CDZ I'm angry, most of us are - how do we bridge the divide and become one nation again?

[ChrisL]

US Economy Visualized: Government Tax Revenue & Deficit stacked in $100 bills

US Budget in 1 Week: $73,221,917,808
For the year 2011:

- The US Government spends $73,221,917,808 (~$73 billion, 221 million) per week (both portions)
- Of the total money shown above, the US Government borrows $31,547,945,205 (31 billion, 547 million) each week-- shown on the right portion.

You can say Booyakashaa when this is your weekly allowance.

 

[dcbl]

I'm not sure we should "become one nation" again. We just have to learn to discuss our differences in a civil manner.

Ridiculing the loud mouthed radio talk show hosts would be a start.

Not voting for people who sound like they are trying to start a war would be the next.

you start with "discuss in a civil manner" but then cut to "ridicule loud moth radio hosts"

TBH, I'd rather ridicule loud mouthed journalists in our "traditional media"

also, it's worth noting that Trump ran on somewhat of an "isolationist" platform & basically promised to keep us out of military entanglements

that's why many of his core supporters got angry when we bombed Syria

not sure how I would handle N Korea though - we may be at war soon & I don't like it (but I do think may wind up being necessary)

 

[dcbl]

The time has come to break the union up and a new two or three countries form out of the remnants. Go be happy.

I actually would not mind seeing this, but it is highly unlikely that something like this happens peacefully

the biggest question would revolve around our military assets - how to split them?

I don't think your suggestion is realistic UNLESS we have an actual "shooting war/civil war"

 

[dcbl]

First, we have to find a way to culturally marginalize the division pimps. These are the people on both ends of the spectrum who have a vested professional interest in keeping their "side" angry and separated from the other "side".

Second, we need little, individual acts of leadership from people who are brave enough to publicly fight the behaviors that zealots on both ends are guilty of. These people can be political leaders or sports figures or entertainment stars or just laypeople who stand up and are noticed when they try to bridge the gap. Enough of those little brave actions could conceivably create needed momentum.

money right there baw

 

[dcbl]

In my grandmothers generation it was considered impolite to discuss politics or religion in a social setting. Those restraints were intended to keep the peace because they were then, as they are now, hot button topics. We have no such restraints - there are no meaningful repercussions for impolite behavior and language on social media.

The last 8 years have been an eye-opener into the behavior of the far-left in this country - especially among high profile politicians and entertainers regarding the near celebrity status and hero worship of the former prez. That man could have drowned puppies on national tv and the headlines would read 'President personally shows care and concern over the growing population of stray dogs'. Talk about tyrannical behavior, declaring half the country as 'the enemy' and collusion with the Russians - sheesh.

I don't think we're at the point of no return - most of us still go about our daily lives providing for our families, sharing a kind word or a smile with a stranger, letting another car into traffic, paying our bills and are grateful to be Americans. We're not homogenous like many other countries - so there will be points of contention. Diversity is a good thing if it means diversity of thought and viewpoint and not defined as skin color, gender or ethnicity.

On a site like this the fanatics abound in far higher numbers than exist in real life. Most of my life I have considered myself to a principled liberal - but those principles seem to have all but disappeared from the public square...destroyed by the worst of the progressives - politicians, entertainers and journalists...who appear to admire totalitarianism.

Anyway - there's no point in letting such fuel anger - turn anger into determination to be heard. They are the loud, but the few. Let your voice be heard by your elected officials and when it comes to todays press remember old Ben's adage - 'believe none of what you hear, and only half of what you see'.

We're on a course correction and are tacking to the right to head to the center - and that's ok.

excellent contribution

thank you!

 

[dcbl]

It's our two-party system and our politicians that are tearing us apart. The responsibility is on their shoulders, as well as the media. The media plays a big role in this division too.

absolutely spot on

I have often thought that a more pluralistic party system, or rather a multi-party system would be very healthy for this country

if nothing else, it would force the fringests to compromise more & form coalition that find a way to work together

 

[sealybobo]

is it even possible anymore?

Thomas Jefferson said that the tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of Patriots and tyrants from time to time

If I'm being honest, I'm almost there. Except I don't think we have a tyrant in charge, in fact, I'm THRILLED with our president.

There are many people, some whom I respect immensely, that are 180 degrees from where I am politically, that feel the same way.

14 years ago I won custody of a 13 month old baby girl & I was a small business owner starting out. Message boards became my social life & outlet - things are different now, I still have the girl and I still like message boards, but I'm in a better place.

But I have NEVER been this angry and ready for a fight.

Many of my friends on the left feel the same way.

So, how do we fix this?

OR are we at the point of no return?

Stop the widening gap between the rich and poor. A big strong happy middle class will do it.

You can't have free market unregulated capitalism. It has to be regulated. And some things like healthcare need to be regulated. Maybe even socialized.

If your way is going to work people need to stop having kids. A major population decrease. I'm all for that. Too many people now

Who is going to pay for that healthcare with a rapidly declining population?

People through group insurance.

Do what Australia and Canada do. It works

 

[rightwinger]

US Economy Visualized: Government Tax Revenue & Deficit stacked in $100 bills

US Budget in 1 Week: $73,221,917,808
For the year 2011:

- The US Government spends $73,221,917,808 (~$73 billion, 221 million) per week (both portions)
- Of the total money shown above, the US Government borrows $31,547,945,205 (31 billion, 547 million) each week-- shown on the right portion.

You can say Booyakashaa when this is your weekly allowance.

Is that a lot for the largest economy in the world?

 

[dcbl]

It takes TWO sides

OK, I will play, if I understand you correctly you are asking me where I stand on the issues you can compromise on & yu are asking what issues I am will to compromise on - right?

items you are willing to compromise on:

I am willing to compromise spending cuts and tax rates

I want us to spend less than we take in - start the budget with that premise & ANY "extra money" that does come in, apply it towards the national debt

my position is that tax cuts have pretty much always resulted in larger collected tax receipts

I want to be able to leave a legacy for my children without having the government seize the fruits of my labor

I would START with cutting every program by 5% to 10% and go from there

I am willing to compromise on gun control

I may be easier to work with on this one - what I want is for gun licenses AND conceal carry permits to be valid everywhere

I have a license in Alabama, that gives me the absolute right to carry my weapon anywhere in the country - period

in exchange for that, I would be willing to see a national gun registration system that is similar to driver license standards

check that, I don't want the system to be run by the feds, would rather see states do it, but info could be accessible by any law enforcement group

I am willing to compromise on healthcare

so am I, but this is a tricky one

I don't view healthcare as a "right"

I can be on board with standard check-ups & access to immunizations, antibiotics, etc

but the "reward factor" needs to continue to be a part of our system

those that have worked harder & saved more DO deserve 1st access to cutting edge techniques & expensive surgeries

I am willing to compromise on immigration

what do you mean? could you be OK with enforcing existing laws?

 

[IsaacNewton]

The time has come to break the union up and a new two or three countries form out of the remnants. Go be happy.

I actually would not mind seeing this, but it is highly unlikely that something like this happens peacefully

the biggest question would revolve around our military assets - how to split them?

I don't think your suggestion is realistic UNLESS we have an actual "shooting war/civil war"

It isn't likely but it is possible. Dividing assets would just be negotiated, not a hard thing to do. I think the biggest obstacle would be the red state politicians if confronted with this as a real possibility would see that a nation made up of current red states would have an economy far smaller than a new nation with the blue states. California alone dwarfs all red state economies. Texas is the only one even close with an economy about half as large as CA. Almost all the revenue generated in the country currently comes from blue states as that is where the people are. Montana has a population of 1 million yet a huge amount of empty land, or dirt. A 1 million person economy is tiny. CA on the other had has 40 million people and a diversity of robust industries that produce gigantic amounts of revenue. So politicians in red states understand that any new 'red state' country would be a third world size economy with little diversity. Oil in Texas as well as ag in various states but what else? Defense industry jobs but as a much smaller nation with far less money to spend on a military those industries would shrink considerably.

In any case I'd like to see it happen. Everyone go have their little country and be happy. What is wrong with that?

 

[rightwinger]

It takes TWO sides

OK, I will play, if I understand you correctly you are asking me where I stand on the issues you can compromise on & yu are asking what issues I am will to compromise on - right?

items you are willing to compromise on:

I am willing to compromise spending cuts and tax rates

I want us to spend less than we take in - start the budget with that premise & ANY "extra money" that does come in, apply it towards the national debt

my position is that tax cuts have pretty much always resulted in larger collected tax receipts

I want to be able to leave a legacy for my children without having the government seize the fruits of my labor

I would START with cutting every program by 5% to 10% and go from there

I am willing to compromise on gun control

I may be easier to work with on this one - what I want is for gun licenses AND conceal carry permits to be valid everywhere

I have a license in Alabama, that gives me the absolute right to carry my weapon anywhere in the country - period

in exchange for that, I would be willing to see a national gun registration system that is similar to driver license standards

check that, I don't want the system to be run by the feds, would rather see states do it, but info could be accessible by any law enforcement group

I am willing to compromise on healthcare

so am I, but this is a tricky one

I don't view healthcare as a "right"

I can be on board with standard check-ups & access to immunizations, antibiotics, etc

but the "reward factor" needs to continue to be a part of our system

those that have worked harder & saved more DO deserve 1st access to cutting edge techniques & expensive surgeries

I am willing to compromise on immigration

what do you mean? could you be OK with enforcing existing laws?

Let's talk gun control

I am willing to create a category of super gun owners who have had background checks, training and can conceal carry in any state.

I want to see more control over how guns are bought and sold and who gets them.

 

[dcbl]

The time has come to break the union up and a new two or three countries form out of the remnants. Go be happy.

I actually would not mind seeing this, but it is highly unlikely that something like this happens peacefully

the biggest question would revolve around our military assets - how to split them?

I don't think your suggestion is realistic UNLESS we have an actual "shooting war/civil war"

It isn't likely but it is possible. Dividing assets would just be negotiated, not a hard thing to do. I think the biggest obstacle would be the red state politicians if confronted with this as a real possibility would see that a nation made up of current red states would have an economy far smaller than a new nation with the blue states. California alone dwarfs all red state economies. Texas is the only one even close with an economy about half as large as CA. Almost all the revenue generated in the country currently comes from blue states as that is where the people are. Montana has a population of 1 million yet a huge amount of empty land, or dirt. A 1 million person economy is tiny. CA on the other had has 40 million people and a diversity of robust industries that produce gigantic amounts of revenue. So politicians in red states understand that any new 'red state' country would be a third world size economy with little diversity. Oil in Texas as well as ag in various states but what else? Defense industry jobs but as a much smaller nation with far less money to spend on a military those industries would shrink considerably.

In any case I'd like to see it happen. Everyone go have their little country and be happy. What is wrong with that?

you are seriously underestimating red state economies & overestimating those of blue states

outside of that, I agree, I would not mid seeing a split at all

 

[IsaacNewton]

The time has come to break the union up and a new two or three countries form out of the remnants. Go be happy.

I actually would not mind seeing this, but it is highly unlikely that something like this happens peacefully

the biggest question would revolve around our military assets - how to split them?

I don't think your suggestion is realistic UNLESS we have an actual "shooting war/civil war"

It isn't likely but it is possible. Dividing assets would just be negotiated, not a hard thing to do. I think the biggest obstacle would be the red state politicians if confronted with this as a real possibility would see that a nation made up of current red states would have an economy far smaller than a new nation with the blue states. California alone dwarfs all red state economies. Texas is the only one even close with an economy about half as large as CA. Almost all the revenue generated in the country currently comes from blue states as that is where the people are. Montana has a population of 1 million yet a huge amount of empty land, or dirt. A 1 million person economy is tiny. CA on the other had has 40 million people and a diversity of robust industries that produce gigantic amounts of revenue. So politicians in red states understand that any new 'red state' country would be a third world size economy with little diversity. Oil in Texas as well as ag in various states but what else? Defense industry jobs but as a much smaller nation with far less money to spend on a military those industries would shrink considerably.

In any case I'd like to see it happen. Everyone go have their little country and be happy. What is wrong with that?

you are seriously underestimating red state economies & overestimating those of blue states

outside of that, I agree, I would not mid seeing a split at all

The numbers are what they are. Check the populations of red states. Relatively speaking they are very small and people are what drive economies.

 

[dcbl]

Let's talk gun control

I am willing to create a category of super gun owners who have had background checks, training and can conceal carry in any state.

I want to see more control over how guns are bought and sold and who gets them.

if you ran the blue party & I ran the red party, I think we could hammer this out

I want ANY citizen to be able to attain status as "super gun owner"

I am OK with training & aptitude requirements

I could also live with state by state registries that are accessible by the feds (not thrilled here & am wary of the government & encroachments on privacy, but I could live with something on this)

 

[dcbl]

The numbers are what they are. Check the populations of red states. Relatively speaking they are very small and people are what drive economies.

not really, or China would have passed us economically a long time ago

industry & innovation drive economies

I don't want to get into a pissing contest about this ITT

maybe in another thread, but I don't wanna go down this road today...

 

[william the wie]

Again the Blue Wall is running itself out of other people's money quickly. Compromising with someone who is self-destructive, which describes every left-liberal posting on this thread is stupid. they are quite obviously bluffing with a busted flush.

 

[SeaGal]

In my grandmothers generation it was considered impolite to discuss politics or religion in a social setting.

Yeah.

What concerns me as much as anything else right now is how deeply our society and culture have been infected with not only politics, but partisan politics. You can't escape it, even for a minute. It has saturated academia, entertainment, sports, business, religion, every last thing. And more and more people seem to be willing to launch into a partisan tirade at the slightest provocation.

This is at the top of my concerns because once something becomes cultural, it's much tougher to fix.
.

I'm honestly not sure that partisanship is worse now overall, or it's just more openly displayed - though that in itself may indicate a deeper problem.

I have a few copies of the Tampa Times from the mid-forties. True, we were in the depth of a world war but in reading the editorials the partisan divide was evident. My grandfather used to tell me that no self-respecting patriotic American could be a Republican...and in reading some history of a small farming community in the mid-west in the late 1800's at least one farmer sold out and moved further west because a Democrat (Cleveland) was in the White House and the country was going to hell in a hand basket.

So is partisanship more prevalent among the general populace or simply more evident?...I don't know. But it does appear that in this greater than ever age of information, when events are easier than ever to track - we've lost our intellectual curiosity for seeking truth. It also appears that public discourse among political leaders has taken a nasty turn - especially toward those who disagree politically. Labeling millions of Americans as 'deplorables' comes to mind. I do think that would have ended the career of any politician in the past - as perhaps it has 'today'...and rightfully so.

Then again maybe Pollyanna and I are distant cousins.

 

[Moonglow]

In my grandmothers generation it was considered impolite to discuss politics or religion in a social setting.

Yeah.

What concerns me as much as anything else right now is how deeply our society and culture have been infected with not only politics, but partisan politics. You can't escape it, even for a minute. It has saturated academia, entertainment, sports, business, religion, every last thing. And more and more people seem to be willing to launch into a partisan tirade at the slightest provocation.

This is at the top of my concerns because once something becomes cultural, it's much tougher to fix.
.

I'm honestly not sure that partisanship is worse now overall, or it's just more openly displayed - though that in itself may indicate a deeper problem.

I have a few copies of the Tampa Times from the mid-forties. True, we were in the depth of a world war but in reading the editorials the partisan divide was evident. My grandfather used to tell me that no self-respecting patriotic American could be a Republican...and in reading some history of a small farming community in the mid-west in the late 1800's at least one farmer sold out and moved further west because a Democrat (Cleveland) was in the White House and the country was going to hell in a hand basket.

So is partisanship more prevalent among the general populace or simply more evident?...I don't know. But it does appear that in this greater than ever age of information, when events are easier than ever to track - we've lost our intellectual curiosity for seeking truth. It also appears that public discourse among political leaders has taken a nasty turn - especially toward those who disagree politically. Labeling millions of Americans as 'deplorables' comes to mind. I do think that would have ended the career of any politician in the past - as perhaps it has 'today'...and rightfully so.

Then again maybe Pollyanna and I are distant cousins.

When FDR died, republicans cheered.

 

[dcbl]

When FDR died, republicans cheered.

Yer gonna have to link this one baw

 

[Wyatt earp]

is it even possible anymore?

Thomas Jefferson said that the tree of liberty must be refreshed with the blood of Patriots and tyrants from time to time

If I'm being honest, I'm almost there. Except I don't think we have a tyrant in charge, in fact, I'm THRILLED with our president.

There are many people, some whom I respect immensely, that are 180 degrees from where I am politically, that feel the same way.

14 years ago I won custody of a 13 month old baby girl & I was a small business owner starting out. Message boards became my social life & outlet - things are different now, I still have the girl and I still like message boards, but I'm in a better place.

But I have NEVER been this angry and ready for a fight.

Many of my friends on the left feel the same way.

So, how do we fix this?

OR are we at the point of no return?

Get rid of all the liberals. Give them free tickets to any socialist country of their choice.

If we could just name bills with names like "A cesspool in every yard" and the "stop asking us to brush our teeth bill", you could win them over every time. Look how Republicans lie to them and they swallow it hook, line and sinker again and again. Maybe that's what we do when it comes to the GOP base. Just lie. It works for the Republican leadership.

If the mods don't want to stop this I will play you stupid asshole

Stop what? These are the famous confederate Republican Redneck games. Republicans are proud of who they are and who they hate. It's not a secret.

And they lie. About everything. It's almost a chore to find something they don't lie about. And they are the laughingstock of the world. For following a fool.

Look at Trump's most recent lies:

The Paris accords will cost jobs and lower your standard of living. We know it's BS.

I will bring back jobs from overseas. What jobs? 87% of lost manufacturing jobs were automated. They don't exist anymore. They are never coming back.

Bring back clean coal. So many lies packed into one four word sentence. For one, coal is not clean and has never been clean. Many coal jobs have been automated. They aren't coming back. Other energy sources have been replacing coal. Trump and GOP want to take away healthcare for sick coal miners. We know that. It's no secret.

So instead of pissing and moaning that you are being mistreated, wise the f*cking up and learn something of value.

Why do they need health care when they have jobs?

.