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Because it is selecting people for suspicion based solely on their race and not based on anything that has to do with any particular offense. And it's bad math.Tell me , how is racial profiling "BAD"?
While most illegal aliens are Hispanic, most Hispanics are not illegal aliens..that's where the math is bad. If you took a random sample of illegal aliens, the majority would be from Mexico/Central/South America. But is you took a random sample of people who have apparent ancestry from Mexico/Central/South America, the majority would be legal citizens or resident aliens.Call me the devil's advocate. If the shoe fits...Most illegal aliens are Hispanic, Latino or Chicano. They are Mexicans, and they arent shy about it.
I am not fooling myself, I will never accept that I have to carry PAPERS, like Nazi Germany, in order to walk down the street.....NEVER!
Sure profiling can be a bad thing and can be abused by some and possibly also make some people uncomfortable because of the generalization when it comes to who looks like they could be illegal or not....
But, how can any person in this country who pays taxes, and who's future is being sacrificed by the debt we're in, oppose the idea of keeping people out of this country who aren't here legally and who are being a burden on our society...
Legal Mexicans who will be asked for their paperz. They will look just as illegal until they produce them and that is not the America I know.
Sure profiling can be a bad thing and can be abused by some and possibly also make some people uncomfortable because of the generalization when it comes to who looks like they could be illegal or not....
But, how can any person in this country who pays taxes, and who's future is being sacrificed by the debt we're in, oppose the idea of keeping people out of this country who aren't here legally and who are being a burden on our society...
I dont care about racial profiling at all.. But I do care about violation of peoples' rights.
Even though I like the premise of the Arizona law, I cannot support it because it is unconstitutional. Im a caucasian male, and yet the law could theoretically have me arrested for failing to produce my papers even if Im minding my own business walking down a public sidewalk.
And exactly how do you figure THAT? And while you're at it, I'd be fascinated to hear how you get "Unconstitutional" out of something that was very carefully crafted with that very opposing argument in mind.
There was a discussion about this on this board "papers" is actually an old-fashioned term in this computer era. Police can check data bases as well if someone is not carrying their license or other form of ID. And all you need is one of several acceptable forms of ID. There are plenty of illegals with licenses. They will still be safe from the big, bad police - unless they are committing another crime - which is why people will be stopped in the first place.
Also - there are stiff penalties for police who overstep their authority. That in and of itself should prevent profiling.
As for the OP - opponents are few. They just have really big mouths.
There was a discussion about this on this board "papers" is actually an old-fashioned term in this computer era. Police can check data bases as well if someone is not carrying their license or other form of ID. And all you need is one of several acceptable forms of ID. There are plenty of illegals with licenses. They will still be safe from the big, bad police - unless they are committing another crime - which is why people will be stopped in the first place.
Also - there are stiff penalties for police who overstep their authority. That in and of itself should prevent profiling.
As for the OP - opponents are few. They just have really big mouths.
It has already happened. A Drivers license wasnt enough and the cops demanded a guys birth certificate.. he told them it was home, so they arrested him.
the arizona law is illegal
There was a discussion about this on this board "papers" is actually an old-fashioned term in this computer era. Police can check data bases as well if someone is not carrying their license or other form of ID. And all you need is one of several acceptable forms of ID. There are plenty of illegals with licenses. They will still be safe from the big, bad police - unless they are committing another crime - which is why people will be stopped in the first place.
Also - there are stiff penalties for police who overstep their authority. That in and of itself should prevent profiling.
As for the OP - opponents are few. They just have really big mouths.
It has already happened. A Drivers license wasnt enough and the cops demanded a guys birth certificate.. he told them it was home, so they arrested him.
the arizona law is illegal
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity based on specific and articulable facts and inferences. It is the basis for an investigatory or Terry stop by the police and requires less evidence than probable cause, the legal requirement for arrests and warrants. Reasonable suspicion is evaluated using the "reasonable person" or "reasonable officer" standard, in which said person in the same circumstances could reasonably believe a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity; such suspicion is not a mere hunch. Police may also, based solely on reasonable suspicion of a threat to safety, frisk a suspect for weapons, but not for contraband like drugs. A combination of particular facts, even if each is individually innocuous, can form the basis of reasonable suspicion.
It has already happened. A Drivers license wasnt enough and the cops demanded a guys birth certificate.. he told them it was home, so they arrested him.
the arizona law is illegal
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity based on specific and articulable facts and inferences. It is the basis for an investigatory or Terry stop by the police and requires less evidence than probable cause, the legal requirement for arrests and warrants. Reasonable suspicion is evaluated using the "reasonable person" or "reasonable officer" standard, in which said person in the same circumstances could reasonably believe a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity; such suspicion is not a mere hunch. Police may also, based solely on reasonable suspicion of a threat to safety, frisk a suspect for weapons, but not for contraband like drugs. A combination of particular facts, even if each is individually innocuous, can form the basis of reasonable suspicion.
The constitution says nothing about 'reasonable suspicion' only probable cause. Just because somebody's been using 'reasonable suspicion' as some 'accepted process' doesnt make it right or constitutional...
The problem with this law is that it violates peoples' privacy...Now, I like Jan Brewer.. I do. and I like all the other laws Arizona has done to exert its 10th amendment rights.. But imagine the next governor of Arizona is Mexican and wants to use this law to hassle white people..
Its like my Republican friends who are horrified on learning that the feds under obama can look up their medical records without a warrant.. When they ask me where Obama got such power from I tell them - the Patriot Act under George Bush.
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law that a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity based on specific and articulable facts and inferences. It is the basis for an investigatory or Terry stop by the police and requires less evidence than probable cause, the legal requirement for arrests and warrants. Reasonable suspicion is evaluated using the "reasonable person" or "reasonable officer" standard, in which said person in the same circumstances could reasonably believe a person has been, is, or is about to be engaged in criminal activity; such suspicion is not a mere hunch. Police may also, based solely on reasonable suspicion of a threat to safety, frisk a suspect for weapons, but not for contraband like drugs. A combination of particular facts, even if each is individually innocuous, can form the basis of reasonable suspicion.
The constitution says nothing about 'reasonable suspicion' only probable cause. Just because somebody's been using 'reasonable suspicion' as some 'accepted process' doesnt make it right or constitutional...
The problem with this law is that it violates peoples' privacy...Now, I like Jan Brewer.. I do. and I like all the other laws Arizona has done to exert its 10th amendment rights.. But imagine the next governor of Arizona is Mexican and wants to use this law to hassle white people..
Its like my Republican friends who are horrified on learning that the feds under obama can look up their medical records without a warrant.. When they ask me where Obama got such power from I tell them - the Patriot Act under George Bush.
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law.
Is federal immigration law different from Arizona's new law? - Phoenix Arizona news, breaking news, local news, weather radar, traffic from ABC15 News | ABC15.com1. Will SB1070 force police to racially profile?
SB1070 says police cannot solely consider race, color or national origin.
It also says officers can only ask during a valid traffic stop or an investigation with probable cause.
In short, for those who say it allows officers to profile... it doesn't.
2. Will you need to prove that you are a U.S. citizen if you are stopped?
The bill is clear, if you're a U.S. citizen you need local, state or federally issued identification, like a driver's license.
If you're a naturalized citizen you need your green card or proof of citizenship. But that's already required by the U.S. government, not Arizona.
So do you need proof? Yes.
3. Another concern is if SB1070 will cost governments and taxpayers.
The law will require every officer to be trained. The governor just ordered it.
There will also be extra costs for prosectuing, transporting and jailing suspects.
How much? Police and correction departments are still figuring that out, but it will cost us.
4. Other issues have come up about if the bill is constitutional and if it "mirrors" federal law.
The bill is based on U.S. statutes and gives Arizona police the power that federal officers have.
It's not a new idea. In 1996, the U.S. trained local officers to enforce national immigration laws under the 287(g) program.
This bill is a bigger extension of that program.
It seems some people have come on here to bitch about how anti american this law is without knowing anything about it, come on people knowing is half the battle!!!
Is federal immigration law different from Arizona's new law? - Phoenix Arizona news, breaking news, local news, weather radar, traffic from ABC15 News | ABC15.com1. Will SB1070 force police to racially profile?
SB1070 says police cannot solely consider race, color or national origin.
It also says officers can only ask during a valid traffic stop or an investigation with probable cause.
In short, for those who say it allows officers to profile... it doesn't.
2. Will you need to prove that you are a U.S. citizen if you are stopped?
The bill is clear, if you're a U.S. citizen you need local, state or federally issued identification, like a driver's license.
If you're a naturalized citizen you need your green card or proof of citizenship. But that's already required by the U.S. government, not Arizona.
So do you need proof? Yes.
3. Another concern is if SB1070 will cost governments and taxpayers.
The law will require every officer to be trained. The governor just ordered it.
There will also be extra costs for prosectuing, transporting and jailing suspects.
How much? Police and correction departments are still figuring that out, but it will cost us.
4. Other issues have come up about if the bill is constitutional and if it "mirrors" federal law.
The bill is based on U.S. statutes and gives Arizona police the power that federal officers have.
It's not a new idea. In 1996, the U.S. trained local officers to enforce national immigration laws under the 287(g) program.
This bill is a bigger extension of that program.
The constitution says nothing about 'reasonable suspicion' only probable cause. Just because somebody's been using 'reasonable suspicion' as some 'accepted process' doesnt make it right or constitutional...
The problem with this law is that it violates peoples' privacy...Now, I like Jan Brewer.. I do. and I like all the other laws Arizona has done to exert its 10th amendment rights.. But imagine the next governor of Arizona is Mexican and wants to use this law to hassle white people..
Its like my Republican friends who are horrified on learning that the feds under obama can look up their medical records without a warrant.. When they ask me where Obama got such power from I tell them - the Patriot Act under George Bush.
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law.
Here is a quote from the highest law of the land. If any other law contradicts this highest law, then that lesser law is automatically null and void and of no force. It is no law at all, and neednt be followed by anybody.
Amendment 4 - Search and Seizure. Ratified 12/15/1791.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Reasonable suspicion is a legal standard in United States law.
Here is a quote from the highest law of the land. If any other law contradicts this highest law, then that lesser law is automatically null and void and of no force. It is no law at all, and neednt be followed by anybody.
Amendment 4 - Search and Seizure. Ratified 12/15/1791.
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
but not for contraband like drugs.
Here is that link to Bill 1070 that the Arizona Governor signed last moth. At the top of the page it will tell you what the colored text is all about. She sent it back once for changes before she would sign it. HERE
Sure profiling can be a bad thing and can be abused by some and possibly also make some people uncomfortable because of the generalization when it comes to who looks like they could be illegal or not....
But, how can any person in this country who pays taxes, and who's future is being sacrificed by the debt we're in, oppose the idea of keeping people out of this country who aren't here legally and who are being a burden on our society...
Sure profiling can be a bad thing and can be abused by some and possibly also make some people uncomfortable because of the generalization when it comes to who looks like they could be illegal or not....
But, how can any person in this country who pays taxes, and who's future is being sacrificed by the debt we're in, oppose the idea of keeping people out of this country who aren't here legally and who are being a burden on our society...
Legal Mexicans who will be asked for their paperz. They will look just as illegal until they produce them and that is not the America I know.
Sure profiling can be a bad thing and can be abused by some and possibly also make some people uncomfortable because of the generalization when it comes to who looks like they could be illegal or not....
But, how can any person in this country who pays taxes, and who's future is being sacrificed by the debt we're in, oppose the idea of keeping people out of this country who aren't here legally and who are being a burden on our society...
I dont care about racial profiling at all.. But I do care about violation of peoples' rights.
Even though I like the premise of the Arizona law, I cannot support it because it is unconstitutional. Im a caucasian male, and yet the law could theoretically have me arrested for failing to produce my papers even if Im minding my own business walking down a public sidewalk.
I'll be damned if I am forced to carry ID with me to walk down the street, in this land of the free....
I will NEVER accept this....till the day I die....
Here is that link to Bill 1070 that the Arizona Governor signed last moth. At the top of the page it will tell you what the colored text is all about. She sent it back once for changes before she would sign it. HERE