Is our justice system now gone because of Trump?

[DonGlock26]

You are aware that in NY and before Trump was indicted, prosecuted, and then found guilty of breaking the laws, there were 9 other cases like Trump, where the same exact laws were broken, and they (like Trump) were found guilty by a jury of peers, no?

You are aware that those laws were there before Trump was even in the picture, aren't you?

You are aware that in order to indict, a grand jury has to find the laws to be correct and reasonable reason to believe the indictee could be guilty of breaking those laws, right?

You are aware that Trump was found guilty by a jury of his peers and where 6 of those peers were chosen by the defense, correct?

You are aware that if just 1 of the Jury members does not agree with the accusations, it gets throw out, no?

You are aware that there were 34 charges against Trump and that he was found guilty of ALL 34, correct?

You are aware that all of this legal process was put together by our forefathers and is in the Constitution and that it has worked this way (and worked well) for 248 years, right?

I just wanted to make sure you are aware of THE FACTS.

Now, what was that about prima facie??

Source?

 

[Independent thinker]

so freedom of speech is now gone and opening my mouth and giving my opinion and doing what the Constitution says is right, will now get me prosecuted?

Freedom of speech has been gone for quite a while. Trump is bringing it back. In fact, he signed an EO on it.

 

[Luckyone]

Source?

Survey of Past New York Felony Prosecutions for Falsifying Business Records
and here is an interesting statistic I just found that goes to show that the laws that were used to indict Trump were not "snatched from some hidden place"

Between 2014 and 2023, prosecutors in New York state filed 11,663 charges of first-degree falsifying business records. This crime is a common part of white-collar crime prosecutions in New York.

 

[berg80]

They made one small miscalculation: the voters.

The voters made one not so small miscalculation; trump.

 

[Luckyone]

Freedom of speech has been gone for quite a while. Trump is bringing it back. In fact, he signed an EO on it.

How can you say that with a straight face when facts are all against you?

Trump has made more than 100 threats to prosecute or punish perceived "enemies within"​

He is generating revenge against all the people that have opposed him. Free speech is all about allowing people to say what they think (normally those that have opposite views to yours) and doing it without worrying about persecution.

are you a total blind, brainwashed, and blathering idiot?

 

[dudmuck]

An indictment is just an accusation, it’s not evidence

Jack couldn’t prove his accusations and the charges were all dismissed

Moreover Jack was illegally appointed

To obtain an indictment, the prosecution must present evidence to a grand jury that establishes "probable cause," meaning there is a reasonable basis to believe a crime was committed by the accused, which is a lower standard of proof than required at trial; this usually includes witness testimonies, physical evidence, and documents that support the alleged crime.

 

[Care4all]

And indictment is just an accusation. An accusation can have merit and have probable cause.

An indictment is just a formal written accusation

It’s not evidence

Oh silly one, an indictment must have Probable cause that a crime was committed....that's evidence that a crime was likely committed. An accusation is all the Trump crap that he spews, without any probable cause supporting his claims. You can't charge a person of a crime and bring them to court for a trial, where the defendant gets their due process, without there being probable cause a crime was committed....it's a a legal standard needed for an arrest....accusations are simply free speech, including opinion....including wrong opinions.

 

[struth]

Oh silly one, an indictment must have Probable cause that a crime was committed....that's evidence that a crime was likely committed. An accusation is all the Trump crap that he spews, without any probable cause supporting his claims. You can't charge a person of a crime and bring them to court for a trial, where the defendant gets their due process, without there being probable cause a crime was committed....it's a a legal standard needed for an arrest....accusations are simply free speech, including opinion....including wrong opinions.

I didn’t say it didn’t need PC…but it’s still just a document that states accusations that must be proven by evidence

The indictment is not evidence

 

[struth]

To obtain an indictment, the prosecution must present evidence to a grand jury that establishes "probable cause," meaning there is a reasonable basis to believe a crime was committed by the accused, which is a lower standard of proof than required at trial; this usually includes witness testimonies, physical evidence, and documents that support the alleged crime.

I didn’t say that wasn’t true…but it’s still just a written accusation. It’s not evidence, evidence must be presented to prove the accusation at trial

Jack couldn’t do that, hence the indictments were dismissed

 

[dudmuck]

I didn’t say that wasn’t true…but it’s still just a written accusation. It’s not evidence, evidence must be presented to prove the accusation at trial

Jack couldn’t do that, hence the indictments were dismissed

it was because of DoJ policy for sitting presidents

Smith drew a direct line from Trump's actions to the events of the Capitol riot.

• After then-Vice President Pence refused to overturn the electoral college vote count in the Senate, Trump "took aim" at Pence, targeting him in his Jan. 6 rally speech and in a social media post.
• "Taken together, these actions resulted in rioters at the Capitol on January 6 singling out Mr. Pence for their ire and chanting, 'Where is Pence? Bring Him Out!' and, 'Hang Mike Pence!'" the report said.
• Trump's words also "inspired his supporters to commit acts of physical violence" by telling them to "fight like hell" against the purported election fraud.

 

[Contumacious]

it was because of DoJ policy for sitting presidents

Smith drew a direct line from Trump's actions to the events of the Capitol riot.

• After then-Vice President Pence refused to overturn the electoral college vote count in the Senate, Trump "took aim" at Pence, targeting him in his Jan. 6 rally speech and in a social media post.
• "Taken together, these actions resulted in rioters at the Capitol on January 6 singling out Mr. Pence for their ire and chanting, 'Where is Pence? Bring Him Out!' and, 'Hang Mike Pence!'" the report said.
• Trump's words also "inspired his supporters to commit acts of physical violence" by telling them to "fight like hell" against the purported election fraud.

WE THE PEOPLE, MAGA Patriots don't like it when you STEAL elections.

I assure you that next time around you will see a REAL insurrection up close and in person

 

[Leo123]

I didn’t say it didn’t need PC…but it’s still just a document that states accusations that must be proven by evidence

The indictment is not evidence

If you can't prosecute without probable cause, then how did Smith do it? There was no real evidence.

 

[struth]

it was because of DoJ policy for sitting presidents

Smith drew a direct line from Trump's actions to the events of the Capitol riot.

• After then-Vice President Pence refused to overturn the electoral college vote count in the Senate, Trump "took aim" at Pence, targeting him in his Jan. 6 rally speech and in a social media post.
• "Taken together, these actions resulted in rioters at the Capitol on January 6 singling out Mr. Pence for their ire and chanting, 'Where is Pence? Bring Him Out!' and, 'Hang Mike Pence!'" the report said.
• Trump's words also "inspired his supporters to commit acts of physical violence" by telling them to "fight like hell" against the purported election fraud.

Trump wasn’t a sitting president from 2021 to 2025

Jack and the demafacist couldn’t prove their accusations because it was a political prosecution.

 

[Leo123]

WE THE PEOPLE, MAGA Patriots don't like it when you STEAL elections.

I assure you that next time around you will see a REAL insurrection up close and in person

Yes, they really don't realize how pissed off Americans are at the Democrat party and all the lawfare. You would think they would get the hint after the landslide election for Trump.

 

[Contumacious]

If you can't prosecute without probable cause, then how did Smith do it? There was no real evidence.

The Socialist Demon Rats specialize in Criminality

 

[struth]

If you can't prosecute without probable cause, then how did Smith do it? There was no real evidence.

PC is whatever the prosecute tells the grand jury

 

[Leo123]

Trump wasn’t a sitting president from 2021 to 2025

Jack and the demafacist couldn’t prove their accusations because it was a political prosecution.

Yes, they were running around trying to claim Trump had the 'intent' to break the law. Pure lawfare and corruption by the Democrat controlled legal system.

 

[Calypso Jones]

You live in alternate universe. You make outlandish allegations without a shred of proof. Take off your Trump panties and just admit you are fine with an authoritarian leader.

right. someone lives in an alternate universe and it isn't me. You guys are the lowest of the low info voters, IF YOU DO VOTE, that i've EVER encountered. Are you stupid or just naive. because the alternative would not be a complimentary description of you.

YOUI LOST...you've had 4 years to crow...you thought it would last. IT DIDN"T. Now. take your medicine like a man, or at least shut yo mouth. Your side is wicked. How you missed that i don't know. Americans have had quite enough of democrat tyranny.

 

[whitehall]

They impeached Trump with faked evidence. They tried to put him in prison or bankrupt him on the basis of charges of frivolous accounting violations. They tried to bankrupt every supporter on frivolous never ending legal bills. Perverts from the "justice" dept invaded his home and went through his wife's underwear drawer. When all else failed they may have set Trump for two assassination attempts.. Now some left wing lesbian activist lectures Americans about 'justice"? Who wooda thunk it?

 

[BlackSand]

Look, I have been around for 79 years and I have been in 5 totally different industries and have always been at the top of each. I am a knowledge and smart individual and I have ZERO biases for anything.

I had never voted until 2020. Why had I not voted all those years and all those presidents" Because none of them was so good or so bad that my life (and the life of the nation) was going to change.

In giving you an example of the way I think. All of us are human and we ALL have good and bad in us but the key to that is that we have both good and bad in us...........not just good or not just bad. That is the norm in life and we can all deal with that scenario with a bit more effort or a bit more precaution.

Having said all of that, there are exceptions to everything in life and that means that there are people that are all good (Mother Teresa for example) or all bad (Hitler for example). This means there is evil and there is virtue and when you find one or the other, you run or you grab on for life.

Trump is evil and worse, he is incompetent. This means that he can do great and lasting damage. As such, I had to vote in 2020 and again in 2024 because this man can change my life and the lives of everyone I love and care about.

You say you have lived through a couple of decades and you are not crying about it. That is exactly where I also have been at. I had never been a political person until Trump showed up.

You (and everyone else, including me) will BE affected by this man. You need to open your eyes and using your brain and do the research and the study on who Trump is and how he literally can affect your life.

I do not know who you are or what you seek. Heck and like with many Germans, Hitler was great for them. Perhaps Trump is good for you (based on your beliefs and what you value). If you are for Trump, you need to dedicate time for a Plan B, so that if Trump falls (like Hitler fell), you can protect yourself (unlikely all of Hitlers generals that were prosecuted with him).

In my case, I value morals, ethics, principles, humanity, respect, caring for others and honesty highly. I live by those rules (and will die by them). I do believe that we have souls and that they live on to have many lives and the souls will suffer or benefit from what you do in each life. As such, I want my soul to be as clean as it can be. You may be totally the opposite of who I am and we will never agree because our souls and our values may be different.

Nonetheless, this is where I am coming from and there is nothing you can say to me that will change what I have come to believe.

.

I'll start by saying it's okay we disagree on things ...
And thanks for toning it down a notch so we can have a conversation.

No human being has zero biases ... It's human nature ... And completely unavoidable ... But that's another topic.
So, it would be better if you suggested that you try not to let your biases totally influence your decision-making process.

Unlike you, I have voted in every election possible since reaching the appropriate age ...
Munis one or two when overseas with other stuff on my mind ...
And probably twice in local stuff when I wasn't even aware that the polls were open.

Some candidates I have voted for have lost ... And many more have won ... But my 'politics' has never won.
As a Classical Liberal with a great appreciation for our Constitution and the limits it is intended to put on governmental power ...
There's rarely a candidate on either side of the aisle, or in the middle, that represents what I desire, and think is proper.
Like or not ... The last true Conservative to serve in the White House was President Coolidge ...
And that was well before either one of us was born.

I have a degree in Psychology although I never hung a shingle or practiced ...
I was prior military and disenfranchised by where that industry was headed.
We don't need to talk about good or evil as it relates to human nature ... I already know.

I don't look at things the same way you do ... Like when you mentioned 'you run or hang on for dear life'.
I am the polar opposite ... I seek out challenges ... Occasionally embrace risks ... And enjoy the 'climb' as much as getting there.
Likewise ... What I was doing when I was 20 ... Wouldn't have been allowed when you were 20 ... Just for perspective.
We come from different worlds ... And I am close to half your age.

You can say President Trump is evil ... And I can go as far as saying he is not the pillar of virtue.
You can say President Trump is incompetent ... Yet he is President, and you are not ... Which kind of trumps your judgement there.
It's true the President can have a significant effect on the lives of many People ... But that goes for any President.
I hadn't been particularly impressed by many ... And prefer limited government over expanding the power of the Federal Government.

Don't be mistaken ... My eyes are open, and my course is clear.
Maybe, unfortunately for you and the people you care about ... Your life is tied too close to the government and what it can provide.
No matter what President Trump does ... The same as with President Biden who I despised (which is another topic) ...
My course will remain true, and I will survive him like I have many others.

I don't need to change your beliefs ... I am not your keeper.
I would suggest that you are a terrible litigator ... And it probably wouldn't be a good Idea to start practicing law at your age.
President Trump is not good for me personally as a benefit to my position in life or personal desires ... I can handle that myself.
President Trump is beneficial to me politically, because he can damage the Establishment ...
That has been holding our government hostage for almost 5 decades.

And rest assured that the rule of Law has not completely been abandoned ... It's been here longer than we have and will remain.
If politics frightens you ... If the state of our nation frightens you ... Just think about a saying I saw the other day.

"We are a ghost, wearing a meat sack, driving a skeleton, riding a rock made of stardust, hurling through space ...
Fear Nothing ... "

Thanks again ... Good luck in your endeavors ... Have a lovey evening.

.​