Interesting Questionaire for Palestinian Advocates

[ForeverYoung436]

Oh! That's becoming a cool point! So, when does/did Russia allegedly annex the Eastern Ukraine? Need facts! We can't base our holier-than-the-pope posture argument on a creative lie, can we?

Let me know when you can articulate a response that actually makes sense.

Let me know, when "you" can articulate an argument point that, actually, isn't based on a lie.

Crimea, annexed by Russia, was part of Eastern Ukraine. How is that a lie?

 

[Phoenall]

I dislike questionnaires like that because their primary purpose is to legitimize the disenfranchisment and rights of a people. That's all it is.

The right to a homeland, a state, self-determination is not dependendent on who was there longer than who.

Israel was re-created. It had not existed for thousands of years. It has no more or less legitimacy than Palestine.

The Palestinians owned less than 1 % of the total land area of the mandate of Palestine as laid down by the LoN. The Jews owned 7% giving them the greater claim, the remainder was owned by the LoN who gave it to the Jews for the NATIONAL HOME OF THE JEWS. The arab muslims had the least legal claim as they had not controlled the land for over 1,000 years and the LoN had already given them 80% of the land. So they had a homeland, self determination and a nation already. It was just pure ISLAMONAZI greed for everything that caused the problems, and the UN should have sent in the troops to put down the ISLAMONAZI uprising

 

[Phoenall]

I dislike questionnaires like that because their primary purpose is to legitimize the disenfranchisment and rights of a people. That's all it is.

The right to a homeland, a state, self-determination is not dependendent on who was there longer than who.

Israel was re-created. It had not existed for thousands of years. It has no more or less legitimacy than Palestine.

Uhm, the UN voted Yes, due to the history of wars the land belong to present state of Israel, therefore the Palestinians have no claim at all.. including over Gaza - according to you.

According to me? How on earth do you derive that?

What I said is that the Palestinians have as much right to a homeland as the Jews do and basing rights on who was around thousands of years ago is ridiculous.

And who stopped them from creating a homeland in the first place, at the same time attempting to remove the Jews rights to a homeland and free determination. And you support and defend the actions by the ISLAMONAZIS to this day in trying to wipe out the Jews and render them ethnically cleansed from the land

 

[docmauser1]

Let me know when you can articulate a response that actually makes sense.

Let me know, when "you" can articulate an argument point that, actually, isn't based on a lie.

Crimea, annexed by Russia, was part of Eastern Ukraine. How is that a lie?

Part's a keyword, of course. How about a referendum? Any ethnic ukrainians booted en masse out of Crimea? So, when does/did Russia annex the Eastern Ukraine?

 

[Phoenall]

I do agree, Daniyel, these people most definitely deserve a home of their own. Their suffering has gone on far too long. It is heartbreaking. As their brethren control 99.6% of the middle east I am sure one of those arab lands can help them to return and get settled in a place they can flourish and be happy in. I wish them the best.

Why? Their so-called "brethran" represent a variety of nationalities and ethnic groups. The only thing they may have in common in some cases is their religion. That was one of the big mistakes in the Partition of India - thinking that because the Bengali's happened to be Muslim, they belonged with Pakistan, yet they were culturally very different from the Pakistanis. Hence, eventually, the formation of Bangladesh.

Why would you want to forceably relocate people who's families have lived there, in some cases, as long as some of the Jews? That's known as Ethnic Cleansing.

They have a right to live where they live and to have a state of their own. It's the only just solution.

The vast majority cant go back further than the 1870's for habitual living in the land, in fact many cant go back any further than the 1920's - 1930's when they migrated to the land illegally. The demographics tell the story better than any history book could, as there is no way a primitive people with one of the worst live birth records at the time could double the population in 2 years. You will find that those arab muslims who had been around since 637 C.E. are the ones living in Israel as full Israeli citizens. The rest had nothing to hold them to the land so they left in may 1948 at the request of the arab league.
How about the ethnic cleansing of Jews from Palestine in 1948 - 1949, real ethnic cleansing were they were beaten and some murdered by the arab muslims, forcibly removed from their land and homes and their goods stolen leaving them with just the clothes on their backs. Many could trace their occupation back 4,500 years to the same piece of land. Or do you ignore this reality because it does not meet with your ANTI SEMITIC remit.

They were given the option and turned it down in favour of war and bloodshed. Then they exercised free determination and became Egyptian and Jordanian until the PLO decided they wanted it all and went to war against Jordan. This resulted in 50,000 Palestinians being shot inside the concentration camps as an object lesson. But not one pro Palestinian addresses this atrocity because no Jews were involved, even though more Palestinians were mass murdered in one month than the Jews have managed to kill in 66 years of defending themselves from Palestinian terrorism.

 

[P F Tinmore]

As always, I am asking that anyone who responds to this questionaire would do so in a thoughtful and polite manner. This is a subject that needs to be addressed in order to come to some foundational truths. Nevertheless, let us stay on topic and discuss the matter as it pertains to advocates of Israel and advocates of Palestinians. Thank you.

The following is a questionaire that was put together by an author who I had the pleasure of meeting many years ago. They have written many great articles on subject matter addressing middle east conflicts. Here is the questionaire ......I will only put a small portion of the full questionaire up and you all can click the link to read it in its' entirety. Thanks for reading!
AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

If you are so sure that "Palestine”, the country, goes back through most of recorded history, I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about Palestine:

1. When was it founded and by whom?

1924, League of Nations


Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture


British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.

7. Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

George, I truly appreciate your answering the first 7 questions on the questionaire and before I respond I would like you to answer the rest of them. Here they are: Link first.

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

8. Was Palestine ever recognized by a country whose existence, at that time or now, leaves no room for interpretation?

It was. When the Palestinians first declared independence in 1948, five countries recognized Palestine. Palestine was accepted into the Arab League as a member state in 1974. The mandate itself called Palestine a country numerous times.

9. What was the language of Palestine?

Arabic.

10. What was the prevalent religion of the country of Palestine?

At the turn of the 20th century, Palestine was about 15% Christians, 5% Jews, and the remainder were mostly Muslim with an insignificant number of others.

11. What was the name of its currency? Choose any date in history and tell what was the approximate exchange rate of the Palestinian monetary unit against the US dollar, German mark, GB pound, Japanese yen, or Chinese Yuan on that date.

As part of its mandate to bring Palestine to independence, Britain created the Palestinian Pound. I assume that its value was intended to follow the value of the British Pound.

12. And, finally, since there is no such country today, what caused its demise and when did it occur?

Whether Palestine is a country or not is subject to political opinion. Palestine was a country until the 1949 armistice agreements divided it into three areas of occupation. That wiped Palestine off the map.

Legally Palestine still exists. Politically it does not.

* Finally, the author of the questionaire concludes with one Last question here:

You are lamenting the "low sinking" of a "once proud" nation. Please tell me, when exactly was that "nation" proud and what was it so proud of?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRznT1PVDOg]Palestine Pre-1947 - YouTube[/ame]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwVCiN47a40]Lost cities of Palestine | Al Jazeera World | Al Jazeera English - YouTube[/ame]

And here is the least sarcastic question of all: If the people you mistakenly call "Palestinians" are anything but generic Arabs collected from all over -- or thrown out of -- the Arab world, if they really have a genuine ethnic identity that gives them right for self-determination, why did they never try to become independent until Arabs suffered their devastating defeat in the Six Day War?

I hope you avoid the temptation to trace the modern day "Palestinians" to the Biblical Philistines: substituting etymology for history won't work here.

I think there is still some of of that blood there somewhere. Palestine was the center of everything being between Africa, Asia, and Europe. Palestine has seen many conquests and a lot of commerce. A lot of people have come and gone. However the is a core of people who stayed and put down roots. Those are the Palestinians. Palestinians range from blond with blue eyes to dark with kinky hair. Not that any of that matters. Look at the US.
__________________________

And that concludes the 7 questions on the questionaire and the final question from the author, George. Again, I thank you for your willingness to participate in attempting to answer the questionaire honestly and to the best of your ability because so far? You are the only one who has made the attempt. I thank you, George. Sincerely, Jeremiah[/quote]

BTW, where did you get George?

Paul
(Paul Francis Tinmore)

 

[Phoenall]

Israel has always been willing to give land for peace. Israel gave back land to Egypt in exchange for peace. They are willing to give the Palestinians land in exchange for peace. But Hamas doesn't want peace, they are a death cult....

Zander, that baby in your avatar is absolutely darling! I love that photo! I believe you are right in that Israel has always sought to find a way to be at peace with her neighbors and also those who sought refuge there. She has been wonderful when considering the medical needs of other peoples, the arabs, the people even over in Ethiopia! Many nations medical doctors from Israel have done their very best for and their generosity has not gone un-noticed by Americans such as myself. On the subject of the land - it was an interesting point the author made that I am wondering - could someone answer it point for point? Fill in the "blanks" so to speak? I do not know. We shall see.

I think Cuba has more doctors working outside of country than Israel. That does go un-noticed.

You think do you, or is it a hope that they do so you can attack the Jews with yet another unproven fact..............

 

[Phoenall]

According to me? How on earth do you derive that?

What I said is that the Palestinians have as much right to a homeland as the Jews do and basing rights on who was around thousands of years ago is ridiculous.

You missed the important part, the fact Palestinians been here before Israel doesn't apply as much as Jews doesn't apply, this goes both directions except the UN voted for the state of Israel, but not over a state of Palestinians - all the so called occupied territories belong to Israel NOW and ever since they were exchanged by their legal owners (Egypt, Jordan) - the Palestinians no long have claim on the land which is now Israel because they are simply not Israelis, of course they deserve a homeland and even a state - but not in Israel.

That's legally debatable. But, if indeed all those territories belong to Israel, than so do the Palestinian people. They need to be given full Israeli citizenship and rights.

I agree completely, but only if they can pass the same criteria that they have put in place for the Jews. That is they were living in Palestine prior to the formation of Zionism and only then would they legible for citizenship of Israel. If it is good enough for the arab muslims then it must be good enough for the Israeli's.

You do realise what this means, it is simply that if the arab muslim win all the Jews living in Israel would be executed and their lands and property stolen

 

[Phoenall]

I dislike questionnaires like that because their primary purpose is to legitimize the disenfranchisment and rights of a people. That's all it is.

The right to a homeland, a state, self-determination is not dependendent on who was there longer than who.

Israel was re-created. It had not existed for thousands of years. It has no more or less legitimacy than Palestine.

And has been oft noted, the region's Arabs (that's what they were called in 1948) had the same opportunity to create an independent homeland - had they actually wanted one - from 1947 to 1967 when they controlled all the land they now CLAIM would satisfy their endless lust for Israeli blood.
Even after 1967 they could have made a deal - again, had they chosen to - but instead they chose squalid "refugee" camps and the 3 NOs: No recognition, No negotiation, No peace.

It's 50 years later. We have to deal with what is there now - on both sides and a truly just and fair solution.

Tell that to the Palestinians, and tell them that pre conditions do not equate to a fair and just solution. Then remind them that UN res 242 spells out the way that it must be done, and that Israel has already shown that it will cooperate fully and honestly in any negotiations as proven by their treaties with Jordan and Egypt.
Now what have the Palestinians done to show their willingness to agree to a just and fair solution ? ? ? ? ?

 

[Phoenall]

Let me answer first, GISMY. After careful review of the questions the author poses I am thoroughly convinced that the only people who have a legitimate claim to Israel / Palestine and this would include all of Jerusalem - would be the Jews. Only the Jews have the right to that land - that is the conclusion I come to. Based on all the evidence I have seen and what I already know about the history of Israel which spans back to 4,000 years ago. - Jeremiah

I agree as the Jews owned the land for many years before the Romans invaded and took control. Then the Christians took control and in the later part of the 7C the arab muslims took control and instigated a genocide and ethnic cleansing of Jews and Christians. Shortly afterwards the arab muslims were dethroned by the Christians and were run out of town. The longest ownership was that of the Ottomans who could not get one arab muslim to settle and work the land, so they invited the Jews of Europe to come and own the land. This led to an influx of greedy thieving arab muslims hoping to kill the Jews and steal the now fertile farm land. 1914 world war broke out and the allies offered the arab muslims nations of their own in Palestine, along with the resurrected NATIONAL HOME OF THE JEWS. This was acceptable to all so the Jews and Muslims fought against the Ottomans and other axis powers. Once the Hashemite princes had got their nations in Syria and Trans Jordan they tried to renege on their signed word to allow the Jews a nation in Palestine. This led to civil war and islamic terrorism in Palestine until the mass murder of Jews in Hebron. Then more civil war and terrorism until WW2 broke out and the allies were fighting the axis once again. After WW2 the Jews of Europe started to migrate to Palestine as invited to do so by the lands LEGAL OWNERS until the British took the side of the arab muslims and put the Jews in concentration camps on the island of Cyprus. In 1945 the LoN was absorbed by the new U.N. who took on the LoN role in Palestine. This led to the partition plan of 1947 that the arab muslins denied and the Jews accepted. The British realising that they were being out manoeuvred threw the towel in and handed the mandate to the UN at 12:00 midnight on the 14 may, the same time and date that the Jews declared independence. The arab muslims decided on war and violence and were beaten to a standstill by the fledgling Jews who won disputed territory in the process. The arab muslims failed to act and lost their chance of a nation, and only accepted the termsof the partition plan as late as 1988. But still they fail to show free determination or an ability to govern themselves.

 

[Phoenall]

As always, I am asking that anyone who responds to this questionaire would do so in a thoughtful and polite manner. This is a subject that needs to be addressed in order to come to some foundational truths. Nevertheless, let us stay on topic and discuss the matter as it pertains to advocates of Israel and advocates of Palestinians. Thank you.

The following is a questionaire that was put together by an author who I had the pleasure of meeting many years ago. They have written many great articles on subject matter addressing middle east conflicts. Here is the questionaire ......I will only put a small portion of the full questionaire up and you all can click the link to read it in its' entirety. Thanks for reading!

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

If you are so sure that "Palestine”, the country, goes back through most of recorded history, I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about Palestine:

1. When was it founded and by whom?

1924, League of Nations

2. What were its borders?

Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture

6. What was its form of government?

British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.

7. Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

LINK to the treaty and the Palestinian leaders who signed the treaty

No they ceased to exist when trans Jordan was created in Palestine

Who gave them Jerusalem ?

Who were the governors of those cities

Nope the British were there to facilitate the indigenous in forming a government.

You forget that Husseini was a leader of the Palestinians in the 1920's.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

1924, League of Nations


Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture


British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.


Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

George, I truly appreciate your answering the first 7 questions on the questionaire and before I respond I would like you to answer the rest of them. Here they are: Link first.

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

8. Was Palestine ever recognized by a country whose existence, at that time or now, leaves no room for interpretation?

It was. When the Palestinians first declared independence in 1948, five countries recognized Palestine. Palestine was accepted into the Arab League as a member state in 1974. The mandate itself called Palestine a country numerous times.


Arabic.


At the turn of the 20th century, Palestine was about 15% Christians, 5% Jews, and the remainder were mostly Muslim with an insignificant number of others.


As part of its mandate to bring Palestine to independence, Britain created the Palestinian Pound. I assume that its value was intended to follow the value of the British Pound.


Whether Palestine is a country or not is subject to political opinion. Palestine was a country until the 1949 armistice agreements divided it into three areas of occupation. That wiped Palestine off the map.

Legally Palestine still exists. Politically it does not.

* Finally, the author of the questionaire concludes with one Last question here:

You are lamenting the "low sinking" of a "once proud" nation. Please tell me, when exactly was that "nation" proud and what was it so proud of?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRznT1PVDOg]Palestine Pre-1947 - YouTube[/ame]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwVCiN47a40]Lost cities of Palestine | Al Jazeera World | Al Jazeera English - YouTube[/ame]

And here is the least sarcastic question of all: If the people you mistakenly call "Palestinians" are anything but generic Arabs collected from all over -- or thrown out of -- the Arab world, if they really have a genuine ethnic identity that gives them right for self-determination, why did they never try to become independent until Arabs suffered their devastating defeat in the Six Day War?

I hope you avoid the temptation to trace the modern day "Palestinians" to the Biblical Philistines: substituting etymology for history won't work here.

I think there is still some of of that blood there somewhere. Palestine was the center of everything being between Africa, Asia, and Europe. Palestine has seen many conquests and a lot of commerce. A lot of people have come and gone. However the is a core of people who stayed and put down roots. Those are the Palestinians. Palestinians range from blond with blue eyes to dark with kinky hair. Not that any of that matters. Look at the US.
__________________________

And that concludes the 7 questions on the questionaire and the final question from the author, George. Again, I thank you for your willingness to participate in attempting to answer the questionaire honestly and to the best of your ability because so far? You are the only one who has made the attempt. I thank you, George. Sincerely, Jeremiah

BTW, where did you get George?

Paul
(Paul Francis Tinmore)[/QUOTE]

I have no idea! I apologise! Paul! I like that name! Paul. Paul is a great name! Thank you for your response, Paul!

I will give my own response later on today ( God willing! ) if that is alright with you? I am in the middle of something but want you to know right now that I do appreciate you answering the entire questionaire!

I have not read through this thread, Paul. But the last time I did read through it ( the other night ) you were the only person who I believe to be an advocate of the Palestinians who had actually addressed the questionaire and made an honest attempt to answer it! For that I commend you. You are a person I find willing to discuss the questions on the questionaire point for point - fully - and directly - and for that you have my respect! Thank you, Paul.

 

[Phoenall]

You missed the important part, the fact Palestinians been here before Israel doesn't apply as much as Jews doesn't apply, this goes both directions except the UN voted for the state of Israel, but not over a state of Palestinians - all the so called occupied territories belong to Israel NOW and ever since they were exchanged by their legal owners (Egypt, Jordan) - the Palestinians no long have claim on the land which is now Israel because they are simply not Israelis, of course they deserve a homeland and even a state - but not in Israel.

That's legally debatable. But, if indeed all those territories belong to Israel, than so do the Palestinian people. They need to be given full Israeli citizenship and rights.

Good point.

In international law, when a state is dissolved and new states are established, “the population follows the change of sovereignty in matters of nationality.”5 As a rule, therefore, citizens of the former state should automatically acquire the nationality of the successor state in which they had already been residing.

Genesis of Citizenship in Palestine and Israel

That means that all of the Palestinians who normally lived in the territory that became Israel are Israeli citizens. This would include the refugees.

Un fortunately for you customary international law allows for the expulsion of hostile elements who then lose their rights to citizenship. This means any and all arab muslims that raised their hands or voices against Israel in may 1948 could be arrested and sent for trial to be sentenced to life in prison of expulsion. This was transmuted to summary expulsion under the then international law which led to 50,000 arab muslims being evicted from their homes and cast out of Israel.

 

[Phoenall]

As always, I am asking that anyone who responds to this questionaire would do so in a thoughtful and polite manner. This is a subject that needs to be addressed in order to come to some foundational truths. Nevertheless, let us stay on topic and discuss the matter as it pertains to advocates of Israel and advocates of Palestinians. Thank you.

The following is a questionaire that was put together by an author who I had the pleasure of meeting many years ago. They have written many great articles on subject matter addressing middle east conflicts. Here is the questionaire ......I will only put a small portion of the full questionaire up and you all can click the link to read it in its' entirety. Thanks for reading!

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

If you are so sure that "Palestine”, the country, goes back through most of recorded history, I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about Palestine:

1. When was it founded and by whom?

1924, League of Nations


Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture


British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.

7. Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

Show me ONE link that says Palestine was founded in 1924

Palestine does not have international borders. Israel has internationally recognized borders with Egypt and Jordan.
How can Palestine have a border with Lebanon if no part of the Palestinian Territories touches it??

Show me a link that says Britain prevented the formation of a government.

International borders require international treaties and they cant make any decision for a nation without having its input. This is why the question " who signed for the Palestinians as a recognised Palestinian negotiator these international borders" which is ignored because it shows the whole tale to be an Islamic lie.

 

[Phoenall]

1924, League of Nations


Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture


British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.


Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

Mandate began in 1920, but Britain had controled the land since 1918. Transjordan was recognized in 1923.
Economy under the mandate declined, especially of arab agriculture.
Leaders of the high committee were Raghib al-Nashashibi, Amin al-Husayni, Ahmed Hilmi Pasha, Abdul Latif Bey Es-Salah, Mr. Alfred Roke, Jamal eff. el-Husseini, Dr. Hsein Khaldhi, Ya'cub Bey el-Ghussein, Mr. Fuad Saba.

That is pretty much the way I understood it. Britain occupied Palestine while it was still under Turkish sovereignty. During that time it did the prep work for its mandate. But it could not officially become the mandate until Palestine was released from Turkey in 1924.

I couldn't think of any Palestinian leaders offhand but I recognized some of those you mentioned as being in the All Palestine Government of 1948.

The land was released from Ottoman rule in 1919 as part of the surrender, The LoN took over ownership at this time and passed control to the mandated powers. The mandated powers had no rights to impose anything other than assistance in setting up a government. The rest was dictated by the LoN and the treaties it signed with other parties. Trans Jordan removed any borders that Palestine might of had when it was created on part of Palestine, As did Syria and Iraq.

 

[Phoenall]

As always, I am asking that anyone who responds to this questionaire would do so in a thoughtful and polite manner. This is a subject that needs to be addressed in order to come to some foundational truths. Nevertheless, let us stay on topic and discuss the matter as it pertains to advocates of Israel and advocates of Palestinians. Thank you.

The following is a questionaire that was put together by an author who I had the pleasure of meeting many years ago. They have written many great articles on subject matter addressing middle east conflicts. Here is the questionaire ......I will only put a small portion of the full questionaire up and you all can click the link to read it in its' entirety. Thanks for reading!

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

If you are so sure that "Palestine”, the country, goes back through most of recorded history, I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about Palestine:

1. When was it founded and by whom?

2. What were its borders?

3. What was its capital?

4. What were its major cities?

5. What constituted the basis of its economy?

6. What was its form of government?

7. Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

_________________________
Thank you in advance for your participation and please remind to be respectful to others in your responses.

[MENTION=45621]1776[/MENTION] , [MENTION=36422]blackhawk[/MENTION], [MENTION=49937]Daniyel[/MENTION] [MENTION=20411]ForeverYoung436[/MENTION], [MENTION=42952]GISMYS[/MENTION] , [MENTION=17047]Godboy[/MENTION] [MENTION=46353]GreenBean[/MENTION] , [MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] , [MENTION=35577]MJB12741[/MENTION] , [MENTION=45791]Mojo2[/MENTION] , [MENTION=20102]mudwhistle[/MENTION] , [MENTION=17668]Peach[/MENTION] , [MENTION=39618]proudveteran06[/MENTION] , [MENTION=26838]Ropey[/MENTION] , [MENTION=35716]SAYIT[/MENTION] , [MENTION=50178]Sgt_Gath[/MENTION] , [MENTION=40539]skye[/MENTION] , [MENTION=29246]The Irish Ram[/MENTION] , [MENTION=39069]toastman[/MENTION] , [MENTION=23239]westwall[/MENTION] [MENTION=36253]Sally[/MENTION], [MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION], [MENTION=49464]teddyearp[/MENTION] ! ! !

A small invitation list from those that I thought might want to participate in the discussion. Anyone is welcome to share here!

I never thought it was a country, just an ungoverned "territory" owned by the British. I hear the land was pretty much a wasteland before with actually very few inhabitants because it was harsh. So, considering that is how I feel, I really can't answer those questions.

The British never owned Palestine.

They did as members of the LoN, but they never held title. The arab muslims had not held title for over 1,000 years so had no legal claim to the land.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

I just finished a very detailed response to another thread, Paul, so I am going to work on a brief but concise response to yours if that is alright with you. If you would prefer my addressing the questionaire replies you gave point for point then please let me know otherwise I believe I could condense it to a pararagraph or two. Would that be acceptable to you? Please let me know. Thank you. - Jeremiah

 

[aris2chat]

Land ownership is not strictly to a person. All land belongs to the state firstly. People pay to own or use the land for personal or business. The state can remove you as owner for a number of reason. State can take or buy land for roads, wetlands, military, etc. even if a person does not want to give up or sell the land at a set government price.
Land can be transferred and divided as the state decides. You cannot own land on the border between nevada and california and decide you would rather belong to nevada because of lower taxes or better schools. The states or federal government decides where the lines were drawn.
People do not strictly own the land but has to accept the rules and laws of the state, so they control the land, no matter who holds the deed.
Brits did not just leave america, they formally surrendered to Washington. In the middle east a surrender to peace would be signing a formal agreement. Land under Israeli control is not transferred without a formal agreement.
people need to sit down and talk face to face with each other.

 

[ChrisL]

As always, I am asking that anyone who responds to this questionaire would do so in a thoughtful and polite manner. This is a subject that needs to be addressed in order to come to some foundational truths. Nevertheless, let us stay on topic and discuss the matter as it pertains to advocates of Israel and advocates of Palestinians. Thank you.

The following is a questionaire that was put together by an author who I had the pleasure of meeting many years ago. They have written many great articles on subject matter addressing middle east conflicts. Here is the questionaire ......I will only put a small portion of the full questionaire up and you all can click the link to read it in its' entirety. Thanks for reading!

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

If you are so sure that "Palestine”, the country, goes back through most of recorded history, I expect you to be able to answer a few basic questions about Palestine:

1. When was it founded and by whom?

2. What were its borders?

3. What was its capital?

4. What were its major cities?

5. What constituted the basis of its economy?

6. What was its form of government?

7. Can you name at least one Palestinian leader before Arafat?

_________________________
Thank you in advance for your participation and please remind to be respectful to others in your responses.

[MENTION=45621]1776[/MENTION] , [MENTION=36422]blackhawk[/MENTION], [MENTION=49937]Daniyel[/MENTION] [MENTION=20411]ForeverYoung436[/MENTION], [MENTION=42952]GISMYS[/MENTION] , [MENTION=17047]Godboy[/MENTION] [MENTION=46353]GreenBean[/MENTION] , [MENTION=20204]Kondor3[/MENTION] , [MENTION=35577]MJB12741[/MENTION] , [MENTION=45791]Mojo2[/MENTION] , [MENTION=20102]mudwhistle[/MENTION] , [MENTION=17668]Peach[/MENTION] , [MENTION=39618]proudveteran06[/MENTION] , [MENTION=26838]Ropey[/MENTION] , [MENTION=35716]SAYIT[/MENTION] , [MENTION=50178]Sgt_Gath[/MENTION] , [MENTION=40539]skye[/MENTION] , [MENTION=29246]The Irish Ram[/MENTION] , [MENTION=39069]toastman[/MENTION] , [MENTION=23239]westwall[/MENTION] [MENTION=36253]Sally[/MENTION], [MENTION=20947]The Rabbi[/MENTION], [MENTION=49464]teddyearp[/MENTION] ! ! !

A small invitation list from those that I thought might want to participate in the discussion. Anyone is welcome to share here!

I never thought it was a country, just an ungoverned "territory" owned by the British. I hear the land was pretty much a wasteland before with actually very few inhabitants because it was harsh. So, considering that is how I feel, I really can't answer those questions.

" Palestine" was never a Country; It is a territory

But that is what I said. See above in bold.

 

[Book of Jeremiah]

1924, League of Nations


Palestine has international borders with Lebanon, Syria, Jordan, and Egypt


Jerusalem


Jaffa, Haifa, Acca, Jerusalem


Free market, mostly agriculture


British occupation. Britain prevented the formation of a government.


Good question. Anyone who poked his head up was jailed, exiled, or killed by the British.

George, I truly appreciate your answering the first 7 questions on the questionaire and before I respond I would like you to answer the rest of them. Here they are: Link first.

AN_INTERESTING_QUESTIONNAIRE_FOR_PALESTINIAN_ADVOCATES

8. Was Palestine ever recognized by a country whose existence, at that time or now, leaves no room for interpretation?

It was. When the Palestinians first declared independence in 1948, five countries recognized Palestine. Palestine was accepted into the Arab League as a member state in 1974. The mandate itself called Palestine a country numerous times.


Arabic.


At the turn of the 20th century, Palestine was about 15% Christians, 5% Jews, and the remainder were mostly Muslim with an insignificant number of others.


As part of its mandate to bring Palestine to independence, Britain created the Palestinian Pound. I assume that its value was intended to follow the value of the British Pound.


Whether Palestine is a country or not is subject to political opinion. Palestine was a country until the 1949 armistice agreements divided it into three areas of occupation. That wiped Palestine off the map.

Legally Palestine still exists. Politically it does not.

* Finally, the author of the questionaire concludes with one Last question here:

You are lamenting the "low sinking" of a "once proud" nation. Please tell me, when exactly was that "nation" proud and what was it so proud of?

[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRznT1PVDOg]Palestine Pre-1947 - YouTube[/ame]
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwVCiN47a40]Lost cities of Palestine | Al Jazeera World | Al Jazeera English - YouTube[/ame]

And here is the least sarcastic question of all: If the people you mistakenly call "Palestinians" are anything but generic Arabs collected from all over -- or thrown out of -- the Arab world, if they really have a genuine ethnic identity that gives them right for self-determination, why did they never try to become independent until Arabs suffered their devastating defeat in the Six Day War?

I hope you avoid the temptation to trace the modern day "Palestinians" to the Biblical Philistines: substituting etymology for history won't work here.

I think there is still some of of that blood there somewhere. Palestine was the center of everything being between Africa, Asia, and Europe. Palestine has seen many conquests and a lot of commerce. A lot of people have come and gone. However the is a core of people who stayed and put down roots. Those are the Palestinians. Palestinians range from blond with blue eyes to dark with kinky hair. Not that any of that matters. Look at the US.
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And that concludes the 7 questions on the questionaire and the final question from the author, George. Again, I thank you for your willingness to participate in attempting to answer the questionaire honestly and to the best of your ability because so far? You are the only one who has made the attempt. I thank you, George. Sincerely, Jeremiah

BTW, where did you get George?

Paul
(Paul Francis Tinmore)[/QUOTE]

Paul, I must apologise to you. I signed off earlier and completely forgot about my brief and concise reply I promised you earlier!

Here it is!

I am deeply touched by your willingness to address these questions. I find you to be a most sincere and precious man and I know the LORD loves you and so do I.

That concludes my brief and concise reply and it is also my final reply for this thread. I think the people have covered every conceivable angle on this questionaire and then some! Have a wonderful evening, Paul, and thank you again for your participation.

From my heart,

Jeri