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Latino Veteran: I didn't fight for America just for radical left to destroy it...i'm running for Congress because Biden's policies are destroying USA

Stormlover

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What people need to realize is these "hispanics" hate this country and are coming here to destroy this country. They're the enemies of the united states. Probably the single worst enemy that we face today.
 

Unkotare

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What people need to realize is these "hispanics" hate this country and are coming here to destroy this country. They're the enemies of the united states. Probably the single worst enemy that we face today.
Is that what you have determined while hiding behind your sofa with the shades drawn?
 

Mushroom

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hopefully he wins easily in California

Questionable today.

The problem is that the demographics in that region have been shifting in recent decades. I remember when Orange County most of the way to San Diego was solidly "Red", because of it being still largely rural and military affiliated. Especially Oceanside, which has a high pro-military population because of Camp Pendleton. But that has changed with the "urban sprawl", and now it is damned near a suburb of San Diego.

I find it sad that now the Republicans are having to pander to various groups, only if as a way to avoid being called a "Racist".
 
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ESay

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Questionable today.

The problem is that the demographics in that region have been shifting in recent decades. I remember when Orange County most of the way to San Diego was solidly "Red", because of it being still largely rural and military affiliated. Especially Oceanside, which has a high pro-military population because of Camp Pendleton. But that has changed with the "urban sprawl", and now it is damned near a suburb of San Diego.

I find it sad that now the Republicans are having to pander to various groups, only if as a way to avoid being called a "Racist".
If I remember correctly, you don't affiliate yourself with any major party. And you served the US for years. What is your opinion where the US are heading? What do you support and what do you want to change?
 

Mushroom

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If I remember correctly, you don't affiliate yourself with any major party. And you served the US for years. What is your opinion where the US are heading? What do you support and what do you want to change?

I support compromise most of all. Both sides have good and bad ideals, and they should work together more instead of fighting each other to reach those compromises.

535798081-3884051d2067d7abf191c4c79434277f.jpg


We once had an era where we had "Conservative Democrats" and "Liberal Republicans". But both parties have become more and more radicalized in the past half century, and such no longer seem to exist. They are more interested in pointing fingers at each other and sustaining the almost eternal gridlock we have today, and not in reaching across the isle to help find a compromise.

But of all the states, California is unquestionably the most broken. Largely because it is a state of single party rule, and they now feel freely empowered to do any damned thing they want. Ignore their own Constitution at will, subjugate huge areas of low population to meet the demands of the high population areas. In the last three decades they have increasingly created a "failed state", that is only getting worse. And they do not even see the shrinking population numbers and loss of a congressional seat as a problem.

And to be honest, I am a "conservative" by nature. Not "Politically Conservative", but my inclination tends to lead me that way politically because I do not like or trust radical changes. I believe in a moderated, gradual change over time, so things can be studied and analyzed as they happen. Not fast radical changes, that tend to leave shockwaves through society for decades afterwards. And the demand for "instant gratification" by giving a group anything they demand as akin to giving children all the candy they want just because they beg for it.

Good example, "Racial Equality" was a century long process, and it took far longer than it should have. But as bad as the Reconstruction era was and what followed, imagine if instead in the 1860's the full rights and power of the later Civil Rights acts had happened. I have actually talked this over with many in the past, and we all seem to agree in a radically different country. Likely with a lot of "White Flight" from the South, and less of the exodus of many Blacks in the region (as they would have had more political power). The Whites taking their capitol with them and moving likely to the West, and most of the South becoming a large ghetto (in the technical term and not the modern connotation). This would have led to few Blacks moving West themselves from the early 1900's to the 1940's, and a very different country.

But we did not have that radical change, and one of the benefits to our country and society of not giving an "instant perfect solution" to what many think they wanted was a large migration of Blacks throughout the rest of the country. Families leaving the oppression of the South, and seeking better lives as far away as Washington and California. Enriching all by blending into the country and not remaining largely in a "Black Region" of the country. My own family left Georgia shortly after the turn of the century. Long time abolitionists and believers in equality, shortly after 1910 they moved to North Dakota to get away from that area. And as "Conservative" as they were (the family was founded in North America by a Lutheran Minister from Germany and Lutheran ministers were in almost every generation for a century), they were also participants in the Underground Railroad, and fought against slavery since right after they arrived in Georgia in the late 18th century.

And in case any think the "Civil Rights Act of 1964" was only about the South, you are wrong. Areas in California, Arizona, New York, Alaska, South Dakota, and Michigan were also covered.
 

ESay

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I support compromise most of all. Both sides have good and bad ideals, and they should work together more instead of fighting each other to reach those compromises.

535798081-3884051d2067d7abf191c4c79434277f.jpg


We once had an era where we had "Conservative Democrats" and "Liberal Republicans". But both parties have become more and more radicalized in the past half century, and such no longer seem to exist. They are more interested in pointing fingers at each other and sustaining the almost eternal gridlock we have today, and not in reaching across the isle to help find a compromise.

But of all the states, California is unquestionably the most broken. Largely because it is a state of single party rule, and they now feel freely empowered to do any damned thing they want. Ignore their own Constitution at will, subjugate huge areas of low population to meet the demands of the high population areas. In the last three decades they have increasingly created a "failed state", that is only getting worse. And they do not even see the shrinking population numbers and loss of a congressional seat as a problem.

And to be honest, I am a "conservative" by nature. Not "Politically Conservative", but my inclination tends to lead me that way politically because I do not like or trust radical changes. I believe in a moderated, gradual change over time, so things can be studied and analyzed as they happen. Not fast radical changes, that tend to leave shockwaves through society for decades afterwards. And the demand for "instant gratification" by giving a group anything they demand as akin to giving children all the candy they want just because they beg for it.

Good example, "Racial Equality" was a century long process, and it took far longer than it should have. But as bad as the Reconstruction era was and what followed, imagine if instead in the 1860's the full rights and power of the later Civil Rights acts had happened. I have actually talked this over with many in the past, and we all seem to agree in a radically different country. Likely with a lot of "White Flight" from the South, and less of the exodus of many Blacks in the region (as they would have had more political power). The Whites taking their capitol with them and moving likely to the West, and most of the South becoming a large ghetto (in the technical term and not the modern connotation). This would have led to few Blacks moving West themselves from the early 1900's to the 1940's, and a very different country.

But we did not have that radical change, and one of the benefits to our country and society of not giving an "instant perfect solution" to what many think they wanted was a large migration of Blacks throughout the rest of the country. Families leaving the oppression of the South, and seeking better lives as far away as Washington and California. Enriching all by blending into the country and not remaining largely in a "Black Region" of the country. My own family left Georgia shortly after the turn of the century. Long time abolitionists and believers in equality, shortly after 1910 they moved to North Dakota to get away from that area. And as "Conservative" as they were (the family was founded in North America by a Lutheran Minister from Germany and Lutheran ministers were in almost every generation for a century), they were also participants in the Underground Railroad, and fought against slavery since right after they arrived in Georgia in the late 18th century.

And in case any think the "Civil Rights Act of 1964" was only about the South, you are wrong. Areas in California, Arizona, New York, Alaska, South Dakota, and Michigan were also covered.
And what economic or political developments in the US do you want to slow down?
What I feel seeing the recent developments in the US is that some part of American 'elite' wants to 'californicate' the rest of the US. Broad social policies, public healthcare, government regulations and spending at the cost of higher taxes. In other words, there is a trend to make the US more similar to West European countries in social and economic terms. How this will work out, who knows.
 

Mushroom

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What I feel seeing the recent developments in the US is that some part of American 'elite' wants to 'californicate' the rest of the US. Broad social policies, public healthcare, government regulations and spending at the cost of higher taxes.

Which I oppose.

Now I have no problem with the general concepts of many of those programs. Social Security is one, which was never intended to entirely replace pension plans, but rather to provide everybody with a pension when they retired. I had no problem with the earlier Nixon era plans for government health care, but oppose the way it was finally done with the government not only taking over all aspects of it, but even mandating everybody participate or pay a fine for refusing to do so.

As I said, California is a broken state, which is why I joined the almost 1 million people each year in leaving the state. I originally left in 2003, returned in 2012, and finally left again for good in 2020. It is so bad that even L. Ron Musk is bailing out of the state, as a large number of corporations already have. And for being one of the largest gasoline producer states in the country, they have the highest gas prices due to their insane taxes. The fantasy train to nowhere, and all of the rest are ruining the state.

California was once the second largest car producing state in the country, second only to Michigan. It now ranks next to last, only beating Arizona. And passed by such "industrial powerhouse states" like Mississippi, South Carolina, and Tennessee. And in a few years when Tesla leaves for Texas, California will be out of the car business.

I remember when the state was still a powerhouse in auto production, with assembly plants all over the state. Toyota, Nissan, Suzuki, and many other overseas car companies were based in the state. Now Honda is the last one left, and they are looking at offers for where to move to if they can sell their current headquarters. Even the factory Tesla is leaving was owned by Toyota before them, and GM before Toyota. Soon it will be growing nothing but weeds in the parking lot.

I even remember working for Hughes when it was still a major aerospace company. The Satellite factory I worked at was once a factory for building Nash cars. That was sold in 2000 to Boeing, who moved most production to Washington. I also worked for DirecTV, when it was still owned by Hughes. That was sold to AT&T, which of course is based in Texas. Hughes Electronics was sold to a DELCO, which left the US and reformed in Ireland. Their RADAR and missile systems was sold to Raytheon, based in Massachusetts. The once vast Hughes empire is now long gone, most of the square miles of production facilities of just 2 decades ago now empty and decaying buildings that have been waiting for a purchaser since the 1990's.

If any state wants to see how to screw itself over, they just need to follow the example of California. Rising costs, crime, and unemployment are just some of their problems. Because they have this fantasy they can tax their state into prosperity.
 

ESay

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Which I oppose.

Now I have no problem with the general concepts of many of those programs. Social Security is one, which was never intended to entirely replace pension plans, but rather to provide everybody with a pension when they retired. I had no problem with the earlier Nixon era plans for government health care, but oppose the way it was finally done with the government not only taking over all aspects of it, but even mandating everybody participate or pay a fine for refusing to do so.

As I said, California is a broken state, which is why I joined the almost 1 million people each year in leaving the state. I originally left in 2003, returned in 2012, and finally left again for good in 2020. It is so bad that even L. Ron Musk is bailing out of the state, as a large number of corporations already have. And for being one of the largest gasoline producer states in the country, they have the highest gas prices due to their insane taxes. The fantasy train to nowhere, and all of the rest are ruining the state.

California was once the second largest car producing state in the country, second only to Michigan. It now ranks next to last, only beating Arizona. And passed by such "industrial powerhouse states" like Mississippi, South Carolina, and Tennessee. And in a few years when Tesla leaves for Texas, California will be out of the car business.

I remember when the state was still a powerhouse in auto production, with assembly plants all over the state. Toyota, Nissan, Suzuki, and many other overseas car companies were based in the state. Now Honda is the last one left, and they are looking at offers for where to move to if they can sell their current headquarters. Even the factory Tesla is leaving was owned by Toyota before them, and GM before Toyota. Soon it will be growing nothing but weeds in the parking lot.

I even remember working for Hughes when it was still a major aerospace company. The Satellite factory I worked at was once a factory for building Nash cars. That was sold in 2000 to Boeing, who moved most production to Washington. I also worked for DirecTV, when it was still owned by Hughes. That was sold to AT&T, which of course is based in Texas. Hughes Electronics was sold to a DELCO, which left the US and reformed in Ireland. Their RADAR and missile systems was sold to Raytheon, based in Massachusetts. The once vast Hughes empire is now long gone, most of the square miles of production facilities of just 2 decades ago now empty and decaying buildings that have been waiting for a purchaser since the 1990's.

If any state wants to see how to screw itself over, they just need to follow the example of California. Rising costs, crime, and unemployment are just some of their problems. Because they have this fantasy they can tax their state into prosperity.
From what I read or hear about California, I don't understand where their taxes go. They have huge problems with homelessness, with infrastructure maintenance. I haven't heard about their public healthcare or education showing great results because of mass investments.

Either that is a result of grand mismanagement and corruption or these money have been spent on something else.
 

Mushroom

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From what I read or hear about California, I don't understand where their taxes go. They have huge problems with homelessness, with infrastructure maintenance. I haven't heard about their public healthcare or education showing great results because of mass investments.

Either that is a result of grand mismanagement and corruption or these money have been spent on something else.

All of the above, and thinking that throwing money at a problem will solve it.

For over 2 years, I was working in the field of Loss Prevention in the Bay Area and Sacramento. In case you do not know, that is working undercover to catch shoplifters. And yes, a lot of them were homeless. But do not think they were stealing food to eat. Alcohol was their largest target, they could get food stamps easily enough but you can't get booze with that. I have seen homeless with multiple EBT cards selling them to people in the parking lot and even approaching me to buy them inside the store. Going price if 50 cents on the dollar. Use their card to buy $50 worth of food, give them $25. And because in California residency and even proof of identity is not required, it is common for the homeless to get cards from 3 or 4 different counties.

California has become a mecca for the homeless, I caught them on a daily basis stealing. Shampoo, detergent, and high end cuts of meat were all big, because they could be easily sold to get money for drugs. And easily over half of those I caught were not even from California. That the state will do almost nothing to them even when they break the law is what attracts them. Break into a building and live in it, no problem. Get caught stealing $700 of alcohol? No big deal, it's just a ticket. Smoke a joint in a city park, hey man it's California. Set up your tent in the vacant lot next to somebodies house and crap wherever you want, who's going to tell you no?

I actually enjoyed that job, and I was also quite effective at it. Even changing my appearance regularly to blend in where I was working. If I was in Walnut Creek, I might even dress like one of the local tech workers. In Richmond, San Pablo or Vallejo I would even dress up like one of the homeless. And it was often funny when I would actually talk to them as they were removing the security tags inside the store as I was five feet away from $40 bottles of vodka, then stopping them right outside the door.

If you want to be homeless, California is the place to go. Set up in the Bay area, there are 7 counties you can get to by train or city bus and claim EBT benefits at (San Francisco, Marin, Contra Costa, Alameda, San Mateo, Solano). No ID needed, just say you have none and use the post office as your address (or many of the "Homeless Outreach Programs" will let you use them for mail delivery). Get your food stamp card from several, you got easy income selling the benefits to others in parking lots. Steal all you want, a lot of police departments (Richmond, Vallejo, San Pablo, San Francisco, Oakland) will not even show up even if you are caught.

Hell, as much as I loved that job, the main reason I quit was because it was so damned dangerous. I had been gang jumped, had knives and guns pulled on me, bitten, and attacked many times. Many times with multiple witnesses and on security camera. And the DA never once prosecuted them because they felt sending them to jail for 3-5 years for stealing was excessive. Never mind that it would have been for assault, that does not matter. They even know they can attack security at will, nothing will happen to them.

My wife was more worried when I was doing that than when I was deployed for a year in a combat theater. And a lot of those in that field are former military. We excel at it for the most part, and take no crap off of people. And most of us shortly after we start learn to hate the homeless. But do not think we were all hard asses. One of my "regulars" was a homeless guy I saw almost every time I worked at one store in San Pablo. He would panhandle most days nearby, and come in and buy his food when he had enough money. But once or twice a week we knew he had a bad day begging because he would steal a $1 package of hotdogs and $1 in buns. And I never once stopped him, even telling my partners to let it go. He was stealing minimal food, and he would buy his stuff more often than he stole. We were looking for the serious crooks, stealing $80 in liquor or $200 in steaks. Not the guy taking $2 in actual food.

But ask around anybody that has done Loss Prevention-Asset Protection, and you will see certain trends. Makeup, shampoo (Head & Shoulders), detergent (Tide), razor blades, batteries, frozen shrimp, liquor, baby formula, diapers, and high end meats are all bit target items for the homeless. Because it is easy to sell, they do not actually use it themselves. It is rare to see the homeless stealing five cans of chili and a loaf of bread because they have EBT for that. They steal for liquor, or to sell for their drugs. One guy I caught twice in the same store in Sacramento in the same week even admitted to me he stole $200 in high dollar alcohol, because for that his dealer would give him his daily fix of heroin.
 

TNHarley

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I support compromise most of all. Both sides have good and bad ideals, and they should work together more instead of fighting each other to reach those compromises.

535798081-3884051d2067d7abf191c4c79434277f.jpg


We once had an era where we had "Conservative Democrats" and "Liberal Republicans". But both parties have become more and more radicalized in the past half century, and such no longer seem to exist. They are more interested in pointing fingers at each other and sustaining the almost eternal gridlock we have today, and not in reaching across the isle to help find a compromise.

But of all the states, California is unquestionably the most broken. Largely because it is a state of single party rule, and they now feel freely empowered to do any damned thing they want. Ignore their own Constitution at will, subjugate huge areas of low population to meet the demands of the high population areas. In the last three decades they have increasingly created a "failed state", that is only getting worse. And they do not even see the shrinking population numbers and loss of a congressional seat as a problem.

And to be honest, I am a "conservative" by nature. Not "Politically Conservative", but my inclination tends to lead me that way politically because I do not like or trust radical changes. I believe in a moderated, gradual change over time, so things can be studied and analyzed as they happen. Not fast radical changes, that tend to leave shockwaves through society for decades afterwards. And the demand for "instant gratification" by giving a group anything they demand as akin to giving children all the candy they want just because they beg for it.

Good example, "Racial Equality" was a century long process, and it took far longer than it should have. But as bad as the Reconstruction era was and what followed, imagine if instead in the 1860's the full rights and power of the later Civil Rights acts had happened. I have actually talked this over with many in the past, and we all seem to agree in a radically different country. Likely with a lot of "White Flight" from the South, and less of the exodus of many Blacks in the region (as they would have had more political power). The Whites taking their capitol with them and moving likely to the West, and most of the South becoming a large ghetto (in the technical term and not the modern connotation). This would have led to few Blacks moving West themselves from the early 1900's to the 1940's, and a very different country.

But we did not have that radical change, and one of the benefits to our country and society of not giving an "instant perfect solution" to what many think they wanted was a large migration of Blacks throughout the rest of the country. Families leaving the oppression of the South, and seeking better lives as far away as Washington and California. Enriching all by blending into the country and not remaining largely in a "Black Region" of the country. My own family left Georgia shortly after the turn of the century. Long time abolitionists and believers in equality, shortly after 1910 they moved to North Dakota to get away from that area. And as "Conservative" as they were (the family was founded in North America by a Lutheran Minister from Germany and Lutheran ministers were in almost every generation for a century), they were also participants in the Underground Railroad, and fought against slavery since right after they arrived in Georgia in the late 18th century.

And in case any think the "Civil Rights Act of 1964" was only about the South, you are wrong. Areas in California, Arizona, New York, Alaska, South Dakota, and Michigan were also covered.
The more gridlock in corruption, USA, the better off we are.
 

Mushroom

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The more gridlock in corruption, USA, the better off we are.

Uh-huh. And what exactly has been accomplished through that?

Case in point, however low the approval ratings were for the last President were, his were stellar when compared to Congress. We have had decades of gridlock there now, and their approval rating is right around 25%.

Yes, just twenty-five percent approval. Even at his lowest, President Trump was in the 30-40% range. You have to go back almost 20 years to find Congressional approval numbers in that range for more than a single week.
 

TNHarley

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Uh-huh. And what exactly has been accomplished through that?

Case in point, however low the approval ratings were for the last President were, his were stellar when compared to Congress. We have had decades of gridlock there now, and their approval rating is right around 25%.

Yes, just twenty-five percent approval. Even at his lowest, President Trump was in the 30-40% range. You have to go back almost 20 years to find Congressional approval numbers in that range for more than a single week.
95% of the time, when congress "accomplishes" something, it means we lose liberty.
Federal supremacists might appreciate that, but not me.
25%? that means it went up. Last time I looked, it was around 12. That was a few years ago.
 

HenryBHough

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I keep seeing the term: "conservative democrats".

To the users of that tame I invite your attention, brief as that may be, to a different term:
Oxymoron.
 

ESay

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All of the above, and thinking that throwing money at a problem will solve it.

For over 2 years, I was working in the field of Loss Prevention in the Bay Area and Sacramento. In case you do not know, that is working undercover to catch shoplifters. And yes, a lot of them were homeless. But do not think they were stealing food to eat. Alcohol was their largest target, they could get food stamps easily enough but you can't get booze with that. I have seen homeless with multiple EBT cards selling them to people in the parking lot and even approaching me to buy them inside the store. Going price if 50 cents on the dollar. Use their card to buy $50 worth of food, give them $25. And because in California residency and even proof of identity is not required, it is common for the homeless to get cards from 3 or 4 different counties.

California has become a mecca for the homeless, I caught them on a daily basis stealing. Shampoo, detergent, and high end cuts of meat were all big, because they could be easily sold to get money for drugs. And easily over half of those I caught were not even from California. That the state will do almost nothing to them even when they break the law is what attracts them. Break into a building and live in it, no problem. Get caught stealing $700 of alcohol? No big deal, it's just a ticket. Smoke a joint in a city park, hey man it's California. Set up your tent in the vacant lot next to somebodies house and crap wherever you want, who's going to tell you no?

I actually enjoyed that job, and I was also quite effective at it. Even changing my appearance regularly to blend in where I was working. If I was in Walnut Creek, I might even dress like one of the local tech workers. In Richmond, San Pablo or Vallejo I would even dress up like one of the homeless. And it was often funny when I would actually talk to them as they were removing the security tags inside the store as I was five feet away from $40 bottles of vodka, then stopping them right outside the door.

If you want to be homeless, California is the place to go. Set up in the Bay area, there are 7 counties you can get to by train or city bus and claim EBT benefits at (San Francisco, Marin, Contra Costa, Alameda, San Mateo, Solano). No ID needed, just say you have none and use the post office as your address (or many of the "Homeless Outreach Programs" will let you use them for mail delivery). Get your food stamp card from several, you got easy income selling the benefits to others in parking lots. Steal all you want, a lot of police departments (Richmond, Vallejo, San Pablo, San Francisco, Oakland) will not even show up even if you are caught.

Hell, as much as I loved that job, the main reason I quit was because it was so damned dangerous. I had been gang jumped, had knives and guns pulled on me, bitten, and attacked many times. Many times with multiple witnesses and on security camera. And the DA never once prosecuted them because they felt sending them to jail for 3-5 years for stealing was excessive. Never mind that it would have been for assault, that does not matter. They even know they can attack security at will, nothing will happen to them.

My wife was more worried when I was doing that than when I was deployed for a year in a combat theater. And a lot of those in that field are former military. We excel at it for the most part, and take no crap off of people. And most of us shortly after we start learn to hate the homeless. But do not think we were all hard asses. One of my "regulars" was a homeless guy I saw almost every time I worked at one store in San Pablo. He would panhandle most days nearby, and come in and buy his food when he had enough money. But once or twice a week we knew he had a bad day begging because he would steal a $1 package of hotdogs and $1 in buns. And I never once stopped him, even telling my partners to let it go. He was stealing minimal food, and he would buy his stuff more often than he stole. We were looking for the serious crooks, stealing $80 in liquor or $200 in steaks. Not the guy taking $2 in actual food.

But ask around anybody that has done Loss Prevention-Asset Protection, and you will see certain trends. Makeup, shampoo (Head & Shoulders), detergent (Tide), razor blades, batteries, frozen shrimp, liquor, baby formula, diapers, and high end meats are all bit target items for the homeless. Because it is easy to sell, they do not actually use it themselves. It is rare to see the homeless stealing five cans of chili and a loaf of bread because they have EBT for that. They steal for liquor, or to sell for their drugs. One guy I caught twice in the same store in Sacramento in the same week even admitted to me he stole $200 in high dollar alcohol, because for that his dealer would give him his daily fix of heroin.
Well, the problem with homelessness is fundamental and can't be resolved with a couple of moves. You can't just scrap their foodstamps because it will lead to surge in more serious crimes from their part.

Put them behind the bars for shoplifting and minor crimes? The prison system of the US is already overcrowded even without them.

Yes, the system of foodstamps should be reorganized to make it impossible to exploit it for own benefit.

But at the same time, drug consumption should be recognized as medical problem. And there should be centers where these guys get treatment and, yes, their dose at the state cost. You participate in this program and you get your foodstamps, you refuse to do so and do some bad things - you go in closed specialized entities with mandatory treatment.

And yes, there should be certain designated areas where they will be allowed to live. Putting their tents on the streets or near someone's homes is not only about a bad scenery. It is also anti-sanitary issue which endanger people living nearby.
 

Mushroom

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Well, the problem with homelessness is fundamental and can't be resolved with a couple of moves. You can't just scrap their foodstamps because it will lead to surge in more serious crimes from their part.

Put them behind the bars for shoplifting and minor crimes? The prison system of the US is already overcrowded even without them.

Yes, the system of foodstamps should be reorganized to make it impossible to exploit it for own benefit.

But at the same time, drug consumption should be recognized as medical problem. And there should be centers where these guys get treatment and, yes, their dose at the state cost. You participate in this program and you get your foodstamps, you refuse to do so and do some bad things - you go in closed specialized entities with mandatory treatment.

And yes, there should be certain designated areas where they will be allowed to live. Putting their tents on the streets or near someone's homes is not only about a bad scenery. It is also anti-sanitary issue which endanger people living nearby.

And California has had much of that for decades. Safe places to go and use your drugs, free needles, food stamps for all, and multiple treatment centers.

And I guess you agree, that we just ignore crime because the prisons are already full. I actually have no problem with building more of them. Heck, why even bother having laws in the first place? Just do whatever in the hell you want, no problem.

California. Let's just make the entire country over in their image.
 

ESay

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And California has had much of that for decades. Safe places to go and use your drugs, free needles, food stamps for all, and multiple treatment centers.

And I guess you agree, that we just ignore crime because the prisons are already full. I actually have no problem with building more of them. Heck, why even bother having laws in the first place? Just do whatever in the hell you want, no problem.

California. Let's just make the entire country over in their image.
Well, thanks for your answers. I really enjoyed reading them. To tell the truth they surprised me a bit. Because I considered you to have more 'liberal' views.
 

Mushroom

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Because I considered you to have more 'liberal' views.

There is a quote that often goes something like "A Republican is a Liberal who has been smacked in the face by reality".

I actually am fairly liberal, but have also seen the results of "excessive liberalism" when taken to an extreme. In California, that started to change once the Democrats basically achieved a "supermajority", and has gotten worse ever since. Hence, my huge mistrust of either party having such a monopoly on power in a state. And that "Liberalism" really does not extent once somebody breaks the law. If they have a drug problem, find. Order them to treatment. Failure to complete it, go back to jail.

Get in trouble again, no more treatment, you had your chance and you go to jail. Break the law, you go to jail. That is all a personal decision that the individual made, and it violates the rights and prosperity of others. And I have little to no pity on people like that.

And as an FYI, I have been homeless myself. Off and on for several years in fact. But the difference is, it was for economic reasons (California economics - unemployment there will not even cover rent) and rarely for more than 6 months or so at a stretch. I continued to look for work even then, and always pulled myself back out again. Meanwhile, even 2 decades ago I got to know people who years later were still living like that. Normally drug and/or alcohol dependent, and that was simply their life. Move from shelter to shelter, and stealing or begging for enough for their next bottle or fix.

The real slap of awareness there was my winter in a "Seasonal Shelter". Only open from October to May, it was a former warehouse and housed around 500 people. It was first come first served, but the exception is if you had a job. Then you had a guaranteed bed, and no curfew (If you were not there by 6 you likely would not get a bed for the night). They had 20 cots set aside just for those of us with jobs, and less than half of them were used. And it was not even like you needed a "real job", just doing 1 day a week at a day labor place was good enough. But less than 10 out of over 500 people, shows how many even wanted to go back to work and stop being homeless.

Go to downtown Long Beach, and visit Lincoln Park. That was where most of them hung out during the day, or a bit farther North at the mission. Once again, 3 month stay but longer term if you had a job. But there was a circuit just for that also, 3 months at the Long Beach Mission, then they would move to the Bell or Riverside mission. Rinse and repeat, 3 months at a time then on to the next.

Being on the street myself made me particularly jaded, as I was only homeless because of the damned early 2000's recession. But meeting people who had lived that way for years, and had no problem with that made me realize that for many that was actually a decision they made themselves. Then starting a decade ago and meeting more doing security. Then even a few years ago as a store manager, having to deal with them on a daily basis. I got to know quite a few, and they got to know me. I never banned them from the store, other than for stealing or bad behavior.

I do feel bad for the short timers like me that were like that because of economics, but that is the vast minority. Most have serious substance abuse issues, as well as mental health issues often made worse by the substance abuse. To me, one of the worst decisions was allowing those not a danger to others to leave the mental institutions back in the 1970's. That was really the start, and if we could return to institutionalizing many of them they could get the help they really need and they would not have to live on the street anymore. I have even seen that first hand, as for over a year I lived in a Veteran Facility.

Only open to Veterans, they had a few strict rules though. Among them, being 30 days clean and sober before checking in, and you were subject to random drug and alcohol checks. The turnover rate in the first 90 days was around 60%, many could not or would not stay clean, so out they went to make room for others that would take sobriety seriously. But once past the 90 day mark, the success rate climbed to over 70%.

And this shelter is well known among the LA Homeless Vet community. Any vet can eat meals there for free, if they are a resident or not. And I was on of their outreach members, and would spend weekends visiting my old haunts trying to get other vets off of the street. But in over a year and a half, none ever did. They all knew of it, and that they could not use drugs or drink while there so chose to remain homeless. And during that time I became even more jaded towards "Homeless Vets", as I realized that most of them were frauds. Not vets at all, talking to most for just a few minutes that is obvious. I laugh at the number I met who claimed to have been Infantry in the Army, but had no idea what an "11 Bravo" was. Saying they were in say the "1st Infantry Division", but could not tell me what Regiment or Battalion. One even laughingly told me all about his training with the 101st Division, and when he was talking about the "Combat Course" with meat hanging from barbed wire with real machine guns firing over their heads I knew exactly where he got that from.

All who have gone through that training know it is called the "Infiltration Course", and the real machine guns and meat were from "Band of Brothers". Even 40 years ago they used "compressed air machine guns" that only simulated the sound, not real ones. And no meat hanging from the wire either. And when he proudly said "Curahee" to me, I asked him if he was in the 502nd Regiment and he agreed that he was. Yeah, too bad "Curahee" was the motto of the 506th PIR.

But people still believe the frauds, who just claim to have been a veteran, and will give them handouts because they do not know the difference. But one organization I still support is US Vets. Who only has a single mission, and that is helping real homeless vets. They were only a single facility when they helped me, and they are now nationwide.

 

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