Mass shooting in France at magazine that published Mohammed cartoons

[irosie91]

France had adequate warnign they had problems as the Muslims have been terrorizing the Jews there for several years. But because it's the Jews and no one gives a shit about them they figured "real Frenchmen" were OK. Guess not.
This isnt the last of these incidents, in France or elsewhere.

The biggest fear in the media seems to be not more Muslim attacks but more support for Marine Le Pen and right wing groups. Who could blame anyone for going to them? The Left certainly has no solutions.

so true----it was actually more than 20 years ago when
French jews in the USA began commenting "jews cannot
live in France anymore"

 

[irosie91]

Jere 10512422

Imagine if 1.5 billion Muslims would leave Islam tonight? A world without Islam. How much better off the world would be!

Noomi 10519362

How dare you tell me to leave my religion just because of a few nutcases

I have not seen Noomi trash your religion so why are you trashing hers, Jeremiah?

nobody should trash "other" religions. I was horrified when I attended a mosque by invitation and the pig Imam----
a "genius" visitor to the US ---farted forth a 'khutbah jumaat" speech in which he described the New Testament as a "perverse lie"----and Christians as " perverse liars" I am sure Noomi would consider that pig Imam to be disgusting. What horrified me way back then is that no
one objected at all------not a murmur. . When I commented
about it to my hosts-----two muslim doctors----one snapped
----"Everything he said was true"------I almost vomited----no
doubt noomi would vomit too. I have no doubt that she objects to such shit whenever she encounters it

 

[Kondor3]

...Drowning in denial doesn't alter the facts. Either retract what you posted or it stands as is...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...Merely calling me a liar won't alter the hate that you posted and the call for war against 1.5 billion innocent people...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...But that is your problem, not mine...

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

...I am a realist and know that Muslims are no different to anyone else...

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

...Yes, they have their fanatics but so do Christians, Jews and Hindus...

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

...Fanatics that commit acts of violence are criminals and will be dealt with as such...

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

...Your hate inspired war will never transpire.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed at loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

You're like an old girlfriend - always flapping your jaw - usually wrong - and always needing to have the last word - and, of course, you were the first to resort to personal insult during the course of our exchange - the mark of a weak position and - oftentimes - a lesser mind.

You serve-up no convincing arguments - rather, you merely regurgitate the sort of Politically Correct vomitus that got The West to drop its guard in the first place.

Your kind are dangerous - not for your strength - but for your head-in-the-sand myopia and for your weakness. Fortunately, your idiocy is easily counterpointed, by those possessing sufficient courage to absorb a brickbat or two along the way.

And even more fortunately for The West, those running the show, in most countries in The West, are reaching more servicable conclusions about Islam at-large; including folks such as Cameron and Merkel, who have publicly stated in recent years that multiculturalism (a.k.a. large-scale Muslim immigration and integration in Western Europe) is not working - and they should know - they are on the front lines in all of this, in high profile political and cultural leadership positions.

Confidence is fairly high that you began this journey into Threat Blindness with the very best of intentions and goodwill towards your fellow man.

But your inability to recognize the differences and risks posed to The West (and, indeed, the rest of the non-Islamic world) by Islamic dogma and philosophy, is the sad and nearly inevitable result of pursing that admirable commitment to nearly psychotic lengths, regardless of growing mountains of evidence that your confidence is misplaced in this instance.

That is the mark of the ideologue rather than the pragmatist and realist.

I make no 'claims' and I have not declared 1.5 (actually, 1.6) billion people as my enemy.

I have stated that the Belief System (Islam) practiced by 1.6 billion people is the spiritual and cultural and political and philosophical Enemy of The West, because it carries with it the seeds of endless hostility and animosity and warfare and violence directed against non-Believers - everyone who does not share their warped vision of The Deity.

And, I have stated that the Militant element of that Belief System is, indeed, a perpetual and mortal Enemy of The West - as evidenced by its growing numbers (ISIS-ISIL-IS) and growing territorial gains and operations and declarations against The West and its reversion to degenerate 6th century political and cultural thinking and practices and behaviors - and as evidenced by the growing military response against it, by The West.

Your myopia and your disingenuous misrepresentations of the positions of your adversarial colleagues tell us much about your lack of integrity and your instability and unreliability as a debating partner.

Now, go (try to) sell your All-Is-Well Islam is a Religion of Peace horseshit to those more gullible - your arrow missed its mark, when you tried to aim at me.

--- End ---

 

[irosie91]

So true, Kondor-----I have mentioned that I read Nazi propaganda---old pamphlets and little magazine things
as well as new stuff as a kid----circa 1960. The stuff
put out in the 1930s and early 40s for American
consumption focused on "there are lots of 'us' and this
is what we all agree is right and we want" "you can't
fight us ---you might as well JOIN US---WE ARE THE FUTURE" and alternatively "it's over there and
not here -----none of the business of americans" Such
suggestings ---or implications ---always bring me to
attention

 

[whutTHEYsay]

iros 10519973

nobody should trash "other" religions. I was horrified when I attended a mosque by invitation and the pig Imam----
a "genius" visitor to the US ---farted forth a 'khutbah jumaat" speech in which he described the New Testament as a "perverse lie"----and Christians as " perverse liars" I am sure Noomi would consider that pig Imam to be disgusting. What horrified me way back then is that no
one objected at all------not a murmur. . When I commented
about it to my hosts-----two muslim doctors----one snapped
----"Everything he said was true"------I almost vomited----no
doubt noomi would vomit too. I have no doubt that she objects to such shit whenever she encounters it

I'm trying to stay on the objective route which primarily is to go by posters on this thread meaning those that can provide information and ask and answer questions. So I will ask you one question. Did your doctor friends or the Imam advocate killing Christians?

 

[irosie91]

iros 10519973

nobody should trash "other" religions. I was horrified when I attended a mosque by invitation and the pig Imam----
a "genius" visitor to the US ---farted forth a 'khutbah jumaat" speech in which he described the New Testament as a "perverse lie"----and Christians as " perverse liars" I am sure Noomi would consider that pig Imam to be disgusting. What horrified me way back then is that no
one objected at all------not a murmur. . When I commented
about it to my hosts-----two muslim doctors----one snapped
----"Everything he said was true"------I almost vomited----no
doubt noomi would vomit too. I have no doubt that she objects to such shit whenever she encounters it

I'm trying to stay on the objective route which primarily is to go by posters on this thread meaning those that can provide information and ask and answer questions. So I will ask you one question. Did your doctor friends or the Imam advocate killing Christians?

Your question is silly. The man was a visiting foreigner----
in the USA-----it was LONG AGO-----he virtually shrieked ---
'they are' "THE ENEMEEES OF ISLAAAAM" -----and explained that they exist to "DESTROY ISLAAAAAM"----in
the ears of a whole bunch of young boys--------not enough
for you?------you need a scimitar demonstration too? ----
the episode took place in the late 1960s BTW the 'mosque' was situated walking distance from the site
at which the World Trade Center would later be built----
still ok with you? Way back then it was not ok with me----
I will not claim that I predicted what would happen. As the
pig spoke------My mind conjured up scenes of pogroms about which I had heard as a child----the screams of victims.

I actually thought------"they'll get over it"

 

[Wildman]

Is there anyone going to provide an explanation as to why Noomi is responsible or connected in any way to what sick terrorist murderers do.

Noomi 10512380

Such sick scum do not represent my religion.

RV 10512495

Does your deity say to kill all non-believers?

RV 10512534

From all I have read of you posts Noomi you are a very nice person. These people may not represent your beliefs or your values but they do indeed represent your religion.

iros 10512601

what difference does it make if Noomi is a nice person or not? She just lied. She knows that people in muslim countries are killed for alleged insults against muhummad or islam or the Koran or even ------against a muslim by a non-muslim. Some people tend to do whatever their religion claims is "right"------no matter where they are. The terrorists in France were doing the ISLAMIC THING--. The Islamic thing will continue to be done until lots and lots of muslim clerics declare "lots of shariah is no
damned good" don't hold your breath

RV 10512649

You are right in what you say. I actually do not know what difference it makes. I would hope it does but I do not think so.

NF 10513380

Every terrorist that murders other human beings because they have become offended is not practicing the same Islam as Naomi apparently does.

Deri 10513380

The average Muslim is no different to the average Christian, Jew or Hindu for that matter. Their religion is a part of who they are but it in no way makes them "militant" or supporters of violence in the name of their religion.

WM 10513676

sooooo !! you are a muslime ??????

WM 10513788

so there it is, and from what i read, Noomi is bound for HELL !!

Jere 10513790

Everything I have read from Noomi tells me she is a very gentle hearted, caring individual with enormous potential to be whatever she wanted to be in life. She is a very intelligent young woman and I wish her the best - which means for her own good - I am hoping she will decide not to continue in Islam. I do not wish to offend Noomi - but I do want her to know the truth because I care about her.

Jere 10513814

It sounds as if you are almost delighted to say such a thing and I fail to find the humor in it, Wildman. I think Noomi was discovering her own spirituality and went down the wrong road but it is nothing that could not be amended within a split second decision! Jesus Christ came to save Noomi not leave her condemned in her sins. If you are not born again, Wildman? Noomi is no more lost than you are! We all have to be born again and receive Christ for the remission of our sins. All of us. Not some of us. Not a few of us. We all must be born again! The LORD loves Noomi. So knock it off.

WM 10513839

if you are intelligent enough, read this in it's entirety: The Quran s Verses of Violence. if you did not read it, you too are going to be sent to HELL!!

Jere 10513886

The only thing that will send someone to hell is rejecting Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior of their life. Refusing to abide in Christ and Keep His Word. That is the only thing that will send a person to hell. There are many Christians in hell because they refused to live for Christ and abide in Him. They decided to turn away from Him and live for themselves preferring the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the boastful pride of life. The road is narrow. Not wide. NARROW.

No one can murder their way into heaven and no one should believe that there is a brothel in heaven with sex as a reward for those who do jihad. The bible is very clear there is no sex in heaven. We will not even be thinking of such things in heaven. We will have a new glorified body.

WM 10513896

no mater what you say, the koran is supreme, as long as Noomi remains a muslime......, Noomi is going to HELL !!

NF 10516396

This discussion loses it's rational value when other posters begin speculating when or if other posters are going to hell or not.

Can we keep the discussion to rational verifiable arguments? There is no way that I know of that us earthbound mortals can venture into Hell to see if failure to read a certain book causes a soul to end up there.

<><><><><><><><><><><><><><><>
NFBW, you are an idiot !! NO !! you are a fucking idiot !! i am NOT speculating.., the koran says so and if any muslime believes the words in their book of HATE, MURDER and CHILD RAPE they WILL go to HELL ! got it now ??


oooooh ! ....................

 

[whutTHEYsay]

Kond 10519978

I make no 'claims' and I have not declared 1.5 (actually, 1.6) billion people as my enemy.

I have stated that the Belief System (Islam) practiced by 1.6 billion people is the spiritual and cultural and political and philosophical Enemy of The West, because it carries with it the seeds of endless hostility and animosity and warfare and violence directed against non-Believers - everyone who does not share their warped vision of The Deity.

And, I have stated that the Militant element of that Belief System is, indeed, a perpetual and mortal Enemy of The West - as evidenced by its growing numbers (ISIS-ISIL-IS) and growing territorial gains and operations and declarations against The West and its reversion to degenerate 6th century political and cultural thinking and practices and behaviors - and as evidenced by the growing military response against it, by The West.

• The religion practiced by 1.6 billion people are the spiritual, cultural, and philosophical enemy of the west.
• The militant element of that religion is the perpetual and mortal enemy of the West.
• You have not declared 1.6 billion Muslims as your enemy.

I couldn't agree with you more on the second bullet. Your first bullet is the one I have a problem with because viewing Islam as you do, smacks of intolerance of the religion of others. Which side was at fault in Europe through the bloody ages when Protestants and Catholics were spiritual, cultural, and philosophical enemies. And as recent as Ireland.

Do you believe that you can tolerate and respect what you consider to be your spiritual and cultural and political and philosophical enemy? And at the same time support our government taking every military action possible as in such places as the parts of Syria and Iraq under DAIISH control?

What do we do with President al Sisi in Egypt since he has taken bold harsh military and policing steps against militant Islam which is our agreed upon enemy, yet he practices a belief that you consider your enemy? I think that latter view is a mistake.​

 

[Kondor3]

...Your first bullet is the one I have a problem with because viewing Islam as you do, smacks of intolerance of the religion of others...

You have a problem with the first bullet because you do not see Islam as a mixture of Religious Belief + Cultural System + Legal System + Political Scheme, rather than purely as a Religious Belief, as is the case with all the other remaining modern mainstream religious belief systems...

You have a problem with the first bullet because you expect others to tolerate-the-intolerant... the intolerance rife within Islam is systemic and fundamental and immutable... and persons of goodwill are under no obligation to tolerate such ancient and institutionalized and systemic intolerance.

 

[Derideo_Te]

...Drowning in denial doesn't alter the facts. Either retract what you posted or it stands as is...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...Merely calling me a liar won't alter the hate that you posted and the call for war against 1.5 billion innocent people...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...But that is your problem, not mine...

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

...I am a realist and know that Muslims are no different to anyone else...

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

...Yes, they have their fanatics but so do Christians, Jews and Hindus...

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

...Fanatics that commit acts of violence are criminals and will be dealt with as such...

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

...Your hate inspired war will never transpire.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed at loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

You're like an old girlfriend - always flapping your jaw - usually wrong - and always needing to have the last word - and, of course, you were the first to resort to personal insult during the course of our exchange - the mark of a weak position and - oftentimes - a lesser mind.

You serve-up no convincing arguments - rather, you merely regurgitate the sort of Politically Correct vomitus that got The West to drop its guard in the first place.

Your kind are dangerous - not for your strength - but for your head-in-the-sand myopia and for your weakness. Fortunately, your idiocy is easily counterpointed, by those possessing sufficient courage to absorb a brickbat or two along the way.

And even more fortunately for The West, those running the show, in most countries in The West, are reaching more servicable conclusions about Islam at-large; including folks such as Cameron and Merkel, who have publicly stated in recent years that multiculturalism (a.k.a. large-scale Muslim immigration and integration in Western Europe) is not working - and they should know - they are on the front lines in all of this, in high profile political and cultural leadership positions.

Confidence is fairly high that you began this journey into Threat Blindness with the very best of intentions and goodwill towards your fellow man.

But your inability to recognize the differences and risks posed to The West (and, indeed, the rest of the non-Islamic world) by Islamic dogma and philosophy, is the sad and nearly inevitable result of pursing that admirable commitment to nearly psychotic lengths, regardless of growing mountains of evidence that your confidence is misplaced in this instance.

That is the mark of the ideologue rather than the pragmatist and realist.

I make no 'claims' and I have not declared 1.5 (actually, 1.6) billion people as my enemy.

I have stated that the Belief System (Islam) practiced by 1.6 billion people is the spiritual and cultural and political and philosophical Enemy of The West, because it carries with it the seeds of endless hostility and animosity and warfare and violence directed against non-Believers - everyone who does not share their warped vision of The Deity.

And, I have stated that the Militant element of that Belief System is, indeed, a perpetual and mortal Enemy of The West - as evidenced by its growing numbers (ISIS-ISIL-IS) and growing territorial gains and operations and declarations against The West and its reversion to degenerate 6th century political and cultural thinking and practices and behaviors - and as evidenced by the growing military response against it, by The West.

Your myopia and your disingenuous misrepresentations of the positions of your adversarial colleagues tell us much about your lack of integrity and your instability and unreliability as a debating partner.

Now, go (try to) sell your All-Is-Well Islam is a Religion of Peace horseshit to those more gullible - your arrow missed its mark, when you tried to aim at me.

--- End ---

I took an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States. That means that I am prepared to die defending the millions of my fellow Americans their freedom to believe what you have egregiously labeled as "the enemy".

They are not the problem, you are the problem because you believe in lies about Islam.

Read post #84 in this thread and prove it wrong.

Predictably the left blame Bush for the disaster in France. Yeap. Page 3 US Message Board - Political Discussion Forum

You can't because you are the one who is wrong here.

There is no threat posed by 1.6 billion Muslims. There is just international terrorism that has always been around and will always be around. Back in the 1970's we had a spate of terrorism with planes and ships being hijacked.

Terrorists are just attention seeking criminals who are prepared to die for their beliefs. Timothy McVeigh was a terrorist and so was Eric Rudolph and the Unabomber. Are you going to declare "America" to be your next "enemy" because it spawned them?

Your hyperbolic vitriol in nonsensical. Your rationalizations are puerile.

Reality is that we are experiencing another violent period in our history. But we don't have to repeat the mistakes of the past. We don't need to wage another crusade because that only hurts the innocents. Instead we have the benefit of superior technology and can target the criminals who are responsible and spare the innocent from becoming "collateral damage".

So yes, I am calling you out for being unAmerican and deservedly so. America means standing up for the rights of others even when you don't agree with them. Those 1.6 billion people have a right to believe as they choose and you have no right whatsoever to declare millions of your fellow Americans as "the enemy".

 

[Derideo_Te]

...Drowning in denial doesn't alter the facts. Either retract what you posted or it stands as is...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...Merely calling me a liar won't alter the hate that you posted and the call for war against 1.5 billion innocent people...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...But that is your problem, not mine...

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

...I am a realist and know that Muslims are no different to anyone else...

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

...Yes, they have their fanatics but so do Christians, Jews and Hindus...

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

...Fanatics that commit acts of violence are criminals and will be dealt with as such...

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

...Your hate inspired war will never transpire.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed at loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

Derideo----you comment makes no sense-------"1.5 billion people cannot be an enemy"-- why not?

Because 1.6 billion people are not waging war on anyone.

 

[Kondor3]

...I took an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States. That means that I am prepared to die defending the millions of my fellow Americans their freedom to believe what you have egregiously labeled as "the enemy"...

I took the same oath, and take it every bit as seriously.

Your inability to distinguish between labeling a Belief System as an Enemy, versus labeling its practitioners as an Enemy, speaks volumes about your intellectual limitations.

...They are not the problem, you are the problem because you believe in lies about Islam...

Thank you for your feedback.

...Read post #84 in this thread and prove it wrong...

Whatever for?

...You can't because you are the one who is wrong here...

Thank you for your feedback.

...There is no threat posed by 1.6 billion Muslims...

Your inability to distinguish between labeling a Belief System as a Threat, versus labeling its practitioners as a Threat, speaks volume about your intellectual limitations.

...There is just international terrorism that has always been around and will always be around. Back in the 1970's we had a spate of terrorism with planes and ships being hijacked...

Another idiotic faux equivalency.

...Terrorists are just attention seeking criminals who are prepared to die for their beliefs. Timothy McVeigh was a terrorist and so was Eric Rudolph and the Unabomber. Are you going to declare "America" to be your next "enemy" because it spawned them?..

Your inability to discern the pattern connected to the Belief System speaks volumes about your intellectual limitations.

...Your hyperbolic vitriol in nonsensical. Your rationalizations are puerile...

Thank you for your feedback.

...Reality is that we are experiencing another violent period in our history. But we don't have to repeat the mistakes of the past. We don't need to wage another crusade because that only hurts the innocents. Instead we have the benefit of superior technology and can target the criminals who are responsible and spare the innocent from becoming "collateral damage"...

Indeed.

Nolo contendere.

...So yes, I am calling you out for being unAmerican and deservedly so...

Please consider yourself cleared to proceed to pound sand up your ass at your discretion and earliest convenience.

...America means standing up for the rights of others even when you don't agree with them...

Indeed.

Right up to the point where we encounter a Belief System whose sacred texts, founding father(s) and present-day interpretations call for death and destruction to be rained down upon the heads of those who do not believe in their vision of the godhead, who suppress half the human race (women), and who represent the very epitome of INtolerance.

...Those 1.6 billion people have a right to believe as they choose...

Indeed.

And I am as tolerant as the next person, right up to the point where their dogma and modern interpretation call for my destruction and that of my culture.

Tolerance is not the same as suicide - nor suicidal stupidity.

... and you have no right whatsoever to declare millions of your fellow Americans as "the enemy".

I have every right to do just that.

It's called Freedom of Speech.

Fortunately for me, I have done no such thing.

I merely label their Belief System as a potential enemy - holding, as it does, the seeds of endless Militancies and Slaughters in the defense-of or in the name of their Belief System, owing to its compulsion to come to the defense of The Faith and its practitioners, and its saturation-level collection of permissions and encouragements to wage war and commit violence against Unbelievers.

I DO, indeed, name their Miltant elements as a real and mortal Enemy.

I also name their Belief System - Islam at large - as a spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy - a largely accurate observation, based upon their own texts, teachings, and interpretations.

The observation stands.

 

[whutTHEYsay]

NFBW, you are an idiot !! NO !! you are a fucking idiot !! i am NOT speculating.., the koran says so and if any muslime believes the words in their book of HATE, MURDER and CHILD RAPE they WILL go to HELL ! got it now ??

I don't believe there is a hell. I don't run around claiming such a place exists or doesn't exist or claim to know who is going to Hell and who isn't,

I can tell by your response that you are not interested in finding the best plausible way to destroy militant Islam without killing or converting the 1.6 billion Muslims who find the militant's belief system abhorrent anot theirs.

 

[irosie91]

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed at loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

Derideo----you comment makes no sense-------"1.5 billion people cannot be an enemy"-- why not?

Because 1.6 billion people are not waging war on anyone.

so far I have never come across any person who
has advocated a general declaration of "WAR" against
islam. Yet so many islamo Nazis claim that there IS
a War AGAINST ISLAM ongoing or, at the very least, lots
of people want one. I do consider (actually know) that
muslims are hostile (IN GENERAL) to various groups of
people, I know it because muslims told me long before
their "methods" hit the shores of the USA. The objects
of general hatred for sunni muslims sometimes---as I learned more than 4 decades ago depended, to some extent on country of origin. Four decades ago Pakistanis hated hindus---- Indian muslims hated hindus. Iranians hated Arabs and Pakistanis. (it took me about two years
to figure out the Shiite/sunni thing) Arabs and Pakistanis
hated jews -----but Iranians--not yet. Arabs also hated
Christians<<<< all with violent implications. Over the past four decades----that which I was told did manifest.. Genocide in Biafra, Genocide in Nigeria, Ongoing
oppression of ethnic arabs and zoroasrians in Iran and
then against jews, terrorist acts against jews in the middle
east over centuries......etc. Today we do see an acceleration of the acts of violence-----it has touched
the shores of the USA <<< so all that is the ISSUE.
Next question is what to do. There is no question that
just in the past 4 decades muslims as a group (the ummah)
HAVE committed and justified as their HOLY CREDO----
violence against lots of people and the culture of other people. WHAT TO DO? We (the other people)
cannot wage a standard "war" against more than a
billion people. -------what to do???? My answer is
BE CREATIVE and examine history. An examination of
history reveals that islam won a huge empire via-----"attack
the women and children ----rape, kill, pillage and get rid of
non muslims thru oppression and intimidation. The answer lies IN ISLAM. I do not advocate retribution in kind----willy nilly. Just a very cautious LIKE RESPONSE.
First define the battle lines. ----to me that battle line at this
time is muslim vs non-muslim. This week ---the muslim side attacked both involved and uninvolved people
because of political cartoons. Muslims do political cartoons that depict various "others" negatively. The response should be balanced. Find the places----determine what "kind" of people do it-----and attack the persons and their kind- in similar manner. The marker
in history for me was the bombing of Buddhist Statuary ---
and NO RESPONSE!!!!! At the very least an historically important Islamic "holy" site should have gone
down for each giant Buddha murdered

 

[irosie91]

.......

Derideo----you comment makes no sense-------"1.5 billion people cannot be an enemy"-- why not?[/QUOTE]

Because 1.6 billion people are not waging war on anyone.[/QUOTE]

so far I have never come across any person who
has advocated a general declaration of "WAR" against
islam. Yet so many islamo Nazis claim that there IS
a War AGAINST ISLAM ongoing or, at the very least, lots
of people want one. I do consider (actually know) that
muslims are hostile (IN GENERAL) to various groups of
people, I know it because muslims told me long before
their "methods" hit the shores of the USA. The objects
of general hatred for sunni muslims sometimes---as I learned more than 4 decades ago depended, to some extent on country of origin. Four decades ago Pakistanis hated hindus---- Indian muslims hated hindus. Iranians hated Arabs and Pakistanis. (it took me about two years
to figure out the Shiite/sunni thing) Arabs and Pakistanis
hated jews -----but Iranians--not yet. Arabs also hated
Christians<<<< all with violent implications. Over the past four decades----that which I was told did manifest.. Genocide in Biafra, Genocide in Nigeria, Ongoing
oppression of ethnic arabs and zoroasrians in Iran and
then against jews, terrorist acts against jews in the middle
east over centuries......etc. Today we do see an acceleration of the acts of violence-----it has touched
the shores of the USA <<< so all that is the ISSUE.
Next question is what to do. There is no question that
just in the past 4 decades muslims as a group (the ummah)
HAVE committed and justified as their HOLY CREDO----
violence against lots of people and the culture of other people. WHAT TO DO? We (the other people)
cannot wage a standard "war" against more than a
billion people. -------what to do???? My answer is
BE CREATIVE and examine history. An examination of
history reveals that islam won a huge empire via-----"attack
the women and children ----rape, kill, pillage and get rid of
non muslims thru oppression and intimidation. The answer lies IN ISLAM. I do not advocate retribution in kind----willy nilly. Just a very cautious LIKE RESPONSE.
First define the battle lines. ----to me that battle line at this
time is muslim vs non-muslim. This week ---the muslim side attacked both involved and uninvolved people
because of political cartoons. Muslims do political cartoons that depict various "others" negatively. The response should be balanced. Find the places----determine what "kind" of people do it-----and attack the persons and their kind- in similar manner. The marker
in history for me was the bombing of Buddhist Statuary ---
and NO RESPONSE!!!!! At the very least an historically important Islamic "holy" site should have gone
down for each giant Buddha murdered

 

[irosie91]

.......

Derideo----you comment makes no sense-------"1.5 billion people cannot be an enemy"-- why not?[/QUOTE]

Because 1.6 billion people are not waging war on anyone.[/QUOTE]

so far I have never come across any person who
has advocated a general declaration of "WAR" against
islam. Yet so many islamo Nazis claim that there IS
a War AGAINST ISLAM ongoing or, at the very least, lots
of people want one. I do consider (actually know) that
muslims are hostile (IN GENERAL) to various groups of
people, I know it because muslims told me long before
their "methods" hit the shores of the USA. The objects
of general hatred for sunni muslims sometimes---as I learned more than 4 decades ago depended, to some extent on country of origin. Four decades ago Pakistanis hated hindus---- Indian muslims hated hindus. Iranians hated Arabs and Pakistanis. (it took me about two years
to figure out the Shiite/sunni thing) Arabs and Pakistanis
hated jews -----but Iranians--not yet. Arabs also hated
Christians<<<< all with violent implications. Over the past four decades----that which I was told did manifest.. Genocide in Biafra, Genocide in Nigeria, Ongoing
oppression of ethnic arabs and zoroasrians in Iran and
then against jews, terrorist acts against jews in the middle
east over centuries......etc. Today we do see an acceleration of the acts of violence-----it has touched
the shores of the USA <<< so all that is the ISSUE.
Next question is what to do. There is no question that
just in the past 4 decades muslims as a group (the ummah)
HAVE committed and justified as their HOLY CREDO----
violence against lots of people and the culture of other people. WHAT TO DO? We (the other people)
cannot wage a standard "war" against more than a
billion people. -------what to do???? My answer is
BE CREATIVE and examine history. An examination of
history reveals that islam won a huge empire via-----"attack
the women and children ----rape, kill, pillage and get rid of
non muslims thru oppression and intimidation. The answer lies IN ISLAM. I do not advocate retribution in kind----willy nilly. Just a very cautious LIKE RESPONSE.
First define the battle lines. ----to me that battle line at this
time is muslim vs non-muslim. This week ---the muslim side attacked both involved and uninvolved people
because of political cartoons. Muslims do political cartoons that depict various "others" negatively. The response should be balanced. Find the places----determine what "kind" of people do it-----and attack the persons and their kind- in similar manner. The marker
in history for me was the bombing of Buddhist Statuary ---
and NO RESPONSE!!!!! At the very least an historically important Islamic "holy" site should have gone
down for each giant Buddha murdered

 

[Derideo_Te]

...I took an oath to uphold the Constitution of the United States. That means that I am prepared to die defending the millions of my fellow Americans their freedom to believe what you have egregiously labeled as "the enemy"...

I took the same oath, and take it every bit as seriously.

Your inability to distinguish between labeling a Belief System as an Enemy, versus labeling its practitioners as an Enemy, speaks volumes about your intellectual limitations.

...They are not the problem, you are the problem because you believe in lies about Islam...

Thank you for your feedback.

...Read post #84 in this thread and prove it wrong...

Whatever for?

...You can't because you are the one who is wrong here...

Thank you for your feedback.

...There is no threat posed by 1.6 billion Muslims...

Your inability to distinguish between labeling a Belief System as a Threat, versus labeling its practitioners as a Threat, speaks volume about your intellectual limitations.

...There is just international terrorism that has always been around and will always be around. Back in the 1970's we had a spate of terrorism with planes and ships being hijacked...

Another idiotic faux equivalency.

...Terrorists are just attention seeking criminals who are prepared to die for their beliefs. Timothy McVeigh was a terrorist and so was Eric Rudolph and the Unabomber. Are you going to declare "America" to be your next "enemy" because it spawned them?..

Your inability to discern the pattern connected to the Belief System speaks volumes about your intellectual limitations.

...Your hyperbolic vitriol in nonsensical. Your rationalizations are puerile...

Thank you for your feedback.

...Reality is that we are experiencing another violent period in our history. But we don't have to repeat the mistakes of the past. We don't need to wage another crusade because that only hurts the innocents. Instead we have the benefit of superior technology and can target the criminals who are responsible and spare the innocent from becoming "collateral damage"...

Indeed.

Nolo contendere.

...So yes, I am calling you out for being unAmerican and deservedly so...

Please consider yourself cleared to proceed to pound sand up your ass at your discretion and earliest convenience.

...America means standing up for the rights of others even when you don't agree with them...

Indeed.

Right up to the point where we encounter a Belief System whose sacred texts, founding father(s) and present-day interpretations call for death and destruction to be rained down upon the heads of those who do not believe in their vision of the godhead, who suppress half the human race (women), and who represent the very epitome of INtolerance.

...Those 1.6 billion people have a right to believe as they choose...

Indeed.

And I am as tolerant as the next person, right up to the point where their dogma and modern interpretation call for my destruction and that of my culture.

Tolerance is not the same as suicide - nor suicidal stupidity.

... and you have no right whatsoever to declare millions of your fellow Americans as "the enemy".

I have every right to do just that.

It's called Freedom of Speech.

Fortunately for me, I have done no such thing.

I merely label their Belief System as a potential enemy - holding, as it does, the seeds of endless Militancies and Slaughters in the defense-of or in the name of their Belief System, owing to its compulsion to come to the defense of The Faith and its practitioners, and its saturated levels of permissions and encouragements to wage war and commit violence against Unbelievers.

I DO, indeed, name their Miltant elements as a real and mortal Enemy.

I also name their Belief System as a spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy - a largely accurate observation, based upon their own texts, teachings, and interpretations.

The observation stands.

I uphold your right to stupidly declare your fellow Americans as your "enemy" just as I uphold your right to make a fool of yourself with your posts here.

The 1st Amendment prohibits the government from "declaring a belief system to be the enemy" since that precludes the "free exercise" of religion.

Obviously you don't understand the oath you claim to have taken because if you did you would not be declaring that your fellow Americans are the "enemy" for doing nothing more than exercising their 1st Amendment rights to their choice of religious beliefs.

That you persist in your blind bigotry and unAmerican intolerance that violates the oath that you allegedly took is most definitely you problem and yes, I will continue to call you out on it whenever I see you doing it.

 

[RandomVariable]

...Drowning in denial doesn't alter the facts. Either retract what you posted or it stands as is...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...Merely calling me a liar won't alter the hate that you posted and the call for war against 1.5 billion innocent people...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...But that is your problem, not mine...

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

...I am a realist and know that Muslims are no different to anyone else...

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

...Yes, they have their fanatics but so do Christians, Jews and Hindus...

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

...Fanatics that commit acts of violence are criminals and will be dealt with as such...

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

...Your hate inspired war will never transpire.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed out loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

Sun Tzu would ABSOLUTELY declare every single Muslim on the planet an enemy.

 

[Derideo_Te]

My answer is
BE CREATIVE and examine history.

I recommend that you read Sun Tzu's the Art of War first.

But let me make some observations that put a lot of this in context. Christians have waged war on other Christians as recently as the 1990's. Those wars were bloody and brutal and killed millions of innocent people. There is ongoing religious strife between Muslims and Hindus just as there is between Jews and Muslims.

As far as I am concerned all religions are at fault here because all of their "holy books" can be interpreted to justify violence in the name of their deity.

But We the People don't need to repeat the mistakes of the past. We have "godlike powers" at our disposal. We can observe our enemies from the "heavens" and strike them dead from the "heavens" too at the push of a button.

Sun Tzu advised against making unnecessary "enemies". The sheer utter stupidity of declaring 1.6 billion people who believe something to be the "enemy" is astounding. Furthermore it is a violation of the 1st Amendment so the government won't be as ignorant and stupid as Kondor.

I think that you and I are on the same page when it comes to analyzing the problem and being creative in finding alternative solutions.

The problem is disaffected individuals who are being mislead into believing that violence is a solution to their situation. When someone has nothing they have nothing to lose. So it makes sense to alter their situation so that they do have something to lose in which case they will reconsider their alternatives.

Yes, there are many ways to make that happen and I have some ideas in that regard but I would like to hear back from you first before taking this any further.

Peace
DT

 

[Derideo_Te]

...Drowning in denial doesn't alter the facts. Either retract what you posted or it stands as is...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...Merely calling me a liar won't alter the hate that you posted and the call for war against 1.5 billion innocent people...

Naming an Enemy (as I did in #845) is a far cry from declaring (or advocating for) War.

Your inability to distinguish between the two is your cross (or crescent?) to bear, not mine.

...But that is your problem, not mine...

Given that I do not HAVE a problem... given that I did NOT declare nor advocate for war in #845 - either explicitly nor implicitly - it looks like the problem is yours, after all.

...I am a realist and know that Muslims are no different to anyone else...

No, you are not a Realist... you have your head in the sand.

...Yes, they have their fanatics but so do Christians, Jews and Hindus...

Care to count-up the number of acts of large-scale worldwide religiously-driven terrorism committed by Muslims in recent decades, versus the numbers committed by Christians, Jews and Hindus?

Wanna lose?

...Fanatics that commit acts of violence are criminals and will be dealt with as such...

Fanatics that control entire Muslim countries and regions and that command Muslim armies and militias actively engaged in large-scale warfare and terrorism operations are, indeed, criminals, as well as being valid military war-targets.

...Your hate inspired war will never transpire.

I wage no war nor call for war against Islam.

But I DO label Islam as our (The West's) spiritual and cultural and philosophical Enemy.

And I DO label Militant Islam as our actual and mortal Enemy - in a very real military sense.

Militant Islam will end-up dominating mainstream Islam.

When that happens, there may, indeed, be war, although it will not be The West (modern, secularized Christendom) that starts it.

The hate oozing up from the philosophical roots of Islam is the breast-milk of Militant Islam.

And, unless mainstream Islam manages to wean its misbegotten offspring off the teat - and undergo serious modernizing and reform, Islam remains a serious threat.

Your foolhardy faux equivalencies and attempts to portray Islam-at-large as non-threatening, as a spiritual and philosophical baseline, no longer signifies like it once did.

Your arguments are being swept aside by modern history and recent events, and relegated to the back burner as well-intentioned but simplistic, naive and gravely flawed.

Miltant Islam is our mortal Enemy.

Mainstream Islam is our spiritual and philosophical Enemy.

The former deserves our best efforts to kill it.

The latter deserves our most serious and sustained watchfulness and skepticism.

Any other portrayal of what I have said - or my intentions - is in error.

Or the result of outright lying, in an attempt to discredit a position or a colleague.

You have been caught lying, in intentionally and falsely attempting to portray my #845 as a declaration of war against Islam.

When one is caught in a lie, it is valid to label that person as a Liar.

Again... your problem, not mine.

You are obviously ignorant of the ongoing violence that Hindus have been waging against Muslims for the last 6 decades. Just as you are ignorant of the other religious violence that is ongoing. What do think is happening in Gaza? How how about in the middle of Africa?

So once again you made a statement based upon nothing but undiluted ignorance just as you have about Islam.

Perhaps the worst aspect of this is that your ignorance is self imposed and willful. You have no interest whatsoever in trying to learn anything at all about the 1.5 billion people you have declared to be your "enemy". Are you even aware that you have just declared a couple of million of your fellow Americans your "enemy"?

So yes, you are identical in attitude to those who committed murder in France because you are intolerant and ignorant.

And yes, you are the problem because you refuse to educate yourself.

Fortunately the majority of Americans are better people than you are and yes, I am including the American Muslim population in that majority.

You have zero understanding of the degree to which I have studied and understand Islam at large.

Your simple-minded falling back upon personal insult, baseless allegations, and outright lying about declarations and intent, and your inability to distinguish between declaring a belief-system an Enemy versus declaring war upon actual people, show you up for the intellectual coward and mental deficient that you have manifested as during the course of this exchange.

Furthermore, I am not 'into' endless automatic gainsay... especially with proven liars and Muslim apologists.

My arguments will have to stand or fall upon their own merits, in the eyes of others, your own whiny protestations notwithstanding.

This sequence is terminated.

Only a fool would claim to have "studied Islam" and still have no clue that you cannot suppress a religion any more than you can suppress an idea. That you have unilaterally declared it "the enemy" demonstrates that you had no idea just how many of your fellow Americans are Muslims. Sun Tzu would have laughed out loud at your stupidity for declaring 1.5 billion people as your "enemy".

Yes, you are running away because you cannot defend your own unAmerican bigotry and intolerance. Like many of your ilk you are incapable of admitting when you are proven wrong.

Sun Tzu would ABSOLUTELY declare every single Muslim on the planet an enemy.

In which case you won't have any problem providing the quotation from him that supports your claim, right?