How Coronavirus Raced Through Quarantined Cruise Ship.

[eagle1462010]

I have been stating for weeks now .....hell maybe even a month that this virus will spread through ventilation systems. I've also shown the SARs reports for Hong Kong OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because the studies SHOWED HOW IT SPREAD.

The Cruise ship Diamond Princess quarantined was in effect a LAB EXPERIMENT. Showing a set number of people exposed to the virus in close quarters and about 690 people got it, out of 3500 people on the ship. The early articles said that it didn't spread through the ventilation systems.........this article says different as does the SARs report on Hong Kong.

How Coronavirus Raced Through Quarantined Cruise Ship - Drugs.com MedNews

The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can t filter ou

www.drugs.com

TUESDAY, Feb. 25, 2020 -- The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can't filter out particles as small as the new coronavirus, one air quality expert says.

Typical conditions onboard cruise ships probably contributed to those case numbers, one expert said.

"It's standard practice for the air conditioning systems of cruise ships to mix outside air with inside air to save energy," Qingyan Chen, a professor of mechanical engineering at Purdue University in West Lafayette, Ind., explained.

"The problem is that these systems can't filter out particles smaller than 5,000 nanometers. If the coronavirus is about the same size as SARS [severe acute respiratory syndrome], which is 120 nanometers in diameter, then the air conditioning system would be carrying the virus to every cabin," Chen said in a university news release.

"Cruise ships could minimize this problem by just using outside air and not recirculating it," he added.

Toilets would be the main source of coronavirus transmission on commercial flights.

"Stool also contains viruses. Close the lid before you flush to limit how much goes into the air. Planes should provide wet wipes with alcohol to prevent the spread of the virus through touch," Chen said.

COPD (Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease)

COPD, or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, is a chronic lung condition that makes it difficult to breathe.

www.webmd.com

Study showing how it spread in Amoy Gardens.
video

 

[eagle1462010]

In these reports they said once the SARS spread from the exhaust ducts of bathrooms.......Open windows allowed the spread to go horizontal .....building to building in Hong Kong.

On the Cruise ship the shared air system would spread it cabin to cabin because standard filters WILL NOT STOP coronavirus microbes. Only UV style Ionization can stop the virus and even N95 masks cannot stop all microbes.

Another point I am making is the POOP. Sars in Hong Kong Spread in POOP, and now it's doing the same thing in Coronavirus.

Covid-19 study implicates fecal transmission

Fecal transmission of SARS was implicated in sickening hundreds in Hong Kong's Amoy Gardens housing estate in 2003

www.dhakatribune.com

The first US patient diagnosed with Covid-19 also experienced loose bowel movements for two days and the virus was subsequently detected in his stool, and there have been other such cases in China documented in the Lancet, albeit infrequently.

"Importantly, Covid-19 has been reported elsewhere in the feces of patients with atypical abdominal symptoms, similar to SARS which was also shed in urine, suggesting a fecal transmission route which is highly transmissible," William Keevil, a professor of environmental healthcare at the University of Southampton said in a comment to the UK's Science Media Centre.

The possibility is not totally surprising to scientists, given that the new virus belongs to the same family as SARS.

Fecal transmission of SARS was implicated in sickening hundreds in Hong Kong's Amoy Gardens housing estate in 2003. A rising plume of warm air originating in bathrooms contaminated several apartments and was transported by wind to adjacent buildings in the complex.

 

[eagle1462010]

In the beginning of this outbreak. Wuhan China. High Rise apartments and population density were the MAJOR problem.

This is the same case in New York and New Jersey. High Population Density and High Rise Apartments sharing air. Same thing as Amoy Gardens Hong Kong in 2003, and the Same TYPE of virus.

1. It can be spread through the sewage system. If the Sewage traps aren't full or SANITIZED then the virus gets airborne when the door is shut to the bathroom and the exhaust fan is used via Negative Air pressure.

2. Droplets of contamidated Coronavirus then spread upward through the vents to other Apartments.
Then spread through AC systems or open windows via normal air currents to other buildings.

3. Then the whole process starts again.

My point.............is to show possible means of spreading the disease to figure out how to stop the spread. How do we minimize the spread or stop it as it explodes in Urban America with people packed in like Sardines?

 

[Maxdeath]

So using your numbers this is not that infectious.
Only a small percentage of those exposed contracted the virus.
IF it is spread through ventilation ducts only a small percentage needs to worry about being exposed. then considering the death rate on te ship. That number is actually a small percentage of those who actually contracted the virus.
So why the fear mongering?

 

[Remodeling Maidiac]

I voted OTHER because I have no earthly idea how the infrastructure is built in New York and I'm not an infectious disease expert.

 

[Lesh]

I have been stating for weeks now .....hell maybe even a month that this virus will spread through ventilation systems. I've also shown the SARs reports for Hong Kong OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because the studies SHOWED HOW IT SPREAD.

The Cruise ship Diamond Princess quarantined was in effect a LAB EXPERIMENT. Showing a set number of people exposed to the virus in close quarters and about 690 people got it, out of 3500 people on the ship. The early articles said that it didn't spread through the ventilation systems.........this article says different as does the SARs report on Hong Kong.

How Coronavirus Raced Through Quarantined Cruise Ship - Drugs.com MedNews

The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can t filter ou

www.drugs.com

TUESDAY, Feb. 25, 2020 -- The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can't filter out particles as small as the new coronavirus, one air quality expert says.

Typical conditions onboard cruise ships probably contributed to those case numbers, one expert said.

"It's standard practice for the air conditioning systems of cruise ships to mix outside air with inside air to save energy," Qingyan Chen, a professor of mechanical engineering at Purdue University in West Lafayette, Ind., explained.

"The problem is that these systems can't filter out particles smaller than 5,000 nanometers. If the coronavirus is about the same size as SARS [severe acute respiratory syndrome], which is 120 nanometers in diameter, then the air conditioning system would be carrying the virus to every cabin," Chen said in a university news release.

"Cruise ships could minimize this problem by just using outside air and not recirculating it," he added.

Toilets would be the main source of coronavirus transmission on commercial flights.

"Stool also contains viruses. Close the lid before you flush to limit how much goes into the air. Planes should provide wet wipes with alcohol to prevent the spread of the virus through touch," Chen said.

COPD (Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease)

COPD, or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, is a chronic lung condition that makes it difficult to breathe.

www.webmd.com

Study showing how it spread in Amoy Gardens.
video

For the most part apartments don't HAVE shared ventilation systems like offices and some schools do.
And C-19 spreads far more efficiently by surface contact anyway.

The virus drops out of the air in minutes. Meaning it would be rare for it to be caught by the ventilation system

 

[eagle1462010]

Possible solutions. My opinions based on what I've read.

1. Ensure every U trap in plumbing in the city is full of water. any empty U trap will allow exhaust gases from the sewage to escape. Since SARs and Coronavirus are in the poop. They will travel through the Sewage pipes infecting more people. Any drain pipes in the floor for mopping need to be full as well.

2. All toilets should be sanitized at regular intervals. 1 cup of Bleach will kill the hell out of the virus. Bleach is CHEAP. If one cup of Bleach were added to the U traps of all sewage systems via flushing it would help sanitize and kill the virus in every sewage system.

3. Close windows in infected rooms and buildings. Positive air flow to normal air currents have spread the disease. Someone sick or having this disease can spread it to other buildings through the air.

4. Portable Ionizers that can kill the Microbes of the virus and clean the air of ANY ROOM as it filters the air. Cheap ones that kill dust will not kill this virus.

5. Ionized and UV filter systems in the AC systems will kill the virus. Not allowing transmission.

6. Humidifiers can help reduce the spread of coronavirus. Keeps them from floating easy in the air. Droplets fall to the ground quickly and limit the spread.

7. Standard CDC items of Wash your dang hands........wipe surfaces being touched......careful to contaminate food and etc.....

Add your recommendations here.

 

[JackOfNoTrades]

In the beginning of this outbreak. Wuhan China. High Rise apartments and population density were the MAJOR problem.

This is the same case in New York and New Jersey. High Population Density and High Rise Apartments sharing air. Same thing as Amoy Gardens Hong Kong in 2003, and the Same TYPE of virus.

1. It can be spread through the sewage system. If the Sewage traps aren't full or SANITIZED then the virus gets airborne when the door is shut to the bathroom and the exhaust fan is used via Negative Air pressure.

2. Droplets of contamidated Coronavirus then spread upward through the vents to other Apartments.
Then spread through AC systems or open windows via normal air currents to other buildings.

3. Then the whole process starts again.

My point.............is to show possible means of spreading the disease to figure out how to stop the spread. How do we minimize the spread or stop it as it explodes in Urban America with people packed in like Sardines?

Simple. Everybody stays put in their bleeping houses for a month, make sure you don't come within six feet of anyone while you're out on just a supplies run (because I realize not everyone has someone to go shop for them), and if you're sick, stay home!!
Infection rates in cities are higher because people are stacked on top of one another...but it's also because a lot of people didn't take the social distancing seriously for a few weeks in February and early March. Sorry, that kind of messaging starts at the top of the leadership chain and the people in Washington who knew this was coming since December.

We have very little information at the moment about how this virus really spreads and what variables here cause its spread to accelerate. Because of the lack of widespread testing, we don't know everyone who is or who has been infected, and I'm just starting to see studies being right now studying the blood of people who have been infected to see if their plasma can be used to treat the infected or be made to use as part of a vaccine. Those are studies that will run for the next 1-2 years. This can't be solved in the space of a Law And Order episode.

 

[eagle1462010]

I have been stating for weeks now .....hell maybe even a month that this virus will spread through ventilation systems. I've also shown the SARs reports for Hong Kong OVER AND OVER AGAIN. Because the studies SHOWED HOW IT SPREAD.

The Cruise ship Diamond Princess quarantined was in effect a LAB EXPERIMENT. Showing a set number of people exposed to the virus in close quarters and about 690 people got it, out of 3500 people on the ship. The early articles said that it didn't spread through the ventilation systems.........this article says different as does the SARs report on Hong Kong.

How Coronavirus Raced Through Quarantined Cruise Ship - Drugs.com MedNews

The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can t filter ou

www.drugs.com

TUESDAY, Feb. 25, 2020 -- The crisis aboard the quarantined Diamond Princess cruise ship in Japan shows how germs can spread rapidly through air conditioning systems that can't filter out particles as small as the new coronavirus, one air quality expert says.

Typical conditions onboard cruise ships probably contributed to those case numbers, one expert said.

"It's standard practice for the air conditioning systems of cruise ships to mix outside air with inside air to save energy," Qingyan Chen, a professor of mechanical engineering at Purdue University in West Lafayette, Ind., explained.

"The problem is that these systems can't filter out particles smaller than 5,000 nanometers. If the coronavirus is about the same size as SARS [severe acute respiratory syndrome], which is 120 nanometers in diameter, then the air conditioning system would be carrying the virus to every cabin," Chen said in a university news release.

"Cruise ships could minimize this problem by just using outside air and not recirculating it," he added.

Toilets would be the main source of coronavirus transmission on commercial flights.

"Stool also contains viruses. Close the lid before you flush to limit how much goes into the air. Planes should provide wet wipes with alcohol to prevent the spread of the virus through touch," Chen said.

COPD (Chronic Obstructive Pulmonary Disease)

COPD, or chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, is a chronic lung condition that makes it difficult to breathe.

www.webmd.com

Study showing how it spread in Amoy Gardens.
video

For the most part apartments don't HAVE shared ventilation systems like offices and some schools do.
And C-19 spreads far more efficiently by surface contact anyway.

The virus drops out of the air in minutes. Meaning it would be rare for it to be caught by the ventilation system

The SARs study in Hong Kong says different.........and that it spread via the air building to building and upwards via the sewage systems.

WHO and the CDC tried to discount these studies.........Other funded studies disagreed with them. Their studies under found it spread through the air. Humidity does exactly what you say though........Why Flu doesn't spread so easy in the Summer.

I'm no expert.........but I READ.......and their are plenty of experts I'm quoting that are saying this.

On the cruise ship........they discounted........OH it couldn't spread through the ventilation. I've shown articles and studies that disagree.

 

[eagle1462010]

In the beginning of this outbreak. Wuhan China. High Rise apartments and population density were the MAJOR problem.

This is the same case in New York and New Jersey. High Population Density and High Rise Apartments sharing air. Same thing as Amoy Gardens Hong Kong in 2003, and the Same TYPE of virus.

1. It can be spread through the sewage system. If the Sewage traps aren't full or SANITIZED then the virus gets airborne when the door is shut to the bathroom and the exhaust fan is used via Negative Air pressure.

2. Droplets of contamidated Coronavirus then spread upward through the vents to other Apartments.
Then spread through AC systems or open windows via normal air currents to other buildings.

3. Then the whole process starts again.

My point.............is to show possible means of spreading the disease to figure out how to stop the spread. How do we minimize the spread or stop it as it explodes in Urban America with people packed in like Sardines?

Simple. Everybody stays put in their bleeping houses for a month, make sure you don't come within six feet of anyone while you're out on just a supplies run (because I realize not everyone has someone to go shop for them), and if you're sick, stay home!!
Infection rates in cities are higher because people are stacked on top of one another...but it's also because a lot of people didn't take the social distancing seriously for a few weeks in February and early March. Sorry, that kind of messaging starts at the top of the leadership chain and the people in Washington who knew this was coming since December.

We have very little information at the moment about how this virus really spreads and what variables here cause its spread to accelerate. Because of the lack of widespread testing, we don't know everyone who is or who has been infected, and I'm just starting to see studies being right now studying the blood of people who have been infected to see if their plasma can be used to treat the infected or be made to use as part of a vaccine. Those are studies that will run for the next 1-2 years. This can't be solved in the space of a Law And Order episode.

While I agree with your standard precautions......with the exception of shutting down the planet too long..............


THESE STUDIES HAVE BEEN DONE...........This disease is similar and we should use HISTORICAL EVIDENCE for helping minimize the spread now.

I've shown the studies.........and have given some simple solutions to HELP...........WHAT DO WE HAVE TO LOSE to check and see if the plumbing U traps have water and add some bleach to it........not expensive and might work......

 

[Lesh]

First of all...as I said...most apartment building do NOT have shared ventilation systems...

Offices and schools do.

So you understand the obvious need to keep those types of building closed right?

 

[Lesh]

You point out that the virus can spread through ventilation systems and then recommend we go BACK to buildings that HAVE shared ventilation systems?

WTF?

 

[eagle1462010]

All apartments shall have positive air in the system. All bathrooms shall have negative air requirments. Negative air in the bathrooms spread the disease in Amoy Gardens Hong Kong.

Quarantine for Coronavirus victims being done by the hospitals now require ALL ROOMS to be negative air for Quarantine. Apartments in High rises are DESIGNED OPPOSITE. Infections in an apartment IF AIRBORNE can spread with a open window or to the hallways if the front door is open.

 

[Lesh]

WTF are you actually talking about?

Again...Most apartments IN THIS COUNTRY have hot water heat and window or wall unit AC units.

YOU want to send people back to office buildings and schools that have SHARED ventilation systems

 

[eagle1462010]

So using your numbers this is not that infectious.
Only a small percentage of those exposed contracted the virus.
IF it is spread through ventilation ducts only a small percentage needs to worry about being exposed. then considering the death rate on te ship. That number is actually a small percentage of those who actually contracted the virus.
So why the fear mongering?

I'm not fear mongering. I'm giving information on how these things spread in the past.........Seeing what is happening in New York.......I think they could do some simple measures and REDUCE WHAT IS GOING ON THERE.

How hard would it be to just make sure the U traps are filled and add a little bleach...........Ionizers are portable and can be used anywhere.........they filter the air and are simple solutions.

Humidifiers are also portable and also help lesson or stop the spread..........I've read many articles saying that putting Humidifiers in lobbies can help minimize transmission of the virus......

Whey is it......that I am FEAR MONGERING......I am pointing out facts to try and stop the spread......so we can get the hell back to work.

 

[eagle1462010]

You point out that the virus can spread through ventilation systems and then recommend we go BACK to buildings that HAVE shared ventilation systems?

WTF?

Is someone else here that I can't see or was that directed at me.............I have given information on how this virus could spread..........and possible solutions.......IF THAT IS DIRECTED AT ME.

 

[eagle1462010]

WTF are you actually talking about?

Again...Most apartments IN THIS COUNTRY have hot water heat and window or wall unit AC units.

YOU want to send people back to office buildings and schools that have SHARED ventilation systems

lol

Reading comprehension or you didn't read anything I posted .......aka the links..........

In the studies for SARs..........open windows and natural air currents spread the disease horizontally building to buiding..............They had similar AC systems.............The main issue they found.......was the plumbing traps were EMPTY.........because the system had been drained to repair the lines...so many of the traps allowed air to escape via negative pressure from the exhaust vents

 

[Lesh]

All good...as long as you don't advocate going back to work. The dangers you mention are absolutely greater in office buildings, stores, and schools than at home

 

[ReinyDays]

The CDC's take on the matter

TL;DR = so far, no evidence of fecial transmission of Covid-19 ... low transmission rates in related viruses ...

Don't play with other people's poop ... common sense hygiene ... God, you kids today have some disgusting habits ...

 

[eagle1462010]

All good...as long as you don't advocate going back to work. The dangers you mention are absolutely greater in office buildings, stores, and schools than at home

So are places like New York City telling the residents of these high rises or owners to check these lessons from the past..........................I've been on a thread where they were doing nothing to inform them in high rises in New York.

My point being an OUNCE OF PREVENTION is better than a pound of cure. How hard would it be to add water to all traps and some disinfectant or Bleach to them.............Pretty cheap thing to do........makes sure that it kills anything in the plumbing..........which in fact started the Amoy Gardens problems.