Zone1 Lawsuit alleges Harvard gives preferential treatment to legacy admissions, who are ‘overwhelmingly’ White

[Lisa558]

Thank you.


There is no guarantee they will be accepted. It will be the same for everyone. It isn’t just test scores and GPA.

Of course there’s no guarantee. They’d have to apply to safety schools too. But if they’ve had their heart set on Harvard since middle school, their chances are much increased now that their race won’t be held against them.

 

[Hector12]

Wow you never cease to add new negative traits traits to your racial bias’s do you …. ?

The negative traits would exist, whether I pointed them out or not.

 

[MizMolly]

You are such an asshole. Where as any racism from me? Where did I EVER say anything about AA and blacks? How the hell can you prove white women benefitted the most? That’s right, you can’t. You consistently call me racist when I have never inferred or suggested anything racist. YOU, on the other hand, are blatantly racist against whites, proof by calling whites who disagree with you racists.

Pretty bad when my truthful post gets a disagree icon but nothing said against the lying black racist I replied to.

 

[Coyote]

Nothing illegal about buying your kids college admissions? Why were celebrities of kids arrested for it?

We might be talking at cross purposes here. Children of donors get preferential treatment in admissions, is that what you meant by buying?

 

[Coyote]

But they’re not the “undesirable” race.*That’s because thanks to the Supreme Court, there is no undesirable OR desirable race. It’s no longer a factor.

Thus, they are now regular individuals who were accepted over BETTER qualified students for an UNCONSTITUTIONAL reason. Why should the better students be punished for having been viewed as the “undesirable” race when it’s illegal to do that?

Legacies are not based on race.

Actually…they originated to disqualify certain groups and races. That is a fact. That they continue to largely exclude racial minorities indicates that is playing a role if the outcome is racist.

*See, that’s the problem. You are interpreting the decision not to PRIORITIZE blacks meaning they are now being treated as “undesirable.” Nope, all it means is that blacks and whites will be viewed equally, with race not a factor at all.

No. My point on undesirable was on your prior insistence that their acceptances be revoked.

 

[MizMolly]

We might be talking at cross purposes here. Children of donors get preferential treatment in admissions, is that what you meant by buying?

I meant rich people paying for their kids to get into elite colleges when they don’t have the qualifications to get in otherwise.

 

[Coyote]

I meant rich people paying for their kids to get into elite colleges when they don’t have the qualifications to get in otherwise.

I agree with you on that.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

Too bad. They can’t use race as a factor in accepting blacks.

Sure they can Lisa. The SCOTUS ruling which eliminated affirmative action in admissions also included this :

​

"the Supreme Court didn't remove race completely from the application process for higher education because the Court added applicants still have the freedom to "discuss how race affected his or her life, be it through discrimination, inspiration, or otherwise."​

"...A benefit to a student who overcame racial discrimination, for example, must be tied to that student's courage and determination. Or a benefit to a student whose heritage or culture motivated him or her to assume a leadership role or attain a particular goal must be tied to that student's unique ability to contribute to the university.​

​

For example, if I were applying to my alma mater, Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University as a high school graduate, I could include information about how my grandfather having been a Tuskegee Airmen during a time when the U.S. military was racially segregated inspired me to want to follow in his footsteps and pursue a career in aviation as a commercial airline pilot. After WWII the airlines still refused to hire Black pilots even those with such outstanding and impressive records as the Tuskegee Airmen, some of whom were denied entrance to an officer's club due to being Black. It was also reported that German POWs were treated better than the army's own Tuskegee Airmen simply because the German prisoners were white. Imagine that, white American racist who identified more with Nazi Germans than their "fellow" American Black pilots, who often protected them during combat.

As it turns out, I was accepted to and graduated from the only university I wanted to attend and had applied to which was Embry-Riddle. I don't remember specifically being asked about my race and since I didn't learn about the Tuskegee Airmen until after I was enrolled as a student there I couldn't have used my grandfather to make my application more desirable back then.

Honestly, how or why I was accepted was never something I gave any thought to until I had the misfortune of encountering a bunch of racists on the internet who have always insisted that the only reason I have achieved anything in my life is due to affirmative action and all at the expense of one or more, more deserving and thus deprived white males.

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

No, not if they’re already enrolled and in the middle of their program.

But for those who got admitted due to their being black, and a white or Asian being rejected due to their being their races, yes. They haven’t started yet, and it’s not fair to punish the better students just because Harvard didn’t want “their kind.”

I'm guessing you haven't seen this yet then: Forbes - Black Students Graduate From Harvard and Princeton at Higher Rates

 

[NewsVine_Mariyam]

No, not if they’re already enrolled and in the middle of their program.

But for those who got admitted due to their being black, and a white or Asian being rejected due to their being their races, yes. They haven’t started yet, and it’s not fair to punish the better students just because Harvard didn’t want “their kind.”

So this latest SCOTUS ruling is retroactive or you just want it to be?

 

[Hector12]

I have a theory. Harvard, in its personality exam, rated Asians low for being too serious. They considered blacks to be more extroverted, a trait they gave extra points for. So perhaps whites are more serious and less extroverted as well, and Asians and whites are studying in their dorm while blacks are out partying and being extroverted.

That personality exam was preposterous. I have always found Orientals to be likable.

 

[AMart]

Asians are 6% of the population and 26% of Harvard's student body. Asians are not being discriminated against.

But if you are so concerned about the one who didn't make the cut, simple enough solution.
Get rid of that white kid who got in on a legacy admission.
Get rid of that white kid who got in because she's on the volleyball team no one watches.
Get rid of that kid who got in because his mom works in the admissions office.
Get rid of that white kid who got in because he got a Veteran's admission.
Get rid of that white kid who got in because his parents donated enough money to buy a new Lecture Hall.

Yes they are and so are whites you lying leftist retard scumbag commie.

 

[Lisa558]

Sure they can Lisa. The SCOTUS ruling which eliminated affirmative action in admissions also included this :

​

"the Supreme Court didn't remove race completely from the application process for higher education because the Court added applicants still have the freedom to "discuss how race affected his or her life, be it through discrimination, inspiration, or otherwise."​

"...A benefit to a student who overcame racial discrimination, for example, must be tied to that student's courage and determination. Or a benefit to a student whose heritage or culture motivated him or her to assume a leadership role or attain a particular goal must be tied to that student's unique ability to contribute to the university.​

​

For example, if I were applying to my alma mater, Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University as a high school graduate, I could include information about how my grandfather having been a Tuskegee Airmen during a time when the U.S. military was racially segregated inspired me to want to follow in his footsteps and pursue a career in aviation as a commercial airline pilot. After WWII the airlines still refused to hire Black pilots even those with such outstanding and impressive records as the Tuskegee Airmen, some of whom were denied entrance to an officer's club due to being Black. It was also reported that German POWs were treated better than the army's own Tuskegee Airmen simply because the German prisoners were white. Imagine that, white American racist who identified more with Nazi Germans than their "fellow" American Black pilots, who often protected them during combat.

As it turns out, I was accepted to and graduated from the only university I wanted to attend and had applied to which was Embry-Riddle. I don't remember specifically being asked about my race and since I didn't learn about the Tuskegee Airmen until after I was enrolled as a student there I couldn't have used my grandfather to make my application more desirable back then.

Honestly, how or why I was accepted was never something I gave any thought to until I had the misfortune of encountering a bunch of racists on the internet who have always insisted that the only reason I have achieved anything in my life is due to affirmative action and all at the expense of one or more, more deserving and thus deprived white males.

We have black racists here insisting *I* only got to where I was - including accepted at my university - is because of Affirmative Action, so I know how you feel there. But I myself never said that you, or every black, got into their university due to AA, only that the majority did - which is a fact: 2 out of 3.

As far as universities now doing a work-around using obstacles, I could write an essay explaining how during the 1940s when my dad was a teen, he lost his grandmother, aunt, uncle, and four cousins to Hitler - knowing that the reason they were murdered was due to their being Jewish - and knew of the anguish in the early weeks (when the letters stopped) and the grief of the later months (when it was obvious they were gone) and heard his mother cry every night - and STILL he buckled down to win a free college education by studying hard. In doing so, he moved from the abject poverty of his childhood to middle-class homeownership in less than 10 years.

I could continue as to how this inspired me though the hard times, including my own experiences with antisemitism (and I would give examoles) knowing that Jews such as my dad did not let the horror of the Holocaust derail them from their dreams, and moved forward knowing that there was such hatred of Jews that they were being slaughtered by the millions - WHILE this was happening.

Now. The problem will come in if Jewish applicants with a 4.0 GPA and a 1540 with this story are rejected over a blacks with a 3.6 and a 1200 SAT with a story such as yours. The SCOTUS also ruled that universities cannot use indirect ways to achieve the same outcome - ultimately factoring in race.

 

[Lisa558]

That personality exam was preposterous. I have always found Orientals to be likable.

That was because the acceptance GPA and SAT of blacks was so far below that of rejected whites and Asians that Harvard devised a subjective exam upon which they could score blacks high and Asians low and artificially close the gap.

Didn’t work, obviously. And can you imagine the outrage if a university “explained” that they rejected excellent black students because blacks were unlikeable?

 

[Lisa558]

So this latest SCOTUS ruling is retroactive or you just want it to be?

Did you read what I said? Let the blacks who got admitted this year due to race go ahead, knowing how they lucked out. Starting with the next academic years, no more favoring blacks. Poor Jewish boys with excellent grades and top scores will no longer be punished for their race and tossed aside.

 

[JoeB131]

I owned a car, but I appreciated the exercise of walking three miles to work and three miles back. Because I was walking through parts of the city occupied by Vietnamese, I knew I was safe.

yeah, I'm calling bullshit.

Read what I said. SAT and ACT scores usually over estimate black academic performance. They usually accurately predict white scores.

Perhaps tests aren't a good way to measure intelligence. The biggest problem is that big education has been spending the last 40 years teaching to the test, it's why our schools are churning out generations of dummies with no critical thinking skills. And that applies to ALL races.

No, not if they’re already enrolled and in the middle of their program.

But for those who got admitted due to their being black, and a white or Asian being rejected due to their being their races, yes. They haven’t started yet, and it’s not fair to punish the better students just because Harvard didn’t want “their kind.”

Then get rid of legacies and Dean's interest, which benefits white kids.

It seems you are only upset about "Unfair" admissions that benefit black people. Kind of like the way you got terribly upset there were too many pictures of black models at the Mall last time you went.

 

[JoeB131]

They said that Asians were too serious, which they used against them, implying that blacks are less serious. Pretty nasty of Harvard to be making wide-spread racial stereotypes like that, wouldn’t you say?

Or they recognized that the Asian Kid who only got a high GPA because his Tiger Mom refused to give him dinner if he came home with an A- wasn't going to do well in an interactive group setting.

To continue, Harvard must have decided that blacks have just the right degree of seriousness! That’s how they justified admitting ones with scores so much lower than Asians.

Or that they overcame more obstacles.

Let's take step back here. You say that "If only black people would avoid getting pregnant in HS (even though teen pregnancy is at an all time low) and got good grades, they could be totally successful like the Jews are!" (Forgetting that the Jews are white and no one really cares what religion you belong to.) And a black kid does exactly that, and you say, "Nope, you didn't get as good a grade as the Asian Kid, even though Asians have twice as many slots as Harvard with only being half that percentage of the population!"

The Asians and whites ALSO applied in good faith. Why don’t you feel it’s unfair to punish THEM, since they were the better students who were rejected due to their race? Pretty damn cold.

I agree. Let's get rid of the ALDC admissions, that favor other less qualified white people, and then we can have more slots.

The reality is of the 22 million people in college, only 23,000 of them will get to go to Harvard. We are arguing over 0.1% of college admissions, because we've given Harvard an outsized role in our national politics.

 

[Unkotare]

Or they recognized that the Asian Kid who only got a high GPA because his Tiger Mom refused to give him dinner if he came home with an A- wasn't going to do well in an interactive group setting.



Or that they overcame more obstacles.

Let's take step back here. You say that "If only black people would avoid getting pregnant in HS (even though teen pregnancy is at an all time low) and got good grades, they could be totally successful like the Jews are!" (Forgetting that the Jews are white and no one really cares what religion you belong to.) And a black kid does exactly that, and you say, "Nope, you didn't get as good a grade as the Asian Kid, even though Asians have twice as many slots as Harvard with only being half that percentage of the population!"


I agree. Let's get rid of the ALDC admissions, that favor other less qualified white people, and then we can have more slots.

The reality is of the 22 million people in college, only 23,000 of them will get to go to Harvard. We are arguing over 0.1% of college admissions, because we've given Harvard an outsized role in our national politics.

What an ignorant, racist POS you are.

 

[Hector12]

Perhaps tests aren't a good way to measure intelligence. The biggest problem is that big education has been spending the last 40 years teaching to the test, it's why our schools are churning out generations of dummies with no critical thinking skills. And that applies to ALL races.

If our schools have been turning out unthinking automatons for forty years, why have Americans made pioneering advances in computer technology? Why are we ahead in space exploration?

Intelligent people do not need to be taught to the test. They can figure things out. Teaching to the test is a way of getting a few more points out of low IQ people.

 

[Coyote]

Sure they can Lisa. The SCOTUS ruling which eliminated affirmative action in admissions also included this :

​

"the Supreme Court didn't remove race completely from the application process for higher education because the Court added applicants still have the freedom to "discuss how race affected his or her life, be it through discrimination, inspiration, or otherwise."​

"...A benefit to a student who overcame racial discrimination, for example, must be tied to that student's courage and determination. Or a benefit to a student whose heritage or culture motivated him or her to assume a leadership role or attain a particular goal must be tied to that student's unique ability to contribute to the university.​

​

For example, if I were applying to my alma mater, Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University as a high school graduate, I could include information about how my grandfather having been a Tuskegee Airmen during a time when the U.S. military was racially segregated inspired me to want to follow in his footsteps and pursue a career in aviation as a commercial airline pilot. After WWII the airlines still refused to hire Black pilots even those with such outstanding and impressive records as the Tuskegee Airmen, some of whom were denied entrance to an officer's club due to being Black. It was also reported that German POWs were treated better than the army's own Tuskegee Airmen simply because the German prisoners were white. Imagine that, white American racist who identified more with Nazi Germans than their "fellow" American Black pilots, who often protected them during combat.

As it turns out, I was accepted to and graduated from the only university I wanted to attend and had applied to which was Embry-Riddle. I don't remember specifically being asked about my race and since I didn't learn about the Tuskegee Airmen until after I was enrolled as a student there I couldn't have used my grandfather to make my application more desirable back then.

Honestly, how or why I was accepted was never something I gave any thought to until I had the misfortune of encountering a bunch of racists on the internet who have always insisted that the only reason I have achieved anything in my life is due to affirmative action and all at the expense of one or more, more deserving and thus deprived white males.

IMO, that is how race, ethnicity etc should be a factor. It is what makes you stand out as a unique individual. It’s more than checking a box for race and why, in a school that gets 6,000 applications a year places importance on the essay portion of the process.

From the institutional point of view, they aren’t just accepting applications but assembling a cohort. And of course, getting a lot of money in the process.