If an EV is in your future, keep this issue in mind

[Toddsterpatriot]

Of course.

To fuel a hydrogen car from water, electricity is used to generate hydrogen by electrolysis. The resulting hydrogen is an energy carrier that can power a car by reacting with oxygen from the air to create water, either through burning in a combustion engine or catalyzed to produce electricity in a fuel cell.

Water-fuelled car - Wikipedia​

What happens when the battery runs out of power?

 

[Robert W]

What happens when the battery runs out of power?

Buy a new battery.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Of course.

To fuel a hydrogen car from water, electricity is used to generate hydrogen by electrolysis. The resulting hydrogen is an energy carrier that can power a car by reacting with oxygen from the air to create water, either through burning in a combustion engine or catalyzed to produce electricity in a fuel cell.

Water-fuelled car - Wikipedia​

If you would actually read that article, you'll find that it completely refutes the idea of a water-fueled car. See the Extracting_energy_from_water section thereof.

According to the currently accepted laws of physics, there is no way to extract chemical energy from water alone. Water itself is highly stable—it was one of the classical elements and contains very strong chemical bonds. Its enthalpy of formation is negative (-68.3 kcal/mol or -285.8 kJ/mol), meaning that energy is required to break those stable bonds, to separate water into its elements, and there are no other compounds of hydrogen and oxygen with more negative enthalpies of formation, meaning that no energy can be released in this manner either.

Most proposed water-fuelled [sic] cars rely on some form of electrolysis to separate water into hydrogen and oxygen and then recombine them to release energy; however, because the energy required to separate the elements will always be at least as great as the useful energy released, this cannot be used to produce net energy.​

 

[Robert W]

Here are a couple more…

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View attachment 870668

Well since those are your presentations, and not my presentations, let's just say you brought those up so you stick with them.

 

[Robert W]

If you would actually read that article, you'll find that it completely refutes the idea of a water-fueled car. See the Extracting_energy_from_water section thereof.

According to the currently accepted laws of physics, there is no way to extract chemical energy from water alone. Water itself is highly stable—it was one of the classical elements and contains very strong chemical bonds. Its enthalpy of formation is negative (-68.3 kcal/mol or -285.8 kJ/mol), meaning that energy is required to break those stable bonds, to separate water into its elements, and there are no other compounds of hydrogen and oxygen with more negative enthalpies of formation, meaning that no energy can be released in this manner either.​

​

Most proposed water-fuelled [sic] cars rely on some form of electrolysis to separate water into hydrogen and oxygen and then recombine them to release energy; however, because the energy required to separate the elements will always be at least as great as the useful energy released, this cannot be used to produce net energy.​

People also ask


Can water be used to power a car?


Water cannot be directly used to propel vehicles. However, it can be decomposed into hydrogen and oxygen, and the isolated hydrogen can power fuel cells. Considering our forever escalating fuel costs, filling up at a gas station can give us all sorts of wild ideas.Jan 14, 2023

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Of course.

To fuel a hydrogen car from water, electricity is used to generate hydrogen by electrolysis. The resulting hydrogen is an energy carrier that can power a car by reacting with oxygen from the air to create water, either through burning in a combustion engine or catalyzed to produce electricity in a fuel cell.

Water-fuelled car - Wikipedia​

To fuel a hydrogen car from water, electricity is used to generate hydrogen by electrolysis.

How efficient is the process?

 

[Robert W]

If you would actually read that article, you'll find that it completely refutes the idea of a water-fueled car. See the Extracting_energy_from_water section thereof.

According to the currently accepted laws of physics, there is no way to extract chemical energy from water alone. Water itself is highly stable—it was one of the classical elements and contains very strong chemical bonds. Its enthalpy of formation is negative (-68.3 kcal/mol or -285.8 kJ/mol), meaning that energy is required to break those stable bonds, to separate water into its elements, and there are no other compounds of hydrogen and oxygen with more negative enthalpies of formation, meaning that no energy can be released in this manner either.​

​

Most proposed water-fuelled [sic] cars rely on some form of electrolysis to separate water into hydrogen and oxygen and then recombine them to release energy; however, because the energy required to separate the elements will always be at least as great as the useful energy released, this cannot be used to produce net energy.​

Hydrogen as a fuel has shown great promise in automotive propulsion. In separate designs, it has been used to generate electricity to power motors, as well as fuel combustion in modified IC engines.

It already finds use in commercial transport, such as buses and trucks, and even private transport cars. Owing to the difficulties in producing hydrogen, this format is not as popular as its electric and fossil fuel counterparts.

Q for the people? Is H in Water or not?

The Role Of Water In Hydrogen Fuel Cells And Vehicles​

To understand the role of water in hydrogen-powered vehicles, it’s crucial to understand the working of hydrogen fuel cells. Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors. Vehicles that run on this technology are also known as Fuel Cell electric vehicles (FCEVs).

While there are many types of fuel cells, polymer electrolyte membrane fuel cells are the most commonly used.

Working Of Hydrogen Fuel Cells​

Fuel cells typically consist of a cathode and an anode. Hydrogen from the fuel tank is supplied at the anode, where it reacts with a catalyst to split into its constituent subatomic particles, i.e., a proton and a neutron.

 

[Robert W]

To fuel a hydrogen car from water, electricity is used to generate hydrogen by electrolysis.

How efficient is the process?

The Role Of Water In Hydrogen Fuel Cells And Vehicles​

To understand the role of water in hydrogen-powered vehicles, it’s crucial to understand the working of hydrogen fuel cells. Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors. Vehicles that run on this technology are also known as Fuel Cell electric vehicles (FCEVs).

While there are many types of fuel cells, polymer electrolyte membrane fuel cells are the most commonly used.

Working Of Hydrogen Fuel Cells​

Fuel cells typically consist of a cathode and an anode. Hydrogen from the fuel tank is supplied at the anode, where it reacts with a catalyst to split into its constituent subatomic particles, i.e., a proton and a neutron.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Working Of Hydrogen Fuel Cells​

Fuel cells typically consist of a cathode and an anode. Hydrogen from the fuel tank is supplied at the anode, where it reacts with a catalyst to split into its constituent subatomic particles, i.e., a proton and a neutron.

If your hydrogen has a neutron, you've got bigger issues.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

The Role Of Water In Hydrogen Fuel Cells And Vehicles​

To understand the role of water in hydrogen-powered vehicles, it’s crucial to understand the working of hydrogen fuel cells. Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors. Vehicles that run on this technology are also known as Fuel Cell electric vehicles (FCEVs).

While there are many types of fuel cells, polymer electrolyte membrane fuel cells are the most commonly used.

Working Of Hydrogen Fuel Cells​

Fuel cells typically consist of a cathode and an anode. Hydrogen from the fuel tank is supplied at the anode, where it reacts with a catalyst to split into its constituent subatomic particles, i.e., a proton and a neutron.

Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors.

And then you can use the electricity to generate more hydrogen!!!

 

[Robert W]

Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors.

And then you can use the electricity to generate more hydrogen!!!

Importance Of Water As A Raw Material For Hydrogen Production​

Water is not only the end product of a reaction in hydrogen fuel cells, but it is a source of hydrogen itself. This can create a loop, where ‘exhaust’ water from fuel cells is electrolyzed to produce the hydrogen essential for fuel cell functioning.

In such cases, dependency on hydrogen from external sources further decreases, further reducing the vehicle’s carbon footprint. While it is theoretically possible to create such a self-contained system, as per the second law of thermodynamics, it is impossible to create a self-sustaining system without incurring some loss of energy.

Thus, a loop architecture can have shortcomings that may not immediately be apparent.

Benefits Of Using FCEVs​

The biggest advantage of using fuel cells is the immediate elimination of harmful tailpipe emissions. Apart from refueling times being as low as fossil fuel equivalents, they also have superior fuel economy. An average FCEV can replenish its hydrogen tank in under 5 minutes, and return fuel efficiencies in the range of 70MPGe (miles per gallon of gasoline equivalent).

This makes them a very competitive alternative to electric vehicles, which currently suffer from low range and high charging times.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Water cannot be directly used to propel vehicles. However, it can be decomposed into hydrogen and oxygen, and the isolated hydrogen can power fuel cells. Considering our forever escalating fuel costs, filling up at a gas station can give us all sorts of wild ideas.Jan 14, 2023

If you've got the energy present on board a car to split the water, why not use that energy directly to power a motor, instead of adding an extra wasteful step to split the water, and burn the resulting hydrogen.

You seem to be describing a process like this: Battery→Electrolysis of water→Fuel cell→Electric motor.

What advantage can that possibly have over this? Battery→Electric motor

Inserting electrolysis and a fuel cell between a battery and an electric motor only wastes energy, and adds gratuitous complexity.

 

[Robert W]

If you've got the energy present on board a car to split the water, why not use that energy directly to power a motor, instead of adding an extra wasteful step to split the water, and burn the resulting hydrogen.

You seem to be describing a process like this: Battery→Electrolysis of water→Fuel cell→Electric motor.

What advantage can that possibly have over this? Battery→Electric motor

Inserting electrolysis and a fuel cell between a battery and an electric motor only wastes energy, and adds gratuitous complexity.

Why am I against batteries as you want to have?

I explained this early on. Weight. HEAVY WEIGHT.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

Why am I against batteries as you want to have?

I explained this early on. Weight. HEAVY WEIGHT.

You're using a battery to split the water.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Hydrogen from the fuel tank is supplied at the anode, where it reacts with a catalyst to split into its constituent subatomic particles, i.e., a proton and a neutron.

The vast majority of hydrogen atoms do not contain neutrons. Just a lone proton at its core, orbited by a single electron.

Deuterium AKA heavy hydrogen, has one neutron in each atom, and makes up about 0.0145%, and tritium, with two neutrons, is so rare that no source I've been able to Google up dares to give me a percentage. Isotopes with more that two neutrons have never been observed to occur at all in nature, but have been artificially synthesized with up to six neutrons.

 

[Robert W]

The vast majority of hydrogen atoms do not contain neutrons. Just a lone proton at its core, orbited by a single electron.

Deuterium AKA heavy hydrogen, has one neutron in each atom, and makes up about 0.0145%, and tritium, with two neutrons, is so rare that no source I've been able to Google up dares to give me a percentage. Isotopes with more that two neutrons have never been observed to occur at all in nature, but have been artificially synthesized with up to six neutrons.

The vast majority of hydrogen atoms are not reacting with the catalyst.

 

[Bob Blaylock]

Hydrogen fuel cells use chemical energy to generate electricity that powers motors.

And then you can use the electricity to generate more hydrogen!!!

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

View attachment 870746

Musk is working on one.

 

[Robert W]

View attachment 870746

The Steam engine produces energy from burning fuels. Is that perpetual as you posit above?

 

[Flopper]

You want to power your car with a hydrogen bomb?
Is Alzheimer's hitting you at night?

Surely you know difference between igniting fuel and nuclear fusion.