How would you fight China?

[HUGGY]

Someone clue me in.

Why are we going to war with China?

Because China has the ambitions of being the world's only superpower....and we're in the way.

Projecting useful power on the other side of the planet is VERY expensive. Right now we are that useful power and we use it to protect all sea lanes for every nation including China. China can't just build some super navy to protect just it's own commerce. If they want to build a policing force for the benfit of the worlds commerce then let em have at it. Because police actions lead to invasions. Invasions lead to world observation and the consequence of those observations. Not all the judges are fair and reasonable. Some try to use every incident as a bridge to a wedge and a bigger condemnation. China already has "issues" with many countries we don't ever hear about. If she wanted to be the big bad new cop on the beat every grievance ever lodged against China would strangle her. Before you know it some gay ambassadore would be out of place at a predictably bad time and location and get his dumb ass killed along with a couple of ex Chinese versions of Seal Team 6. (I wonder how long the international community would put up with a Chinese "seal team" going into any country in the world to right all wrongs or just do a drug or weapons deal)

My guess is that projected power by the Chinese would land them into a major war with somebody...maybe several somebodies real quickly with no possible good outcome for the Chinese.

 

[Flopper]

What you're talking about is WWIII. China has nothing to gain and a lot to loose in any confrontation against the US.

I doubt seriously that US would invade Iran. Much more likely would be surgical strikes limited to nuclear development. China doesn't want a nuclear arsenal in Iran any more than we do and they're certainly not going to start a world war over it. What China wants is Iranian oil.

Except we've already been warned by Russia not to strike Iran. And if we do, that will put us in direct military confrontation with Russia. And if we fight Russia, we will also fight China, because they have a defense treaty, much like NATO.

Yep, I'm afraid you're right. However, Russia and China are not BFF's by a long shot and China may, or may not, join Russia in opposing us.

There is no defense treaties between China and Iran or between Russia and Iran so neither country is going to be dragged into a nuclear confrontation over this. They have little to gain and much to lose.

Turn the clock back 30 or 40 years, and a nuclear confrontation between the superpowers would be much more likely than today. Russia and China are no longer isolated or ruled by ideology. Both their economies are very dependent on western nations.

 

[Oldguy]

Except we've already been warned by Russia not to strike Iran. And if we do, that will put us in direct military confrontation with Russia. And if we fight Russia, we will also fight China, because they have a defense treaty, much like NATO.

Yep, I'm afraid you're right. However, Russia and China are not BFF's by a long shot and China may, or may not, join Russia in opposing us.

There is no defense treaties between China and Iran or between Russia and Iran so neither country is going to be dragged into a nuclear confrontation over this. They have little to gain and much to lose.

Turn the clock back 30 or 40 years, and a nuclear confrontation between the superpowers would be much more likely than today. Russia and China are no longer isolated or ruled by ideology. Both their economies are very dependent on western nations.

Ever heard of the SCO?

The Sino-Russian Alliance: Challenging America's Ambitions in Eurasia | Critical Analysis |Axisoflogic.com

 

[Unkotare]

Someone clue me in.

Why are we going to war with China?

Because China has the ambitions of being the world's only superpower....and we're in the way.

Projecting useful power on the other side of the planet is VERY expensive. Right now we are that useful power and we use it to protect all sea lanes for every nation including China. China can't just build some super navy to protect just it's own commerce. If they want to build a policing force for the benfit of the worlds commerce then let em have at it. Because police actions lead to invasions. Invasions lead to world observation and the consequence of those observations. Not all the judges are fair and reasonable. Some try to use every incident as a bridge to a wedge and a bigger condemnation. China already has "issues" with many countries we don't ever hear about. If she wanted to be the big bad new cop on the beat every grievance ever lodged against China would strangle her. Before you know it some gay ambassadore would be out of place at a predictably bad time and location and get his dumb ass killed along with a couple of ex Chinese versions of Seal Team 6. (I wonder how long the international community would put up with a Chinese "seal team" going into any country in the world to right all wrongs or just do a drug or weapons deal)

My guess is that projected power by the Chinese would land them into a major war with somebody...maybe several somebodies real quickly with no possible good outcome for the Chinese.

China is no doubt aware of all this, but they know that to become a true global super power they must develop the ability to project power and command a blue water navy. Our example is not lost on them. That is why they are largely following the theories of Alfred Thayer Mahan just as Roosevelt did when he set out to expand US power around the world.

 

[rightwinger]

Someone clue me in.

Why are we going to war with China?

Because China has the ambitions of being the world's only superpower....and we're in the way.

No, it's because China envies our freedom

 

[Beria]

The old Gloucester Regiment took them on single handed !

 

[editec]

Why would we want to fight China? They are a good trading partner

We need to invade Canada....They are much closer and are easier to beat

Are you sure about that? We've already invaded them 4 or 5 times and been sent packing.

I think it's been three times.

Four only if you count the Finians, who after all, were not representing the US government but the IRA.

 

[Billo_Really]

There is no defense treaties between China and Iran or between Russia and Iran so neither country is going to be dragged into a nuclear confrontation over this. They have little to gain and much to lose.

Turn the clock back 30 or 40 years, and a nuclear confrontation between the superpowers would be much more likely than today. Russia and China are no longer isolated or ruled by ideology. Both their economies are very dependent on western nations.

Russia and China have a defense treaty.

USSR and PRC sign mutual defense treaty

The mutual defense section of the agreement primarily concerned any future aggression by Japan and "any other state directly or indirectly associated" with Japan. Zhou En-lai proudly declared that the linking of the two communist nations created a force that was "impossible to defeat."

In addition, Russia has trade agreements with Iran they will not like to see, if interrupted by a US attack.

 

[Dugdale_Jukes]

Not really, but they are just about the only place actively mining them.

Where is the evidence?

Here's some, little *****. The rest of the world has begun responding to China's manipulation of their supply by mining elsewhere, like the very productive mine in Mountain Pass CA that was once the world's top source but had been shut down due to environmental concerns and the availability of cheap supplies from China.


Rare Earth Minerals: An End To China's Monopoly Is In Sight - Forbes


China?s advantage erodes in a key area: rare earth minerals - Washington Post



Japan discovers huge mineral deposits in Pacific - video | World news | guardian.co.uk



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/12/b...set-to-start-importing-the-elements.html?_r=0

The point, you lowlife ********** and the ignorant ***** you rode in on, is that China does NOT is NOT the only nation mining them. Thank you for making MY point.

It is laugh out loud funny that another lowlife ********** Wicked Jester negged me for negging a skunked out moron posting that. And my thanks to the posters who made it clear the US has plenty of the metals - as do Canada, South Africa and a dozen other nations.

 

[Unkotare]

Where is the evidence?

Here's some, little *****. The rest of the world has begun responding to China's manipulation of their supply by mining elsewhere, like the very productive mine in Mountain Pass CA that was once the world's top source but had been shut down due to environmental concerns and the availability of cheap supplies from China.


Rare Earth Minerals: An End To China's Monopoly Is In Sight - Forbes


China?s advantage erodes in a key area: rare earth minerals - Washington Post



Japan discovers huge mineral deposits in Pacific - video | World news | guardian.co.uk



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/12/b...set-to-start-importing-the-elements.html?_r=0

The point, you lowlife ********** and the ignorant ***** you rode in on, is that China does NOT is NOT the only nation mining them. Thank you for making MY point.

It is laugh out loud funny that another lowlife ********** Wicked Jester negged me for negging a skunked out moron posting that. And my thanks to the posters who made it clear the US has plenty of the metals - as do Canada, South Africa and a dozen other nations.

Go back and read MY first post on the subject, idiot. You're too stupid to even know what you thought you were arguing about. What a ******* numbskull.

 

[Flopper]

There is no defense treaties between China and Iran or between Russia and Iran so neither country is going to be dragged into a nuclear confrontation over this. They have little to gain and much to lose.

Turn the clock back 30 or 40 years, and a nuclear confrontation between the superpowers would be much more likely than today. Russia and China are no longer isolated or ruled by ideology. Both their economies are very dependent on western nations.

Russia and China have a defense treaty.

USSR and PRC sign mutual defense treaty

The mutual defense section of the agreement primarily concerned any future aggression by Japan and "any other state directly or indirectly associated" with Japan. Zhou En-lai proudly declared that the linking of the two communist nations created a force that was "impossible to defeat."

In addition, Russia has trade agreements with Iran they will not like to see, if interrupted by a US attack.

I said Iran does not have a defense treaty with either Russia or China. Russia and China have had a mutual defense since 1950.

 

[Billo_Really]

I said Iran does not have a defense treaty with either Russia or China. Russia and China have had a mutual defense since 1950.

And Russia has trade agreements with Iran they don't want to see being affected by a US attack.

 

[anotherlife]

The American drafted meat-shield will not be as effective as the historic Soviet one was against the Nazis, because we don't have the headcount and area advantage.

"Area advantage"?


And, we have a much larger population than that of the Soviet Union during WWII.

I think strategic land advantage means that you can defensively move your population in such as way that an invading force must cover prohibitively large distances to engage you. This was a key factor that won the war for the Soviets against the Nazis.

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

Modern warfare is won with quality and not quantity

Only initially. This is what the Nazis banked on too. Then the simple body-count competition takes over and decides the final outcome.

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

Well it isn't exactly like they have an Amphibious force which could land 1 billion plus soldiers on U.S. soil, so reality dictates that it's an impossible scenario to begin with, and thus an unanswerable question.

Why is it impossible? It's already on in cyber-space, and China is now building military hardware full steam ahead, both for its air force and navy.

I suspect, that every time when a new power emerges, a world war kicks in, like it was with ww1.

I don't think there is much historical evidence to back your theory that when a new power emerges, a world war is inevitable. We have had only two world worlds both involving the same countries; the second war being an outgrowth of the first. Over 70 years have passed since the last world war.

Using the US war with Japan as evidence that a nuclear war would not lead to total annihilation is faulty. Japan had no nuclear weapons. They had no choice but to surrender.

To think that an all out nuclear war evolving the US, China, and Russia would not wipe out billions of people and set civilization back a hundred years is wishfully thinking. The combinded arsenal of these nations is in excess of 6,000 nuclear weapons.

Not all world wars may carry the name "world war" because not all carry the modern legalistic propaganda. But the Napoleonic+USrevolution wars were a world war, and so was the Anglo-Dutch war, and Spain's Grande Armada too that would have wiped England off the map if landed. They are world wars because they are fought over a global scale, in a global theatre. And even if a modern nuclear war wipes out most people in Asia, it will most certainly not be the end of civilization, those who are in control will remain in control after that too.

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

I would stop buying anything they produce and ship to the US first. Everything that you buy that's made in China helps their military in some way.

Isn't it amazing that this is exactly what American communities are prevented from doing, by many federal laws prohibiting American communities from establishing their own local supply chains?

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

Just what is your war scenario? China doesn't the airlift or sealift capability to attack us conventionally on our soil. We would easily wipe them out in a naval confrontation. If we were to attack China, there is no way we could deploy enough conventional forces to fight them on their soil. either way, one side or the other would have to resort to NBC warfare.

China has the money and the time, as well as all the know-how to build anything they want. And they are building all.

Someone clue me in.

Why are we going to war with China?

Because they don't want to buy oil in US dollars to begin with?

Despite China being a borderline criminal nation abusing nearly every trade law in existence and one of the worst trade partners for American citizens in the history of the nation, one suspects that even the stupidest nutball and the lowlifiest NeoCon would draw the line at suicide.

There is no possibility the US is ever going to win a land war on mainland Asia. That is not going to happen now or at any time in the future.

But China can provoke it. New superpowers always provoke an attack on them to take the old powers off the map. See Austria-Hungary for an example. I think national suicide is regularly done.

 

[Toddsterpatriot]

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

I have repeatedly advocated restoring the draft as the only means we have of keeping up with the clearly superior numbers in the Chinese military. They vastly outnumber us and if they move against us the only hope we would have is to use nukes, which would mean Armageddon.

An active draft will flood our civilian population with millions of trained soldiers who could be called up and deployed in a matter of weeks rather than the months it takes to train raw recruits. If we'd had such a pool of easily deployable grunts at the outset of WW-II we could have overwhelmed the Japanese in the Pacific and prevented Bataan, Corregidor, and numerous other defeats we suffered there in the early stages of the War. We were caught with our pants down back then and we should not let it happen again.

We have for too long been smugly dependent on our nuclear capabilities but the era of that advantage has passed. China has nukes, too. So does Russia, Pakistan, and N. Korea. It's possible that Iran already has them or if not will have them soon. We can no longer rely on that option because a nuclear exchange could mean the end of civilization. So we need to have more trained soldiers on inactive reserve status.

We need more boots to put on the ground or we can be overrun. In spite of what the money-grubbing military politicians in Washington tell us the days of the foot soldier are far from over. We were warned by General Shinseki that to prevail in Iraq in the time frame proposed by the Bush Administration would have called for at least 350,000 more troops, which we didn't have. Consequently we've been there for ten years now at a cost of more than a trillion dollars, the loss of 4,400 lives and 36,000 disabling injuries.

The Military Industrial Complex is responsible for the current emphasis on technology because drafting and training foot soldiers doesn't put as much money in its pockets as does manufacturing exotic machinery and Star-Wars gadgetry.

We need more boots to put on the ground or we can be overrun.

Overrun? What are they gonna do, swim over?

 

[Sunshine]

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

We can't fight China. They are like the company store in the song. We owe our souls to them.

 

[Unkotare]

The American drafted meat-shield will not be as effective as the historic Soviet one was against the Nazis, because we don't have the headcount and area advantage.

"Area advantage"?


And, we have a much larger population than that of the Soviet Union during WWII.

I think strategic land advantage means that you can defensively move your population in such as way that an invading force must cover prohibitively large distances to engage you. .

You haven't noticed that the United States is pretty big, or that the Atlantic and Pacific oceans cover "large distances"?

 

[Unkotare]

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

We can't fight China. They are like the company store in the song. We owe our souls to them.

Why can't people stop themselves from posting nonsense like this?

 

[Sunshine]

How would us 250 million Americans fight the 1 billion ++ China in a war? They can just keep coming with more and more men and more and more money. How would the US stay its foothold against them?

We can't fight China. They are like the company store in the song. We owe our souls to them.

Why can't people stop themselves from posting nonsense like this?

Why can't you do youself and us a favor and stop breathing!

 

[Flopper]

I said Iran does not have a defense treaty with either Russia or China. Russia and China have had a mutual defense since 1950.

And Russia has trade agreements with Iran they don't want to see being affected by a US attack.

Really? Iran constitutes about .6% of Russia's total foreign trade. Russia does nearly twice as much business with the US as it does Iran. They are certainly not going to get in a thermonuclear war over this. It would make no sense.

I believe it's quite possible that US or Israel backed by the US will do a surgical strike against Iranian nuclear development sites. China and Russian will lodge strong protests with the UN. However, neither Russia nor China gives a damn about Iran. Iran is neither economically or militarily of any real significance to either country. It's just a bargaining chip.

 

[Unkotare]

We can't fight China. They are like the company store in the song. We owe our souls to them.

Why can't people stop themselves from posting nonsense like this?

Why can't you do youself and us a favor and stop breathing!

Give me an example for a few hours and I'll think about it.