I've heard it on here so much enough is enough

[HelenaHandbag]

The last BRAC basically did that

Link?

Defense.gov News Article: DOD Conducts ?BRAC-like? Review in Europe

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

 

[NYcarbineer]

OK, point by point.

Let's debate it point by point, with real substance. The following is out of the opening statement by JFK in his September 1960 debate with Nixon:

I don't want the talents of any American to go to waste. I know that there are those who want to turn everything over to the government. I don't at all. I want the individuals to meet their responsibilities. And I want the states to meet their responsibilities.

"Responsibilities" as defined how and by whom?


Two straw man arguments in one.

• Your opinion that there is a national responsibility does not make it so by fiat.
  
• The people of the United States DID create the TVA. That it was imposed upon the area is irrelevant, as development of the project wasn't even considered or attempted as a voluntary compact between states.

Never heard of the commodities markets, have you?



I don't even know what that is supposed to mean.

Now, if JFK would be a 2013 conservative, shoulder to shoulder with Ted Cruz, and Rand Paul, or you name your own, how much of the above would be drawing cheers from them?

Another straw man argument.

I can't find a post of anyone claiming that JFK would be standing shoulder to shoulder with the likes of Cruz, Paul or any of the other TEA party crowd. Can you link to a post that claims this?

If Carbineer's arguments are straw man, then please....make sure no one with a lit match gets close to you.

What that poster didn't get is that those weren't my arguments, they were JFK quotes from his first debate with Nixon in 1960.

 

[C_Clayton_Jones]

Communism today is no threat to the United States. No need to invade and have Americans killed to stop the threat

Kennedy fought the Communist threat of 1961. To assume we need the same anti- communist policy that Kennedy had is moronic

But then again......you are the daveman

I never said it was a threat to the US. I said it was a bad thing. Apparently, you disagree.

Terrorism is bad.......Communism is not a threat

Now...go back to justifying how JFK is Conservative

Peace Corps, Civil Rights, Medicare, anti poverty programs

Sounds liberal to me...are you suddenly pro healthcare?

Only an ignorant partisan idiot would argue JFK was a ‘conservative.’

 

[rightwinger]

Link?

Defense.gov News Article: DOD Conducts ?BRAC-like? Review in Europe

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

I still like Air Bases and Naval Bases.......helps project global power

Most Army bases have been closed

 

[kotd2013]

The founding fathers were a mixed batch. The information is all on this WWW for anyone wanting to learn it. Obviously, most of the founders were more progressive than the vast majority of the christian right believe. American politics were definitely more open minded before the huge migration of peasants fleeing from Europe. America was founded on deist principles, which is pretty damn progressive, other founders wanted the states to be christian in writing. Many of these situations are documented. I believe at the time, many founding fathers were Christians in name only because it was too shocking at the time to not be. If you're so inclined why don't you just look it up. You obviously have the internet.

 

[HelenaHandbag]

Defense.gov News Article: DOD Conducts ?BRAC-like? Review in Europe

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

I still like Air Bases and Naval Bases.......helps project global power

Most Army bases have been closed

All that does is make the American military the party guest that refuses to go home.

Besides that, projecting military power is for warmongering neconservatives, which makes you no different from the likes of Bush.

 

[Harry Dresden]

Bullshit. Jefferson and Adams would both be consider "extreme" right-wingers today. The only one of the founders who differed in any significant way was Thomas Paine. He was the only socialist in the group. The rest were all die-hard supporters of private property and free enterprise.

Hell, JFK would be considered an extreme right-winger today.

Republicans would call him a commie.....just like they did in 1963

Republicans say the darnedest things....

 

[Harry Dresden]

First liberals on this board or some liberals claim that the founding fathers of this country were liberals. What I want to address is which liberal policy would the founders of America support?
Give their names and the policy.

They 'were' liberals. Not 'are' liberals. They are dead. They have been a very long time.

As someone once said, 'the past is another country; they do things differently there.'

Progressives, generally, want to make progress; conservatives, generally, want to conserve things the way they are.

Progressives are pragmatists, they seek the best course of action based on facts and evidence, not partisan ideology and dogma; they embrace change and diversity and advocate for a consistent application of the Constitution and its case law.

Conservatives not only seek to keep things the way they are, but as fearful reactionaries they seek to turn back the hands of time, they pursue a myth of an idealized American past, a fantasy that never existed in the first place. As reactionaries conservatives fear change, diversity, and dissent and are often at odds with the Constitution and its case law accordingly.

geezus....do you even know what the **** you are talking about?....

 

[rightwinger]

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

I still like Air Bases and Naval Bases.......helps project global power

Most Army bases have been closed

All that does is make the American military the party guest that refuses to go home.

Besides that, projecting military power is for warmongering neconservatives, which makes you no different from the likes of Bush.

Bush?

We have been projecting military power around the world for 100 years

 

[Harry Dresden]

They 'were' liberals. Not 'are' liberals. They are dead. They have been a very long time.

As someone once said, 'the past is another country; they do things differently there.'

Progressives, generally, want to make progress; conservatives, generally, want to conserve things the way they are.

Progressives are pragmatists, they seek the best course of action based on facts and evidence, not partisan ideology and dogma; they embrace change and diversity and advocate for a consistent application of the Constitution and its case law.

Conservatives not only seek to keep things the way they are, but as fearful reactionaries they seek to turn back the hands of time, they pursue a myth of an idealized American past, a fantasy that never existed in the first place. As reactionaries conservatives fear change, diversity, and dissent and are often at odds with the Constitution and its case law accordingly.

I'm not sure which is more disturbing -- the fact that you believe that, or the fact that you vote based on it.

he believes it.....he is one of them FAR Lefties....just saying that "Progressives" dont do Partisan ideology and dogma settled that....Jones is one of the most Partisan people here....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Link?

Defense.gov News Article: DOD Conducts ?BRAC-like? Review in Europe

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

ill agree there....Europe should be able to defend themselves....

 

[Harry Dresden]

I never said it was a threat to the US. I said it was a bad thing. Apparently, you disagree.

Terrorism is bad.......Communism is not a threat

Now...go back to justifying how JFK is Conservative

Peace Corps, Civil Rights, Medicare, anti poverty programs

Sounds liberal to me...are you suddenly pro healthcare?

Only an ignorant partisan idiot would argue JFK was a ‘conservative.’

oh geezus.....this Meatball calling someone else....Partisan....as Spock would say..."Fascinating".....

 

[Harry Dresden]

Defense.gov News Article: DOD Conducts ?BRAC-like? Review in Europe

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

I still like Air Bases and Naval Bases.......helps project global power

Most Army bases have been closed

i like them too RW....but Europe should be able to defend themselves....

 

[NYcarbineer]

JFK advocated tax cuts to strengthen the economy and a strong foreign policy to stand up to Communism. He said, "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country."

Yup, no doubt about it. He was a conservative.

If JFK was a conservative, what was Nixon? What was Goldwater? What was LBJ?

Which of today's liberals believe "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country"?

I'm not surprised you have no idea where Nixon, Goldwater, and LBJ fall on the political spectrum,

given your comical opinion of JFK.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

The founders were radical, liberal, intelligent democrats, not bought off, stupid, greedy, entrenched conservatives. Conservatives never change lol...but they've never been worse than today...

Doesn't matter what they called themselves.

If the conservatives had gotten their way, we'd all be speaking with a British accent today.

And, if they have their way today, we will have no education, no science, no progress. Our country will fall. We will become the bedroom community of China, controlled by Muslims, just as the GObP/pubs want and work toward, every single day.

 

[rightwinger]

Consolidation is not elimination.

There is no longer any reason to have any of those bases in Europe.

Bring all the troops home. Half measures are a cop out.

I still like Air Bases and Naval Bases.......helps project global power

Most Army bases have been closed

i like them too RW....but Europe should be able to defend themselves....

I agree

But having a place to deploy from in that theatre comes in handy

 

[NYcarbineer]

JFK advocated tax cuts to strengthen the economy and a strong foreign policy to stand up to Communism. He said, "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country."

Yup, no doubt about it. He was a conservative.

If JFK was a conservative, what was Nixon? What was Goldwater? What was LBJ?

Which of today's liberals believe "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country"?

JFK was calling on that generation to serve their government in peaceful goals the way they had served it in war, in the past.

Nice try though.

 

[Luddly Neddite]

First liberals on this board or some liberals claim that the founding fathers of this country were liberals. What I want to address is which liberal policy would the founders of America support?
Give their names and the policy.

Really ignorant rw's will sometimes whine that Dems started the KKK, yadda yadda.

FACT is consevatives started the KKK. They were called Dems in those days and the Rs were the party of progress and education ans science.

Its the opposite now.

Now, the Rs are racist haters who want an end to progress and education and science.

Go look at the racism threads and look at who is posting the ignorant hate.

Its not the Dem/libs.

 

[kotd2013]

JFK advocated tax cuts to strengthen the economy and a strong foreign policy to stand up to Communism. He said, "Ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country."

Yup, no doubt about it. He was a conservative.

JFK advocated reducing taxes that were raised to pay for WWII
He was strong anti-communism because in 1960, we actually had a Cold War

Ask not what your country can do for you....was a call for public service (Peace Corps) not a condemnation of social services

Kennedy advocated Medicare, anti-poverty programs, Civil Rights

As liberal as they come

Like I said -- a rich fantasy life.

"Ask not what your country ca...." It's obvious in the context of the speech that the line is based almost entirely on an anti-communism campaign.

 

[WillowTree]

First liberals on this board or some liberals claim that the founding fathers of this country were liberals. What I want to address is which liberal policy would the founders of America support?
Give their names and the policy.

Really ignorant rw's will sometimes whine that Dems started the KKK, yadda yadda.

FACT is consevatives started the KKK. They were called Dems in those days and the Rs were the party of progress and education ans science.

Its the opposite now.

Now, the Rs are racist haters who want an end to progress and education and science.

Go look at the racism threads and look at who is posting the ignorant hate.

Its not the Dem/libs.

Democrats were democrats, ask lester maddox, george c wallace and all members of the KKK, they didn't claim to be democrats masquerading as conservatives they were flat out registered democrats.