quit ya bitchin.

Eventually there will be only large, wealthy corporations, deeply embedded with government, and 'employees'. And you talk about slavery.

I'm afraid that's already the case for the most part. That ship has sailed. But the Corporations can afford to pay Minimum Wage. They'll be fine. I assure you, the Walton Family will still be able to afford their 20th luxury yacht this year.

Why do you want to ensure the Walton Family can afford yachts? Not everyone serves the corporations. Some are still fighting the good fight. And fools like you are selling them out for a pat on the head.

Done-deal. The Corporations own it all, including the Government. Now it's just a matter of surviving in the mess. It's gonna take paying workers at least $10-$12 an hr. just for them to survive. And even at that, they'll struggle mightily. But it's a just & decent start.

I mean let's be real, Rents & Utilities aren't going down anytime soon. In fact, they'll only be going up. Everything has gone up, except for wages. It's time to adjust and do right.

Upon what moral authority do you declare for others what their work (either offered or performed for wages) is worth?

Why do you object to simply basing a worker's wage upon what that worker's work is worth?

 

[paulitician]

if only 4-6% of the workers in this nation are paid minimum wage, then they are only producing about 6% of the Nations GDP, 94% is produced by mostly much higher paid workers....

And if 50% of those making minimum wage, work in the fast food/restaurant business, then only 2-3% of all minimum wage workers produce other things.

Even with having to raise those additional people making close to the $10 an hour that Congress wants to raise the minimum wage to, we will see very little, if any rise at all in inflation. Numbers talk.

And this is why, if done in increments, raising the minimum wage HAS NEVER had a measurable effect on inflation.

All of these wild examples and wild speculations is simply B.S.

There are exceptions for small businesses with 50-100 employees or less, where they can take several more years to raise their minimum wage earners.

If a company has as many as 100 employees as Skull Pilot mentioned, it is a fairly large company and not all of their employees are at minimum wage...they probably have very few people at minimum wage, unless they have a huge turn over rate in employees and pay out the kazoo for constant training of new employees, and unless this multi million dollar company has no upper management and no middle management and no comptroller and no accountant and no administrative assistants and no receptionist, and no other workers than the new hires they hire off the street at minimum. This is HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

I am not denying that there will be some exceptions, where a pizzeria that is not performing profitably as they sit, and an increase in minimum wage could lead to their going out of business EARLIER than they would have eventually gone out of business....BUT the customers who were going to the hurting Pizzeria, will end up going to the other Pizzeria a few blocks or a mile away, and THAT business will have an increase in sales and have the need to hire more people....the very people that lost their jobs at the hurting Pizzeria could be hired by the Pizzeria down the road....

This is not the end of the world, this is not an inflation breaker, and this is not an unemployment increaser, and this is not a business breaker either....with very few exceptions.

Sorry, the low skilled bottom 6% of the workforce is responsible for much less than 6% of GDP.

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

 

[Andylusion]

Yeah I hear ya. The idea is to temporarily jack up labor costs for leaner businesses to shut them down.

You can't pay someone Minimum Wage, you're out. Sorry, but it just wasn't meant to be for you. No one is forced to hire workers. That's a choice. Don't wanna pay, just shut up and do the work yourself. Quit ya bitchin.

Eventually there will be only large, wealthy corporations, deeply embedded with government, and 'employees'. And you talk about slavery.

I'm afraid that's already the case for the most part. That ship has sailed. But the Corporations can afford to pay Minimum Wage. They'll be fine. I assure you, the Walton Family will still be able to afford their 20th luxury yacht this year.

Why do you want to ensure the Walton Family can afford yachts? Not everyone serves the corporations. Some are still fighting the good fight. And fools like you are selling them out for a pat on the head.

Done-deal. The Corporations own it all, including the Government. Now it's just a matter of surviving in the mess. It's gonna take paying workers at least $10-$12 an hr. just for them to survive. And even at that, they'll struggle mightily. But it's a just & decent start.

Let's be real, Rents & Utilities aren't going down anytime soon. In fact, they'll only be going up. Everything has gone up, except for wages. It's time to adjust and do right.

Yeah, and when you increase the minimum wage, then prices go up accordingly.

Which then nullifies the higher wage, which will have the same buying power as the original wage. Or less buying power.

You do realize that the exact same argument you just made right here, right now, was verbitum the argument made in 2006 for increasing the wage from $5.25 to $7.25.

I said back in 2006, that when the minimum wage went up to $7.25, that prices would adjust upward accordingly, and we'd have the exact same argument for $10/hr, or more, all over again.

Sure enough.... here we are. Like I have a crystal ball or something. And guess what.... I promise you, if we raise the minimum wage to $10/hr, we'll be right back here in a few years, hearing about how it's got to be $15, and then when it's $15 we'll hear about how it's got to be $20.

It never ends... because every time you move the 50 yard-line, the goal post move with it.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Sorry, the low skilled bottom 6% of the workforce is responsible for much less than 6% of GDP.

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

I can find dozens of storefronts of closed businesses near my home, because they didn't earn enough to pay their minimum wage workers. Durr.

 

[Andylusion]

Sorry, the low skilled bottom 6% of the workforce is responsible for much less than 6% of GDP.

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

Seattle Magazine Restaurants Why Are So Many Seattle Restaurants Closing Lately

The left typically point to a 1994 research paper on Penn and New Jersey. If you actually read that paper, the number of store closings on the New Jersey side (with the recently raised minimum wage), is double that of Penn.

The evidence is all over the place. Not to mention basic rational logic, which is prohibited in Leftist view.

 

[paulitician]

You can't pay someone Minimum Wage, you're out. Sorry, but it just wasn't meant to be for you. No one is forced to hire workers. That's a choice. Don't wanna pay, just shut up and do the work yourself. Quit ya bitchin.

Eventually there will be only large, wealthy corporations, deeply embedded with government, and 'employees'. And you talk about slavery.

I'm afraid that's already the case for the most part. That ship has sailed. But the Corporations can afford to pay Minimum Wage. They'll be fine. I assure you, the Walton Family will still be able to afford their 20th luxury yacht this year.

Why do you want to ensure the Walton Family can afford yachts? Not everyone serves the corporations. Some are still fighting the good fight. And fools like you are selling them out for a pat on the head.

Done-deal. The Corporations own it all, including the Government. Now it's just a matter of surviving in the mess. It's gonna take paying workers at least $10-$12 an hr. just for them to survive. And even at that, they'll struggle mightily. But it's a just & decent start.

I mean let's be real, Rents & Utilities aren't going down anytime soon. In fact, they'll only be going up. Everything has gone up, except for wages. It's time to adjust and do right.

Upon what moral authority do you declare for others what their work (either offered or performed for wages) is worth?

Why do you object to simply basing a worker's wage upon what that worker's work is worth?

Everything's been going up, except for wages. It's time to adjust. And if you don't like that, simply do the work yourself and don't hire workers. Problem solved. You're welcome.

 

[paulitician]

You can't pay someone Minimum Wage, you're out. Sorry, but it just wasn't meant to be for you. No one is forced to hire workers. That's a choice. Don't wanna pay, just shut up and do the work yourself. Quit ya bitchin.

Eventually there will be only large, wealthy corporations, deeply embedded with government, and 'employees'. And you talk about slavery.

I'm afraid that's already the case for the most part. That ship has sailed. But the Corporations can afford to pay Minimum Wage. They'll be fine. I assure you, the Walton Family will still be able to afford their 20th luxury yacht this year.

Why do you want to ensure the Walton Family can afford yachts? Not everyone serves the corporations. Some are still fighting the good fight. And fools like you are selling them out for a pat on the head.

Done-deal. The Corporations own it all, including the Government. Now it's just a matter of surviving in the mess. It's gonna take paying workers at least $10-$12 an hr. just for them to survive. And even at that, they'll struggle mightily. But it's a just & decent start.

Let's be real, Rents & Utilities aren't going down anytime soon. In fact, they'll only be going up. Everything has gone up, except for wages. It's time to adjust and do right.

Yeah, and when you increase the minimum wage, then prices go up accordingly.

Which then nullifies the higher wage, which will have the same buying power as the original wage. Or less buying power.

You do realize that the exact same argument you just made right here, right now, was verbitum the argument made in 2006 for increasing the wage from $5.25 to $7.25.

I said back in 2006, that when the minimum wage went up to $7.25, that prices would adjust upward accordingly, and we'd have the exact same argument for $10/hr, or more, all over again.

Sure enough.... here we are. Like I have a crystal ball or something. And guess what.... I promise you, if we raise the minimum wage to $10/hr, we'll be right back here in a few years, hearing about how it's got to be $15, and then when it's $15 we'll hear about how it's got to be $20.

It never ends... because every time you move the 50 yard-line, the goal post move with it.

Uh, they're gonna raise the prices anyway. None of you 'Sky is Falling' types have yet to prove Minimum Wage is the cause. Prices of goods go up all the time. Even when Minimum Wage isn't raised. They want more money. They're greedy. It's not rocket-science. Your theory is flawed.

 

[paulitician]

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

I can find dozens of storefronts of closed businesses near my home, because they didn't earn enough to pay their minimum wage workers. Durr.

Did you ask them? Because i seriously doubt the Minimum Wage has caused them to go under. They're going under because they failed. Minimum Wage isn't to blame for that. They are.

 

[dblack]

I have submitted and explained to you the well established economic principles that describe how statutory minimum wage is necessarily harmful to the economy.

I have examined plenty of data... yet none of it was corrected for the anti-inflation, and counter unemployment policies (and other confounding externalities) that are active in the same time periods.

An injured athlete pumped full of pain-killers and cortisone feels and functions just fine... would you still say he was not harmed?

Of course not.

Do you have such data--corrected for the anti-inflation, and counter unemployment policies (and other confounding externalities)--that would so soundly refute the points I submitted? If so, please present them so we can examine them together.

So you have no actual facts or evidence proving Minimum Wage has ever caused Unemployment to rise. Thanks. That's what i've been saying all along. You guys are so wrong, so often. Why should anyone believe you?

I also told you this:

No proof whatsoever Minimum Wage causes Unemployment to rise. Unemployment goes up, Unemployment goes down. There are other numerous variables involved. Minimum Wage has little, if any impact at all.

You have been presented with the logically valid argument that making low wage jobs illegal through statutory minimum wage, results in the loss of low wage jobs--unemployment

You have been presented with well established economic principles that state statutory minimum wage causes unemployment.

You have been presented with evidence that supports both the argument, and the well established economic principles that statutory minimum wage results in unemployment.

Yet you still require "proof." You require the real world to overcome your obtuse denial of reality.

This, can't happen. It is a logical impossibility!

So instead, bring proof that statutory minimum wage is some kind of solution, or relief, for poverty. And I mean PROOF, Pumpkin. No bullshit anecdotes; no ad-hominerm arguments; no mawkish appeals to emotion.

Explain to us why you object to simply basing a worker's wage upon what that worker's work is worth.

Do the work yourself. Don't hire workers. Problem solved. You're welcome.

Well, not for the workers.

 

[paulitician]

Spot On. And i swear, i'll never get why angry white Republican dudes especially, are so angry. I mean they've always had it much better than non-white Americans have. They're so upset and panicked because someone at McDonalds might get $15. It's ridiculous. Such greedy hateful little wankers.

Which brings up racism. That's right; the minimum wage is racist. In this country minimum wage means being white is worth no less than $7.25/hr. How does this work? Like this: If 2 prospective employees--one black, one white, but otherwise equal--apply for a minimum wage job, Mr. AryanFront employer can hire white guy with a crew cut and golf shirt at no financial cost--none. He doesn't even have to worry about his competitors picking up the aspiring black worker for less, because they too have to pay him $7.25/hr. If this black worker were allowed to contract his labor for $5.00/hr, or $7.24 even, choosing the white guy would cost RacistJackass $2.25/hr (or $0.01 depending). Moreover, his competitors, if not racist, have the opportunity to hire the black worker at a cost advantage.

If you think this is not the case, you should check out how the white dominated unions in apartheid South Africa complained that the lack of minimum wage regulations led employers to hire cheap black laborers over better trained and better paid white folks. Which, coincidentally was exactly the same argument (check the congressional record) used by Robert Bacon when he wrote the Davis-Bacon Act (the first minmum wage law) in response to Southern contractors bringing black labor to a federal project in his Long Island district; a labor regulation which forces contractors engaged in government contracts to pay employees union wage scale (unions, which incidently were, at the time, usually exclusively white); effectively barring Southern blacks and immigrants from working on plush, government funded construction projects.

Minimum wage doesn't neccessarily have to be racist; on it's best day, minimum wage is only a state sponsored protection for older, higher paid workers from the competition of anyone who would accept less pay for the same work. The surprise for me was that though I understood that minimum wage and Davis-Bacon were, in observable and measurable effect, racist policies--I just had no idea that they were racist in intent.

So why is it that proponents for statutory minimum wage object to simply basing a worker's wage upon what the worker's work is worth? Why won't they explain their objection to us? Why don't they tell us the reason for refusing to explain their objection?

Maybe the answer is that they're racists. Maybe the're just ashamed to be outed so. Seems legit.

Angry greedy white Republican dudes are just plain ole assholes. Who cares if a McDonalds worker gets $15? Good for them. All the bitchin & moanin coming from the angry white dudes is ridiculous. Get a life for God's sake.

Entitled whiny libs want to be paid top dollar even when they have ZERO skills and can be replaced in about 10 seconds

Why don't all you burger baggers aspire to bigger and better things?

That's especially hilarious coming from entitled fat greedy old white Republican dude. No one in this country is more entitled than you. So quit your bitchin and pay up.

Upon what moral authority do you determine for EVERYONE what their work (either offered or performed for wages) is worth?

I already told you, i think a human's 'worth' right now in America should be somewhere between $10-$15 an hr. And yes, that goes for burger flippers too. Life is hard in today's America. Rent alone, is a real killer. Between $10-$15 could help an American at least survive.

 

[hadit]

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

I can find dozens of storefronts of closed businesses near my home, because they didn't earn enough to pay their minimum wage workers. Durr.

Did you ask them? Because i seriously doubt the Minimum Wage has caused them to go under. They're going under because they failed. Minimum Wage isn't to blame for that. They are.

MW is a business cost. Raise it, and you raise every business's costs. The business then has to choose how to deal with the new artificially imposed cost increase. It can raise prices or cut expenses. If the market won't tolerate increased prices, expenses will be cut elsewhere, and since labor is the typically biggest cost a company has, hours get cut, jobs get cut, or expansion plans are put on hold. To make your repeated statements that increasing the MW true, you would have to be able to raise it to $100/hr immediately and eliminate all poverty. If you can't, then increasing the MW DOES impact jobs.

 

[dblack]

if only 4-6% of the workers in this nation are paid minimum wage, then they are only producing about 6% of the Nations GDP, 94% is produced by mostly much higher paid workers....

And if 50% of those making minimum wage, work in the fast food/restaurant business, then only 2-3% of all minimum wage workers produce other things.

Even with having to raise those additional people making close to the $10 an hour that Congress wants to raise the minimum wage to, we will see very little, if any rise at all in inflation. Numbers talk.

And this is why, if done in increments, raising the minimum wage HAS NEVER had a measurable effect on inflation.

All of these wild examples and wild speculations is simply B.S.

There are exceptions for small businesses with 50-100 employees or less, where they can take several more years to raise their minimum wage earners.

If a company has as many as 100 employees as Skull Pilot mentioned, it is a fairly large company and not all of their employees are at minimum wage...they probably have very few people at minimum wage, unless they have a huge turn over rate in employees and pay out the kazoo for constant training of new employees, and unless this multi million dollar company has no upper management and no middle management and no comptroller and no accountant and no administrative assistants and no receptionist, and no other workers than the new hires they hire off the street at minimum. This is HIGHLY UNLIKELY.

I am not denying that there will be some exceptions, where a pizzeria that is not performing profitably as they sit, and an increase in minimum wage could lead to their going out of business EARLIER than they would have eventually gone out of business....BUT the customers who were going to the hurting Pizzeria, will end up going to the other Pizzeria a few blocks or a mile away, and THAT business will have an increase in sales and have the need to hire more people....the very people that lost their jobs at the hurting Pizzeria could be hired by the Pizzeria down the road....

This is not the end of the world, this is not an inflation breaker, and this is not an unemployment increaser, and this is not a business breaker either....with very few exceptions.

Sorry, the low skilled bottom 6% of the workforce is responsible for much less than 6% of GDP.

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

Sure. But then what's the point? A few people, who were probably just barely hanging on at the old wage, will lose their jobs, and a few businesses, that were probably on the verge of going out of business anyway, will go bankrupt. All so a few more people can get a temporary raise. And so politicians can get a few more votes. Five years later, the disparity between rich and poor will be even worse, minimum wage will be even lower, in terms of real buying power. And we'll be having the same dumb argument.

 

[paulitician]

Which only proves my point Todd...It's not a big enough portion of the economy to cause inflation, it will not hurt the overall economy to raise the minimum to $10.10 which Congress is suggesting.

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

Seattle Magazine Restaurants Why Are So Many Seattle Restaurants Closing Lately

The left typically point to a 1994 research paper on Penn and New Jersey. If you actually read that paper, the number of store closings on the New Jersey side (with the recently raised minimum wage), is double that of Penn.

The evidence is all over the place. Not to mention basic rational logic, which is prohibited in Leftist view.

Shitty restaurants that don't wanna pay workers, are going away? Cool. They'll quickly be replaced by better ones that will. Life will go on. I promise.

 

[paulitician]

So you have no actual facts or evidence proving Minimum Wage has ever caused Unemployment to rise. Thanks. That's what i've been saying all along. You guys are so wrong, so often. Why should anyone believe you?

I also told you this:

No proof whatsoever Minimum Wage causes Unemployment to rise. Unemployment goes up, Unemployment goes down. There are other numerous variables involved. Minimum Wage has little, if any impact at all.

You have been presented with the logically valid argument that making low wage jobs illegal through statutory minimum wage, results in the loss of low wage jobs--unemployment

You have been presented with well established economic principles that state statutory minimum wage causes unemployment.

You have been presented with evidence that supports both the argument, and the well established economic principles that statutory minimum wage results in unemployment.

Yet you still require "proof." You require the real world to overcome your obtuse denial of reality.

This, can't happen. It is a logical impossibility!

So instead, bring proof that statutory minimum wage is some kind of solution, or relief, for poverty. And I mean PROOF, Pumpkin. No bullshit anecdotes; no ad-hominerm arguments; no mawkish appeals to emotion.

Explain to us why you object to simply basing a worker's wage upon what that worker's work is worth.

Do the work yourself. Don't hire workers. Problem solved. You're welcome.

Well, not for the workers.

Don't worry about it. The usual suspect fat greedy old white Republicans will bitch & moan for awhile, but then they'll shut up and deal with it. They won't be doing the work themselves. They'll still be hiring workers. The sky won't fall. I promise.

 

[paulitician]

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

I can find dozens of storefronts of closed businesses near my home, because they didn't earn enough to pay their minimum wage workers. Durr.

Did you ask them? Because i seriously doubt the Minimum Wage has caused them to go under. They're going under because they failed. Minimum Wage isn't to blame for that. They are.

MW is a business cost. Raise it, and you raise every business's costs. The business then has to choose how to deal with the new artificially imposed cost increase. It can raise prices or cut expenses. If the market won't tolerate increased prices, expenses will be cut elsewhere, and since labor is the typically biggest cost a company has, hours get cut, jobs get cut, or expansion plans are put on hold. To make your repeated statements that increasing the MW true, you would have to be able to raise it to $100/hr immediately and eliminate all poverty. If you can't, then increasing the MW DOES impact jobs.

The Market has always tolerated Minimum Wage increases. The sky has never fallen over it. That's just what the usual suspect greedy wankers always predict. And of course they're always proven wrong. And they'll be proven wrong this time too.

 

[dblack]

Don't worry about it. The usual suspect fat greedy old white Republicans will bitch & moan for awhile, but then they'll shut up and deal with it. They won't be doing the work themselves. They'll still be hiring workers. The sky won't fall. I promise.

Your posting style has become really strident and repetitive over the years. You don't even really seem to read the posts you respond to anymore, other than to get a general idea of whether they are "for" or "against". Then you just repeat some slogans with gratuitous insult attached.

Wouldn't it be more fun to have an actual discussion?

 

[dblack]

It will cause some businesses to go under. It will cause more to reduce head count. People who think it will be a boost to the economy are morons. Especially the op.

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

Seattle Magazine Restaurants Why Are So Many Seattle Restaurants Closing Lately

The left typically point to a 1994 research paper on Penn and New Jersey. If you actually read that paper, the number of store closings on the New Jersey side (with the recently raised minimum wage), is double that of Penn.

The evidence is all over the place. Not to mention basic rational logic, which is prohibited in Leftist view.

Shitty restaurants that don't wanna pay workers, are going away? Cool. They'll quickly be replaced by better ones that will. Life will go on. I promise.

They'll be replace by richer ones - probably owned by corporations who can afford the temporary bump in overhead costs. But I guess you'll just cheer for that too, eh?

 

[Mac1958]

Why don't you explain to us why you object to simply basing a worker's wages upon what that worker's work is worth?

I agree with you that people should just be paid what they are worth. That would be the obvious motivation for people to put the effort into improving themselves and their skillset. Fundamental human dignity. It's an obvious point, and still there are many who will simply refuse to have that conversation. And if you feel that business is being unfairly targeted and penalized here, I'd agree with that, too.

Unfortunately, as with anything else, we have to deal with the reality of the situation. And here is the reality:

First, we have raised at least one full generation of young people, the Selfie Generation, who are terribly self-centered and entitled. We've given them participation medals just for showing up and we've avoided hurting their feelings in class. We've told them how special and wonderful they are while they're in school, knowing full well that the real world would not be nearly so kind. (Confident Idiots American Students Growing More Confident Less Capable)

Second, because these young people are entering the work force with far more phony "self esteem" than actual skills or proper attitude, they simply don't have as much value in the free market as they could have. So, bottom line, either American business "takes care" of them or they end up on the public dole, and we already know that this has become an inter-generational culture now.

And third, automation has eliminated the need for many, many people who have chosen not to increase their skill set, and our economy is clearly in a period of transition as we try to balance massively increased (and increasing) productivity with the skills and size of the labor force.

Bottom line is, we have little choice. It's going to fall on the backs of American business to "take care" of these people, at least until we efficiently find a way to deal with the boom in productivity and automation. If ever, and that's debatable. This, I strongly suspect, is a significant part of the reason for the terribly dishonest "you didn't build that" culture into which we have fallen. Business just has to give it up, tough shit.

I don't like it either, but it is what it is.

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Ok. Now that you've offered some kind of crap rationalization for why a worker's work is not based upon what that worker's work is worth; upon what moral authority do you determine for everybody what their work (either offered or performed for wages) is worth?

Mine was (as usual) a reasonable, civil and rational post. So your "crap rationalization" criticism tells me that you either did not actually read what I wrote, or that you just don't want to hear any contrary opinions, or (most likely) both.

And I also made it quite clear that it's not what I would want.

On what moral authority would determination be made on worth? Well, now that we are in the process of detaching value from pay, I have no idea. Those who are pushing hard for a large minimum wage increase seem to have settled most consistently on "a full time job should not pay so little that the worker needs public assistance". You'll have to ask them. My background is in business and finance, I'm afraid I'm not well versed on the "employer is responsible for taking care of its employees" concept. Working on it, though.

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[paulitician]

Yet you 'Sky is Falling' whiners have yet to present even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. So, once again you'll be proven wrong. Just like all the other times you predicted the sky falling over the Minimum Wage. You guys just don't have the credibility to make such predictions.

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

Seattle Magazine Restaurants Why Are So Many Seattle Restaurants Closing Lately

The left typically point to a 1994 research paper on Penn and New Jersey. If you actually read that paper, the number of store closings on the New Jersey side (with the recently raised minimum wage), is double that of Penn.

The evidence is all over the place. Not to mention basic rational logic, which is prohibited in Leftist view.

Shitty restaurants that don't wanna pay workers, are going away? Cool. They'll quickly be replaced by better ones that will. Life will go on. I promise.

They'll be replace by richer ones - probably owned by corporations who can afford the temporary bump in overhead costs. But I guess you'll just cheer for that too, eh?

The shitty restaurants will go bye bye. Oh well, boohoo for them. They'll be replaced by restaurants that'll pay. Welcome to America. Greed & hate rules the roost. I didn't make the rules, it is what it is.

 

[hadit]

Yeah, higher costs, whether raw materials, energy or wages never put a business under. LOL!
You're such a fuck wit.

Now you're finally gettin it. Various numerous more significant variables, play a part in causing a business to go under. You have not presented even one example of a business going under due to the Minimum Wage. Because it doesn't happen. There a lots of reasons businesses go under, but Minimum Wage isn't one of them.

I can find dozens of storefronts of closed businesses near my home, because they didn't earn enough to pay their minimum wage workers. Durr.

Did you ask them? Because i seriously doubt the Minimum Wage has caused them to go under. They're going under because they failed. Minimum Wage isn't to blame for that. They are.

MW is a business cost. Raise it, and you raise every business's costs. The business then has to choose how to deal with the new artificially imposed cost increase. It can raise prices or cut expenses. If the market won't tolerate increased prices, expenses will be cut elsewhere, and since labor is the typically biggest cost a company has, hours get cut, jobs get cut, or expansion plans are put on hold. To make your repeated statements that increasing the MW true, you would have to be able to raise it to $100/hr immediately and eliminate all poverty. If you can't, then increasing the MW DOES impact jobs.

The Market has always tolerated Minimum Wage increases. The sky has never fallen over it. That's just what the usual suspect greedy wankers always predict. And of course they're always proven wrong. And they'll be proven wrong this time too.

Great. Then raise it to $100/hr and really eliminate poverty.