Left/Right should ALL read this!

[Sherry]

Really? Please link to tea party outrage over 'Too Big To Fail'. That's what started all this: opposition to the TARP bailouts, which Bush/Paulson claimed would save the economy, since we couldn't let these financial institutions go down.

Show me the tea party outrage over 'TBTF', and make it from 2011.

Tea party was protesting that in 2008 and 2009. You know, when the last two administrations were making that bullcrap argument.

Seems odd that now the OWS has a problem with it. Despite their candidate doing it.

ah your retard s showing. Here let me explain it for you. Hopefully you will understand because i dont have a neat little pop up book for you.

See the OWS gave Obama a chance to right the ship, he didnt, so therefore he is part of the problem. Is there now something wrong in giving people a chance? or is it right off the bait they are failures because they didnt it fast enough. The economy isnt a Burger king. Its more like a fine restaurant where it takes time to make your food.

oh course Captain pop-up book here most likely wouldnt understand such things. Thats why you watch beck.

Makes logical sense, and so one would expect to see more of their signs stating such...yet they've been few and far between. Interesting for such a vocal group.

 

[Avatar4321]

holy shit, i didnt think you could get more stupid

We stopped saying that a while ago. You kept proving us wrong.

dont you have some beck program to watch you simple minded nothing

Nope. Besides, I can multi task.

Why? Am I getting to you?

 

[Lakhota]

Another fine article by Matt Taibbi.

 

[SFC Ollie]

I have not only followed this movement on TV and the net but I have actually been to a local Occupy Rally.....

I saw the expected 99%ers and the anti bankers, and anti corps, then thrown in among them was the pro Union anti SB 5 (If you know Ohio you know what that is) And of course the green party had their representatives there, and the Anti-war crowd. And I'm supposed to believe it's not a leftist movement? I don't think I can stretch that far...............

Where was it? i assume Youngstown? Maybe if i have time ill go down and take a peek. Its not that i dont trust your word....no wait i dont...

You do realize its not about being anti-bank and Anti corp right? Its a tad more complex than that simple bumper sticker you have been told to repeat

Gee dumb ass if you look hard enough you might even find the half dozen pictures I posted.........

 

[oreo]

*snip*

There is going to be a fusillade of attempts from many different corners to force these demonstrations into the liberal-conservative blue-red narrative.

This will be an effort to transform OWS from a populist and wholly non-partisan protest against bailouts, theft, insider trading, self-dealing, regulatory capture and the market-perverting effect of the Too-Big-To-Fail banks into something a little more familiar and less threatening, i.e. a captive "liberal" uprising that the right will use to whip up support and the Democrats will try to turn into electoral energy for 2012.


Tactically, what we'll see here will be a) people firmly on the traditional Democratic side claiming to speak for OWS, and b) people on the right-Republican side attempting to portray OWS as a puppet of well-known liberals and other Democratic interests.


On the Democratic side, we've already seen a lot of this behavior, particularly in the last week or so. Glenn Greenwald wrote about this a lot last week, talking about how Obama has already made it clear that he is "on the same side as the Wall Street protesters" and that the Democratic Party, through the DCCC (its House fundraising arm), has jumped into the fray by circulating a petition seeking 100,000 party supporters to affirm that “I stand with the Occupy Wall Street protests.”(I wonder how firmly the DCCC was standing with OWS sentiment back when it was pushing for the bailouts and the repeal of Glass-Steagall Act).


We've similarly heard about MoveOn.org jumping into the demonstrations and attempting, seemingly, to assume leadership roles in the movement.


All of this is the flip side of the coin that has people like Breitbart trying to frame OWS as a socialist uprising and a liberal media conspiracy. The aim here is to redraw the protests along familiar battle lines.


The Rush Limbaughs of the world are very comfortable with a narrative that has Noam Chomsky, MoveOn and Barack Obama on one side, and the Tea Party and Republican leaders on the other. The rest of the traditional media won't mind that narrative either, if it can get enough "facts" to back it up. They know how to do that story and most of our political media is based upon that Crossfire paradigm of left-vs-right commentary shows and NFL Today-style team-vs-team campaign reporting.


What nobody is comfortable with is a movement in which virtually the entire spectrum of middle class and poor Americans is on the same page, railing against incestuous political and financial corruption on Wall Street and in Washington. The reality is that Occupy Wall Street and the millions of middle Americans who make up the Tea Party are natural allies and should be on the same page about most of the key issues, and that's a story our media won't want to or know how to handle.


Take, for instance, the matter of the Too-Big-To-Fail banks, which people like me and Barry Ritholz have focused on as something that could be a key issue for OWS. These gigantic institutions have put millions of ordinary people out of their homes thanks to a massive fraud scheme for which they were not punished, owing to their enormous influence with government and their capture of the regulators.


This is an issue for the traditional "left" because it's a classic instance of overweening corporate power -- but it's an issue for the traditional "right" because these same institutions are also the biggest welfare bums of all time, de facto wards of the state who sucked trillions of dollars of public treasure from the pockets of patriotic taxpayers from coast to coast.


Both traditional constituencies want these companies off the public teat and back swimming on their own in the cruel seas of the free market, where they will inevitably be drowned in their corruption and greed, if they don't reform immediately. This is a major implicit complaint of the OWS protests and it should absolutely strike a nerve with Tea Partiers, many of whom were talking about some of the same things when they burst onto the scene a few years ago.


The banks know this. They know they have no "natural" constituency among voters, which is why they spend such fantastic amounts of energy courting the mainstream press and such huge sums lobbying politicians on both sides of the aisle.


The only way the Goldmans and Citis and Bank of Americas can survive is if they can suck up popular political support indirectly, either by latching onto such vague right-populist concepts as "limited government" and "free-market capitalism" (ironic, because none of them would survive ten minutes without the federal government's bailouts and other protections) or, alternatively, by presenting themselves as society's bulwark against communism, lefty extremism, Noam Chomsky, etc.


All of which is a roundabout way of saying one thing: beware of provocateurs on both sides of the aisle. This movement is going to attract many Breitbarts, of both the left and right variety. They're going to try to identify fake leaders, draw phony battle lines, and then herd everybody back into the same left-right cage matches of old. Whenever that happens, we just have to remember not to fall for the trap. When someone says this or that person speaks for OWS, don't believe it. This thing is bigger than one or two or a few people, and it isn't part of the same old story.

I am a Tea Party member--and over the last 3-1/2 years we have been protesting against bail-outs--& croni-capitalism--and I sure didn't see any support coming from the OWS protester crowd.

As far as you claiming that the OWS protester crowd is being painted with multiple colors--of fringe left wing rhetoric--the only people to blame for that is themselves--because they do NOT have any single issue that they stand firmly against. They have been infiltrated by UNIONS and LEFT WING Socialists--which then makes them completely opposite of what the Tea Party movement stands for. (A smaller federal government.)

And as we have seen--we have the video's to prove it.

1. A radio interview with Lloyd Hart--(master occupier) on his original 13 demand list.
96.9 Boston Talks Audio On-Demand
2. Keith Olbermann--video--reading a statement from the general council.
Keith Olbermann reads first collective statement of Occupy Wall Street - YouTube
3. Occupy DC groups comments
Occupy DC invades Newseum, hates on Ron Paul & Alex Jones - YouTube

All of THEM wanting more Federal Government control- more SPENDING--and not an ounce of common sense that says: Where would this money come from.

And that's where The Tea Party Movement and the OWS protester crowd comes face to face at odds with one another.

 

[Utilitarian]

How about REALLY taking the money out of politics and make all elections publicly funded and only publicly funded?

That would definitely help.

 

[8537]

The common refrain from the OWS airheads is that those greedy corporations and those rich fuckers are sitting on their massive wealth. Implicit in that "complaint" is the notion (which some of the OWS jerkoffs at least have enough sense not to verbalize): "we" should be able to take "it" away from "them" for the common good.

NO, they are sitting on YOUR massive wealth. It was your money, Liability. They took it courtesy of government transfer - and both government and corporations convinced you to carry their water for them.

Nonsense.

I had no massive wealth. I have had some wealth and the government has taken much of it for reasons we never agreed to.

They needed it to give it to financial institutions, defense contractors, energy companies and pharmaceutical firms as well as actual people in need.

To be fair, though, many of the financial institutions actually paid it back already

 

[Synthaholic]

Tea party was protesting that in 2008 and 2009. You know, when the last two administrations were making that bullcrap argument.

Seems odd that now the OWS has a problem with it. Despite their candidate doing it.

ah your retard s showing. Here let me explain it for you. Hopefully you will understand because i dont have a neat little pop up book for you.

See the OWS gave Obama a chance to right the ship, he didnt, so therefore he is part of the problem. Is there now something wrong in giving people a chance? or is it right off the bait they are failures because they didnt it fast enough. The economy isnt a Burger king. Its more like a fine restaurant where it takes time to make your food.

oh course Captain pop-up book here most likely wouldnt understand such things. Thats why you watch beck.

Makes logical sense, and so one would expect to see more of their signs stating such...yet they've been few and far between. Interesting for such a vocal group.

When are you going to show me the tea party outrage over 'TBTF', in 2011?

 

[AVG-JOE]

There is NOTHING with this fake movement (occupiers) I want to associate with.

I don't take kindly to Marxist, Commies and NAZIS.

thanks but NO thanks.

Just 'cause you're invited, doesn't mean you HAVE to go. This is still America, after all.

And it always will be, but what will Americans be like and what type of government will we have? that is the question.

One can only influence that if one is willing to get involved, rubbing elbows with and discussing the issues with people who don't think like them. The trick is to holster your iron, keep the discussion out of the flame zone, and be willing to agree to disagree before voting.

 

[Stephanie]

There is NOTHING with this fake movement (occupiers) I want to associate with.

I don't take kindly to Marxist, Commies and NAZIS.

thanks but NO thanks.

holy shit, i didnt think you could get more stupid

chill pill Jack?

 

[AVG-JOE]

One cannot "hinder" a "conversation" with a group of inarticulate sheep.

The fact remains, however pure their intent and however valid their basic (though ill-defined) complaint may be, the OWS protestors are unable and/or unwilling to articulate a rational proposal for a solution.

And they absolutely wouldn't even TRY to articulate their proposal for a "solution" to the extent that it flows naturally from their major premise. For they know in advance that such a proposed "solution" would be rejected flatly and forever.

Most aren't running for office, they're just letting their representatives know they don't feel accurately represented. Nothing un-American 'bout that!

So? They have every right to march around in a circle carrying homemade signs that say nothing and chanting "Greed like all sucks and shit!"

And?

Nobody is contending that they don't have the right to give voice to their inarticulate emotional bleatings.

What I have maintained is that they lack ANY hint of giving voice to a rational proposed SOLUTION.

I've never argued against that - I'm simply impressed by the sheer numbers crawling the streets crying "Foul!" And it's 'bout fucking time.

 

[WillowTree]

How about REALLY taking the money out of politics and make all elections publicly funded and only publicly funded?

That would definitely help.

No it would not. Because only half of us pay Federal Taxes. Why should we pay to support your dumb ass candidate?

 

[WillowTree]

Yes - after they were taken over by FOX/FreedomWorks.

They pivoted from being angry at TARP and TBTF to hating Obama when he had only been in office 2 months!

Who directed that pivot? Not Ron Paul, whose followers were the real, original tea partiers.

you can try to walk it back but that ain't gonna happen either. never.

Show me some recent tea party outrage over TBTF.

You can't and you know it. So you'll make an excuse why you won't try.

The Tea Party has a caucus in the House now remember? I'm afraid the TBTF debacle is over.. you need to keep up..

 

[AVG-JOE]

Nobody knows what 'they' stand for! There are WAY to many scared and pissed off people for there even to BE some sort of consensus in political demands.

Most are simply standing in the street crying "unfair", with little in the way of specific policy being promoted.

I know there are alot of scared and pissed off people. The problem is these radical elements, the ones who organized the events, and the ones who have since joint, ie as the American Nazis have today, have no problem using these people who scared and pissed off in order to overthrow the Republic.

And once they suceed in that, they will immediately purge the ranks. Which unfortunately means alot of those same people who supported them wont be allowed to live. Which is why it's so vital to expose these people out. They exist and as long as we are ignorant of them or deny their existance, we can be manipulated by them.

Do you really think OWS could be a catalyst for putting America asunder in favor of Nazism, Communism or other similar unpalatable form of governance?

Really?!?

If it is, America is already too weak to survive and should be put out of her misery. I'd like to go on record in disagreement on that point.

 

[AVG-JOE]

Who the heck ever claimed the right is pure as the snow?

Help with the situation? THERE ARE PEOPLE ADVOCATING REVOLUTION AND VIOLENCE. How the heck are we supposed to fix the situation if we can't be honest about what these people stand for?

I know you don't like it. I don't like it. The idea that people want to overthrow our civilization bothers me to no end. But it's the truth. You can either accept it and oppose the people doing it. Or you can lie to yourself and others and pretend they are completely harmless all the way to the point they execute you.

Nobody knows what 'they' stand for! There are WAY to many scared and pissed off people for there even to BE some sort of consensus in political demands.

Most are simply standing in the street crying "unfair", with little in the way of specific policy being promoted.

From that perspective, is it very wise for any politician to be throwing their support towards such a loose band of people??

They're all looking for leadership. Isn't that in the offical job description for 'politician'?

If not a risk of ideology, what risk is there to being in politics, and should the profession be filled with millionairs? Most millionairs risked SOMEthing to get where they are today.

 

[Avatar4321]

How about REALLY taking the money out of politics and make all elections publicly funded and only publicly funded?

That would definitely help.

Because it makes perfect sense to ban people from supporting candidates they choose and forcing them to support every candidate. That sounds fair to the people.

 

[Avatar4321]

Nobody knows what 'they' stand for! There are WAY to many scared and pissed off people for there even to BE some sort of consensus in political demands.

Most are simply standing in the street crying "unfair", with little in the way of specific policy being promoted.

I know there are alot of scared and pissed off people. The problem is these radical elements, the ones who organized the events, and the ones who have since joint, ie as the American Nazis have today, have no problem using these people who scared and pissed off in order to overthrow the Republic.

And once they suceed in that, they will immediately purge the ranks. Which unfortunately means alot of those same people who supported them wont be allowed to live. Which is why it's so vital to expose these people out. They exist and as long as we are ignorant of them or deny their existance, we can be manipulated by them.

Do you really think OWS could be a catalyst for putting America asunder in favor of Nazism, Communism or other similar unpalatable form of governance?

Really?!?

If it is, America is already too weak to survive and should be put out of her misery. I'd like to go on record in disagreement on that point.

I honestly dont know. But I think they do believe that. Which means they are going to be willing to be violent to reach their goals.

 

[Avatar4321]

ah your retard s showing. Here let me explain it for you. Hopefully you will understand because i dont have a neat little pop up book for you.

See the OWS gave Obama a chance to right the ship, he didnt, so therefore he is part of the problem. Is there now something wrong in giving people a chance? or is it right off the bait they are failures because they didnt it fast enough. The economy isnt a Burger king. Its more like a fine restaurant where it takes time to make your food.

oh course Captain pop-up book here most likely wouldnt understand such things. Thats why you watch beck.

Makes logical sense, and so one would expect to see more of their signs stating such...yet they've been few and far between. Interesting for such a vocal group.

When are you going to show me the tea party outrage over 'TBTF', in 2011?

Again, why on earth do we need to provide evidence for outrage in 2011 when the arguments occured in 2008 and 2009? Tea Party has some power now. And you notice that no one is trying to bail others out by claiming they are too big to fail in 2011?

Maybe you should keep up with what's going on in society.

 

[Synthaholic]

you can try to walk it back but that ain't gonna happen either. never.

Show me some recent tea party outrage over TBTF.

You can't and you know it. So you'll make an excuse why you won't try.

The Tea Party has a caucus in the House now remember? I'm afraid the TBTF debacle is over.. you need to keep up..

No it isn't. They put a band-aid on a gaping wound. It is still there, ready to bring down the economy. It's nothing for intelligent, informed people to be laughing about.

 

[Synthaholic]

Since I've given everyone ample time to reply, we can now say that what originally drove the Tea Party movement - giving billions to financial institutions because they were too big to fail - has not been a concern for teabaggers since around March, 2009, 2 months after Obama took office. Which coincides with the first FOXNEWS Tea Party rally.

Thanks for playing.