Zone1 Let's Debate: Is "Transgender" a Valid Concept based in Reality?

The level of cluster B personality disorder among Transgenders is off the charts. Especially for Narcissistic personality disorder and Histrionic personality disorder, when children seeking attention are met with virtue signaling adults, early questions about their gender are now being met with such love and support that it acts like heroin to a junkie with these kids. That is why it has exploded in recent years.
In a few years thats where the detransitioners come from.
 
No. A transgender person is somebody who is one sex biologically, but BELIEVES they are a member of the opposite sex. Belief and reality are two different concepts.

And of course many of them admit they just claim it for the attention it brings them. Some 'parents' also encourage it for the same reasons; they make their kids mentally ill on purpose because it's a big fad now in some circles of making their kids 'Speshul N Stuff'. They've bought the myth that homos are 'very intelligent, artistic, and gifted' compared to others, which of course is a load of utter rubbish.
 
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And of course many of them admit they just claim it for the attention it brings them. Some 'parents' also encourage it for the same reasons; they make their kids mentally ill on purpose because it's a big fad now in some circles of making their kids 'Speshul N Stuff'. They've bought the myth that homos are 'very intelligent, artistic, and gifted' compared to others, which of course is a load of utter rubbish.
When my younger son was 3, he loved to go in circles with his arms moving back and forth as he said "choochoochoochoo".

I'm sure glad I resisted the temptation to amputate his feet and replace them with iron wheels.
 
When my younger son was 3, he loved to go in circles with his arms moving back and forth as he said "choochoochoochoo".

I'm sure glad I resisted the temptation to amputate his feet and replace them with iron wheels.
When my oldest boy was six, he said he wanted to be a black guy.Because black guys were tougher. I had just watched the movie Soul Man on VHS but I talked myself out of it.
 
Meme I saw on Facebook:

1781814058674.webp


Interesting. Anyone who is defending the idea of males in the women's bathrooms care to comment?
 
Hesitating to play the "I know things you don't" card, but I have to say that I have been teaching mainly in junior high for eighteen years. The adult supervision in PE locker rooms often lax to say the least.

Most PE teachers are also coaches of at least one sport team and that is what they view as their primary job even if they are required to teach five periods of regular PE per day. in my observation, they sit in their offices while the students are changing in the locker room. I can't really blame them for that. If they stood around watching the kids dress and undress, they would get reputations for being creepy.
SO make them do their jobs!!!

This isn't complicated.

Blame that on the left not being able to draw lines and say "guys with a beard and still with a penis shouldn't use ladies facilities"

You guys took on the fetishists and perverts into the tent and wonder why people are pissed off.
No, you guys are just running out of people who it is acceptable to hate on, now that minorities, women, and gays have been taken off the board for you.
 
SO make them do their jobs!!!

This isn't complicated.
How about LET males play on males' teams!!!

That is REALLY not complicated.

That would be a LOT less complicated that convincing coaches who are already being forced to teach PE to non-athletes to sit and watch their students undress with no concern for being accused of being perverts, instead of talking to their head coach in the locker room office about strategies to go to state this year.

If we did convince them, who would we hire for next year when they got fired for being accused perverts or for not engaging the head coach about winning?

No, you guys are just running out of people who it is acceptable to hate on, now that minorities, women, and gays have been taken off the board for you.
Not appropriate for the Clean Debate Zone.
 
How about LET males play on males' teams!!!

That is REALLY not complicated.

That would be a LOT less complicated that convincing coaches who are already being forced to teach PE to non-athletes to sit and watch their students undress with no concern for being accused of being perverts, instead of talking to their head coach in the locker room office about strategies to go to state this year.

If we did convince them, who would we hire for next year when they got fired for being accused perverts or for not engaging the head coach about winning?

The reason PE coaches get accused of being pervs is that a lot of them are pervs.

We had a coach at my HS who liked to show gay porn to his sophomore football team. Nobody said anything about it for years because they all wanted to advance to varsity. (And this was back in the 1970s, when you had to actually set up projectors)

Again, you guys make it sound like there's a whole lot of boys who are going to pretend to be girls so they can get a look in the locker room. The level of ridicule they'd put up with from their fellow boys wouldn't be worth the trouble. The only people who are going to try this are kids who are legitimately transgender.
 
SO make them do their jobs!!!

This isn't complicated.


No, you guys are just running out of people who it is acceptable to hate on, now that minorities, women, and gays have been taken off the board for you.

Saying something is stupid isn't hate.

You have to go argumentum ad absurdum to make your point.
 
The reason PE coaches get accused of being pervs is that a lot of them are pervs.
Have them stare at children undressing and a lot more of them will be accused who are only following orders.
We had a coach at my HS who liked to show gay porn to his sophomore football team. Nobody said anything about it for years because they all wanted to advance to varsity. (And this was back in the 1970s, when you had to actually set up projectors)
Incredible.
Again, you guys make it sound like there's a whole lot of boys who are going to pretend to be girls so they can get a look in the locker room. The level of ridicule they'd put up with from their fellow boys wouldn't be worth the trouble. The only people who are going to try this are kids who are legitimately transgender.
Visit a high school in the present and you will see that attention-seeking is quite common, as is boys dressing very feminine and girls masculine. There is some ridicule, but kids that age ridicule each other all the time for any reason they can think of, so the butches and the femboys are not much more subject to it than anyone else.

We know that the Loudon County rapist did not identify as a female yet he certainly tried this. Very successfully from his perspective and that of his supporters. Two rapes and no prison time.
 
Saying something is stupid isn't hate.

You have to go argumentum ad absurdum to make your point.

Actually, it's not absurd at all.

The only way the Plutocracy gets the white working class to keep voting against its own economic interests is to find people for them to fear or hate.

So ignore that we are cutting your pay or moving your job to a No Rights at Work State, there's some transgender illegal aliens coming to get you!!!
 
Visit a high school in the present and you will see that attention-seeking is quite common, as is boys dressing very feminine and girls masculine. There is some ridicule, but kids that age ridicule each other all the time for any reason they can think of, so the butches and the femboys are not much more subject to it than anyone else.

We know that the Loudon County rapist did not identify as a female yet he certainly tried this. Very successfully from his perspective and that of his supporters. Two rapes and no prison time.

Only 3% of rapists ever end up in jail.

So the Loudon County kid isn't what you portray it as.

The first assault was relationship abuse. They agreed to meet in that bathroom, he didn't surprise her in there.

The second one wasn't a rape, just a fight between students.
 
Actually, it's not absurd at all.

The only way the Plutocracy gets the white working class to keep voting against its own economic interests is to find people for them to fear or hate.

So ignore that we are cutting your pay or moving your job to a No Rights at Work State, there's some transgender illegal aliens coming to get you!!!

There's that plutocracy reference!

More government drones and NGO graft isn't in the middle classes interest.
 
Only 3% of rapists ever end up in jail.
Doesn't change the fact that you claimed that the skirt-wearing rapist was "punished."
So the Loudon County kid isn't what you portray it as.

The first assault was relationship abuse. They agreed to meet in that bathroom, he didn't surprise her in there.

The second one wasn't a rape, just a fight between students.
No, the second was rape also. Unless you consider that a type of fight?

The other victim, who was also 15, spoke of the trauma she has suffered since the attack last October.

Elicia Brand leads a crowd of angry parents and community members in the singing of the Star Spangled Banner after a Loudoun County School Board meeting was halted by the school board because the crowd refused to quiet down, in Ashburn, Virginia, U.S. June 22, 2021.6
The assaults sparked violent protests at school board meetings.REUTERS/Evelyn Hockstein
Stone Bridge High School6
The attacks occurred at two separate Loudoun County schools last year.Wikipedia / @Vahurzpu
She said she had befriended the fiend even though he wore an ankle monitor in their Broad Run High School, where he had been transferred after his first attack five months earlier.

“Why me? Did I look like an easy target?” she asked him. “I feel like all of this has pushed me back into my shell I worked so hard to get out of.”

Before he was sentenced, the boy apologized to the girls and their families, looking at them directly but not saying their names. He said he hadn’t realized how he had hurt them until he heard their statements.

“I will never hurt anyone like this again,” he vowed.


"What?!?!?!?! You were hurt by me raping you? Holy cow! Well, I know now, jebus!"

How does this distinction you are trying to make change the argument? I don't want either rape or violent "relationship abuse" happening because boys are allowed in the girls' restrooms.

Do you?
 
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Such a debate will have to start with definining the word "transgender." That is often the beginning and the rather abrupt end of such debates. So, I will propose a definition for us to have the debate about:

A transgender person or a person with transgenderism is a person who was born biologically one sex and who is in reality a person of the opposite sex.

If you have another definition, I am happy to debate whether that is the best definition and whether "transgender" is real under your definition.

My one rule is that the various medical conditions that fall under the layperson's term "intersex" not be part of the debate.

Is it OK if I say that this topic is above my Security Clearance Level with Messiah Yeshua - Jesus and - or the Being of Light of near death experience fame and I hit you with a relevant quotation from near death experiencer Christian Andreason?


12. What about sexually diverse people?​

If this world was to ever find out just a small amount of what sexually diverse (gay) people are here to do on this planet, there would never be one single wisecrack or hurtful remark made ever again. Instead there would be great respect! People who speak disrespectful things about people of this orientation … enact judgment, and do so from a place of unenlightenment, insecurity, ego and socially induced prejudice. Some may use mistranslated scriptures taught to them, not by the Holy Spirit … but by fear-filled human beings. Many will choose to sustain a divinely unsupported satanic hate-based rage against these children of God, rather than using love to bring understanding and healing between both peoples. Christ said, THE GREATEST COMMANDMENT IS THAT WE ARE TO LOVE ONE ANOTHER! When people sling condemnation, judgment and bitterness at others, they are not practicing the great commandment. They are allowing their souls to fall into darkness.

a. What were you told or shown about this issue?​

When I got to heaven, one of the first things I asked was about the very issue of bisexuality, as it had caused me a great deal of concern my whole life. My lady guide walked me to a room that had a large screen in it. On the screen, I saw two forms of light conjoining with one another in the act of making love. My guide then asked me to tell her which was the male and which was the female? I said, “I dunno!” She smiled at me and said it does not matter. She went on to say that the two lights were what God saw when he looked upon us. She explained that God always sees us as our higher selves and that gender is a very temporary thing that will not be around forever. It was further explained to me that God himself is both a Mother essence and a Father essence to us, therefore; God fully understands our attractions for members of similar genders. It was told to me (or rather I was reminded) that there are no mistakes in the way each of us were made. God knew what each of us would be challenged and blessed with. We each act according to our heart (or developed soul center) and as we mature spiritually, we come up higher each time.

One other thing I was shown was a couple engaging in activities that focused on lust rather than love. My lady guide said that these individuals were in great spiritual duress and bringing upon themselves a life that would present much challenge. I saw that their soul lights began to dim significantly and there was a dark haze all about them. My lady guide then told me a time would come when these individuals would need to learn to come to God with their sexual selves, so that he could help them to use their sexuality in a more loving way. More than likely, emotional or mental illness would emerge and help guide them to a more loving path of expression. As I looked upon the figures, I sadly commented that lust was a major factor that involved many gay people. The lady smiled at me and explained that all fall into lust before we fully embrace the light within ourselves. Later the lady also revealed to me that the two dimly beings in spiritual duress … had been a married heterosexual couple.


There is related material on the Gilgul Cycle of Judaism over here:





There is evidence from the paranormal that our humans spirit or soul may well volunteer to come back to earth all of the racial, ethnic and philosophical spectrum? This cycle can be really hard on our minds, souls and even on our spirit?


"You do not understand this life, he said on a later occasion, so you do not understand what you can achieve. You think that you were born and die and have only the time in between to live. The Sadducees do not even believe in the resurrection. And the Pharisees and Essenes believe you are saved or damned on the basis of what you do here in this life.

So you judge and condemn others and forsake love in order to enter heaven. Yet I tell you that the Father has many heavens and many homes for you. This is not your only life, and these are not the only things you have to learn. You will have lives in other times and places.

Do not judge the gentiles? You may have been a Gentile. Do not judge the prostitute You may have been a prostitute. Do not judge the Roman or Greek? You may have been those.

"The Father wishes you to know the life of the world in all its conditions so that you may be able to love those in all conditions. He wishes you to learn poverty and wealth, weakness and strength, sickness and health so that, in all these, you may seek Him and find Him.

Is He the Father only of the righteous? No, he is Father of all and Mother of all. All may come to God and find the love appropriate to their condition. Are you poor? Learn to love your fellows. Are you rich? Learn to give of your surplus to those who have nothing. Are you in a place of power? Learn to use your power for the good of others. Learn the love appropriate to the condition you are in and all conditions will become blessed.

"So, do not fear what people can do to your body, because you will have many more of those. Rather, avoid those who can kill the soul within you, those who would destroy love and the light of your soul. I tell you, you will have much more to learn then, and at the end of the Age, those who have not learned love will enter the Long Sleep, while those who have learned love, will inherit the New Earth which the Father prepares for them."

"In each life, you are affected by what happened in other lives, but you in turn can affect those lives. The Father has not put you in a prison, that you can change nothing. Rather, you can do anything when your inner eyes are opened and you see the Kingdom within."

"Now, even you who follow me see dimly as through a fog. So do not, in that condition, set up laws for others to follow. Rather, teach others to grow in spirit so that their eyes may be opened to the peace and love of the Father."

The Father wishes good for you, not evil. If then, you bring your fears and errors before the Father in meditation, He will help you to understand and be free. The Father does not condemn: you condemn yourself."

"If you judge, you will be judged. If you condemn, you are already condemned. If you do not love, how will you know love? If you are cruel, cruelty will come to you. What you are within yourself ----- that you will draw to yourself." (Bruce F. MacDonald Ph. D., The Thomas Book, Near Death, A Quest and a New Gospel by the Twin Brother of Jesus.
page 117,118 )



[Helen Wambach Ph. D.] :

Book Review 225
Wambach then explains why she used Chicago as a source for
her data. She wanted to see if the data she received from her previous
work in California matched up in some way with the Chicago data,
to dispel any possibility that the answers her participants gave her on
her questionnaires were inuenced by their geographical and cultural
backgrounds. The rst hypnotic induction she conducted was for the
“birth trip.” She describes how she also slips into trance while inducing
her participants to follow her on the hypnogogic journey. Here is a bit
of an example of the avor of the experience:
I would get a feeling that in a certain corner of the room someone
was experiencing diculty. I couldn’t pinpoint exactly what this was,
as I am not sure when I am experiencing telepathic communication
from others. Like most of us, I require some kind of objective proof
before I can accept telepathy as a fact. But still, I felt that in the right-
hand corner of the room there was someone who was experiencing
some anxiety. I sent a thought to this person that all would go well
with them and they could trust me. (Wambach, 2020, p. 2)
This comment reminded me of Carl Jung’s “transference grid,”
where not only do we convey information through our voice to the ears
of whomever we are communicating with (conscious to conscious) but
also in a variety of other ways, one being “unconscious to unconscious.”
Certainly we can apply this concept to any form of communication with
any sentient being (or possibly non-sentient as well!). In hypnosis it
would seem the “unconscious to unconscious” route would be more
prominent, as well as conscious (hypnotist) to unconscious (subject)
(Jung, 1946/1969, pp. 163–323).
Aer the hypnotic induction, Wambach asks her subjects a number
of questions such as:
Now I want you to go back into your memory and nd a picture of
yourself that was taken between the ages of six and twelve. Look
closely at that picture. Where were you when that picture was taken?
You will remember more and more details of that place where the
picture was taken. (Wambach, 2020, p. 3)
Throughout this series of sessions with her subjects conducted
in one long day, her own personal experience is recorded: dierent

226 Book Review
images that come up for her, some abstract and some relating to the
questions she is asking, and they are interjected into the book. She ends
up asking quite a few questions (dozens) including questions about her
participants’ choice of birth parents, partners, whether they wanted to
be born or not, etc. When she is nished (aer about four hours with
her participants sitting on the oor the entire time), she takes them out
of trance and has them all ll out a detailed questionnaire.
The next chapters detail the answers, her impressions of the
answers, and an overall analysis of the session(s). It is again emphasized
that her goal in conducting these sessions in the Midwest (Chicago) was
to compare the results to her results in California where most of her
previous work was performed. She says in the early part of this chapter
that she did not see much dierence between California and Chicago.
Essentially the rest of the book focuses on analyzing the answers
in her questionnaire, moving from topic to topic, which are (as chapter
headings): “Choosing to Live Again”, “Choosing the Twentieth Century
and Choosing One’s Sex”, “Why Are We Here on Earth? Have We
Known Our Family and Friends in Other Lifetimes?”, “When Does the
Soul Enter the Fetus? Is the Soul of the Infant Aware of the Feelings
of the Mother?”, “Taking the Big Step. Getting Born”, and “Adopted
Children. Premature Births. Caesareans” (Wambach, 2020, p. v). These
are fascinating questions, and the answers from her hundreds of
participants are even more fascinating and intriguing.
Imagine a quantitative research article with many charts, with
columns containing percentages of specic types of responses: sex of
participant, age of participant, whether the participant has been under
past life hypnosis before, etc. And then take all that data, and rather than
keep it in “chart format” verbalize it all in a narrative. It is a qualitative
presentation of a quantitative study. The book is not quite that sterile.
Wambach does include her own personal interjections about her own
life and other experiences she knows about from other participants
that are relevant to a particular participant’s personal response. She
also allows for the subjective, heartfelt, responses to her questions,
presented in the participant’s own words, which a quantitative report
would have little use for.
Wambach also makes much eort to straddle the fence between
a serious quantitative analysis and a more qualitative approach by


Book Review 227
inserting percentages through-
out: “Only 11 percent of the
sample reported being aware of
being inside the fetus any time
between conception and the six-
month gestation period” (p. 92)
and “When all the 750 cases were
analyzed, 89 percent of all the
subjects responding said that they
did not become a part of the fetus
or involved with the fetus until
aer six months of gestation” (p.
78). Although Wambach enjoyed
giving percentages, she also,
seemingly just as oen, referred to
ambiguous phrases such as many
participants or very few subjects
without any numerical indication
as to what those descriptions meant.

 
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Is it OK if I say that this topic is above my Security Clearance Level with Messiah Yeshua - Jesus and - or the Being of Light of near death experience fame and I hit you with a relevant quotation from near death experiencer Christian Andreason?
Sure, that is okay, but I cannot give much credance to the NDE folk. Nearly all of them talk about going to the light, seeing departed loved ones, feeling the joy, etc. A certain percentage of them would be expected to say, "I saw the light, then I realized it was flames. As I was dropped into them, I screamed in agony, hearing the laughter of the demons!"

From the excerpt you posted:

God fully understands our attractions for members of similar genders. It was told to me (or rather I was reminded) that there are no mistakes in the way each of us were made. God knew what each of us would be challenged and blessed with. We each act according to our heart (or developed soul center) and as we mature spiritually, we come up higher each time.

I don't need to hear from an NDE narrative to know that God understands our various sexual idiosynchrasies. I'm sure that He gets why I find softball players, especially in catcher's gear, so alluring. He understands the desires of same-sex, multiple partnered, fetish enthusiasts, and those who await sex robots. How could He not understand? He's God.

But we know from Jesus what God thinks of a person who allows his or her sexual desires and eccentricities to lead him or her to harm a child. We know that from Mathew 18:6, no NDE needed.

My lady guide walked me to a room that had a large screen in it. On the screen, I saw two forms of light conjoining with one another in the act of making love. My guide then asked me to tell her which was the male and which was the female? I said, “I dunno!” She smiled at me and said it does not matter. She went on to say that the two lights were what God saw when he looked upon us. She explained that God always sees us as our higher selves and that gender is a very temporary thing that will not be around forever.

In Heaven, you get shown non-binary light porn on your first day?

Maybe it is true that we can be whatever gender we want in Heaven, or that there is no gender in Heaven. Not sure what that story means to imply about that. But on Earth, there is gender, which is tied firmly to biological sex. That division by biological sex is the plainest mainifestation of God's plan for human relations possible.
 
15th post
How does this distinction you are trying to make change the argument? I don't want either rape or violent "relationship abuse" happening because boys are allowed in the girls' restrooms.

Do you?
NO, but they aren't happening because he was allowed in the girl's restroom. The school didn't have a policy on that.

They were in there because that was their hookup site.
The attacks occurred at two separate Loudoun County schools last year.Wikipedia / @Vahurzpu
She said she had befriended the fiend even though he wore an ankle monitor in their Broad Run High School, where he had been transferred after his first attack five months earlier.

“Why me? Did I look like an easy target?” she asked him. “I feel like all of this has pushed me back into my shell I worked so hard to get out of.”

I think when you use words like "Fiend", you really don't have crediblity. I haven't seen any report that the second girl was sexually assaulted.


Before he was sentenced, the boy apologized to the girls and their families, looking at them directly but not saying their names. He said he hadn’t realized how he had hurt them until he heard their statements.
Wait, you said he wasn't punished.
 
NO, but they aren't happening because he was allowed in the girl's restroom. The school didn't have a policy on that.
Yes, incredibly, they passed their "anyone-can-use-the-girls-bathroom policy after a girl got raped by a boy in a skirt.

Also, makes it strange that they insisted on trying to hide him on another campus to rape another girl, when they could have sent him to DAEP for using the girls' bathrooms fo rhookeups.
They were in there because that was their hookup site.
Probably. But if they hooked up ten thousand times before that, and she said no this time, it was rape. I don't know why you are arguing against that.
I think when you use words like "Fiend", you really don't have crediblity.
A guy that rapes two girls has his feelings hurt by the word "fiend," my sympathy is still with his vicims.
I haven't seen any report that the second girl was sexually assaulted.
Lib-Dem media wasn't too keen on reporting it.

1781921063736.webp


In May 2021, a male student sexually assaulted a girl classmate inside a restroom at Stone Bridge High School. He was transferred to Broad Run High School for the next school year, where he assaulted another girl.

The report says the Loudoun County Sheriff's Office effectively directed the school district to hold off on launching a Title IX investigation after the first attack, even though, the report says, the school district was legally obligated to do so.

It took months for the district to launch a Title IX investigation because the district's Title IX coordinator thought they needed to get information about the attack from the sheriff's office, which the sheriff's office was slow to provide, the report says.

The director of school administration told the Title IX coordinator, “This is an example where we, by law, have to be involved earlier in the process.”

The reports says that when transferring the student, the district never conducted a threat assessment of the attacker and it should have. The report could not conclude, though, that a threat assessment would have prevented the second attack.



The district screwed this one up badly, transgender issues aside. Why you insist on defending them I'm not really sure of.
Wait, you said he wasn't punished.
Nope.

I said:
He never identified as she. The so called punishment he got from the district was to be moved to another school so that he could rape another girl. In that case, it was the cover up that mattered, not transgender policy.

Is legal punishment for the two rapes was supervised probation until his eighteenth birthday, at which time all records were sealed, and he is a completely free man.

Odds of him raping another girl?
BTW, the answer to the last question is very close to 100%.
 
Then let me ask about my definition of "transgender" for the purpose of this thread:

A transgender person or a person with transgenderism is a person who was born biologically one sex and who is in reality a person of the opposite sex.

Do you believe that is real?
Where ever you got that definition from isn’t a very reliable or intelligent source.

“Sex” and “gender” are not the same thing.

Transgenderism isn’t about being “in reality a person of the opposite sex”

It’s about gender, not sex. Look at the word…… it’s right there
 
Yes, incredibly, they passed their "anyone-can-use-the-girls-bathroom policy after a girl got raped by a boy in a skirt.
Because it was a relationship issue and not a gender identity issue.

Probably. But if they hooked up ten thousand times before that, and she said no this time, it was rape. I don't know why you are arguing against that.
Because it isn't what you are portraying it as. they had a relationship. She decided the best place to break up with his was at their hookup site, and not the school lunch room or a public park. What he did was wrong, but it had nothing to do with his gender identity.

A guy that rapes two girls
No evidence he raped the second girl.

From your article.

The reports says that when transferring the student, the district never conducted a threat assessment of the attacker and it should have. The report could not conclude, though, that a threat assessment would have prevented the second attack.

After much discussion over whether the perpetrator was transgender or wore a skirt to get into the restroom where the first teen was attacked, the report found no evidence that the attacker identified as female or gender fluid. It found no evidence that he wore a skirt or kilt that day, and no witnesses reported seeing him in a girl’s bathroom or trying to get into one.




The district screwed this one up badly, transgender issues aside. Why you insist on defending them I'm not really sure of.

I agree, the district screwed this one up. It had nothing to do with transgender issues.
 
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