If you're in the Guard, and you commit crimes for Trump, you are going to be prosecuted

[Crepitus]

Nope. It was one of your heros shooting at the ICE officers.

View attachment 1159733

Oh.


Did he get him?

 

[Rawley]

Oh.


Did he get him?

Not yet. But a $100,000 reward if your turn your brown buddy in.

 

[Crepitus]

Not yet. But a $100,000 reward if your turn your brown buddy in.

Why would they give him another shot?

 

[White 6]

JAG Officers are not admitted to the bar to operate in state courts nor are the allowed to act as the personal lawyer for a criminal defendent in state courts.

My daughter is an Air Force JAG she is admitted to the Bar in Virginia. She can't represent a criminal defendent in her official capacity in say California.

WW

And, should not be a Judge over civil affairs, as Donnie is intending, either. On the other hand, I have seen JAG Officer's representing servicemen in State court.

 

[westwall]

And, should not be a Judge over civil affairs, as Donnie is intending, either. On the other hand, I have seen JAG Officer's representing servicemen in State court.

It's normal for JAG to represent military personnel in all courts.

 

[WorldWatcher]

And, should not be a Judge over civil affairs, as Donnie is intending, either. On the other hand, I have seen JAG Officer's representing servicemen in State court.

Agreed, Attorney's are like Doctors. They have areas of speciality such as contract law, mergers and aquisitions, real estate, criminal, etc. Very few if any JAGs would have experience in the field of immigration law. But you are right, Immigration Judges are not Article III Judges practicing before the bar. They are DHS employees with a title. As DHS employees performing an administrative function, the administratiaon can probably be more lax. Well we know they are being more lax, they recently dropped the years of experience required to hire non-military JAG Immigration Judges.

This however goes back to a comment about JAGs defending people in State courts.

However I doubt that you have seen JAG's functioning as defense attornys as first seat in criminal State courts. #1 the JAG has to be admitted to the bar of that state, and #2 JAG's don't act as defense attrorny's for state criminal proceedings. They may be called in to advise on military law if needed.

It's normal for JAG to represent military personnel in all courts.

No, actually it's not.

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/legal_services/milvets/aba_home_front/information_center/working_with_lawyer/information_about_lawyers/military_legal_assistance/criminal_matters/

WW

 

[WorldWatcher]

My daughter is an Air Force JAG with close to 10 years of service. Right now she's in a special billet that required a 3-year lock in so it's unlikely she would be assigned on this go around. However she is due for transfer next year, so she is in "wait-n-see" mode for that.

Her concerns were...

#1 Lack of Experience in the field of Immigration. JAGs are not a field of attorney's that deal with immigration as a normal course of their duties. Mostly JAGs are involved with contract law and military procurement, base legal providing limited family related services, and criminal prosecution/defense under the UCMJ. Two weeks of "training" doesn't replace years of experience in the field of immigration.

#2 Reports are (and what she's hearing) is that assignments will be 179 days of TDY (Temporary Duty), what we in the Navy called TAD (Temporary Assigned Duty). I'm assuming that comes from PCS (Permenant Change of Station) rules. Over that time the individuals wouldn't be TDY but would need to be permenantly assigned (meaning household goods shipments, transportation for not only themselves but reloaction of family, etc.).

#3 JAG is already understaffed, pulling 150 Air Force JAGs (the AF share of the 600 authorization) would severly impact an already backlog case load of existing military UCMJ prosecutions. If the JAG officers are pulled from the Air FORCE and TAD'd to DHS - they wouldn't be working their existing cases.

#4 The TAD pull will likley NOT be the junior JAGs, with will likely be senior Captains, Major's, maybe even Lt. Colonels. Those that normally sit First Chair and even act as Military Judges, which compounds the impact of #3 as these are the ones training the junior JAGs.

#5 Because the "judges" will not be qualitied and experienced in the field, defense attorny's will have a field day. In addition, there will be challenges to the TDY Judges rulings based on errors and lack of qualifications. That could result in class action status and "freeze" the whole idea of an extended period. One issue that neither of us thought about was Posse Comitatus Act and using JAGs for civil immigration law enforcement mentioned in the article below.

While she didn't mention it, I also wonder about how such assignments will impact promotion opportunities. If JAGs are being pulled out for 6-months of "dead time" from the regular duties to be detailed to DHS that time will impact promotions. Time which can be extended. Will it be viewed positively by promotion boards? With the SecDef try to put his fingers on promotion board selection for or against the JAG/Immigration Judge depending on if he felt the individual deported enough people? How will career senior officers sitting the boards view such a extended TDY status not involved with military law?

WW
.
.
.
.

Pentagon authorizes up to 600 military lawyers to serve as temporary immigration judges

Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has approved sending up to 600 military lawyers to the Justice Department to serve as temporary immigration judges, according to a memo reviewed by The Associated Press.

apnews.com

 

[Dr.Destructo]

Democrats threaten charges for troops who commit crimes at Trump’s direction

Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker and Philadelphia’s DA have warned troops they’ll face charges that Trump can’t save them from if they violate residents.

www.msnbc.com

And those prosecutions will be under state law where Trump's pardon infamy does not work. And if you think a "just following orders" defense will save you, you should study up on the Nuremberg trials of the Nazis after World War II.

Bigly!!!

So, that means Republicans can charge military personnel for going over to the other side of the planet to start their wars?

Good to know!!!

 

[White 6]

It's normal for JAG to represent military personnel in all courts.

True. Military courts over military personnel. Not civilian courts, as judges over domestic civil affairs.

 

[Hafar1014]

Democrats threaten charges for troops who commit crimes at Trump’s direction

Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker and Philadelphia’s DA have warned troops they’ll face charges that Trump can’t save them from if they violate residents.

www.msnbc.com

And those prosecutions will be under state law where Trump's pardon infamy does not work. And if you think a "just following orders" defense will save you, you should study up on the Nuremberg trials of the Nazis after World War II.

Bigly!!!

As democrats become the party that defends criminals their thoughts become more based on hysteria and fear

 

[WorldWatcher]

True. Military courts over military personnel. Not civilian courts, as judges over domestic civil affairs.

Context. …

JAG officers do not represent military in state and federal courts for criminal or civil matters.

They represent military members in military courts and legal actions.

WW

 

[jbrownson0831]

Democrats threaten charges for troops who commit crimes at Trump’s direction

Illinois Gov. JB Pritzker and Philadelphia’s DA have warned troops they’ll face charges that Trump can’t save them from if they violate residents.

www.msnbc.com

And those prosecutions will be under state law where Trump's pardon infamy does not work. And if you think a "just following orders" defense will save you, you should study up on the Nuremberg trials of the Nazis after World War II.

Bigly!!!

So head-up-your-Ass-tro likes Jabba the Governor?
And reading your comic book articles again I see......

 

[White 6]

Agreed, Attorney's are like Doctors. They have areas of speciality such as contract law, mergers and aquisitions, real estate, criminal, etc. Very few if any JAGs would have experience in the field of immigration law. But you are right, Immigration Judges are not Article III Judges practicing before the bar. They are DHS employees with a title. As DHS employees performing an administrative function, the administratiaon can probably be more lax. Well we know they are being more lax, they recently dropped the years of experience required to hire non-military JAG Immigration Judges.

This however goes back to a comment about JAGs defending people in State courts.

However I doubt that you have seen JAG's functioning as defense attornys as first seat in criminal State courts. #1 the JAG has to be admitted to the bar of that state, and #2 JAG's don't act as defense attrorny's for state criminal proceedings. They may be called in to advise on military law if needed.



No, actually it's not.

View attachment 1159840

https://www.americanbar.org/groups/legal_services/milvets/aba_home_front/information_center/working_with_lawyer/information_about_lawyers/military_legal_assistance/criminal_matters/

WW

Correct. Though, I have seen JAG on duty as lead in civilian court, at least once.
A large interstate service station/convenience service location, refused to schedule his Guard Member workers off, to attend National Guard Drills, threatening termination to force compliance. His attitude changed, after the MPs padlocked his money making establishment on I-40. He realized, pretty quick, there would be no helpful appeal, as the State Attorney General was also a full Bird Colonel, and Jag Officer in the National Guard. it was pretty much like swatting a gnat with a sledge hammer.

 

[White 6]

Context. …

JAG officers do not represent military in state and federal courts for criminal or civil matters.

They represent military members in military courts and legal actions.

WW

In the case, I refer to, yes, they were on orders, no only lead but only counsel representing the Guard members. They represented very effectively in state court and at no cost to the soldiers. Is it unusual? Yes. Does it happen? Yes, and quite effectively, as the Guard JAG officers, being civilian lawyers in day to day life, knew the civilian courts quite well. One of them, later became a judge and is still serving on the bench, though, like me, past military retirement.

 

[WorldWatcher]

In the case, I refer to, yes, they were on orders, no only lead but only counsel representing the Guard members. They represented very effectively in state court and at no cost to the soldiers. Is it unusual? Yes. Does it happen? Yes, and quite effectively, as the Guard JAG officers, being civilian lawyers in day to day life, knew the civilian courts quite well. One of them, later became a judge and is still serving on the bench, though, like me, past military retirement.

Guard is different then active duty JAG.

Because the NG falls under state authority unless activated for federal service.

We are talking active duty JAG here ( and possibly reserve officers called to active federal service).

WW

 

[White 6]

Guard is different then active duty JAG.

Because the NG falls under state authority unless activated for federal service.

We are talking active duty JAG here ( and possibly reserve officers called to active federal service).

WW

It is unlikely you will see JAG Officer (normally staffed at Sep Brigade or higher command level) activated for the city occupations. Although, some were activated, with units sent overseas.

 

[AZrailwhale]

Imigration

My daughter is an Air Force JAG with close to 10 years of service. Right now she's in a special billet that required a 3-year lock in so it's unlikely she would be assigned on this go around. However she is due for transfer next year, so she is in "wait-n-see" mode for that.

Her concerns were...

#1 Lack of Experience in the field of Immigration. JAGs are not a field of attorney's that deal with immigration as a normal course of their duties. Mostly JAGs are involved with contract law and military procurement, base legal providing limited family related services, and criminal prosecution/defense under the UCMJ. Two weeks of "training" doesn't replace years of experience in the field of immigration.

#2 Reports are (and what she's hearing) is that assignments will be 179 days of TDY (Temporary Duty), what we in the Navy called TAD (Temporary Assigned Duty). I'm assuming that comes from PCS (Permenant Change of Station) rules. Over that time the individuals wouldn't be TDY but would need to be permenantly assigned (meaning household goods shipments, transportation for not only themselves but reloaction of family, etc.).

#3 JAG is already understaffed, pulling 150 Air Force JAGs (the AF share of the 600 authorization) would severly impact an already backlog case load of existing military UCMJ prosecutions. If the JAG officers are pulled from the Air FORCE and TAD'd to DHS - they wouldn't be working their existing cases.

#4 The TAD pull will likley NOT be the junior JAGs, with will likely be senior Captains, Major's, maybe even Lt. Colonels. Those that normally sit First Chair and even act as Military Judges, which compounds the impact of #3 as these are the ones training the junior JAGs.

#5 Because the "judges" will not be qualitied and experienced in the field, defense attorny's will have a field day. In addition, there will be challenges to the TDY Judges rulings based on errors and lack of qualifications. That could result in class action status and "freeze" the whole idea of an extended period. One issue that neither of us thought about was Posse Comitatus Act and using JAGs for civil immigration law enforcement mentioned in the article below.

While she didn't mention it, I also wonder about how such assignments will impact promotion opportunities. If JAGs are being pulled out for 6-months of "dead time" from the regular duties to be detailed to DHS that time will impact promotions. Time which can be extended. Will it be viewed positively by promotion boards? With the SecDef try to put his fingers on promotion board selection for or against the JAG/Immigration Judge depending on if he felt the individual deported enough people? How will career senior officers sitting the boards view such a extended TDY status not involved with military law?

WW
.
.
.
.

Pentagon authorizes up to 600 military lawyers to serve as temporary immigration judges

Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth has approved sending up to 600 military lawyers to the Justice Department to serve as temporary immigration judges, according to a memo reviewed by The Associated Press.

apnews.com

Immigration "judges" are not judges at all in the normal sense of the word. They are hearing officers appointed by the DOJ and aren't subject to the strictures or limits put on normal judges. Immigration "courts" aren't courts, the immigrant is not furnished a lawyer and must pay for one him/herself.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Imigration

Immigration "judges" are not judges at all in the normal sense of the word. They are hearing officers appointed by the DOJ and aren't subject to the strictures or limits put on normal judges. Immigration "courts" aren't courts, the immigrant is not furnished a lawyer and must pay for one him/herself.

Correct, they (Immigration Judges) are employees of DHS.

What will be interesting will be the challenges of using military personnel as Immigration Judges to enforce immigration law under the posse comitatus act.

WW
.
.
.
.

18 U.S. Code § 1385 - Use of Army, Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force, and Space Force as posse comitatus

www.law.cornell.edu

 

[AZrailwhale]

Correct, they (Immigration Judges) are employees of DHS.

What will be interesting will be the challenges of using military personnel as Immigration Judges to enforce immigration law under the posse comitatus act.

WW
.
.
.
.

18 U.S. Code § 1385 - Use of Army, Navy, Marine Corps, Air Force, and Space Force as posse comitatus

www.law.cornell.edu

I think the loophole is that the military JAG officers will be enforcing immigration RULES, not laws.

 

[Admiral Rockwell Tory]

Pay all national guardsmen a full veteran cop salary plus benefits on top of their terms when they signed up. That should happen.

Who knew Methusaleh was so free with the taxpayer's money?