Messiah

[Meriweather]

Jews and Christians use the word "messiah,' the meaning of the word is quite different in each faith. The Christian understanding is that their messiah, Jesus, died for the sins of the people. The messiah, according to this Christian definition, is supposed to be a human offering: a blood sacrifice necessary for the forgiveness of sin. But we are taught in our Bible that no one can die for the sins of another. In Deuteronomy 24:16 it says this unequivocally:

The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin. [Deuteronomy 24:16]
(Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another,' and Essay #2, 'Jews Believe That a Blood Sacrifice Is Not Required for Forgiveness of Sins').

The Bible is clear, in verse after verse: no one can die for the sins of another. Regarding what the Bible says about human sacrifice, please see Essay #4, 'Gd hates human sacrifices.'

Jews do not believe that after forbidding human sacrifice, Gd had a change of heart and decided to require it; and we certainly do not believe that it was the sacrifice of Gd's own human 'son' that Gd wanted. After telling Israel to stay away from pagan practices and pagan beliefs, did Gd change Gd's mind and say, 'Okay, now go ahead and believe in a human sacrifice, just as these very pagans believe?' No -- as we saw in Malachi 3:6, Gd is constant and unchanging. (Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another').

Gd tells us that any human sacrifice is an abomination, something Gd hates, and so horrible that it would never even come into Gd's mind to demand it of us. Human sacrifice was practiced by the pagans -- those who worshipped and made offerings to one or more imaginary deities -- it was NOT to be practiced by believers in the One Gd.

It should be understood that the Christian definition of the term 'messiah' is pagan. How do Christians define the term messiah? They understand it exactly as the pagans understood their dying-saving man-gods and heroes. The ancient world is filled with examples. Mithra, Adonis, Dionysis, Attis, Ra, and many others were born in the Winter, died in the Spring, and came back to life. This should sound familiar to anyone conversant with Christian theology.

Alongside this, they believed that their followers would have immortal life, since the death of the hero-god acted as the sacrifice for their sins. This should also sound familiar. The pagan world was filled with gods who were the product of a human mother and a god for the father. Heracles had Zeus for a father, and a human mother named Alcmene. Dionysus’s human mother was Semele, and his father was Zeus; Dionysus was considered a savior god. The parallels to Christian theology are plain to see.

When the earliest Christians would come into the synagogues and missionize, they would get kicked out; they were not allowed to stay and preach. They were rejected because their message was pagan and was recognized as such by the Jews. Thus, they were removed and separated from the Jewish people. This shows the real reason why Judaism and Christianity parted ways, dating from the very beginnings of Christianity. It also shows that one cannot be a Jew and a Christian at the same time. (Please see Essay #9 'Jews' for Jesus, Messianic 'Jews', and 'Hebrew' Christians are not Jews').

What Jews Believe: Essay #3: Jesus Not the Messiah

Your posts are often hard to respond to because of so many misconceptions. The Catholic view is that 'Messiah' means 'Anointed One.' It is my understanding that Jews are awaiting a Messiah (an anointed one) who is fully human and will rule over Judea and have a great earthly kingdom. Nations will look to Jews as the best way to govern and live life.

Catholics believe Jesus is the Messiah. He came to rule over individual lives, to teach us to discern the will of the Father and to follow it. Christ came pronouncing, "Your sins are forgiven." He was met (by some) with scorn. Who gave him the authority to say anything so audacious? Jesus said his authority came from God, whom he called Abba...Father.

As the religious authorities of the day did not believe Jesus, Temple sacrifices continued, and priests of that day brought the sins (and sin offerings) of the people to God for forgiveness. Jesus' life, his total obedience to the Father, had him willingly giving his life for this message. Sins are forgiven. Jesus would not recant. He gave his life, his blood, as the sign of this covenant between God and His people. God confirmed He was the authority behind this message by raising Jesus from the dead.

There are some Christian denomination who have a more far-out view of what Jesus did. But the vast majority of Christians--as do Jews--believe in repentance for the forgiveness of sins. This is what Jesus taught--he did not teach animal or cereal sacrifice.

God forgives sins. We have a covenant that every Jew should understand. I understand most covenants make-do with animal blood, but for this one, Jesus gave his own blood, and in doing so set the stage for God to raise him from the dead.

The other belief Christians have is that in turning from sin (repenting), they do all it is possible for them to do make restitution for what they have done wrong. Often times, what we can do is not nearly enough, and we turn this part, this gap, over to Jesus to bridge for us.

 

[HaShev]

It is my understanding that Jews are awaiting a Messiah (an anointed one) who is fully human and will rule over Judea and have a great earthly kingdom. Nations will look to Jews as the best way to govern and live life.
Catholics believe Jesus(morning star Lucifer) is the Messiah.

"Have a great earthly kingdom":
War Scroll” (4Q471)
Where in verse XVII, it says, “God will send eternal bliss by the might of the Princely Angel of the "Kingdom of Michael". He will enlighten with joy the children of Israel.

IT'S quite clear, the people of the cross chose the deception and the world has paid for their choice ever since.

 

[Desperado]

I thought this was just another of his Obama's thread.

 

[theHawk]

Jews and Christians use the word "messiah,' the meaning of the word is quite different in each faith. The Christian understanding is that their messiah, Jesus, died for the sins of the people. The messiah, according to this Christian definition, is supposed to be a human offering: a blood sacrifice necessary for the forgiveness of sin. But we are taught in our Bible that no one can die for the sins of another. In Deuteronomy 24:16 it says this unequivocally:

The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin. [Deuteronomy 24:16]
(Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another,' and Essay #2, 'Jews Believe That a Blood Sacrifice Is Not Required for Forgiveness of Sins').

The Bible is clear, in verse after verse: no one can die for the sins of another. Regarding what the Bible says about human sacrifice, please see Essay #4, 'Gd hates human sacrifices.'

Jews do not believe that after forbidding human sacrifice, Gd had a change of heart and decided to require it; and we certainly do not believe that it was the sacrifice of Gd's own human 'son' that Gd wanted. After telling Israel to stay away from pagan practices and pagan beliefs, did Gd change Gd's mind and say, 'Okay, now go ahead and believe in a human sacrifice, just as these very pagans believe?' No -- as we saw in Malachi 3:6, Gd is constant and unchanging. (Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another').

Gd tells us that any human sacrifice is an abomination, something Gd hates, and so horrible that it would never even come into Gd's mind to demand it of us. Human sacrifice was practiced by the pagans -- those who worshipped and made offerings to one or more imaginary deities -- it was NOT to be practiced by believers in the One Gd.

It should be understood that the Christian definition of the term 'messiah' is pagan. How do Christians define the term messiah? They understand it exactly as the pagans understood their dying-saving man-gods and heroes. The ancient world is filled with examples. Mithra, Adonis, Dionysis, Attis, Ra, and many others were born in the Winter, died in the Spring, and came back to life. This should sound familiar to anyone conversant with Christian theology.

Alongside this, they believed that their followers would have immortal life, since the death of the hero-god acted as the sacrifice for their sins. This should also sound familiar. The pagan world was filled with gods who were the product of a human mother and a god for the father. Heracles had Zeus for a father, and a human mother named Alcmene. Dionysus’s human mother was Semele, and his father was Zeus; Dionysus was considered a savior god. The parallels to Christian theology are plain to see.

When the earliest Christians would come into the synagogues and missionize, they would get kicked out; they were not allowed to stay and preach. They were rejected because their message was pagan and was recognized as such by the Jews. Thus, they were removed and separated from the Jewish people. This shows the real reason why Judaism and Christianity parted ways, dating from the very beginnings of Christianity. It also shows that one cannot be a Jew and a Christian at the same time. (Please see Essay #9 'Jews' for Jesus, Messianic 'Jews', and 'Hebrew' Christians are not Jews').

What Jews Believe: Essay #3: Jesus Not the Messiah

We get it Guano, you're the type of Jew that hates Christianity with a passion.

So tell us, since you're so into the Bible, how Gd approves of homosexuality and abortion.

 

[theHawk]

I thought this was just another of his Obama's thread.

He had to make his daily "I hate Christians" thread.

 

[Indeependent]

Aris2chat it doesn't matter because 1 Rabbi trumps all Rabbis-Dan 10:21
& by your standard if a Rabbi says Jesus was Lucifer, then your standard and use of argument means Jesus was Lucifer.
Citing a single Rabbi as a source is called an ad homminem tactic. Not gonna fly here.

Singer is the founder of Outreach Judaism, in Indonesia. Till today I have not heard about it or him. Rabbi Kaduri was one the best know and globally respected.

I would tend to believe Kaduri over Singer, if I had to judge. A bit more credibility.

I NEVER heard of Kaduri until now.
Everyone I know knows Singer.

 

[guno]

Jews and Christians use the word "messiah,' the meaning of the word is quite different in each faith. The Christian understanding is that their messiah, Jesus, died for the sins of the people. The messiah, according to this Christian definition, is supposed to be a human offering: a blood sacrifice necessary for the forgiveness of sin. But we are taught in our Bible that no one can die for the sins of another. In Deuteronomy 24:16 it says this unequivocally:

The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin. [Deuteronomy 24:16]
(Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another,' and Essay #2, 'Jews Believe That a Blood Sacrifice Is Not Required for Forgiveness of Sins').

The Bible is clear, in verse after verse: no one can die for the sins of another. Regarding what the Bible says about human sacrifice, please see Essay #4, 'Gd hates human sacrifices.'

Jews do not believe that after forbidding human sacrifice, Gd had a change of heart and decided to require it; and we certainly do not believe that it was the sacrifice of Gd's own human 'son' that Gd wanted. After telling Israel to stay away from pagan practices and pagan beliefs, did Gd change Gd's mind and say, 'Okay, now go ahead and believe in a human sacrifice, just as these very pagans believe?' No -- as we saw in Malachi 3:6, Gd is constant and unchanging. (Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another').

Gd tells us that any human sacrifice is an abomination, something Gd hates, and so horrible that it would never even come into Gd's mind to demand it of us. Human sacrifice was practiced by the pagans -- those who worshipped and made offerings to one or more imaginary deities -- it was NOT to be practiced by believers in the One Gd.

It should be understood that the Christian definition of the term 'messiah' is pagan. How do Christians define the term messiah? They understand it exactly as the pagans understood their dying-saving man-gods and heroes. The ancient world is filled with examples. Mithra, Adonis, Dionysis, Attis, Ra, and many others were born in the Winter, died in the Spring, and came back to life. This should sound familiar to anyone conversant with Christian theology.

Alongside this, they believed that their followers would have immortal life, since the death of the hero-god acted as the sacrifice for their sins. This should also sound familiar. The pagan world was filled with gods who were the product of a human mother and a god for the father. Heracles had Zeus for a father, and a human mother named Alcmene. Dionysus’s human mother was Semele, and his father was Zeus; Dionysus was considered a savior god. The parallels to Christian theology are plain to see.

When the earliest Christians would come into the synagogues and missionize, they would get kicked out; they were not allowed to stay and preach. They were rejected because their message was pagan and was recognized as such by the Jews. Thus, they were removed and separated from the Jewish people. This shows the real reason why Judaism and Christianity parted ways, dating from the very beginnings of Christianity. It also shows that one cannot be a Jew and a Christian at the same time. (Please see Essay #9 'Jews' for Jesus, Messianic 'Jews', and 'Hebrew' Christians are not Jews').

What Jews Believe: Essay #3: Jesus Not the Messiah

We get it Guano, you're the type of Jew that hates Christianity with a passion.

So tell us, since you're so into the Bible, how Gd approves of homosexuality and abortion.

posting truth about what the messiah is, is hate? interesting

christianity claims Jesus was the promised messiah , yet the Torah is a Jewish text for the Jews who understand the text and prophecies given

According to Torah, the Messiah will:

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies. Additionally:


Jesus was not descended from King David. Per Genesis 49:10 and Isaiah 11:1, the Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David. However, according to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father -- and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David! The Christian idea of a virgin birth is derived from a verse in Isaiah describing an "alma" as giving birth. The word "alma" has always meant a young woman, but Christian theologians came centuries later and translated it as "virgin." This accords Jesus' birth with the first century pagan idea of mortals being impregnated by G-ds.


In Christianity, the role of the messiah was redefined in order to fit the man’s career as written by his followers. As Jesus was said to have been resurrected, the Bible was examined with the purpose of finding evidence that the messiah would be killed without bringing peace to the world or redemption to Israel. There was therefore the expectation of a second coming, at which time Jesus would carry out the task expected of the messiah (because he obviously didn't do it the first time). This also required creation of an explanation for the first coming and its catastrophic end. The net result of all of this was to shift the function of the messiah from a visible level where it could be tested (as in Tanach, what Christians call the "Old Testament") to an invisible level where it could not. As a result of this reworking, the messiah’s goal the first time around was changed from the redemption of Israel to the atonement for "original sin". A reworking of Biblical themes.

There were also mistakes with respect to Jesus's death and its foretelling. Psalms 22:17 says, "Like a lion, they are at my hands and feet." The Hebrew word ki-ari (like a lion) is grammatically similar to the word "gouged." Thus Christianity reads the verse as a reference to crucifixion: "They pierced my hands and feet." Christians also claim that Isaiah 53 refers to Jesus. Actually, Isaiah 53 directly follows the theme of chapter 52, describing the exile and redemption of the Jewish people. The singular form is used because the Jews ("Israel") are regarded as one unit (this occurs elsewhere in Torah).

For Jews, if the Tanach's requirements for the messiah have not been fulfilled, then there can only be one explanation: he has not yet come. To Jews, who were often subjected to mockery and contempt when asked where their messiah was, this was a painful statement to make. But it was inescapable. As our forefather's said: Ani M'amin: I believe with complete faith in the coming of the messiah; and though he may tarry I shall wait for him every day.”

This explains why during the Inquisitions and throughout history, Jews gave up their lives rather than convert.

 

[Two Thumbs]

another hate christian thread by guano

if bat guno had any balls, even for a leftist, he talk some shit about muslims and buddist.

but alas, even leftist males consider him a wimp

another hate christian thread

But what you need is a catchy anti-? phrase so you can succinctly stifle any debate about your religion regardless of the merits.

Where did he go wrong?

go fuck yourself

oh that wasn't christian of me

we go fuck yourself with a splintery cross

oh, and I'm not a christian, guano is just a fucking pussy, like you, that pretends christians are a great horror to the world.

you're a fucking deluded pussy

What, you're not christian? You are just fixated on guno, a jilted lover perhaps?

ooo, gay insults

very tolerant of you.

when's the last time you started a hate islam thread or buddist or any other religion thread?

 

[Meriweather]

Jews and Christians use the word "messiah,' the meaning of the word is quite different in each faith. The Christian understanding is that their messiah, Jesus, died for the sins of the people. The messiah, according to this Christian definition, is supposed to be a human offering: a blood sacrifice necessary for the forgiveness of sin. But we are taught in our Bible that no one can die for the sins of another. In Deuteronomy 24:16 it says this unequivocally:

The fathers shall not be put to death for the children, neither shall the children be put to death for the fathers: every man shall be put to death for his own sin. [Deuteronomy 24:16]
(Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another,' and Essay #2, 'Jews Believe That a Blood Sacrifice Is Not Required for Forgiveness of Sins').

The Bible is clear, in verse after verse: no one can die for the sins of another. Regarding what the Bible says about human sacrifice, please see Essay #4, 'Gd hates human sacrifices.'

Jews do not believe that after forbidding human sacrifice, Gd had a change of heart and decided to require it; and we certainly do not believe that it was the sacrifice of Gd's own human 'son' that Gd wanted. After telling Israel to stay away from pagan practices and pagan beliefs, did Gd change Gd's mind and say, 'Okay, now go ahead and believe in a human sacrifice, just as these very pagans believe?' No -- as we saw in Malachi 3:6, Gd is constant and unchanging. (Please see Essay #1, 'Jews Believe That No One Can Die for the Sins of Another').

Gd tells us that any human sacrifice is an abomination, something Gd hates, and so horrible that it would never even come into Gd's mind to demand it of us. Human sacrifice was practiced by the pagans -- those who worshipped and made offerings to one or more imaginary deities -- it was NOT to be practiced by believers in the One Gd.

It should be understood that the Christian definition of the term 'messiah' is pagan. How do Christians define the term messiah? They understand it exactly as the pagans understood their dying-saving man-gods and heroes. The ancient world is filled with examples. Mithra, Adonis, Dionysis, Attis, Ra, and many others were born in the Winter, died in the Spring, and came back to life. This should sound familiar to anyone conversant with Christian theology.

Alongside this, they believed that their followers would have immortal life, since the death of the hero-god acted as the sacrifice for their sins. This should also sound familiar. The pagan world was filled with gods who were the product of a human mother and a god for the father. Heracles had Zeus for a father, and a human mother named Alcmene. Dionysus’s human mother was Semele, and his father was Zeus; Dionysus was considered a savior god. The parallels to Christian theology are plain to see.

When the earliest Christians would come into the synagogues and missionize, they would get kicked out; they were not allowed to stay and preach. They were rejected because their message was pagan and was recognized as such by the Jews. Thus, they were removed and separated from the Jewish people. This shows the real reason why Judaism and Christianity parted ways, dating from the very beginnings of Christianity. It also shows that one cannot be a Jew and a Christian at the same time. (Please see Essay #9 'Jews' for Jesus, Messianic 'Jews', and 'Hebrew' Christians are not Jews').

What Jews Believe: Essay #3: Jesus Not the Messiah

We get it Guano, you're the type of Jew that hates Christianity with a passion.

So tell us, since you're so into the Bible, how Gd approves of homosexuality and abortion.

posting truth about what the messiah is, is hate? interesting

christianity claims Jesus was the promised messiah , yet the Torah is a Jewish text for the Jews who understand the text and prophecies given

According to Torah, the Messiah will:

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies. Additionally:


Jesus was not descended from King David. Per Genesis 49:10 and Isaiah 11:1, the Messiah must be descended on his father's side from King David. However, according to the Christian claim that Jesus was the product of a virgin birth, he had no father -- and thus could not have possibly fulfilled the messianic requirement of being descended on his father's side from King David! The Christian idea of a virgin birth is derived from a verse in Isaiah describing an "alma" as giving birth. The word "alma" has always meant a young woman, but Christian theologians came centuries later and translated it as "virgin." This accords Jesus' birth with the first century pagan idea of mortals being impregnated by G-ds.


In Christianity, the role of the messiah was redefined in order to fit the man’s career as written by his followers. As Jesus was said to have been resurrected, the Bible was examined with the purpose of finding evidence that the messiah would be killed without bringing peace to the world or redemption to Israel. There was therefore the expectation of a second coming, at which time Jesus would carry out the task expected of the messiah (because he obviously didn't do it the first time). This also required creation of an explanation for the first coming and its catastrophic end. The net result of all of this was to shift the function of the messiah from a visible level where it could be tested (as in Tanach, what Christians call the "Old Testament") to an invisible level where it could not. As a result of this reworking, the messiah’s goal the first time around was changed from the redemption of Israel to the atonement for "original sin". A reworking of Biblical themes.

There were also mistakes with respect to Jesus's death and its foretelling. Psalms 22:17 says, "Like a lion, they are at my hands and feet." The Hebrew word ki-ari (like a lion) is grammatically similar to the word "gouged." Thus Christianity reads the verse as a reference to crucifixion: "They pierced my hands and feet." Christians also claim that Isaiah 53 refers to Jesus. Actually, Isaiah 53 directly follows the theme of chapter 52, describing the exile and redemption of the Jewish people. The singular form is used because the Jews ("Israel") are regarded as one unit (this occurs elsewhere in Torah).

For Jews, if the Tanach's requirements for the messiah have not been fulfilled, then there can only be one explanation: he has not yet come. To Jews, who were often subjected to mockery and contempt when asked where their messiah was, this was a painful statement to make. But it was inescapable. As our forefather's said: Ani M'amin: I believe with complete faith in the coming of the messiah; and though he may tarry I shall wait for him every day.”

This explains why during the Inquisitions and throughout history, Jews gave up their lives rather than convert.

Two thoughts: First, is having large nails pounded through flesh and tendons more like piercing the hands and feet, or more like gouging hands and feet?

Second: I do not rule out the idea of a man of Jewish faith ruling Judea, and being a ruler like David of old. My question (and I do tender it respectfully) is that I have heard that if a prophecy has not been fulfilled within a few generations, Jews generally consider that prophecy to have been a false prophecy. Yet, Jews still believe this prophecy which was made thousands of years ago--and yet has never come to pass in the way they have expected. Why is this prophecy not considered a false prophecy?

One other question: I have read that the reason so many Jews were expecting the Messiah at the time of Christ is that people of that time saw Herod's Temple as the third Temple. It wasn't until after it was destroyed Rabbis concluded that it must have simply been a renovation of an existing Temple (as Temple activities had not ceased), and that a third Temple is to be expected. Once again, as numerous generations have passed and there is no Temple, why is this not considered a false prophecy?

Again, no disrespect intended. I'm curious and I have a desire to learn.

 

[HaShev]

According to Torah, the Messiah will:

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies. Additionally:

Ironically he did everything opposite and adversary the prerequisites you listed.

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   Instead his character boasted it would be demolished every single stone (which was wrong as some still stood but evidence Rome spoke through this image they created)
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   Instead he caused them to be dispersed.
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   Thousands of wars later makes the fallacious claims not just rediculous but out right evil.
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

So they made him a trinity and they created his image from many including the 3 christs ranging 100bc-45ad.

Prerequisites Christians hate discussing that will P.O. the forum fanatics.

God can't be a man nor is God messiah or Messiah God.
Moshiach is a servant to mankind not served by mankind.

Moshiach will know the secret wisdom of the name of God 4Q300I ii4=4Q299 2 i I4.
(because the name is shared and the definition is the reflection and teaching)

"The Name"(HaShem)of God will be in his name-(EXODUS 23:20-21 & Hebrew Version of Micah 4:5)

Moshiach lifts the veil from our eyes.-Isaiah 25:7.

Moshiach must have his name in
"the bible" (Mikra)-Melakim
{I Kings8:43} Torah-Devarim 14:22

The Torah portions(Miketz,Shevitz)must
carry his first and last name.
Helps to know Hebrew; MIKEtz-
(Ketz; lit., `end': a particularly auspicious time for Mashiach to bring the exile to an end)

The name must be in the Temple (Mikdash)-
Melakim {I Kings8:43}(2Chronicles6)
Ma'aser Sheni in the Torah says
About tithing the produced food and eating it at the Temple:
“at the site that He shall choose to place His Name”
and the name must be in
the holy city of YeruShalem.
-(1 Kings 11:36 &in dead sea scrolls: Words of the Archangel Michael scroll 4Q529, 6Q23)
The Gemarah (Baba Batra 75)
Sefer D’varim (12:5, 11, 14, 18, 21; 14:23,24, 25; 15:20; 16:2, 6, 7, 11, 15, 16; 17:8, 10; 18:6; 26:2; 31:11)

The name must be remembered by the Sheva (7th) day kept holy.

The name must be revealed in all cultures to come together as one(Y'shv,Shiva,proper transliteration of Shalem, Al Laila,Mikado).
The first and last name and secret name will be revealed in the Bible(Dan 10:20-21 in Hebrew carries both).
-SEPHER IKKARIM 28:54

The Moshiach must come from the Aaronic Lineage.-scrolls: lQS lX, ll which seems to be fragment omitted from 4QSe(4Q259).

The name must be of the remover of the devil and his works. The person must know the secret of returning to his inheritance. Must know and be a catalyst for process of messaging and a catalyst for the Tikkun Olam and resurrection process and involved in the movement to build the Temple. Has to be involved in being an intercessor, mediator, remover, archstrategist, fascilitstor, teacher, judge etc....
None of these things have Jesus by name or deeds.

 

[guno]

According to Torah, the Messiah will:

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

Jesus fulfilled none of these messianic prophecies. Additionally:

Ironically he did everything opposite and adversary the prerequisites you listed.

1. Ezekiel 37:26-28: Build the Third Temple
   
   
   Instead his character boasted it would be demolished every single stone (which was wrong as some still stood but evidence Rome spoke through this image they created)
   
2. Isaiah 43:5-6: Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel
   
   Instead he caused them to be dispersed.
   
   
   
3. Isaiah 2:4: Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore."
   
   Thousands of wars later makes the fallacious claims not just rediculous but out right evil.
   
   
4. Zechariah 14 Spread universal knowledge of the G-d of Israel - uniting the entire human race as one: "G-d will be King over all the world—on that day, G-d will be One and His Name will be One"

So they made him a trinity and they created his image from many including the 3 christs ranging 100bc-45ad.

Prerequisites Christians hate discussing that will P.O. the forum fanatics.

God can't be a man nor is God messiah or Messiah God.
Moshiach is a servant to mankind not served by mankind.
Moshiach reveals the secret of the name of God-

"The Name"(HaShem)of God will be in his name-(EXODUS 23:20-21 & Hebrew Version of Micah 4:5)

Moshiach lifts the veil from our eyes.-Isaiah 25:7.

Moshiach must have his name in
"the bible" (Mikra)-Melakim
{I Kings8:43} Torah-Devarim 14:22

The Torah portions(Miketz,Shevitz)must
carry his first and last name.
Helps to know Hebrew; MIKEtz-
(Ketz; lit., `end': a particularly auspicious time for Mashiach to bring the exile to an end)

The name must be in the Temple (Mikdash)-
Melakim {I Kings8:43}(2Chronicles6)
Ma'aser Sheni in the Torah says
About tithing the produced food and eating it at the Temple:
“at the site that He shall choose to place His Name”
and the name must be in
the holy city of YeruShalem.
-(1 Kings 11:36 &in dead sea scrolls: Words of the Archangel Michael scroll 4Q529, 6Q23)
The Gemarah (Baba Batra 75)
Sefer D’varim (12:5, 11, 14, 18, 21; 14:23,24, 25; 15:20; 16:2, 6, 7, 11, 15, 16; 17:8, 10; 18:6; 26:2; 31:11)

The name must be remembered by the Sheva (7th) day kept holy.

The name must be revealed in all cultures to come together as one(Y'shv,Shiva,proper transliteration of Shalem, Al Laila,Mikado).
The first and last name and secret name will be revealed in the Bible(Dan 10:20-21 in Hebrew carries both).
The Moshiach must come from the Aaronic Lineage.-scrolls: lQS lX, ll which seems to be fragment omitted from 4QSe(4Q259).

The name must be of the remover of the devil and his works. The person must know the secret of returning to his inheritance. Must know and be a catalyst for process of messaging and a catalyst for the Tikkun Olam and resurrection process and involved in the movement to build the Temple. Has to be involved in being an intercessor, mediator, remover, archstrategist, fascilitstor, teacher, judge etc....
None of these things have Jesus by name or deeds.

And the goyim. not knowing Torah could be told anything because they were and are ignorant of Torah. that is why they have guys in gowns bowing to statues and crosses using incense just like there pagan forefathers religions

 

[HaShev]

As was Rome when forging their charade.
The fact they didn't understand Hebrew or Judaic concepts made for some really hysterical and embarassing errors.
Regurgetating those errors by passing them down the line is one thing, but doing it willingly and knowingly after the errors are pointed out is pure darkness (lies- ignorance- and folly). Maintaining the lies while being abusive to those exposing them is pure evil.

 

[aris2chat]

ignorance is the mother of hate

 

[HaShev]

I would say it's laziness and hate is the result of pride. In our age of info there is no excuse to not investigate & research unless you work 24-7 and even then I see people on their smart phones all day wasting time on cat videos.

 

[hobelim]

For Jews, if the Tanach's requirements for the messiah have not been fulfilled, then there can only be one explanation: he has not yet come.

There is another explanation.

Your expectations of what the messiah is supposed to do is as irrational as Christian expectations about the second coming of Christ so of course he has not yet come and you will be waiting for a Messiah that builds a temple and leads the Jewish people back to Israel (even though they are already there) for as long as Christians will wait for Jesus to float down from the sky.

And even if someone in this day and age manages to convince Jews to build a Temple to slaughter animals in the name of God he will only be another false messiah to add to a very long list of false messiahs'.

For as long as people think that a holy God wants people to ritually slaughter animals in a Temple dedicated to a God obsessed with diet and fashion and the sex lives of human beings they will never see peace.

 

[Tehon]

another hate christian thread by guano

if bat guno had any balls, even for a leftist, he talk some shit about muslims and buddist.

but alas, even leftist males consider him a wimp

another hate christian thread

But what you need is a catchy anti-? phrase so you can succinctly stifle any debate about your religion regardless of the merits.

Where did he go wrong?

go fuck yourself

oh that wasn't christian of me

we go fuck yourself with a splintery cross

oh, and I'm not a christian, guano is just a fucking pussy, like you, that pretends christians are a great horror to the world.

you're a fucking deluded pussy

What, you're not christian? You are just fixated on guno, a jilted lover perhaps?

ooo, gay insults

very tolerant of you.

when's the last time you started a hate islam thread or buddist or any other religion thread?

If you're not christian then why did you take offence to the OP? As someone who in the past has had a history in christianity but does not presently follow any religion I see nothing offensive in it. Indeed there are similarities between the pagan myths and the story of Jesus, that is not to be insulting, it just is.

 

[HaShev]

For Jews, if the Tanach's requirements for the messiah have not been fulfilled, then there can only be one explanation: he has not yet come.

There is another explanation.

Your expectations of what the messiah is supposed to do is as irrational as Christian expectations about the second coming of Christ so of course he has not yet come and you will be waiting for a Messiah that builds a temple and leads the Jewish people back to Israel (even though they are already there) for as long as Christians will wait for Jesus to float down from the sky.

And even if someone in this day and age manages to convince Jews to build a Temple to slaughter animals in the name of God he will only be another false messiah to add to a very long list of false messiahs'.

For as long as people think that a holy God wants people to ritually slaughter animals in a Temple dedicated to a God obsessed with diet and fashion and the sex lives of human beings they will never see peace.

1)it's a known fact that us Jews have a unique biological makeup reason for seperating meat and Dairy. Many of us seem to get easilly
sick from the combo. Back then especially
bacteria developing in milk and meat combined would be enough a reason for dietary Warnings.
2) I guess you missed the source I posted that has busted your excessively repeating complaint about Temple ritual animal sacrifice(barbeque) bring your own dish party.
Ma'aser Sheni in the Torah says
About tithing the produced food and eating it at the Temple:
“at the site that He shall choose to place His Name”.

Not only does it put your rant and rave to rest but it also puts your missing king to rest being the MIKdash is named after Mike but not Jesus or Yeshu or Theudas.
In fact the Mikdash is also called MikDosh. Dosh meaning thresher, meaning Mike is the thresher not Jesus.

In Isaiah 25:7 it's the Moshiach who lifts the veil from our eyes, this is symbolised by the thresher label on Moshiach being the thresher removing the thin layer film from the grain so what's left is the edible substance.
Check and Mate! I got your king.
And if I have your Lucifer under my foot, that makes me...... come on Hobe, you know this answer. Just let the pride go and be honest with yourself and
the conclusion. John Hagee was able to admit in front of his congregation, that if Jesus was not who he claimed to be then Jesus was the biggest liar and nutcase known to man. Of course you understand it was Rome that was the liar and early followers who lifted the image high, the actual ad era figure never claimed to be son of man he spoke of third person tense. Just as Rabbi Schneerson never claimed to be Moshiach he talked about third person tense.
It was some of his Chabad Lubivictors devotees that made Schneerson their Messiah and lifted him to the role he so eloquently spoke of as another to come.
WE LEARN FROM EMULATIONS (LIKENESSES), so we can see how these inflated images occur theoretically found in similar events.

 

[irosie91]

why are islamo Nazi dogs obsessed with the fact that the people who worked in
the historic temple ate meat? ----------I am delighted that they did not DECORATE
the walls with the dead heads of the animals they ate. I cannot eat in a room in
which a the dead eyes of some innocent victim of their bullets and arrows ---STARE
VACANTLY

 

[HaShev]

I wonder if Hobe listened to Ted Nugent when he was younger or would accept an invitation to his ranch which has animals hung upside down skined and draining blood, with their heads hung all over his wall.
With arrow drawn, I wonder if Hobe would tell Ted about his practices? And if so, would Ted have enough room for such a big bull headed plaque on his wall?

 

[irosie91]

I wonder if Hobe listened to Ted Nugent when he was younger or would accept an invitation to his ranch which has animals hung upside down skined and draining blood, with their heads hung all over his wall.
With arrow drawn, I wonder if Hobe would tell Ted about his practices? And if so, would Ted have enough room for such a big bull headed plaque on his wall?

getting back to this recently introduced topic------HOW did the fact that animals were
slaughtered in the Temple get to be a "LIBEL" ? Anyone out there willing to
comment ??