Kamala Harris Denies Govt-Run Single Payer is 'Socialism'

[dblack]

Our fist mistake with heath insurance was accepting it in lieu of pay as a "gift" from our employers. This made us depend on our employers for health care, and trapped people with chronic illnesses as virtual slaves. Single payer moves the responsibility, and the power, of controlling our health insurance from employers to the government. Some see this as an improvement, even after 2016.

 

[McRocket]

LOL - I hear you already. Like I said. Call it whatever you want. I oppose it for what it is, not the label attached to it.

So you want a health insurance company's CEO to be in charge of your healthcare.

I'm always baffled that you think this is an argument.

"So you want a politician, and their political lobbying groups, to be in charge of your healthcare?"

The difference between my statement, and your statement, is that mine is actually accurate, while yours is mythology.

I have been to a doctor when I didn't have insurance. I've been to a hospital without insurance.

Both times, I got something called a "bill". I then paid the "bill".

What insurance CEO has control over my health care?

That isn't a valid complaint. People who have insurance, choose to have insurance, because they value the service provided by the insurance company. You don't have to have insurance. You can choose to not have insurance, and just pay the bill yourself.

And quite frankly, if you think government politicians are going to take care of you... you are crazy.

AOC has been caught funneling money to her lover, through corrupt transactions. You think she is going to take care of you?

Reminds me of the MP up in Canada, getting cancer, and flying to the US for care, on tax payer dollars. She's taking care of herself... not the public. While people are dying on 3 year long waiting lists in Canada, she's using their tax dollars to fly to the US to get good care.

Or Castro in Cuba, not using the garbage Cuban health care system, but hiring a private doctor, and flying him and his medical equipment, to personally service Castro alone... while the average Cuban can't even get Aspirin.

You people seem completely detached from reality. You live in this mythical fairy land, where elitist in Washington, who have never worked a full days wage in their life... are going to take care of you?

Please.... if I have to choose, I'll take a CEO who has provided a service to millions of people, over a 1970s socialist mummy who was kicked out of his own commune, because he was too lazy.

Absolutely, I'll take the CEO. You can have your VA Hospital waiting list, and pray the politicians fix your life. We'll see who ends up better off.

Why the Mayo Clinic is refusing to see Medicare patients

I'll go to the Mayo clinic, and get top quality care. You can go to your medicare approved doctor, and we'll see who is better off.

One of my co-workers needed hand surgery, didn't want to pay for it, went through the government, and that doctor screwed up her hand so badly, she never came back to work.

My father who is a career painter and water color artist, had the same surgery though a private doctor, and it was expensive, and now he can paint again.

Yeah, let's see who ends up better off.

VA: Secret waiting list delayed care for 87 veterans in 2017


Good luck with that.

The VA hospitals were government run. Under single payer hospitals are private run.

Got any other stupid excuse?

Medicare is more efficient that insurance companies.

No they are not. You have NO IDEA what you are talking about.

Canada has virtually no private hospitals.

Ontario - by far the most populated province - has over 13 million people and 492 hospitals. Only two are private...and they are very small at that and are public/private.

Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic
Centric Health: One of Ontario's Two Public Private Hospitals | Beaches|Life magazine

No you are not correct.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

A link to a group of search engine results? What lazy ass nonsense.

Post a link that shows the ACTUAL names of hospitals...not clinics or cosmetic surgery 'hospitals' or physio 'hospitals'. But full blown hospitals that do operations like bypass surgeries and the like.

I posted two links that proves there are only two private PROPER HOSPITALS in Ontario.

BTW - two of Toronto's 'private hospitals' (like Mount Sinai) are part of the University of Toronto....which is a public research university. In other words - it AIN'T private. So the hospitals are not private.

Mount Sinai Hospital (Toronto) - Wikipedia

Besides, what would be the point of them? BY LAW, they cannot charge people for critical care more than the government does...so what would be the point? So why would they bother? They certainly cannot make huge profits like some American hospitals can.

 

[McRocket]

The subject is single payer...not medicare.

With Medicare, you have a choice. With Single payer, you do not.

Under Single Payer (like in the UK), every, single doctor is a government employee. So every, single surgery performed is 'owned' by the government as they 'own' the hospital, all the equipment and employee all the nurses, doctors, specialists, staff, paper pushers...everyone. They decide the costs, charges, who pays and when.
And since virtually no other private healthcare is allowed, that means the government has a complete monopoly on almost all medical treatments.

Of course it is socialism.

Jesus Christ. get a fucking education.

Medicare IS single payer.

You are so fucking stupid that you do npo know what single payer is.

LOL...it is you who is clueless on this. And what are you freaking out about? It's just a conversation...get a grip.

'Single-payer healthcare is a type of universal healthcare[1] financed by taxes that covers the costs of essential healthcare for all residents, with costs covered by a single public system (hence 'single-payer').'

Single-payer healthcare - Wikipedia


Medicare is optional. No one HAS to be on it...they can opt for private healthcare instead. And it is insurance...not an entire, medical system (which single-payer is).

Single payer means you have NO OPTIONS. You cannot opt for private healthcare because little/none exists.

In Canada, for example, if you need a pacemaker? A heart bypass? A hip replacement? There is only one place to get it...from the government healthcare. It is illegal in Canada (which has single payer) to have these operations from the private sector. Flat out illegal.

THAT is single payer...you have few/no choices.

And that IS socialism...BY DEFINITION.

Whether you like it or not.

"Single-payer" describes the mechanism by which healthcare is paid for by a single public authority, not the type of delivery or for whom physicians work, which may be public, private, or a mix of both.

You are missing the point. Almost all physicians in Canada are private. But almost all of them can ONLY get their pay from the government AND only at the rates the government says. So, they maybe private, but the government has a near COMPLETE MONOPOLY of where and how much these doctors can charge/make. There is ZERO competition in this respect.

It's like opening a private bowling alley. But the government tells you what to charge for shoe rentals, cost of bowling, food you sell...EVERYTHING. And you are not allowed to ask for one penny more for ANY service the government mandates. This destroys competition and means the ONLY way to make more money is to work more hours. Innovation gets you nothing.

There are almost no private hospitals in Canada. And the one or two there are are strictly for the wealthy and they are doing so against the Canada Health Act so are technically illegal. But, because of huge shortages of doctors/specialists (and because they cater to the rich), the government looks the other way...to a point.

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

 

[August West]

KH is one dumb bitch...……..

her first name alone will kill her chances, when i hear "Kamala" I think of a huge/fat ugly WWE wrestler from the 80's 90's

Those who watch wrestling are not the kind of voters that she`s targeting. It`s unlikely that she`ll get many votes from the NASCAR crowd either.

 

[McRocket]

I'm always baffled that you think this is an argument.

"So you want a politician, and their political lobbying groups, to be in charge of your healthcare?"

The difference between my statement, and your statement, is that mine is actually accurate, while yours is mythology.

I have been to a doctor when I didn't have insurance. I've been to a hospital without insurance.

Both times, I got something called a "bill". I then paid the "bill".

What insurance CEO has control over my health care?

That isn't a valid complaint. People who have insurance, choose to have insurance, because they value the service provided by the insurance company. You don't have to have insurance. You can choose to not have insurance, and just pay the bill yourself.

And quite frankly, if you think government politicians are going to take care of you... you are crazy.

AOC has been caught funneling money to her lover, through corrupt transactions. You think she is going to take care of you?

Reminds me of the MP up in Canada, getting cancer, and flying to the US for care, on tax payer dollars. She's taking care of herself... not the public. While people are dying on 3 year long waiting lists in Canada, she's using their tax dollars to fly to the US to get good care.

Or Castro in Cuba, not using the garbage Cuban health care system, but hiring a private doctor, and flying him and his medical equipment, to personally service Castro alone... while the average Cuban can't even get Aspirin.

You people seem completely detached from reality. You live in this mythical fairy land, where elitist in Washington, who have never worked a full days wage in their life... are going to take care of you?

Please.... if I have to choose, I'll take a CEO who has provided a service to millions of people, over a 1970s socialist mummy who was kicked out of his own commune, because he was too lazy.

Absolutely, I'll take the CEO. You can have your VA Hospital waiting list, and pray the politicians fix your life. We'll see who ends up better off.

Why the Mayo Clinic is refusing to see Medicare patients

I'll go to the Mayo clinic, and get top quality care. You can go to your medicare approved doctor, and we'll see who is better off.

One of my co-workers needed hand surgery, didn't want to pay for it, went through the government, and that doctor screwed up her hand so badly, she never came back to work.

My father who is a career painter and water color artist, had the same surgery though a private doctor, and it was expensive, and now he can paint again.

Yeah, let's see who ends up better off.

VA: Secret waiting list delayed care for 87 veterans in 2017


Good luck with that.

The VA hospitals were government run. Under single payer hospitals are private run.

Got any other stupid excuse?

Medicare is more efficient that insurance companies.

No they are not. You have NO IDEA what you are talking about.

Canada has virtually no private hospitals.

Ontario - by far the most populated province - has over 13 million people and 492 hospitals. Only two are private...and they are very small at that.

Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic
Centric Health: One of Ontario's Two Public Private Hospitals | Beaches|Life magazine

How many Canadians and English like their NHS?
> 90%?

1) link...I am not interested in your guesses.

2) Well duh. That is the only system most of them have ever known. And all they hear about is how horrible the U.S. system is...so they love it.

But being content with your fat, bitchy wife when the only alternative you think you have is an even fatter, bitchier wife is not the same as being happy with your wife.

You talk to most seniors in Canada (the people who use the system the most by FAR)...and I bet you most of them do NOT like the system. But ask them if they want the American mess instead - and they will probably say 'NOPE'.

So you only like yours because you have never experienced anything else. How does that make you right?

What do you mean 'yours'. I was raised in America. But I spent many years in Canada. And since my mother was Canadian (and my father was British), I can go and live in Canada anytime I want - and I often do.
My job only requires a high-speed, internet connection.
Plus my younger brother lives in San Fran and my sis in Seattle - have for decades.

I have full and direct experience with both types of healthcare systems.

And I never said the American was better...it isn't. But the Canadian one is massively flawed itself.

 

[McRocket]

The government does not have to own it for it to be socialism...just control it...by definition.

Some definitions of socialism say that it is the ownership or regulation of the means of production.

So if we "regulate" doctors by demanding that they be licensed...that's socialism?

Of course not,

That type of regulation means that the ownership my not be governmental but ALL of the decisions are. It is COMPLETELY regulated...from what is bought to what is sold and HOW it is produce and by whom. ALL of it as if it were owned by the state

That's clearly not the case.

Come on now....'some definitions'...?!? You could say almost anything.

Either post the definition in question or please don't waste my time with it.

Anyway, my definition was from the Oxford dictionary...one of the world's most respected, English language dictionaries.

What it says is good enough for me.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

 

[RealDave]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

 

[RealDave]

Jesus Christ. get a fucking education.

Medicare IS single payer.

You are so fucking stupid that you do npo know what single payer is.

LOL...it is you who is clueless on this. And what are you freaking out about? It's just a conversation...get a grip.

'Single-payer healthcare is a type of universal healthcare[1] financed by taxes that covers the costs of essential healthcare for all residents, with costs covered by a single public system (hence 'single-payer').'

Single-payer healthcare - Wikipedia


Medicare is optional. No one HAS to be on it...they can opt for private healthcare instead. And it is insurance...not an entire, medical system (which single-payer is).

Single payer means you have NO OPTIONS. You cannot opt for private healthcare because little/none exists.

In Canada, for example, if you need a pacemaker? A heart bypass? A hip replacement? There is only one place to get it...from the government healthcare. It is illegal in Canada (which has single payer) to have these operations from the private sector. Flat out illegal.

THAT is single payer...you have few/no choices.

And that IS socialism...BY DEFINITION.

Whether you like it or not.

"Single-payer" describes the mechanism by which healthcare is paid for by a single public authority, not the type of delivery or for whom physicians work, which may be public, private, or a mix of both.

You are missing the point. Almost all physicians in Canada are private. But almost all of them can ONLY get their pay from the government AND only at the rates the government says. So, they maybe private, but the government has a near COMPLETE MONOPOLY of where and how much these doctors can charge/make. There is ZERO competition in this respect.

It's like opening a private bowling alley. But the government tells you what to charge for shoe rentals, cost of bowling, food you sell...EVERYTHING. And you are not allowed to ask for one penny more for ANY service the government mandates. This destroys competition and means the ONLY way to make more money is to work more hours. Innovation gets you nothing.

There are almost no private hospitals in Canada. And the one or two there are are strictly for the wealthy and they are doing so against the Canada Health Act so are technically illegal. But, because of huge shortages of doctors/specialists (and because they cater to the rich), the government looks the other way...to a point.

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

Profit or Non-Profit: Are Hospitals Selling Out? | Canadian Women's Health Network

Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations. Hospitals receive the largest block of provincial health funding, approximately 34% compared to 15% for physician services. ... Since most hospitals are not government-owned, they cannot be "privatized".

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

1. Nice spin on the wall because you know for a fact your political party was for it before they were against it!

So why did President Obama waste taxpayer dollars to have walls built when you and your kind believe it was not needed?

Is it because President Obama hated Mexicans?

2. Why do you need National Healthcare when your State can pass a State version of it and tax accordingly to your State population?

Simple, you want other states to pay for your social programs...

3. No one want a Socialist Nation?

You better tell that to Cortez and company!

Bernie Sanders also need to be notified or are they now something different?

I noticed you can not write an entire post without writing lies and profanity, and why?

Because you know you are lying as usual...

 

[McRocket]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

Why are you freaking out about this? It's just a chat...yet you are treating it like it's war.


And his last point is a good one, IMO...most of the progressive ideas - guaranteed income, guaranteed jobs, free college for everyone - will cost SHIT loads of money.

And not one of them has given the slightest example of how to pay for them except Ocasio-Cortez's lame 'get the Fed to pay for it' (funding pipe dreams is NOTHING to do with the Fed).
A guaranteed income alone will add trillions to the deficit...trillions.

And before you start screaming 'no progressive asked for that'...Ocasio-Cortez did.

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

So tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

FYI:

I believe the whole wall idea is beyond retarded. Just enforce the laws on the books and revamp the Visa system.

So now is that something that Fox News would promote?

Of course not!

 

[McRocket]

LOL...it is you who is clueless on this. And what are you freaking out about? It's just a conversation...get a grip.

'Single-payer healthcare is a type of universal healthcare[1] financed by taxes that covers the costs of essential healthcare for all residents, with costs covered by a single public system (hence 'single-payer').'

Single-payer healthcare - Wikipedia


Medicare is optional. No one HAS to be on it...they can opt for private healthcare instead. And it is insurance...not an entire, medical system (which single-payer is).

Single payer means you have NO OPTIONS. You cannot opt for private healthcare because little/none exists.

In Canada, for example, if you need a pacemaker? A heart bypass? A hip replacement? There is only one place to get it...from the government healthcare. It is illegal in Canada (which has single payer) to have these operations from the private sector. Flat out illegal.

THAT is single payer...you have few/no choices.

And that IS socialism...BY DEFINITION.

Whether you like it or not.

"Single-payer" describes the mechanism by which healthcare is paid for by a single public authority, not the type of delivery or for whom physicians work, which may be public, private, or a mix of both.

You are missing the point. Almost all physicians in Canada are private. But almost all of them can ONLY get their pay from the government AND only at the rates the government says. So, they maybe private, but the government has a near COMPLETE MONOPOLY of where and how much these doctors can charge/make. There is ZERO competition in this respect.

It's like opening a private bowling alley. But the government tells you what to charge for shoe rentals, cost of bowling, food you sell...EVERYTHING. And you are not allowed to ask for one penny more for ANY service the government mandates. This destroys competition and means the ONLY way to make more money is to work more hours. Innovation gets you nothing.

There are almost no private hospitals in Canada. And the one or two there are are strictly for the wealthy and they are doing so against the Canada Health Act so are technically illegal. But, because of huge shortages of doctors/specialists (and because they cater to the rich), the government looks the other way...to a point.

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

Profit or Non-Profit: Are Hospitals Selling Out? | Canadian Women's Health Network

Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations. Hospitals receive the largest block of provincial health funding, approximately 34% compared to 15% for physician services. ... Since most hospitals are not government-owned, they cannot be "privatized".

One - your link is from 1998?!? It's 20 years old.

Two - there are a hell of a lot more than 850 hospitals in Canada
Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic

Three - from your (old) link...'Although almost all Canadians believe hospitals are publicly owned and accountable institutions, under provincial legislation 95% operate on a non-profit basis. Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations.'

Yes...they operate as 'non-profit'. If I said they were owned/run by the government, I was mistaken. But that is irrelevant. Who built them? Overwhelmingly is is taxpayer money or donations. You think a corporation is going to built a huge hospital and than run it non-profitly? Suuuuure.

The government funds most of them and then a non-profit group runs them.

But that is NOT for profit...which is my ENTIRE POINT.

Profits mean competition (and better customer service). Competition means lower prices.

That is economics 101.

And it is what the Canadian Healthcare System does NOT have and that is why it sucks (in many ways - some ways it is fine).

 

[RealDave]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

Why are you freaking out about this? It's just a chat...yet you are treating it like it's war.


And his last point is a good one, IMO...most of the progressive ideas - guaranteed income, guaranteed jobs, free college for everyone - will cost SHIT loads of money.

And not one of them has given the slightest example of how to pay for them except Ocasio-Cortez's lame 'get the Fed to pay for it' (funding pipe dreams is NOTHING to do with the Fed).
A guaranteed income alone will add trillions to the deficit...trillions.

And before you start screaming 'no progressive asked for that'...Ocasio-Cortez did.

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

So tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

We basically have something similar to guaranteed basic income in the food stamps, rent assistance, TANF, etc. What s the value of all of those services. There is a lot of theory that says a basic income would encourage more to get jobs. It could be cheaper than what we do now.

The cost of offering a free community college/community trade school based education would not be that expensive.

Don't think all colleges will be free. Its not like you go to Harvard & the government pays for it.

I am sick & tied of all the lies & distortions on the NGD. They put "green" in the title & the right freaks out.

A lot of the GD makes obvious sense.

 

[McRocket]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

Why are you freaking out about this? It's just a chat...yet you are treating it like it's war.


And his last point is a good one, IMO...most of the progressive ideas - guaranteed income, guaranteed jobs, free college for everyone - will cost SHIT loads of money.

And not one of them has given the slightest example of how to pay for them except Ocasio-Cortez's lame 'get the Fed to pay for it' (funding pipe dreams is NOTHING to do with the Fed).
A guaranteed income alone will add trillions to the deficit...trillions.

And before you start screaming 'no progressive asked for that'...Ocasio-Cortez did.

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

So tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

We basically have something similar to guaranteed basic income in the food stamps, rent assistance, TANF, etc. What s the value of all of those services. There is a lot of theory that says a basic income would encourage more to get jobs. It could be cheaper than what we do now.

The cost of offering a free community college/community trade school based education would not be that expensive.

Don't think all colleges will be free. Its not like you go to Harvard & the government pays for it.

I am sick & tied of all the lies & distortions on the NGD. They put "green" in the title & the right freaks out.

A lot of the GD makes obvious sense.

Food stamps? Food stamps costs - what - far less than $100 billion (and I don't have a problem with food stamps, btw). A guaranteed income will cost MANY trillions.
Simple math. 250 million American adults. Give each one $13,000 (the poverty line amount roughly). That alone is over $3 TRILLION (and that does not include children and try living in a major city on $13,000).

So I will ask you again...tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

 

[RealDave]

"Single-payer" describes the mechanism by which healthcare is paid for by a single public authority, not the type of delivery or for whom physicians work, which may be public, private, or a mix of both.

You are missing the point. Almost all physicians in Canada are private. But almost all of them can ONLY get their pay from the government AND only at the rates the government says. So, they maybe private, but the government has a near COMPLETE MONOPOLY of where and how much these doctors can charge/make. There is ZERO competition in this respect.

It's like opening a private bowling alley. But the government tells you what to charge for shoe rentals, cost of bowling, food you sell...EVERYTHING. And you are not allowed to ask for one penny more for ANY service the government mandates. This destroys competition and means the ONLY way to make more money is to work more hours. Innovation gets you nothing.

There are almost no private hospitals in Canada. And the one or two there are are strictly for the wealthy and they are doing so against the Canada Health Act so are technically illegal. But, because of huge shortages of doctors/specialists (and because they cater to the rich), the government looks the other way...to a point.

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

Profit or Non-Profit: Are Hospitals Selling Out? | Canadian Women's Health Network

Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations. Hospitals receive the largest block of provincial health funding, approximately 34% compared to 15% for physician services. ... Since most hospitals are not government-owned, they cannot be "privatized".

One - your link is from 1998?!? It's 20 years old.

Two - there are a hell of a lot more than 850 hospitals in Canada
Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic

Three - from your (old) link...'Although almost all Canadians believe hospitals are publicly owned and accountable institutions, under provincial legislation 95% operate on a non-profit basis. Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations.'

Yes...they operate as 'non-profit'. If I said they were owned/run by the government, I was mistaken. But that is irrelevant. Who built them? Overwhelmingly is is taxpayer money or donations. You think a corporation is going to built a huge hospital and than run it non-profitly? Suuuuure.

The government funds most of them and then a non-profit group runs them.

But that is NOT for profit...which is my ENTIRE POINT.

Profits mean competition (and better customer service). Competition means lower prices.

That is economics 101.

And it is what the Canadian Healthcare System does NOT have and that is why it sucks (in many ways - some ways it is fine).

So post where this has changed over the past 20 years.

Most of the hospitals/ facilities here are owned by Summit Health. A non profit.


Not government owned.

 

[McRocket]

You are missing the point. Almost all physicians in Canada are private. But almost all of them can ONLY get their pay from the government AND only at the rates the government says. So, they maybe private, but the government has a near COMPLETE MONOPOLY of where and how much these doctors can charge/make. There is ZERO competition in this respect.

It's like opening a private bowling alley. But the government tells you what to charge for shoe rentals, cost of bowling, food you sell...EVERYTHING. And you are not allowed to ask for one penny more for ANY service the government mandates. This destroys competition and means the ONLY way to make more money is to work more hours. Innovation gets you nothing.

There are almost no private hospitals in Canada. And the one or two there are are strictly for the wealthy and they are doing so against the Canada Health Act so are technically illegal. But, because of huge shortages of doctors/specialists (and because they cater to the rich), the government looks the other way...to a point.

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

Profit or Non-Profit: Are Hospitals Selling Out? | Canadian Women's Health Network

Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations. Hospitals receive the largest block of provincial health funding, approximately 34% compared to 15% for physician services. ... Since most hospitals are not government-owned, they cannot be "privatized".

One - your link is from 1998?!? It's 20 years old.

Two - there are a hell of a lot more than 850 hospitals in Canada
Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic

Three - from your (old) link...'Although almost all Canadians believe hospitals are publicly owned and accountable institutions, under provincial legislation 95% operate on a non-profit basis. Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations.'

Yes...they operate as 'non-profit'. If I said they were owned/run by the government, I was mistaken. But that is irrelevant. Who built them? Overwhelmingly is is taxpayer money or donations. You think a corporation is going to built a huge hospital and than run it non-profitly? Suuuuure.

The government funds most of them and then a non-profit group runs them.

But that is NOT for profit...which is my ENTIRE POINT.

Profits mean competition (and better customer service). Competition means lower prices.

That is economics 101.

And it is what the Canadian Healthcare System does NOT have and that is why it sucks (in many ways - some ways it is fine).

So post where this has changed over the past 20 years.

Most of the hospitals/ facilities here are owned by Summit Health. A non profit.


Not government owned.

And I said, if I said they were government owned, I was mistaken. But I guarantee you that almost all of the funds to build EVERY Canadian hospital came from either taxpayers or charities. Corporations ain't gonna spend billions on a hospital that makes them ZERO profit.

But it is IRRELEVANT to my point.

The point is are they run FOR A PROFIT? And your own link shows that they are NON PROFIT.

 

[Bruce_T_Laney]

"Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.) on Tuesday defended her support for “Medicare for all,” saying it is not a socialist idea.

"No, no. It’s about providing health care to all people," Harris said"



Kamala Harris is embarrassing herself while proving although she cal lie her ass off about Democrat Health Care BS she is still no Barak Obama...




Harris: 'Medicare for all' is not socialism

.

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

Why are you freaking out about this? It's just a chat...yet you are treating it like it's war.


And his last point is a good one, IMO...most of the progressive ideas - guaranteed income, guaranteed jobs, free college for everyone - will cost SHIT loads of money.

And not one of them has given the slightest example of how to pay for them except Ocasio-Cortez's lame 'get the Fed to pay for it' (funding pipe dreams is NOTHING to do with the Fed).
A guaranteed income alone will add trillions to the deficit...trillions.

And before you start screaming 'no progressive asked for that'...Ocasio-Cortez did.

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

So tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

We basically have something similar to guaranteed basic income in the food stamps, rent assistance, TANF, etc. What s the value of all of those services. There is a lot of theory that says a basic income would encourage more to get jobs. It could be cheaper than what we do now.

The cost of offering a free community college/community trade school based education would not be that expensive.

Don't think all colleges will be free. Its not like you go to Harvard & the government pays for it.

I am sick & tied of all the lies & distortions on the NGD. They put "green" in the title & the right freaks out.

A lot of the GD makes obvious sense.

All that can be done on the State level and does not need the Federal Government to do it.

You know this, so why is your state refusing to tax accordingly to your state population?

Also you stated Free schooling while admitting it is never free and the taxpayer will flip the bill.

I am all for JTPA's that will put Americans to work and know the cost for the education versus the amount of taxes collected is well worth it, but again this can be implemented on the State level.

So tell me why do you need the Federal Government to do the State Job?

 

[RealDave]

Republicans don't hate all socialism.

See what I mean?

1. There was a wall before Trump, so Democrats loved the wall until Trump was for building more of it.

2. Name a Socialist Nation that does not suffer from High Taxes on it society?

3. In your socialist nation you will tax the rich to pay the poor but when there is no more rich who pays for your programs?

1) Show me where there is a 40' concrete wall that is not in a congested area.You people really need to turn off Fox News &Rush Limbaugh & get better informed. This ia not about border barriers. This is about a 40' concrete wall.

2) High taxes, high benefits. Like single payer that would reduce the amount people spent on healthcare

3) No one is wanting a socialist nation so shove your fake argument up your ass. But hey, you want to hand the wealthy tax breaks & make the poor pay for them.

Why are you freaking out about this? It's just a chat...yet you are treating it like it's war.


And his last point is a good one, IMO...most of the progressive ideas - guaranteed income, guaranteed jobs, free college for everyone - will cost SHIT loads of money.

And not one of them has given the slightest example of how to pay for them except Ocasio-Cortez's lame 'get the Fed to pay for it' (funding pipe dreams is NOTHING to do with the Fed).
A guaranteed income alone will add trillions to the deficit...trillions.

And before you start screaming 'no progressive asked for that'...Ocasio-Cortez did.

What’s a universal basic income doing in Ocasio-Cortez’s “Green New Deal”?

So tell us, please...how EXACTLY are progressives going to pay for a guaranteed income?

We basically have something similar to guaranteed basic income in the food stamps, rent assistance, TANF, etc. What s the value of all of those services. There is a lot of theory that says a basic income would encourage more to get jobs. It could be cheaper than what we do now.

The cost of offering a free community college/community trade school based education would not be that expensive.

Don't think all colleges will be free. Its not like you go to Harvard & the government pays for it.

I am sick & tied of all the lies & distortions on the NGD. They put "green" in the title & the right freaks out.

A lot of the GD makes obvious sense.

All that can be done on the State level and does not need the Federal Government to do it.

You know this, so why is your state refusing to tax accordingly to your state population?

Also you stated Free schooling while admitting it is never free and the taxpayer will flip the bill.

I am all for JTPA's that will put Americans to work and know the cost for the education versus the amount of taxes collected is well worth it, but again this can be implemented on the State level.

So tell me why do you need the Federal Government to do the State Job?

Because all States may not do it???????

 

[RealDave]

I don't know where you're getting your information about private hospitals in Canada.

I just did a quick search on them and there are many more than two and they aren't just for rich people. Here's the link to that search. Check it out for yourself.

list of private hospitals in canada - Bing

I don't know their fee structure but because you don't seem to have correct facts on their private hospitals I'm inclined to not believe the rest of what you posted about Canadian health care.

I do know I live about 90 minutes south of the Canadian border. I know many people who used to live up there. Every one of them have retained their citizenship up there for one reason only. The health care. Every one of them get duel citizenship for their kids just so their kids are protected by the Canadian health care system. Those are their words, to protect their children with the Canadian health care system. I know many people who only go to Canada for their health care. They don't trust our system that puts profit before the care of the patient.

I have met countless Canadians and have never met or known even one of them who didn't think our system was cruel and barbaric. None of them would ever want to have our system.

I also know that no politician in Canada or any nation that has universal health care ever campaigns on repealing their system for the system we have. No politician would ever be elected in any of those nations if they ran on that platform.

Stop wasting my time with a link to a search engine result. What nonsense.

Show me a link to actual lists of critical care hospitals that are fully private in Ontario? Not clinics or hospitals that really are clinics or 'hospitals' that only handle physio or cosmetic surgeries (which are privately legal in Ontario to charge whatever they wish).
CRITICAL CARE HOSPITALS.

I showed you links that prove I am right. All you show me is a link to a search engine result.

And save your blather about what people tell you. I do not care.

If you have not actually been shot or spent time in jail or raced winged, open-wheel cars (two of these I have done) - you cannot know what these things are like...no matter how many people tell you about it. The same goes with the Canadian Healthcare system. Unless you have experienced it FIRST HAND...you have no idea what you are talking about.

Either post links to direct and unbiased facts or stop wasting my time.

Profit or Non-Profit: Are Hospitals Selling Out? | Canadian Women's Health Network

Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations. Hospitals receive the largest block of provincial health funding, approximately 34% compared to 15% for physician services. ... Since most hospitals are not government-owned, they cannot be "privatized".

One - your link is from 1998?!? It's 20 years old.

Two - there are a hell of a lot more than 850 hospitals in Canada
Number hospitals Canada by province 2016 | Statistic

Three - from your (old) link...'Although almost all Canadians believe hospitals are publicly owned and accountable institutions, under provincial legislation 95% operate on a non-profit basis. Most of Canada's approximately 850 hospitals are owned and operated by non-profit, voluntary organizations.'

Yes...they operate as 'non-profit'. If I said they were owned/run by the government, I was mistaken. But that is irrelevant. Who built them? Overwhelmingly is is taxpayer money or donations. You think a corporation is going to built a huge hospital and than run it non-profitly? Suuuuure.

The government funds most of them and then a non-profit group runs them.

But that is NOT for profit...which is my ENTIRE POINT.

Profits mean competition (and better customer service). Competition means lower prices.

That is economics 101.

And it is what the Canadian Healthcare System does NOT have and that is why it sucks (in many ways - some ways it is fine).

So post where this has changed over the past 20 years.

Most of the hospitals/ facilities here are owned by Summit Health. A non profit.


Not government owned.

And I said, if I said they were government owned, I was mistaken. But I guarantee you that almost all of the funds to build EVERY Canadian hospital came from either taxpayers or charities. Corporations ain't gonna spend billions on a hospital that makes them ZERO profit.

But it is IRRELEVANT to my point.

The point is are they run FOR A PROFIT.

Your own link shows that they are NON PROFIT.

They are run so that the facility may be non profit overall. That does not mean thy can't make a profit. It depends a lot on what they do with those profits.