Zone1 Let's Talk About "Merit"

[martybegan]

That is untrue. It was founded as a way of discriminating against Blacks and Jews and has little to do with “success” of prior generations. It continues to be discriminatory because to be a “legacy” you have to have a parent who was able to get in.

And 20 years from now the people who got in off all colors and creeds can be legacies as well.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Um, okay. Let's look at that. = Let's look at total spending on poverty programs (that mostly benefit white folks).

TANF - 16.5 Billion
SNAP - 113 billion
Section 8 - 30 billion
Pell Grants - 24.6 Billion.
Head Start - 12 Billion

Wow. Sounds like a lot, right?

Well, no, not really. Not compared to the spending we do on Middle Class Entitlements. Which do mostly benefit middle class white folks who frankly should have prepared better, right?

Social Security - 1,200 Billion.
Medicare - $900 Billion
Unemployment - Peaked at 150 Billion in 2020, but runs about 20 billion because unemployment is so crazy low right now.
Veterans Benefits - $272 Billion

None of those are entitlements. They are all earned benefits, or insurance.

 

[JoeB131]

The first grouping is pure handouts.

The second grouping is earned via work.

Nope, they are all handouts. Some of them are just more acceptable than others.

Why should white middle class people, who worked for 40 years and are now entitled to Medicare and Social Security, have to give that up to give MORE money to black people who keep having children they can’t afford?

Because those children will probably be the ones taking care of them in the retirement homes when their own kids dump their asses there and don't look back. Duh.

I mean, I know you are incapable of empathy or decency, but you might want to try a little enlightened self interest. It ain't going to be white people cleaning out your nasty bedpans when you get too old to take care of yourself.

What “different” thing can we try that does NOT involve taking MORE money from the white middle class and handing it over to blacks for doing nothing other than being black?

Except no one is suggesting taking anything from the White Middle Class. We get there by cutting corporate welfare, taxing the rich, and my personal favorite, stop sending money to the Zionists and playing hall monitor in the Middle East.

 

[Lisa558]

Nope, they are all handouts. Some of them are just more acceptable than others.



Because those children will probably be the ones taking care of them in the retirement homes when their own kids dump their asses there and don't look back. Duh.

I mean, I know you are incapable of empathy or decency, but you might want to try a little enlightened self interest. It ain't going to be white people cleaning out your nasty bedpans when you get too old to take care of yourself.



Except no one is suggesting taking anything from the White Middle Class. We get there by cutting corporate welfare, taxing the rich, and my personal favorite, stop sending money to the Zionists and playing hall monitor in the Middle East.

There goes the caring liberal with his swipe at “ZIONISTS.” What about all the money going to Arab countries, and African countries, and everywhere else? NOPE, you just have a problem with the Joooos.

And there’s a big difference between a responsible, middle-class earner contributing to SS for four decades and a loafer who refuses to be responsible and get a job, content to live off welfare.

Try to ramp down on your Jew-hate when you’re telling other people they have no decency.

 

[JoeB131]

You are mistaken. The failure of the programs demonstrate that there is no substitute for a reasonably high IQ. No program exists that can permanently and substantially raise a low or even a moderate IQ.

Um, yeah, about that. Here's a video about the man who had (probably) the world's highest IQ. He died in poverty and young because his high IQ didn't help him cope with the real world of his time.



I've met Ph.D.s who are some of the most awful people I've met. I've known high school dropouts who were among the best.

What did Charles Darwin say that is not true? Darwin was sympathetic toward Negroes but he recognized that most of them were less intelligent than most whites.

Where is there evidence of intrinsic racial equality? Why should we assume that the races, which look so different, are identical in intellectual ability, especially when there is so much evidence that they are not equal in average intelligence?

Because last time I checked, the brain wasn't stored in the skin. All the different skin colors show is how people are adjusted to different climate. In that case, white people are probably least adapted to the world that is coming.

Point of order, 100 years ago the Eugenicists and Social Darwinists made the same arguments about the inferiority of Asians, South Europeans, Eastern Europeans, etc. They used it as rationalization for genocide.

If Jamal really existed and attended my high school he would have taken special education classes for people with IQ's below 75, so we never would have known each other.

Or he would have been the suave athlete who took your girl and left her with a big silly smile on her face... hence, all your bitterness.

 

[JoeB131]

There goes the caring liberal with his swipe at “ZIONISTS.” What about all the money going to Arab countries, and African countries, and everywhere else? NOPE, you just have a problem with the Joooos.

Well, funny thing, the main reason we send so much money to "Arab Countries" is so they won't attack the Zionist Entity. Egypt has been on our dole since they shot Sadat for treason. Same with Jordan. Not to mention our invasion of Iraq, which was only because the Zionist Lobby decided Saddam had to die. (And they couldn't run away from it fast enough when it turned to garbage.)

And there’s a big difference between a responsible, middle-class earner contributing to SS for four decades and a loafer who refuses to be responsible and get a job, content to live off welfare.

Quite the contrary. Many people on assistance HAVE JOBS! Most of the rest are children who are too young to work.

Try to ramp down on your Jew-hate when you’re telling other people they have no decency.

When you have a religion that is less dodgy, I will be happy to do so. It's not just that your behavior is bad, but you honestly think your imaginary friend in the sky approves.

 

[JoeB131]

None of those are entitlements. They are all earned benefits, or insurance.

Nope, they are all entitlements.. just some of them are more acceptable than others...

 

[Hector12]

Um, yeah, about that. Here's a video about the man who had (probably) the world's highest IQ. He died in poverty and young because his high IQ didn't help him cope with the real world of his time.



I've met Ph.D.s who are some of the most awful people I've met. I've known high school dropouts who were among the best.



Because last time I checked, the brain wasn't stored in the skin. All the different skin colors show is how people are adjusted to different climate. In that case, white people are probably least adapted to the world that is coming.

A high IQ does not guarantee success, but it certainly make it likely. Personal appearance and good mental health also helps.

 

[JoeB131]

A high IQ does not guarantee success, but it certainly make it likely. Personal appearance and good mental health also helps.

So do good looks.
Good interpersonal skills (you should probably work on that)
Being a decent person.

 

[Lisa558]

Well, funny thing, the main reason we send so much money to "Arab Countries" is so they won't attack the Zionist Entity. Egypt has been on our dole since they shot Sadat for treason. Same with Jordan. Not to mention our invasion of Iraq, which was only because the Zionist Lobby decided Saddam had to die. (And they couldn't run away from it fast enough when it turned to garbage.)



Quite the contrary. Many people on assistance HAVE JOBS! Most of the rest are children who are too young to work.


When you have a religion that is less dodgy, I will be happy to do so. It's not just that your behavior is bad, but you honestly think your imaginary friend in the sky approves.

What a bigot.

 

[JoeB131]

What a bigot.

Not at all. Being against a religion (and I'm against all of them, really, if you bother to read my posts) is not bigotry. It's a honest evaluation of your theology.

Your religion is based on a God who creates a universe, just for you. That can't help but to lead to bad behavior.

Christianity, for all it's problems, has a Golden Rule, where how you treat others is the most important thing.

 

[Hector12]

Um, yeah, about that. Here's a video about the man who had (probably) the world's highest IQ. He died in poverty and young because his high IQ didn't help him cope with the real world of his time.



I've met Ph.D.s who are some of the most awful people I've met. I've known high school dropouts who were among the best.

Because last time I checked, the brain wasn't stored in the skin. All the different skin colors show is how people are adjusted to different climate. In that case, white people are probably least adapted to the world that is coming.

Point of order, 100 years ago the Eugenicists and Social Darwinists made the same arguments about the inferiority of Asians, South Europeans, Eastern Europeans, etc. They used it as rationalization for genocide.

The only reason the white race might be at a disadvantage compared with blacks is the pathological altruism that causes many whites to support welfare programs for unemployable blacks in their countries, and to support food aid, medical assistance, and peace keeping missions in sub Saharan Africa. If whites stopped helping Negroes and left Negroes to their own devices, while subduing them with an effective criminal justice system, the Negro population would crash.

Madison Grant lived from November 19, 1865 to May 30, 1937. He believed that the white race was superior to all the other races, and he divided the white race into Nordics, Alpines, and Mediterraneans.

I call Nordics "Germanics." They are Germans, Scandinavians, English, and Dutch. Grant thought Nordics were superior to the other whites. You will not be surprised to learn that he was Nordic himself. So am I, but I do not think Nordics are superior to Orientals and Ashkenazi Jews. We clearly have lower IQ averages. We also have higher rates of crime and illegitimacy than Orientals.

I do not believe that Madison Grant endorsed the Nazis, but they certainly endorsed him.

As a race realist, I place the Ashkenazim at the top of the racial hierarchy, Followed by Orientals, and followed by white Gentiles. I do not distinguish between Nordics, Alpines, and Mediterraneans.

 

[Hector12]

Or he would have been the suave athlete who took your girl and left her with a big silly smile on her face... hence, all your bitterness.

Silly insults like that seem to be all you have. You cannot refute my courteous, fact based, and rational arguments.

You are the one who shows bitterness. You even admitted that you hate me. I do not hate you. I view you with condescending irritation.

 

[Hector12]

So do good looks.
Good interpersonal skills (you should probably work on that)
Being a decent person.

Talk to me about interpersonal skills when you mature beyond the level of school yard insults. You think a decent person is one who lies about the Negro race.

I pay you the compliment of assuming that you are lying. I doubt you really believe that the Negro race, on the average, is intrinsically equal to the white race, and that proof of that intrinsic equality will be proven scientifically at some undisclosed time in the future if we keep spending tax money in efforts to close the race gap.

All previous efforts have failed. This is why I doubt that Negroes are better suited for the future than whites, Orientals, and especially Ashkanazi Jews. The advance of computer technology is inexorable. Computer technology increases the relationship between intelligence and income.

The industrial revolution reduced the need for farm laborers, but it created jobs in factories. The computer revolution reduces the need for those who can learn simple, repetitive tasks, and it creates nothing to replace those jobs.

 

[Toro]

A prime example of the length and consistency of a big lie is the distortion of Affirmative Action. Whites have been given what the right complains about blacks getting since the beginning of this country. The discomfort some whites have in recognizing how they benefit from race-based law and policy is evident in any discussion a person of color has with a person who opposes equal rights legislation. Do they not understand how long whites were hired, promoted, admitted into colleges, and even allowed citizenship rights only because of the color of their skin? Do they not question the qualifications of white legacy students?

While Harvard is currently gearing up for a lawsuit around affirmative action and discriminatory admissions policies against Asian Americans, the real vector for race-based discrimination goes on unchallenged: white privilege. While white privilege operates at every level of society, the case against affirmative action cleverly hides how white privilege influences college admissions specifically. This article will answer the question what is white privilege, and will explain how it is pertinent within the discussion of affirmative action and college admissions. To conclude the article, a discussion of how our understanding of white privilege can be rectified in concrete ways to help end racial discrimination in college admissions. The central argument of this article is that white privilege affects admissions in three crucial ways: the importance placed on legacy admissions and connections, affluence-restricted athletics, and wealth.

Before we can analyze how white privilege affects admissions, it is important to examine what white privilege means. Francis E. Kendall, author of Understanding White Privilege, explains white privilege as “having greater access to power and resources than people of color [in the same situation] do”. There are two main aspects of white privilege that have been identified over the last 50 years: 1) legal and systemic advantages, or overt white privilege 2) subconscious, psychological prejudice. As Cory Collins writes in his article “What is White Privilege, Really?”, “white privilege is both unconsciously enjoyed and consciously perpetuated. It is both on the surface and deeply embedded into American life”. This dual thrust of white privilege is critical to understanding how white privilege operates both visibly and behind the scenes. While there are some overt policies that can be directly critiqued as favoring whites, the subtle ways that white privilege operates can be much harder to identify. Within the realm of college admissions, both forms of white privilege operate in equal measure.

The first way that white privilege impacts admissions is through overt admissions preference through legacy admissions. To contextualize, legacy admissions are defined as “the boost that most private colleges and universities give to the children of alumni”. The the list of schools that place weight on legacy status include: Harvard, the University of Pennsylvania, Dartmouth, Cornell, Georgetown, the University of Southern California and the University of Virginia. These students who are eligible for legacy consideration are called “legacies”, and they are “admitted at twice the rate of other applicants at some universities, and average SAT scores for legacies are, in some cases, [are] lower than the average scores of their peers”.

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​

While legacy admissions are not overtly racialized, Richard D. Kahlenberg explains that these advantages overwhelming benefit white students: “legacy preferences disproportionately benefit white students to the detriment of AsianAmerican, African-American, and Hispanic students… only 7.6% of legacy admits in 2002 were underrepresented minorities, compared with 17.8% of all students”. To drive this point home even further, while “Asian Americans composed 15.7% of all Harvard applicant [they only represented] 3.5% of alumni children”. While legacy admissions could benefit any student who has family that attended the university, research shows that legacy admissions disproportionately benefit white students. As a result, they form one arm of white privilege’s impact on admissions. In concurrence with legacy admission, elite private universities also place a large amount of weight on the connections of a student and there family. For example, “at the University of Texas at Austin, an investigation found that recommendations from state legislators and other influential people helped underqualified students gain acceptance to the school”. These preferences thus elevate “predominantly white, affluent applicants”.

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Study finds 43 percent of Harvard's white students are legacy, athletes, related to donors or staff

The number drops dramatically for black, Latino and Asian American students with less than 16 percent each coming from those categories, the study said.

www.nbcnews.com

‘Affirmative Action’ For Wealthy, White Students: Why Colleges’ Legacy Admissions Must End Now​

In 1963, Duke University admitted its first five Black undergraduates.

When I walked onto campus as a freshman 29 years later, most of my Black classmates and I were still the first in our families to attend the prestigious university. We—like many lower-income students across racial and ethnic backgrounds and first-generation college students—could not benefit from the legacy preference that was extended to our white, wealthier peers—a privilege bestowed upon applicants whose parents or grandparents are alum of the school.

While the United States Supreme Court prepares to decide whether race-based affirmative action should persist, legacy admissions—essentially “affirmative action” for wealthy and white students—remain untouched.

It’s time to demand colleges and universities end the unfair, unjust, and unearned privilege of legacy admissions that has excluded students of color and low-income students for decades.

Among the top 30 universities, legacy students have a 45% greater chance of being admitted than non-legacy students and fill between 10% and 25% of all available slots in an incoming class

'Affirmative Action' For Wealthy, White Students: Why Colleges' Legacy Admissions Must End Now

While the U.S. Supreme Court prepares to decide whether race-based affirmative action should persist, legacy admissions—essentially “affirmative action” for wealthy and white students that's excluded students of color and low-income students for decades—remain untouched.

newsone.com

tl;dr

Merit is the most important concept in promoting competency.

We don't need a bunch of fucking losers arguing otherwise.

 

[MizMolly]

1) This is Zone 1. No calling people “racists.”

2) There is nothing racist about judging people as INDIVIDUALS rather than as part of a group.

The irony of his statement

 

[JoeB131]

Grand Kleagle strikes again... Free Jamal!

Silly insults like that seem to be all you have. You cannot refute my courteous, fact based, and rational arguments.

your irrational hatred is not "courteous", it indicates to me a pretty damaged person. So I have to ask what some black guy did to you that got you so upset.

You are the one who shows bitterness. You even admitted that you hate me. I do not hate you. I view you with condescending irritation.

Yes, I hate racists, because you will eventually destroy this great country, one that my family has served for two generations.

Talk to me about interpersonal skills when you mature beyond the level of school yard insults. You think a decent person is one who lies about the Negro race.

Uh, I think a decent person doesn't spend a considerable amount of brainpower hating people who are less fortunate than he is. I respect people who punch up, I despise people who kick down to feel better about themselves. I seriously think you need to do a self-audit and find where all this hate is coming from.

I pay you the compliment of assuming that you are lying. I doubt you really believe that the Negro race, on the average, is intrinsically equal to the white race, and that proof of that intrinsic equality will be proven scientifically at some undisclosed time in the future if we keep spending tax money in efforts to close the race gap.

People like you have been saying stuff like that for 200 years, and you haven't proven it yet.

As I've stated, I've met some awful smart people, and some really nice dumb people. I can honestly say I'm probably smarter than 99% of the people I encounter. I don't use that to lord over them, I use that to help them when I can, whether it's helping people to write their resumes to get a better job, or helping my Chinese girlfriend hone her English skills.

This is what a decent person does.

A decent person doesn't try to find the supposed "superiority" of his group so he can feel better than other groups.

All previous efforts have failed. This is why I doubt that Negroes are better suited for the future than whites, Orientals, and especially Ashkanazi Jews. The advance of computer technology is inexorable. Computer technology increases the relationship between intelligence and income.

Not really, most of the key-punchers I work with are as dumb as stumps. 6000 years of civilization have brought us the TikTok video. I hardly call that an advantage.
If anything, as I've said, computers make us dumber.

The industrial revolution reduced the need for farm laborers, but it created jobs in factories. The computer revolution reduces the need for those who can learn simple, repetitive tasks, and it creates nothing to replace those jobs.

Okay, so what happens when they perfect AI and the computers start programming themselves.

Now, I happen to be a HUGE fan of Star Trek. But when you think about the Star Trek civilization, only the very elite get to be in Star Fleet, and of those who are, only a small portion of them get to go on the exciting adventures. There's no need for manufacturing, or agriculture, because replicators make everything. There may come a day when none of us have to work.

 

[Hector12]

Grand Kleagle strikes again... Free Jamal!


your irrational hatred is not "courteous", it indicates to me a pretty damaged person. So I have to ask what some black guy did to you that got you so upset.


Yes, I hate racists, because you will eventually destroy this great country, one that my family has served for two generations.



Uh, I think a decent person doesn't spend a considerable amount of brainpower hating people who are less fortunate than he is. I respect people who punch up, I despise people who kick down to feel better about themselves. I seriously think you need to do a self-audit and find where all this hate is coming from.



People like you have been saying stuff like that for 200 years, and you haven't proven it yet.

As I've stated, I've met some awful smart people, and some really nice dumb people. I can honestly say I'm probably smarter than 99% of the people I encounter. I don't use that to lord over them, I use that to help them when I can, whether it's helping people to write their resumes to get a better job, or helping my Chinese girlfriend hone her English skills.

This is what a decent person does.

A decent person doesn't try to find the supposed "superiority" of his group so he can feel better than other groups.



Not really, most of the key-punchers I work with are as dumb as stumps. 6000 years of civilization have brought us the TikTok video. I hardly call that an advantage.
If anything, as I've said, computers make us dumber.



Okay, so what happens when they perfect AI and the computers start programming themselves.

Now, I happen to be a HUGE fan of Star Trek. But when you think about the Star Trek civilization, only the very elite get to be in Star Fleet, and of those who are, only a small portion of them get to go on the exciting adventures. There's no need for manufacturing, or agriculture, because replicators make everything. There may come a day when none of us have to work.

When have I ever said anything about Negroes that is not true? Post it. Let's discuss it.

 

[JoeB131]

When have I ever said anything about Negroes that is not true? Post it. Let's discuss it.

That they are genetically inferior.

That their status in the world has to do with that inferiority and not the awful shit white people have done to them over the centuries.

It's not complicated. And, no, I don't want to see more 50 year old articles from debunked racists that should have been fired from their jobs.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Nope, they are all entitlements.. just some of them are more acceptable than others...

Sorry, SS is paid for from the retirees wages and contributions from his/her employer. Unemployment INSURANCE the same. Veterans benefits are earned with sweat, blood, long hours and danger at low pay. They are all EARNED, not given.