Zone1 It's virtually impossible for Protestants to understand Catholicism

[The Irish Ram]

Could it be that non-Catholic Christians found a place in the Bible that says to demote her?

Could it be that yet another Catholic had yet another vision and turned it into a love fest for Mary?

Luke 1:48, "...for behold, henceforth all generations 'shall' call me Blessed." We are commanded to honor Mary. That's where it comes from. In no way is Mary elevated to the level of God.

Purgatory is 100% biblical, as well as making perfect sense. Only the perfect get into Heaven, and purgatory is how men are made perfect for Heaven. "Every last penny shall be paid.."

I was taught there would be some protestants in Heaven. It's just easier if you're a Catholic, because you have a lot more tools to help you focus on the prize.

When Christ died, he went to Paradise also called Abraham's Bosom. Those there belonged to God, but could not enter Heaven because Christ's blood that purifies us, had not yet been shed. The first thing Christ did was to go get them. They came back with Him. The graves that opened up gave them back their mortal, now restored bodies. Matthew said they ascended with Jesus. I want to read the scripture where Jesus dropped them off somewhere and went on ahead...

 

[Meriweather]

Could it be that yet another Catholic had yet another vision and turned it into a love fest for Mary?

So we should hold back love for some people? Who else? Perhaps our own parents and children?

 

[The Irish Ram]

So we should hold back love for some people? Who else? Perhaps our own parents and children?

How silly. On the other hand, did you turn your love for those you mentioned into religious doctrine? How many visions of dead people have you seen?

 

[Meriweather]

How silly. Did you turn your love for those you mentioned into religious doctrine?

And there's the problem. You turn Catholic honor of Mary into something it is not as an excuse to snipe at the Catholic faith. And yes, I've asked my parents and children to pray for me more often than I have asked Mary, so I guess you can also erroneously insist that I have turned love of family into "religious doctrine".

I don't how badly the great need for non-Catholic Christians to tear down another faith, or to spit on another's holy ground that makes one claim/insist that a people are doing something they are not. Honoring Mary's position is not worship. Doing our best to renew the face of the earth as asked is not earning or working for redemption/salvation.

Don't non-Catholic Christians have something better to do than to investigate what Catholics are doing, and then to twist it into something it is not and then claim that it is? When the Catholic perspective is offered, it is kicked aside and the sniping/defamation continues a few posts (or a few threads) later.

 

[The Irish Ram]

So we should hold back love for some people? Who else? Perhaps our own parents and children?

Stop avoiding the request that you verify your claim with scripture. It is how we substantiate what is truth and what is not.

2 Tim 3:16-17 “As for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it, and how from infancy you have known the Holy Scriptures, which can make you wise for salvation through faith in Christ Jesus. All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting, and training in righteousness, so that the servant of God may be equipped for every good work”

 

[Meriweather]

Stop avoiding the request that you verify your claim with scripture. It is how we substantiate what is truth and what is not.

I've told you many times. I.Do.Not.Proof-text. And, I don't read your proof-texts either. For Catholics who attend Mass weekly, they go through the Bible every three years; those who attend daily, it's every year. Then, of course there is group Bible Study, or our own independent Bible Study.

Yet how often do we hear that Catholics don't read the Bible as much as non-Catholic Christians do? I once expected non-Catholic Christians to know the Bible better than I did--but that was long ago. It has been my experience non-Catholic Christians know their proof-texts very well--and the Bible in its entirety not well at all.

I stopped reading proof-texts (cherry picked verses) long ago because all I could see were all the Bible verses that were passed over.

If you think I am making up what the Bible says, first that tells me how little you know the Bible, and secondly, since you think I'm fabricating what the Bible says, you shouldn't be listening to me in the first place.

Look, I don't care if your denominations goes so far as to black out Mary's name altogether. I don't care if you say, "Catholics should not honor Mary." Where I respond is when someone states as fact something Catholics are doing, that, in fact, we are not doing (i.e., worshiping Mary). I will offer an explanation of what we actuary are doing and why we are doing it. I'll reference something as "Luke's Gospel about the angel appearing to Mary notes..." and people can check with their own Bible what words that specific Bible uses.

For me, that is what religious discussion is all about: Explaining one's own faith/religion without dismissing the faith of others.

 

[ElmerMudd]

Could it be that yet another Catholic had yet another vision and turned it into a love fest for Mary?

When Christ died, he went to Paradise also called Abraham's Bosom. Those there belonged to God, but could not enter Heaven because Christ's blood that purifies us, had not yet been shed. The first thing Christ did was to go get them. They came back with Him. The graves that opened up gave them back their mortal, now restored bodies. Matthew said they ascended with Jesus. I want to read the scripture where Jesus dropped them off somewhere and went on ahead...

14:6, is that people might "come" to the Father, which in the immediate context means that they might know and believe in God.
Jesus came to earth let humans "know and believe in God." Jesus and the other Jews already believed in that God. They already knew Jesus's God. Why would God tell his people they must accept Jesus as my son.
The importance is do as God/Jesus teach us.

 

[The Irish Ram]

Stop with the non-Catholic bullshit, Catholic hater bullshit, Protestants just don't get it bullshit, and you're spitting on my holy ground, bullshit. Because that is what it is, bullshit. You've picked up misery's pettiness and have run with it. You never used to be like this.

Your family praying for you is nice. It is also, intercession, not Catholic doctrine. You didn't decree that it be made a part of mass.

You honoring Mary is fine. Believe it or not, so do "non-Catholic" Christians, or in other words, Christians. Consulting with the dead and asking favors of them is not fine. You say that is not what you do. Other Catholics do. And it has been called into question, and rightly so. The same with believing that you need the rosary to enter Heaven. And other outlandish statements made here recently. One "non-Protestant" tried to escalate her vitriol by punishing people in the basement. You want to play that game, fine. Others here will rely on scripture to either prove a statement or refute it.

Do you want to know how many Catholics are going to be in Heaven? Most of them. Because they are good Christian people that love the Lord.

I've told you many times. I.Do.Not.Proof-text. And, I don't read your proof-texts either. For Catholics who attend Mass weekly, they go through the Bible every three years; those who attend daily, it's every year. Then, of course there is group Bible Study, or our own independent Bible Study.

Yet how often do we hear that Catholics don't read the Bible as much as non-Catholic Christians do? I once expected non-Catholic Christians to know the Bible better than I did--but that was long ago. It has been my experience non-Catholic Christians know their proof-texts very well--and the Bible in its entirety not well at all.

I stopped reading proof-texts (cherry picked verses) long ago because all I could see were all the Bible verses that were passed over.

If you think I am making up what the Bible says, first that tells me how little you know the Bible, and secondly, since you think I'm fabricating what the Bible says, you shouldn't be listening to me in the first place.

Look, I don't care if your denominations goes so far as to black out Mary's name altogether. I don't care if you say, "Catholics should not honor Mary." Where I respond is when someone states as fact something Catholics are doing, that, in fact, we are not doing (i.e., worshiping Mary). I will offer an explanation of what we actuary are doing and why we are doing it. I'll reference something as "Luke's Gospel about the angel appearing to Mary notes..." and people can check with their own Bible what words that specific Bible uses.

For me, that is what religious discussion is all about: Explaining one's own faith/religion without dismissing the faith of others.

No one is dismissing your faith. They are questioning your views by comparing it to what the Bible tells us. Pointing out scripture that disagrees with you, isn't cherry picking verses. It is standing on the Word. It is to show why not everybody agrees with another's particular viewpoint. I keep asking you to verify or refute what the Bible says and you keep shunning scripture to malign "non-Catholics," or in other words, Christians. And avoiding scripture by calling it a weapon.

 

[The Irish Ram]

14:6, is that people might "come" to the Father, which in the immediate context means that they might know and believe in God.
Jesus came to earth let humans "know and believe in God." Jesus and the other Jews already believed in that God. They already knew Jesus's God. Why would God tell his people they must accept Jesus as my son.
The importance is do as God/Jesus teach us.

Because sin is a blood issue. The original sin has been passed down through generation after generation. We have Adam and Eve to thank for that.
Sacrificing animals was part of the Jewish religion. It temporarily covered their sin so God could remain in their presence. God was actually the first one to do it, in the Garden of Eden.
The Blood of His Son, that His Son gave willingly, is pure and covers sin completely, once, for all. Then God put our sins behind Him and doesn't even remember them. Jesus did that for us and gave us His pure record to enter Heaven with as a gift.
The veil in the Temple separated God from us. When Christ died, that curtain was literally torn in half, and Christ sprinkled His own blood on the alter, giving us direct access to our Father again. God went from Judge of the Law, back to loving, forgiving, Father.

 

[ElmerMudd]

Because sin is a blood issue. The original sin has been passed down through generation after generation. We have Adam and Eve to thank for that.
Sacrificing animals was part of the Jewish religion. It temporarily covered their sin so God could remain in their presence. God was actually the first one to do it, in the Garden of Eden.
The Blood of His Son, that His Son gave willingly, is pure and covers sin completely, once, for all. Then God put our sins behind Him and doesn't even remember them. Jesus did that for us and gave us His pure record to enter Heaven with as a gift.
The veil in the Temple separated God from us. When Christ died, that curtain was literally torn in half, and Christ sprinkled His own blood on the alter, giving us direct access to our Father again. God went from Judge of the Law, back to loving, forgiving, Father.

We are all God's children.
Humans come up with rules why their defined way is the only way. By your definition, everyone who believes in God, believes in Jesus. They may not define it the way you do.
The most important is we live following God's direction.

 

[Meriweather]

Stop with the non-Catholic

Some Christians don't care to be called Protestants. Some don't care to be associated with Catholics. I was advised "Non-Catholic Christians" was preferred. Now you tell me it's not. Can't believe you think by using that description I mean to offend!

 

[The Irish Ram]

We are all God's children.
Humans come up with rules why their defined way is the only way. By your definition, everyone who believes in God, believes in Jesus. They may not define it the way you do.
The most important is we live following God's direction.

No, we are not all God's children. Some choose to follow their father, Satan:

John 8:44 You belong to your father, the devil, and you want to carry out your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, not holding to the truth, for there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks his native language, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

You misunderstood me if you think I said everyone who believes in God, believes in Jesus. Muslims make a point of saying that Allah has no son. Jews believe in God, but not in His Son, Jesus.

This may be most important thing we can do for salvation , according to the Bible:

John 11:25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in me, though he were dead, yet shall he live

Mark 16:16 “He who believes and is baptized will be saved;

Romans 10:9 If you declare with your mouth, “Jesus is Lord,” and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.​

^That is our involvement in the process. Notice the period at the end of that sentence.

 

[The Irish Ram]

All Christians are somewhat Catholic or however you may want to put it because all "churches" derived from the Original, namely the Catholic Church.

Nope.
The church at Jerusalem was the home base of Christianity after the ascension of Jesus Christ. It was led by Peter and the other close disciples of Jesus. James, was also a leader. Peter preached there for 15 years. It was at that church that 3,000 people were saved after Peter's sermon and were baptized. James was murdered there and Peter imprisoned and escaped.
There is no proof that Peter was in Rome before 63AD. He was murdered in 64.

It is from Jerusalem that the gospel is sent out and spreads, but it also becomes a sort of headquarters for Christianity. When the apostles there heard about the Samaritans believing the gospel, they sent Peter and John to pray for them to receive the Holy Spirit (Acts 8). This affirmed to the believers that the gospel is for the Samaritans, too. After Peter shared the gospel with Cornelius, a Gentile, in Ceasarea and saw the Holy Spirit come on the Gentiles, he reported it to the church in Jerusalem (Acts 11). When some disciples in Jerusalem disbelieved Paul was truly a disciple of Jesus after his conversion, Barnabas took Paul before the apostles and elders there (Acts 9:26–30). Later, Paul and Barnabas went to Jerusalem from Syrian Antioch to settle matters concerning Gentile believers (Acts 15). To this day, Christians pilgrimage to Jerusalem to see and understand that birthplace of Jesus' Church, as well as the death and resurrection of their Savior

 

[1miseryindex]

I don't how badly the great need for non-Catholic Christians to tear down another faith, or to spit on another's holy ground that makes one claim/insist that a people are doing something they are not. .. Don't non-Catholic Christians have something better to do than to investigate what Catholics are doing, and then to twist it into something it is not and then claim that it is? When the Catholic perspective is offered, it is kicked aside and the sniping/defamation continues a few posts (or a few threads) later.

a huge AMEN to this

I fixed it a little