Is anyone happy with the cap and trade bill?

[editec]

Chris people who live in places like Seattle - less than forty days of sunshine a year - need solar panels like you need an additional hole in your head. And why whould you want old obsoleter\ technology on peoples roofs? We got better things than those old evironmentally nasty things in the pipeline.

Chris has it pointed out to him that S.Cal and Ariz. for instance have different weather factors than Maine or Wash. Etc,thus making standardize roofing nation wide ridiculous....but he just comes back advocating the same roofing for all....

Given the total amount of sunny days we have in Maine, add to that fact the problem of snow covering the solar panels and investing in solar panels here is not really such a good idea.

Maine's energy solutions will be found with some combination of biofuel (wood), nuclear, wind and tidal power.

The potential of tapping the wind in the Gulf of Maine (once the technology is worked out) will generate enough energy to run much of New England, or so we're being told by former Governor King.

 

[KittenKoder]

Nuclear ... the true answer, the perfect solution ... still demonized by the same people who want to get rid of oil consumption. It's the only real solution as well, cleaner and safer than coal, easier and more efficient than oil ... consumes less space than any "green" alternative and is far more reliable. One of the many unused plants could produce far more than a thousand solar plants at less than a quarter of the space. Go figure they don't want that alternative.

 

[Sinatra]

Agreed.

This country's refusal to transform nuclear into our #1 domestic source of energy is idiotic and dangerous to our security.

Instead, we have an administration embracing wind farms and solar panels, while at the same time attempting to destroy cleaner burning coal technology.

Good lord we have really lost our way...

 

[Harry Dresden]

Every house representative that voted yes on this massive fraud should be tossed out on their ears...For the senators that are playing this game we should also take note and send them packing also.

one can only hope Rodi........

 

[Care4all]

Here ya go Care, the main reason this bill should be scrapped....This is what Navy has been trying to get across to everyone. WE SHOULD NEVER EVER HAVE REPRESENTATIVES IN OUR GOVERNMENT THAT ARE WILLING TO USURP POWER TO ANY FOREIGN COUNTRY, FORMER POLITICIAN, CORPORATION OR MONOPOLY....There are legislators that need to be tossed out on their asses for doing this already.

1 ‘‘SEC. 728. INTERNATIONAL EMISSION ALLOWANCES. ‘‘(a) QUALIFYING PROGRAMS.—The Administrator, in consultation with the Secretary of State, may by rule
designate an international climate change program as a qualifying international program if— ‘‘(1) the program is run by a national or supra national foreign government, and imposes a mandatory absolute tonnage limit on greenhouse gas emissions from 1 or more foreign countries, or from 1 or more economic sectors in such a country or coun11
tries; and ‘‘(2) the program is at least as stringent as the program established by this title, including provisions to ensure at least comparable monitoring, compliance, enforcement, quality of offsets, and restrictions on the use of offsets. ‘‘(b) DISQUALIFIED ALLOWANCES.—An international emission allowance may not be held under section
19 722(d)(2) if it is in the nature of an offset instrument or allowance awarded based on the achievement of greenhouse gas emission reductions or avoidance, or greenhouse
gas sequestration, that are not subject to the mandatory absolute tonnage limits referred to in subsection (a)(1).

Ok, not certain at all what this means but as a layman on the topic, it seems to me that this is saying that the Secretary of State along with the administrator, can make the decision as to whether a foreign country, such as Canada, who sells us their electricity, is given some sort of clean allowances?????

I don't understand the concern, probably because I don't understand all the mumbo jumbo...

do you have a link so i can read this in context?

Care

 

[RodISHI]

Ok, not certain at all what this means but as a layman on the topic, it seems to me that this is saying that the Secretary of State along with the administrator, can make the decision as to whether a foreign country, such as Canada, who sells us their electricity, is given some sort of clean allowances?????

I don't understand the concern, probably because I don't understand all the mumbo jumbo...

do you have a link so i can read this in context?Here is a link to the short title of bill that pass the senate yet it does not link to the body of each section.



Care

Search Results - THOMAS (Library of Congress)


Here a link to the entire bill that pass the House....

http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=111_cong_bills&docid=f:h2454eh.txt.pdf
These are the two links I referred. The second one is complete in PDF. It is what has already went through the House.
Part D, ___OFFSETS

Who is cashing in on offset credits---aka carbon credit....

Creators of carbon credit scheme cashing in on it...
By Judi McLeod
Tuesday, March 13, 2007
There's an elephant in global warming's living room that few in the mainstream media want to talk about: the creators of the carbon credit scheme are the ones cashing in on it........cont'

The skeptics of man-made global warming believe that Gore and Strong have made climate change "the new religion". Climate change is not the first religion both parties have tried to make stick. Along with former Soviet Union leader Mikhail Gorbachev, Strong, currently president of the Earth Council, has been boasting of replacing the Ten Commandments with the Earth Charter, a golden rule guide for how the masses should treat the environment.

Cap and Trade is a way to strip the masses of more of their hard earned labor and money.

Gore Invests In Carbon Credit Company, Will Media Care?
By Noel Sheppard
June 4, 2008 Generation Investment Management, the private equity fund chaired by former U.S. vice president Al Gore, has acquired a 9.5 percent stake in Camco International Ltd, a carbon asset developer.

Generation, set up in 2004 by Gore and David Blood, former chief of Goldman Sachs's asset management arm, now holds 16 million Camco shares, Camco said in a statement.

Camco, which has one of the world's largest carbon credit portfolios, works with companies to identify and develop projects that reduce greenhouse gas emissions and then arranges the sale and delivery of carbon credits.

Prior to 2003 part of the bankers new the gig was up so they formed a new game call called "carbon credits" heck of an idea to suck more of the wealth from the masses.

The Money and Connections Behind Al Gore’s Carbon Crusade

Oct 3, 2007 ... A World Bank blog called the Private Sector Development Blog regularly features items touting Al Gore and the concept of carbon credits. ...
"Connect the Dots

In June 2006, the World Bank announced that it, too, had joined CCX, saying that it intended to offset its greenhouse gas emissions by purchasing emission credits through CCX. The bank says its credits would contribute to restoring 4,600 hectares of degraded pastureland in Costa Rica. Somehow, CCX has figured out that this is an amount equivalent to 22,000 metric tons of emission that the bank calculates are created by its activities.

A World Bank blog called the Private Sector Development Blog regularly features items touting Al Gore and the concept of carbon credits. Its articles typically announce corporate “green” initiatives in which carbon credits are said to cancel out “bad” CO2 emissions released by a company’s activities.

In fact, the World Bank now operates a Carbon Finance Unit that conducts research on how to develop and trade carbon credits. The bank works with Italy, the Netherlands, Denmark and Spain to set up carbon-credit funds in each country to purchase emission credits from firms for use in developing countries. In addition, it runs the Carbon Fund for Europe helping countries meet their Kyoto Protocol requirements. These funds are traded on the ECX (half of which is owned by CCX, itself a creature of Al Gore’s firm, Generation Investment Management). Can we connect the dots?

A website affiliated with An Inconvenient Truth invites concerned citizens to personally fight global warming by offsetting their “carbon footprint.” The ways to do that include changing over to fluorescent light bulbs and turning down your thermostat at home. But the website also urges Americans to offset their personal CO2 emissions by “buying” carbon offsets from a native-American-owned company called Native Energy. Native Energy promotes “renewable” wind energy by buying and selling carbon-emission credits and futures for wind turbine projects on Indian reservations.

What the website doesn’t mention is that that the founder of Native Energy, energy industry veteran Tom Boucher, also founded a marketing company called Green Mountain Energy, a CCX associate partner that describes itself as “the nation’s leading retail provider of cleaner energy and carbon-offset solutions. Green Mountain offers residential, business, institutional and governmental customers an easy way to purchase cleaner, affordable electricity products, as well as the opportunity to offset their carbon footprint.” In other words, Green Mountain sells advisory services to energy users, alerting them to opportunities to contribute to or invest in groups like Native Energy.

So it seems banks and investment houses are going green, eager to enter an emerging emissions market. Meanwhile, environmentalists are discovering new ways to get rich while believing they are saving polar bears and rainforests."
Gore’s Non-profit Agitators..........cont'
Force Everyone to Play........cont'

As the trend was seen as a wave of the future more banking types started buying into bio fuel....

This is worse than the large national banks loaning out everyone's retirement funds on "Blue Sky" collecting the losses from the federal guarantees while paying themselves billions of dollars!

 

[Barb]

Nuclear ... the true answer, the perfect solution ... still demonized by the same people who want to get rid of oil consumption. It's the only real solution as well, cleaner and safer than coal, easier and more efficient than oil ... consumes less space than any "green" alternative and is far more reliable. One of the many unused plants could produce far more than a thousand solar plants at less than a quarter of the space. Go figure they don't want that alternative.

Where do you plan to store the nuclear waste? Plutonium has a half-life of 24,300 years. You do know it has to be securely stored for 12,150,000 years. Heaven only knows why everyone has their knickers in a twist. Chernobyl was no big deal.

 

[KittenKoder]

Nuclear ... the true answer, the perfect solution ... still demonized by the same people who want to get rid of oil consumption. It's the only real solution as well, cleaner and safer than coal, easier and more efficient than oil ... consumes less space than any "green" alternative and is far more reliable. One of the many unused plants could produce far more than a thousand solar plants at less than a quarter of the space. Go figure they don't want that alternative.

Where do you plan to store the nuclear waste? Plutonium has a half-life of 24,300 years. You do know it has to be securely stored for 12,150,000 years. Heaven only knows why everyone has their knickers in a twist. Chernobyl was no big deal.

1. They have a facility that's capable of storing as much as we need to the next thousand years safely just sitting there wasting tax dollars.

2. It's not nearly as "dangerous" as they claim. The really odd thing about this claim is that it was made by the same people everyone is so against now, the oil companies ... LOL

3. Chernobyl, as was already proven, is a very bad example and people who keep using it are morons, sorry but that's a fact. You know so little about the subject when you use Chernobyl or 3-Mile Island as an example. Aside from the huge strides in technology since those times, both plants were poorly maintained, Chernobyl especially, and run by people who knew nothing about nuclear plants, so epic fail there.

 

[Barb]

Here ya go Care, the main reason this bill should be scrapped....This is what Navy has been trying to get across to everyone. WE SHOULD NEVER EVER HAVE REPRESENTATIVES IN OUR GOVERNMENT THAT ARE WILLING TO USURP POWER TO ANY FOREIGN COUNTRY, FORMER POLITICIAN, CORPORATION OR MONOPOLY....There are legislators that need to be tossed out on their asses for doing this already.

1 ‘‘SEC. 728. INTERNATIONAL EMISSION ALLOWANCES. ‘‘(a) QUALIFYING PROGRAMS.—The Administrator, in consultation with the Secretary of State, may by rule
designate an international climate change program as a qualifying international program if— ‘‘(1) the program is run by a national or supra national foreign government, and imposes a mandatory absolute tonnage limit on greenhouse gas emissions from 1 or more foreign countries, or from 1 or more economic sectors in such a country or coun11
tries; and ‘‘(2) the program is at least as stringent as the program established by this title, including provisions to ensure at least comparable monitoring, compliance, enforcement, quality of offsets, and restrictions on the use of offsets. ‘‘(b) DISQUALIFIED ALLOWANCES.—An international emission allowance may not be held under section
19 722(d)(2) if it is in the nature of an offset instrument or allowance awarded based on the achievement of greenhouse gas emission reductions or avoidance, or greenhouse
gas sequestration, that are not subject to the mandatory absolute tonnage limits referred to in subsection (a)(1).

"Foreign Policy Powers

The president or his designated representative, such as the Secretary of State, has the exclusive authority to communicate with other nations, recognize foreign governments, receive ambassadors, and make executive agreements. Throughout U.S. history, Congress and the courts have granted the president great deference in conducting foreign policy. This deference is based, in part, on the need for one person, rather than 535 members of Congress, to represent and speak for a national constituency.

These powers were illustrated in the aftermath of the september 11, 2001, terrorist attacks on New York City and Washington, D.C. President george w. bush warned the Taliban government of Afghanistan to surrender Osama bin Laden and other terrorists or face the possibility of war. In the months leading up to the March 2003 invasion of Iraq, President Bush, Secretary of State Colin Powell, and other representatives lobbied the United Nations for support of the U.S. position on Iraq.

In addition to the authority to recognize foreign governments, the president is empowered by Article II to make treaties with foreign nations, subject to the consent of the Senate. A treaty is an agreement between two or more nations containing promises to behave in specified ways.

Executive agreements are international compacts that the president makes with foreign nations without the approval of the Senate. They do not have the same legal status as treaties unless they are subsequently ratified by the Senate. The Constitution does not expressly give the president the power to make executive agreements. However, this power has been inferred from the president's general constitutional authority over foreign affairs. At one time, executive agreements involved minor matters, such as postal relations and the use of radio frequencies. Since the 1930s, however, presidents have negotiated important foreign policy issues through these agreements rather than through treaties. The Supreme Court has recognized that an executive agreement is legally equivalent to a treaty and therefore the supreme law of the land. Executive agreements enable the president to achieve results while avoiding the uncertainty of treaty ratification."
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Presidential+Powers

Good luck. I hope this helps

 

[Navy1960]

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rHOxnZDbDU]YouTube - Quest to Read the Waxman-Markey Cap-and-Trade Bill Because Congress Won't[/ame]

and people wonder how we end up with bills like this? Well one thing for sure I now know what they meant by "Change" that will the "Change" in my pocket after my food bill goes up,gas, utilities, taxes, because thats all that most people will have left. NOW THATS CHANGE WE CAN BELIEVE IN!!