I had not heard about the third item.
and did you hear that 200 subway sandwich places in the US have removed ham and bacon from their menu because of muslims.
Yes. It has nothing to do with "making demands" or "special treatment". Subways are privately owned business' and they base their menus on the clientel of the neighborhoods in which they are located. If there are high numbers of certain ethnic groups, the menu offerings reflect that. In areas where there are large numbers of Muslims, they will adjust their menu to the desires of their customers. In areas with large Jewish populations they have kosher facilities. No ham. No bacon. No dairy. Because of Jews. It's business. Not special treatment. But is anyone crying that's "creeping kosher"?
The treats, terror, aggression and demand for Islam to dominate and enforce the standards, erroneously, of sharia on everyone is going too far.
On everyone? Where? In the US?
All this nonsense is scaring people to capitulate to muslims that misuse their faith to become alphas and everyone else are submissive.
What nonsense? You mean like the Subways?
It is not about freedom of religion but making Islam dominant where ever muslims exist, even as a minority. This is not what the faith should be about, but it is what the faith is becoming. It is not about devotion or logic but threats and fear
Are you talking about the U.S.?
Islam for some of these groups is not about bringing peace of mind and nearness to allah but about using islam to express misplaced anger and vengeance on others, in the name of allah.
I agree. Every religion has it's intolerant extremists and right now Islam has a bigger than average share.
What we see in the news is an abomination, but other muslim are intimidated not to speak against these radical militants.
Except they have been speaking up and against. This has been brought up over and over and ignored.
Subway brand chain of sandwich stores in the US....................YES
This is a company that supplies each store and demands a uniformity. My chiropractor had a subway store for several years.
The menus are supposed to offer the same things in each store. To remove ham and bacon might be encapsulating to the neighborhood but it is not in an muslim country or even Israeli, it is in the US and the owner would have signed an agreement to the menu and to use the products the company supplies. If they want to make it halal or kosher, they should not use the subway brand.
When you walk into a McDonalds, you expect to see a big mac on the menu, not an all vegetarian menu. When Subway advertises bacon and you walk into the local Subway chain you expect to be able to order bacon.
Wendys burgers are made of beef and square in shape. You don't go in to order a burger and expect it to be soy instead, even in India.
You don't go to a brand name steakhouse and expect to find only fish on the menu, or an italian restaurant and find only chinese food.
If people want kosher or halal, they should go to some place that makes that fare, not walk into a pork store with a big fat pig on the sign and a reputation for the best ribs in town.
Even McDonalds isn't totally uniform. Subway is a franchise and they are allowed some alterations to their menus based on what they think will sell. It's a business decision and YES - it is in the US but the US is comprised of Jews, Muslims, Hindus, Christians and whole variety of flavors. What harm does it do if they have some kosher stores? What harm does it do if they do not serve pork products in some stores? No one complained - no one - until a store in a region with a lot of Muslim customers decided to alter their menu.
Subway ISN"T a pork store. It's a sandwitch franchise that offers a wide variety of stuff including a number of regular items. And, Muslims and Jews are Americans also. To offer Kosher isn't to be Israeli. To offer Halal isn't to be Saudi.
Muslims complained and pressured the change in 200 subways in the US. If they don't want to eat ham or bacon, fine don't order it.
Removing it from the store is arm twisting. In the US there are many choices for food, but removing one type of food from a chain's menu is forcing your wants on the rest of society.
Do you have any sources to show that is the reason why they changed - that it wasn't simply in response to customer likes/dislikes? Was that any different than it's choice to have Kosher facilities? Is removing dairy products from those stores
"arm twisting" Is it any different from Subwa's new experiment in offering Vegan choices?
If you need halal or kosher, encourage restaurants to open labeled halal or kosher. Jewish delis and restaurants have done it for decades. You don't force a national chain to create a new menu. If you want to not eat meat, you order from the salad bar, you don't demand all meat be removed from the menu. Even glaut kosher have fare that most people would recognize while still being kosher. They don't advertise pork and beans and then not use any pork.
You seem to be contradicting yourself. That seems to be exactly what Subway did. Not every subway carries the exact same menu. For example, some Subways in some locations are trying out Vegan choices - that are not available in all it's stores.
According to this article:
Subway removes pork from stores after strong demand from Muslims Daily Mail Online they chose to remove based on "customer demand" in those locations in the UK. I should point out that
"customer demand" is what drives most marketing decisions, not just the choice to offer Halal or Kosher or Vegan. Customer demand is what drives the Big Mac (and it's corresponding waistline). Activists may try to force healthier choices onto these enterprises but if the store's customers aren't buying it, they won't be selling it for long.
Subway is an international chain. "
In India, many franchises substitute lamb and chicken items for beef and pork throughout their menus, and some do not sell any meat products at all. Subway has several kosher franchises that do not carry pork products or serve dairy with meat. In the United Kingdom and Ireland, fewer than 200 out of 1,500 Subway sandwich franchises conform to Muslim dietary restrictions: their meat suppliers are certified halal, and no pork products are used. Instead, those locations use turkey products to substitute for ham and bacon. Halal stores are clearly identified by signs throughout, including on the menu panels and in the front windows."
Currently there are NO Halal Subways in the US.
This is what the Subway in India says:
Subway Restaurants International Menu Page
Our goal at each SUBWAY® restaurant is to offer a quality product that is made specific to each individual customers taste. Due to cultural and religious preferences, many SUBWAY® sandwiches that would traditionally be made with beef or pork are made instead with lamb, chicken or turkey, but you can still have a “bahut swaad” (delicious) SUBWAY® sandwich made by a “Sandwichwala” (Sandwich Artist). Lamb pepperoni and salami are popular choices at SUBWAY® restaurants in India. In addition, SUBWAY® restaurants in India feature separate ordering and preparation areas for the comfort of those purchasing vegetarian foods.
Places like McDonalds have prepackaged foods to serve hot or cold labeled halal at chains along the highways for people traveling. They are not McDonalds brand and listed on a side menu. You don't make McDonalds remove pork from the menu because you travel a lot and need a place to stop and eat. McDonald does it at courtesy at their rest stops. Too much of the american diet has some form of pork. When jews want sandwiches or burgers, they ask for it without cheese since mixing cheese and meat is not kosher. They don't demand that no cheese is allowed in stores that offer meat.
McDonalds and Subway are two different entities
with two different marketing models. So far, the only ones complaining about the Halal stores are some non-Muslims who
aren't even customers in those locations.
For people with special heath diets like no gluten, you don't demand all restaurants remove gluten from the menu or sugar for diabetics, or salt for people with heart problems. Some menus offer a few select items for those people, but they don't change the whole menu. It is like offering a child's menu, not every dish is proportioned for children or seniors.
True, but in each of those cases it's up to each business to decide how to handle it.
If you are the sole proprietor of a business you can decide what to sell and who to sell to. If you are part of a chain, you keep your service uniform.
Grocery stores don't remove all grain, bread, crackers etc. from the store, they sell gluten free items in a small section of the store. At passover grocery stores don't remove all forbidden items from the store, they set up shelves or tables covered in paper and sell passover items there. They don't demand a special lane of no pork or alcohol items (or dog care items) in a Target store. Let the cashier wear gloves no refuse to do their job because customers have haram items in their cart.
These are erroneous readings of their faith and more cultural than demanded by their religion.
Your faith is a choice you make not something to be impose on other people against their will.
Franchises are allowed a degree of latitude depending on each individual business. Quite obviously, given the examples above - there is latitude in Subway's model. Every other example is unique and up to the business owner or franchise operator to decide in accordance with the laws of the nation in which they are operating.
............and evangelical christian does not seek employment in a wiccan store. A muslim does not seek a job working in a nunnery. If you don't like children you don't apply at a nursery school. If you don't like dogs, you don't work in a kennel. If you have bee allergies you don't work as a bee keeper. You make concession, you don't force the world to change to accommodate you and your like or dislikes. I can't stand the smell of cooking oil, fat or strong spices, I don't eat at indian restaurants, I don't force everyone to change for me. I cover my face and splash a light cologne to make smells or avoid traveling in the directions of the smells. I can't walk into a department store by the make up and perfume area, I don't demand they remove those items so I can shop there. I avoid the laundry soap and clearer isles in grocery stores............. or I wear nose plugs for the few minutes I am in the store where smell are strong. I learn to shop online to avoid stores when I have to or order online and just walk in pay and leave. I can't rework the world for my specific needs.
You are mixing apples and oranges here. In the Subway example, we are talking about what CUSTOMERS want in a specific franchise location. In the above, you are talking about a whole lot of different things.
Employment: I agree. If you don't like certain things, you don't go and work where you will be involved with those things. You don't expect employers to accommodate unreasonably.
The other stuff is a matter of personal preferences and sensitivities, but even with that accommodation can be FORCED. For example smoking in public areas.
None of the above have anything to do with a franchise owners individual decision to structure his franchise in such a way as to accommodate the religious dietary laws of his clientel.
American should not be forced to bend over backwards for Islam, we welcome all faiths but not at the imposition of everyone else. Immigrant melt into the US population, no the other way around.
America is not being forced into anything because at this point there aren't even any halal Subways in the US>
All of this brings me to a final question.
Why does this bother you so much?
Subway (and likely other business') have operated kosher facilities for years in response to customer demands in certain communities. No one complained. Ever.
No one said Jews are "forcing" Americans to "bend over backwards" for Judaism. No one is saying anything about "Immigrant melt".
They've existed and run successfully serving their Jewish customers without a complaint.
Now, suddenly, there is an uproar because Subway is choosing to make some of it's franchises halal, again, in response to customer demands in certain communities.
Muslims are being accused of "forcing" Americans to "bend over backwards" for Islam. They are being accused of not "assimilating" (even though religious dietary law has nothing to do with either immigration or assimilation).
The ultimate irony is that the people in an uproar aren't even their customers and, these 200 halal franchises
aren't even in the US.
