More to the point when did Israel annexe the west bank, as Jordan did illegally in 1949. The fact is the west bank and gaza are disputed territories until the P.A. negotiate peace and mutual borders. So to even try and compare Israel/Palestine with Russia/Ukraine is like trying to compare lemons to sugar cane
Interesting Questionaire for Palestinian Advocates
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More to the point when did Israel annexe the west bank, as Jordan did illegally in 1949. The fact is the west bank and gaza are disputed territories until the P.A. negotiate peace and mutual borders. So to even try and compare Israel/Palestine with Russia/Ukraine is like trying to compare lemons to sugar cane
How about you let the world know when you can treat Jews as human beings with the legal right to defend themselves against ISLAMONAZI TERRORISM without being demonised and racially abused. Comparing Israel/Palestine with Russia/Ukraine is like comparing an F1 car with a child's pedal car. At no time has Israel annexed any part of Palestine, and it has no intentions of doing so. If the Palestinians want the occupation/blocked lifting then all they need do is stop the terrorism and reach agreement on peace and mutual borders. Israel has a proven track record of honesty and integrity when it comes to treaties, what have the Palestinians got in its stead ?
Phoenal - the comparison stands when you look at what Daniyel is actually saying in regards to Israel and the West Bank. He is sayin they are NOT disputed (or, as internationally recognized - occupied) territories. He is saying the entire West Bank is Israel's to do as it wishes and all those who are not Israeli citizens are illegal aliens regardless of the fact that they have lived there for generations and centuries nor will they be given citizenship unless they are Jewish or their parents are already citizens. They will thus be evicted somewhere.
So given those points -I made the comparison to Russia/Ukraine EXCEPT that when Russia annexed a territory or was given a territory- it took the people with it and gave them Russian citizenship.
I'm not saying Israel is like Russia - I'm saying Daniyel's view of it is comparable.
How about you take the time to actually read what people post instead of this knee-jerk ISLAMONAZI bullcrap?
Learn to read instead of jumping on someone's post without bothering to read the entire conversation and assuming things.
The comparison with Russia was made in a very specific context that you have clearly missed.
It is not what I'm saying, I'm saying something you tend to ignore, the West Bank belong to Jordan, the fact Israel exchanged it with Jordan doesn't mean Israel got the Palestinian burden included - Jordan simply refused to take them but Israel couldn't leave the West Bank so Israel was forced to stay with hostile Arabs in the West Bank - The people live in the West Bank are illegal aliens indeed but not because they are stateless, its more because they suppose to be Jordanians, the fact they lived under Jordanian rule first means they should have Jordanian ID and NOT Israeli ID(*Some of them does), Jordan didn't accept another refugees - whatever, blame Jordan I don't care about that much, but it doesn't mean are Israelis by default because Israel own JORDANIAN territory - They are hostile Arab -supposed to be-Jordanian refugees, Jordanians cannot enter Israel without permit which is why they are given a Green ID (Temp ID) and that's settles it, why do you want to give them Israeli ID again? Israel doesn't give every terrorist captured an Israeli ID - can you see the difference? I can't.
Yes, I do see a difference. First off - no one recognizes West Bank as belonging to Israel in any legal sense - not even the Israeli courts.
Second - even if we say, yes it does - the people go with the territory in any modern civilized society.
It's like when US took territory from Mexico. What happened to the Mexicans living there?
When Russia annexed Crimea - what happened to the Ukrainians living there?
P F Tinmore
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What is the dispute? I don't see one.
P F Tinmore
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The Israeli Supreme Court treat them as 'Temp Residents' status, the WB - Israeli Territory due to the situation held on temporarily as well, it doesn't mean its Palestinian land or anything - don't hang on this one.
The WB Palestinians remained by majority hostile to Israel, the US have zero problem allowing Mexicans a citizenship because it doesn't put the US at the risk Israel stand by giving the WBP Israeli ID, more I can say that Israel gave them temporarily ID, why giving non-Israelis an Israeli ID - a praise for fighting Israel? if they wasn't trying to get their own state it couldn't be much of a problem, but they want to dance in two weddings the same time!
lol - What do you think will happen if Israel would give them Israeli ID? lets go with it, the WB will become a Palestinian state (hostile as usual) with Israeli ID Palestinians that also have Palestinian ID of that future state? nah.The way the WB is considered is a 'Jordanian occupied territory under Israeli control due to peace treaty' respected by both sides, this is Israeli-Jordanian relation only - Jordan which respect the agreement see the WB as Israeli territory.
Palestinians doesn't deserve a state, assuming they do, why not taking a part of the Jordanian land perhaps? Israel security is limited not to mention the land, and the WB Palestinians suppose to be Jordanians, why don't they respect the peace-treaty with Israel-Jordan over the WB? I never heard the refugees in Jordan in our time (58 R.Camps) or the Palestinians living under Egyptian/Jordanian in the past asking for land as well - Israeli Apartheid - the fact they don't respect the peace-treaty and claim the rights of Jordanian residents at once (I won't go far and say they suppose to be citizens)
They are refusing to accept the peace-treaty with Israel and Jordan - and the WB territory - which means they are not in a position to be considered Jordanian, but neither Israeli, this what bugs me the most is the fact they denied statehood 3(00) times in the past and they try to shot all direction claiming to be NOT refugees under Jordanian authority(was) but still deserve Israeli ID because they are refugees, you see the absurd?
They want everything at once, the difference is the perspective.
You might be thinking they are poor refugees stuck between a rock and a hard place, but they are absolutely not, they Palestinians are simply want everything from everyone, the "MEMEMEME" mentality, all in order to destroy us, I see it from Israeli perspective, you might be neutral so you don't see the entire picture of the Israeli side, the Palestinians always seek to destroy Israel - all means necessary - and by saying Palestinians I ignore the misfortune 30%? of them.. take a look on the elections in Gaza, 87% voted for terrorist organizations in 2006 - VERY HOSTILE - to Israel, Abbas is a holocaust denier Fatah(Terrorist organization) made pact with Hamas, Arafat - PFLP, the 'Shaking off' doesn't represent a situation where they actually WANT to be Israelis, the 'Catastrophe' doesn't represent peace-seeking neighbors, Countless terror attacks, the only difference between Hamas and Fatah is if they allow negotiating with Israel or not - Fatah agree to negotiate with Israel just like trading Bob with Talibans - to achieve better position against the enemy..Hamas say lets fight and die..the Gazans? support them.. but Israel still trying to negotiate, insanity.
All Palestinian authorities fail on this one, they want Palestinian state for themselves PLUS Israeli ID for all Palestinians..the WB Palestinians mostly want Israeli ID because they Jordan REFUSED to accept them and they don't want statehood - the PA just playing with them like Hamas play with the Gazans..
What about when Jordan annexed the International city of Jerusalem inhabited by mainly Jews, did they take the people that went with the territory. Or did they ethnically cleanse them from the whole of the west bank using force of arms and violence. Stealing their land and property and giving their homes to the arab muslims. Destroying their Synagogues and denying them access to their holy sites. Now when you can show that the Jews have done this to every arab muslim then you will have a point, but while it is just targeted at possible terrorist CHILD MURDERERS then you are just showing your NAZI ANTI SEMITIC JAE HATRED
While you believe the LIES put out by an ISLAMONAZI with his own agenda then you wont. But the fact remains that Palestine had no borders after Syria and trans Jordan were created on land inside the temporary borders of Palestine. This is why under customary INTERNATIONAL LAW THE PALESTINIANS HAVE TO NEGOTIATE MUTUAL BORDERS WITH ALL OF IT NEIGHBOURS
P F Tinmore
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None of Palestine's borders are disputed by any of its neighbors. What is there to negotiate?
Hossfly
ZIONIST
Just exactly where are those borders located, Tinmore?
P F Tinmore
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Hossfly
ZIONIST
"Rotsa ruck".
~~Scooby DD
Because it is not solely up to them, Israel also has to agree to take them as citizens. That is where the problems will start as all the Palestinians will demand Israeli citizenship as a right and not as a concession, and they will create trouble in the process. Better to leave them to decide if they want free determination and a government capable of running the country and not relying on handouts, charity and what they can mooch. The first step would be to stop paying the terrorists and their families "pensions" when they are put in prison or killed by their own weapons.
Don't you............. Then were is the link to the treaty signed on behalf of the Palestinian people by a Palestinian representative that sets out the mutually agreed borders with it neighbours. As you are fond of reminding people outside illegal interference can not decide Palestine's free determination, so the LoN treaties cant set its borders as thia is illegal outside interference. Now Israel, Egypt and Jordan have collectively agreed mutual borders with each other, but not with Palestine leaving the territory disputed as to who legally owns it.
That is the dispute WHO CONTROLS THE LAND AND UNDER WHICH TREATY
Then who did it belong to after the arab muslims lost control over 1000 years ago. The LoN did not hand ownership of the land over to any Palestinian government under the terms of the mandate, but Jordan was allowed to annexe the land and to grant the arab muslims Jordanian citizenship. The arab muslims agreed to become Jordanian citizens in 1949 and handing ownership of tha land to Jordan. When the PLO tried to steal all of Jordan by violent terrorist means the Jordanian king ordered 50,000 Palestinians killed as a warning of what would happen if they did not cease. He then took away the Jordanian citizenship of all Palestinians and gave up all claims to the land. This made the Palestinians stateless and the land ownerless. Unless you know something different from a non partisan source like the UN ?
The Israeli Supreme Court treat them as 'Temp Residents' status, the WB - Israeli Territory due to the situation held on temporarily as well, it doesn't mean its Palestinian land or anything - don't hang on this one.
The WB Palestinians remained by majority hostile to Israel, the US have zero problem allowing Mexicans a citizenship because it doesn't put the US at the risk Israel stand by giving the WBP Israeli ID, more I can say that Israel gave them temporarily ID, why giving non-Israelis an Israeli ID - a praise for fighting Israel? if they wasn't trying to get their own state it couldn't be much of a problem, but they want to dance in two weddings the same time!
The way the WB is considered is a 'Jordanian occupied territory under Israeli control due to peace treaty' respected by both sides, this is Israeli-Jordanian relation only - Jordan which respect the agreement see the WB as Israeli territory.
Palestinians doesn't deserve a state, assuming they do, why not taking a part of the Jordanian land perhaps? Israel security is limited not to mention the land, and the WB Palestinians suppose to be Jordanians, why don't they respect the peace-treaty with Israel-Jordan over the WB? I never heard the refugees in Jordan in our time (58 R.Camps) or the Palestinians living under Egyptian/Jordanian in the past asking for land as well - Israeli Apartheid - the fact they don't respect the peace-treaty and claim the rights of Jordanian residents at once (I won't go far and say they suppose to be citizens)
They are refusing to accept the peace-treaty with Israel and Jordan - and the WB territory - which means they are not in a position to be considered Jordanian, but neither Israeli, this what bugs me the most is the fact they denied statehood 3(00) times in the past and they try to shot all direction claiming to be NOT refugees under Jordanian authority(was) but still deserve Israeli ID because they are refugees, you see the absurd?
They want everything at once, the difference is the perspective.
You might be thinking they are poor refugees stuck between a rock and a hard place, but they are absolutely not, they Palestinians are simply want everything from everyone, the "MEMEMEME" mentality, all in order to destroy us, I see it from Israeli perspective, you might be neutral so you don't see the entire picture of the Israeli side, the Palestinians always seek to destroy Israel - all means necessary - and by saying Palestinians I ignore the misfortune 30%? of them.. take a look on the elections in Gaza, 87% voted for terrorist organizations in 2006 - VERY HOSTILE - to Israel, Abbas is a holocaust denier Fatah(Terrorist organization) made pact with Hamas, Arafat - PFLP, the 'Shaking off' doesn't represent a situation where they actually WANT to be Israelis, the 'Catastrophe' doesn't represent peace-seeking neighbors, Countless terror attacks, the only difference between Hamas and Fatah is if they allow negotiating with Israel or not - Fatah agree to negotiate with Israel just like trading Bob with Talibans - to achieve better position against the enemy..Hamas say lets fight and die..the Gazans? support them.. but Israel still trying to negotiate, insanity.
All Palestinian authorities fail on this one, they want Palestinian state for themselves PLUS Israeli ID for all Palestinians..the WB Palestinians mostly want Israeli ID because they Jordan REFUSED to accept them and they don't want statehood - the PA just playing with them like Hamas play with the Gazans..
Nothing stopping them from having Israeli ID, it is Israeli citizenship that is the problem
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