I met President Bush Sunday!

[CSM]

what you think my posts "sounds like" is probably about as profound as your opinion of waterboarding.


In case you missed it, I had every chance to kick conservatives out of the forum while I was a mod... yet the FACT is that I was more laissez-faire than any period of a conservative dominated USMB. I didn't ban a single person with whom I disagreed. Can your political persuasion say that? Indeed, unity is a two way street. You probably missed that sign while looking for a liberal generalization to reply with.

Is if my fault that you are flinching?

Interesting. I have never expressed my views on waterboarding so your presumption on that matter is mute. As for the "sounds like" it is my opinion of your post and I dont really care what you think of my opinion. I also don't think you have a clue as to what my political persuasion is and I don't really care if you do or not.

Unity? That will never happen in this country or on this board. Heck, we can't even get to reasonable compromise here.

flinching from what? You? Why would I do that? You have zero impact on my life or on my way of thinking. You are fun to poke sticks at though.

 

[Shogun]

Interesting. I have never expressed my views on waterboarding so your presumption on that matter is mute. As for the "sounds like" it is my opinion of your post and I dont really care what you think of my opinion. I also don't think you have a clue as to what my political persuasion is and I don't really care if you do or not.

Unity? That will never happen in this country or on this board. Heck, we can't even get to reasonable compromise here.

flinching from what? You? Why would I do that? You have zero impact on my life or on my way of thinking. You are fun to poke sticks at though.

CLEARLY, you are not jabbering about assumed vitriol for your political persuasion. As for waterboarding, by all means, tell that Im wrong.

Wow! you mean you DONT care what I think?!?! HOly SHIT, I wonder if that is a universal trait for each user on this forum! Someone call national security!

Unity can happen. If you would rather stay in your partisan corner then so be it. go hve your ruby ridge moment and show the rest of us how independant-minded you unibomber types are.

Indeed, flinching. maybe you should figure out that i'm poking a stick at you right now... After all, It's probably not obvious how the fact of my tenure as a mod shut you right the fuck up about your assumption that I'd like to ban conservatives. Golly gee, wally. did MY assumptions turn out to be more correct than yours were?

 

[Alpha1]

Have you ever met someone who you thought was 'down to earth' or whatever and on getting to know them, you run the other way. Bush landing on the aircraft carrier after draft dodging didn't strike me as someone who is down to earth.

Just for the hell of it .....lets set the record straight....

There IS a difference.....
While some make up lies about a fighter pilot, a man that actually served in the US military, lets look at
and not forget the quotes and record of a tryed and true draft dodger.....lets look at FACTS and not
opinion and innuendo and lies the unproven theory.....
Lets deal with the FACTS of a self addmitted DRAFT DODGER....

Who shall remain nameless...

Infamous quotes from a self-admitted draft dodger:

"First, I want to thank you, not just for saving me from the draft"

"ROTC was the one way left in which I could possibly, but not positively, avoid both Vietnam and resistance. "

"After I signed the ROTC letter of intent I began to wonder whether the compromise I had made with myself was not more objectionable than the draft would have been, because I had no interest in the ROTC program in itself and all I seemed to have done was to protect myself from physical harm."

"At that time, after we had made our agreement and you had sent my 1 - D deferment to my draft board, the anguish and loss of self-regard and self-confidence really set in"

"The decision not to be a resister and the related subsequent decisions were the most difficult of my life"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Record of a REAL DRAFT DODGER:


----? registers for the draft on September 08, 1964, accepting all contractual conditions of registering for the draft.

Given Selective Service Number 3 26 46 228.

----? classified 2-S on November 17, 1964.

....? reclassified 1-A on March 20, 1968.

----?ordered to report for induction on July 28,1969.

----? dishonors order to report and is not inducted into the military.

----? reclassified 1-D after enlisting in the United States Army Reserves on August 07,1969 under authority of Col.E.Holmes. and takes oath of enlistment.

----? fails to report to his duty station at the University of Arkansas ROTC, September 1969.

----? reclassified 1-A on October 30, 1969, as enlistment with Army Reserves is revoked by Colonel E. Holmes and ----? now AWOL and subject to arrest under Public Law 90-40 (2)(a) 'registrant who has failed to report...remain liable for induction'.

----? birth date lottery number is 311, drawn December 1, 1969, but anyone who has already been ordered to report for induction, is INELIGIBLE!

----? runs for Congress (1974), while a fugitive from justice under Public Law 90-40.

----? runs for Arkansas Attorney General (1976),while a fugitive from justice.

----? receives pardon on January 21, 1977 from Carter.

----? FIRST PARDONED FEDERAL FELON ever to serve as President.

All these facts come from Freedom of Information requests, public laws, and various books that have been published, and have not been refuted by ----?

 

[jillian]

Just for the hell of it .....lets set the record straight....

There IS a difference.....
While some make up lies about a fighter pilot, a man that actually served in the US military, lets look at
and not forget the quotes and record of a tryed and true draft dodger.....lets look at FACTS and not
opinion and innuendo and lies the unproven theory.....
Lets deal with the FACTS of a self addmitted DRAFT DODGER....

Who shall remain nameless...

Infamous quotes from a self-admitted draft dodger:

"First, I want to thank you, not just for saving me from the draft"

"ROTC was the one way left in which I could possibly, but not positively, avoid both Vietnam and resistance. "

"After I signed the ROTC letter of intent I began to wonder whether the compromise I had made with myself was not more objectionable than the draft would have been, because I had no interest in the ROTC program in itself and all I seemed to have done was to protect myself from physical harm."

"At that time, after we had made our agreement and you had sent my 1 - D deferment to my draft board, the anguish and loss of self-regard and self-confidence really set in"

"The decision not to be a resister and the related subsequent decisions were the most difficult of my life"
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Record of a REAL DRAFT DODGER:


----? registers for the draft on September 08, 1964, accepting all contractual conditions of registering for the draft.

Given Selective Service Number 3 26 46 228.

----? classified 2-S on November 17, 1964.

....? reclassified 1-A on March 20, 1968.

----?ordered to report for induction on July 28,1969.

----? dishonors order to report and is not inducted into the military.

----? reclassified 1-D after enlisting in the United States Army Reserves on August 07,1969 under authority of Col.E.Holmes. and takes oath of enlistment.

----? fails to report to his duty station at the University of Arkansas ROTC, September 1969.

----? reclassified 1-A on October 30, 1969, as enlistment with Army Reserves is revoked by Colonel E. Holmes and ----? now AWOL and subject to arrest under Public Law 90-40 (2)(a) 'registrant who has failed to report...remain liable for induction'.

----? birth date lottery number is 311, drawn December 1, 1969, but anyone who has already been ordered to report for induction, is INELIGIBLE!

----? runs for Congress (1974), while a fugitive from justice under Public Law 90-40.

----? runs for Arkansas Attorney General (1976),while a fugitive from justice.

----? receives pardon on January 21, 1977 from Carter.

----? FIRST PARDONED FEDERAL FELON ever to serve as President.

All these facts come from Freedom of Information requests, public laws, and various books that have been published, and have not been refuted by ----?

A fighter pilot? You mean the poor little rich kid whose connections got him trained on a plane that wasn't ever going to see war and who ended his "service" by working on daddy's political campaign? Do you need to be again educated in the fact that the reserves (oher than about 8,000) DIDN'T GO TO 'NAM?

How about a VP who had 5 deferments yet likes sending troops to die for Haliburton.

How about people who told lies about a REAL war hero? You know Kerry, who actually served...

As for your other crap... just crap, like most of the stuff you write.

 

[Alpha1]

A fighter pilot? You mean the poor little rich kid whose connections got him trained on a plane that wasn't ever going to see war and who ended his "service" by working on daddy's political campaign? Do you need to be again educated in the fact that the reserves (oher than about 8,000) DIDN'T GO TO 'NAM?

Yep...a fighter pilot! Now you see the difference between serving and being a draft dodger...

How about a VP who had 5 deferments yet likes sending troops to die for Haliburton.
You have a problem with legal deferments to service? Call you Congressman with your complaint

How about people who told lies about a REAL war hero? You know Kerry, who actually served...
Never tell lies about a REAL HERO....if you don't believe hes a hero, just ask him

As for your other crap... just crap, like most of the stuff you write.

And as for the other crap....all true, true, true....as disgusting as it is

 

[maineman]

if you don't believe he's a hero, just ask him

I don't need to. I just look at his Silver Star and Bronze Star and, as a career military man, that's all I need to see... it is repugnant that some civilians would think they need a higher standard of proof than that.

 

[Kagom]

I have to admit, I would like to meet Bush.

 

[Gunny]

First, Bush is still president. Has been for over 7 years. We've had time to judge him. That isn't "bitching and moaning". Someone can appear to be a good guy to have a beer with and still be bad at his job. Do I think if I met him, he'd appear to be a terrible person? No. I think he'd be quite affable. But it's fair to comment on the job he's done.

As for the dogpiling... there are plenty of people here on both sides of this issue (and most others)... after all, it's not like we're judging Bush's personal morality in terms of his marriage, right?

So you're saying that those conservatives who had 8 years to judge Clinton because he did shit they didn't like are justified in parrotting THEIR rhetoric? That's not the way I see it go down whenever King Bill gets mentioned.

All I have seen for the past 7 years are unsupported accusations that get shot down time and again; yet, they get posted again. Tell a lie long enough until those who don't know any better believe it.

Nothing more than political hackery. Nothing to do with what's right or wrong, or the truth ... it's just all about smearing the other side.

 

[jillian]

So you're saying that those conservatives who had 8 years to judge Clinton because he did shit they didn't like are justified in parrotting THEIR rhetoric? That's not the way I see it go down whenever King Bill gets mentioned.

All I have seen for the past 7 years are unsupported accusations that get shot down time and again; yet, they get posted again. Tell a lie long enough until those who don't know any better believe it.

Nothing more than political hackery. Nothing to do with what's right or wrong, or the truth ... it's just all about smearing the other side.

I see your point. But I don't see the criticisms of Bush as unwarranted. As for Clinton, basically what I saw was the right hounding him for eight years when I thought he was doing a great job. (Sorry, I did, and I'm sticking with that).

I just figure there's no way to say Bush has been a competent president. Sorry, GL.

 

[Gunny]

I see your point. But I don't see the criticisms of Bush as unwarranted. As for Clinton, basically what I saw was the right hounding him for eight years when I thought he was doing a great job. (Sorry, I did, and I'm sticking with that).

I just figure there's no way to say Bush has been a competent president. Sorry, GL.

A matter of perspective, is it not? All I've seen is the left hounding Bush for 8 years when he's done a respectable job.

I don't think Clinton did a great job. I think he also did a respectable job. I was not one of "the right" that hounded him, and you have never seen me do it on this or any other board. If the topic comes up, I call him to task only for those things he did with which I disagree.

While I may argue the point, I do not take issue with those who call Bush to task for things he's done with which they disagree. I take issue with the "Bush this ... Bush that ... Bush lied ... blah, blah, blah" crowd. It's gotten WAY old.

I'm quite sure I disagreed with as much Clinton did as you do Bush. That goes back to my first sentence in this post.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

CLEARLY, you are not jabbering about assumed vitriol for your political persuasion. As for waterboarding, by all means, tell that Im wrong.

Wow! you mean you DONT care what I think?!?! HOly SHIT, I wonder if that is a universal trait for each user on this forum! Someone call national security!

Unity can happen. If you would rather stay in your partisan corner then so be it. go hve your ruby ridge moment and show the rest of us how independant-minded you unibomber types are.

Indeed, flinching. maybe you should figure out that i'm poking a stick at you right now... After all, It's probably not obvious how the fact of my tenure as a mod shut you right the fuck up about your assumption that I'd like to ban conservatives. Golly gee, wally. did MY assumptions turn out to be more correct than yours were?

The only Unity you and the liberals care about is the rest of us AGREEING to your position. No thanks.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

I don't need to. I just look at his Silver Star and Bronze Star and, as a career military man, that's all I need to see... it is repugnant that some civilians would think they need a higher standard of proof than that.

Sorry to ruin your parade but there are a HELL of a lot of Service people that are disgusted with the manner he "won" those awards and the purple hearts he used to get out of Nam 9 months early.

I too could have all kind of metals and ribbons if I just could have written them myself.

 

[maineman]

Sorry to ruin your parade but there are a HELL of a lot of Service people that are disgusted with the manner he "won" those awards and the purple hearts he used to get out of Nam 9 months early.

I too could have all kind of metals and ribbons if I just could have written them myself.

Sorry to rain on YOUR parade, but last I knew, military award for valor and heroism were not personality contests. If you were able to get medals and ribbons by writing them yourself, then you are basically saying that the Marine Corps process for rewarding and recognizing heroism, valor and extraordinary performance is totally broken and, therefore, any Marine's medals and awards are now suspect. Let's make sure that you tell GunnyL that all of his awards ain't worth shit.... and that he could very well have lied about all of them and the Marine Corps would still have given them to him. By the way, what medals do YOU have RGS? I need to know so that I can denigrate them...shit...you yourself just admitted that you could have written yourself up for all of them.... for all I know you did!

The process in the Navy for awarding medals of that level of significance involves significant investigation and vetting and verification. The Senior US Military Observer in the UN command wrote my medal citation, but everyone - including Naval Attaches at the US Embassies in Beirut and Tel Aviv - was called and questioned on it.

I guess what you are saying is that, in the Marine Corps, you can get them off the back of a box of cornflakes? As I said, run that by GunnyL for his take on it.

 

[CSM]

CLEARLY, you are not jabbering about assumed vitriol for your political persuasion. As for waterboarding, by all means, tell that Im wrong.

Wow! you mean you DONT care what I think?!?! HOly SHIT, I wonder if that is a universal trait for each user on this forum! Someone call national security!

Unity can happen. If you would rather stay in your partisan corner then so be it. go hve your ruby ridge moment and show the rest of us how independant-minded you unibomber types are.

Indeed, flinching. maybe you should figure out that i'm poking a stick at you right now... After all, It's probably not obvious how the fact of my tenure as a mod shut you right the fuck up about your assumption that I'd like to ban conservatives. Golly gee, wally. did MY assumptions turn out to be more correct than yours were?

You sure make a heck of a lot of judgements about folks you don't know. So you were a mod? I hadn't noticed.

Your assumptions are only correct in your own mind. As for us independent types...your right. I do not depend on the government to give me a darned thing....you should try it. It's called personal responsibility. Then again I am sure you like those freebies you non working scum sucking freeloders are used to getting. How's THAT for an assumption!

 

[midcan5]

Sorry to rain on YOUR parade, but last I knew, military award for valor and heroism were not personality contests. If you were able to get medals and ribbons by writing them yourself, then you are basically saying that the Marine Corps process for rewarding and recognizing heroism, valor and extraordinary performance is totally broken and, therefore, any Marine's medals and awards are now suspect. Let's make sure that you tell GunnyL that all of his awards ain't worth shit.... and that he could very well have lied about all of them and the Marine Corps would still have given them to him. By the way, what medals do YOU have RGS? I need to know so that I can denigrate them...shit...you yourself just admitted that you could have written yourself up for all of them.... for all I know you did!.

Exactly. In the right's hatred of Kerry RGS calls into question all military honors and yet Bush's draft dodging is ok in their strange, twisted world.

 

[RetiredGySgt]

Sorry to rain on YOUR parade, but last I knew, military award for valor and heroism were not personality contests. If you were able to get medals and ribbons by writing them yourself, then you are basically saying that the Marine Corps process for rewarding and recognizing heroism, valor and extraordinary performance is totally broken and, therefore, any Marine's medals and awards are now suspect. Let's make sure that you tell GunnyL that all of his awards ain't worth shit.... and that he could very well have lied about all of them and the Marine Corps would still have given them to him. By the way, what medals do YOU have RGS? I need to know so that I can denigrate them...shit...you yourself just admitted that you could have written yourself up for all of them.... for all I know you did!

The process in the Navy for awarding medals of that level of significance involves significant investigation and vetting and verification. The Senior US Military Observer in the UN command wrote my medal citation, but everyone - including Naval Attaches at the US Embassies in Beirut and Tel Aviv - was called and questioned on it.

I guess what you are saying is that, in the Marine Corps, you can get them off the back of a box of cornflakes? As I said, run that by GunnyL for his take on it.

Isuggest you research Kerry's medals you will find in the case of the purple hearts he lied to get them and you will find in the case of the bravery awards HE wrote them.

And we are not talking about the Marine Corps but rather that fellow you served in, the glorious US Navy.

I also notice your total lack of reading comprehension again, as usual. You will parse what the words the President said down to nit but can not fathom simple English when someone points out the ignorance and lies of Kerry or for that matter ANY democrat.

Go ahead QUOTE where I said I actually wrote my awards. Come on, can not be to hard to do, I have not edited my posts. put that brain of yours in gear and back up the idiotic claim you just made. Ohh wait your gonna parse that too so lets change it to "implied" shall we.

 

[jillian]

Exactly. In the right's hatred of Kerry RGS calls into question all military honors and yet Bush's draft dodging is ok in their strange, twisted world.

Guess a bunch of lying swiftboaters is no problem but telling the truth about Baby Bush's record... that aggravates them. Thing is, I don't even care that Bush used his daddy's connections to stay out of Vietnam. I'm sure my father would have done that for us if we were of that age and he had that power. It's the fact that the same people who get cranky about this and don't want to acknowledge it, are the first ones to call someone else's service into question for disagreeing with the chickenhawks.

(just watch them lose their little minds when the name Murtha is mentioned).

 

[Shogun]

The only Unity you and the liberals care about is the rest of us AGREEING to your position. No thanks.

I've made more effort in tossing out potential compramises and solutions to issues than there are people on this forum who give a damn about your silly little posts, rgs.

that, sir, is a true fact.

 

[Shogun]

I have to admit, I would like to meet Bush.

I would too. He is el presidente, after all.

 

[maineman]

Isuggest you research Kerry's medals you will find in the case of the purple hearts he lied to get them and you will find in the case of the bravery awards HE wrote them.

And we are not talking about the Marine Corps but rather that fellow you served in, the glorious US Navy.

I also notice your total lack of reading comprehension again, as usual. You will parse what the words the President said down to nit but can not fathom simple English when someone points out the ignorance and lies of Kerry or for that matter ANY democrat.

Go ahead QUOTE where I said I actually wrote my awards. Come on, can not be to hard to do, I have not edited my posts. put that brain of yours in gear and back up the idiotic claim you just made. Ohh wait your gonna parse that too so lets change it to "implied" shall we.

YOu said that if you had wanted to, you could have written your own. I assume that is the shoddy system in the Corps. It ain't that way in the Navy... and I laid out for you the vetting THAT I WAS AWARE of for a medal nowhere near as important as Kerry's. And even today, the US Navy stands completely behind every one of Kerry's medals. And I don't know what Marine Corps YOU served in, but the Marines that I have known and went to school with and served with have all understood that Silver Stars were pretty big fuckin' deals... and NONE of them would ever besmirch another veteran's heroism on the battlefield for political gain...but then, none of them were shameless partisan hacks like you.