Homeland Security revokes Harvard’s ability to enroll international students

[toobfreak]

There are other universities that had unruly protests...but only Harvard was singled out and the student visa program was not cancelled for the others...why not? Other universities had Palestine protests and intimidation occurring towards Jewish students, but they were not stripped of their research and development grants.

Look dummy, I'll only say this once:

1. If I apply for any government program, I must qualify and stay qualified. No one is entitled, including any university.
2. Harvard wants to get public money from the Fed but they don't want to meet the conditions to qualify for it.
3. Now they want all these foreign students but again, won't life a finger to qualify for it.
4. There is no free speech issue here. If they are so up on free speech, why won't they ever let a conservative like Charlie Kirk give a talk there?
5. All Harvard needs to do is show a concerted effort to try to discourage further racist activities threatening and harassing ethnic students, but they won't stop.
6. Your point above only proves the urgency of the matter--- we need to put a stop to this at Harvard, then many other schools as this has gotten way out of hand. And that is just what Trump is going to do.

 

[forkup]

See, you're a revisionist historian.

Might makes right when mice attack a lion.

That's exactly how the Nazi's thought about the Jews. "They aren't really human. They are less than us. So, we have a right to kill them."

If I'm a revisionist historian (wouldn't know why, since nothing I've said isn't something I can't back-up.) then you are no historian at all, revisionists or otherwise. What you are, is some guy on the internet using some really, really... really!!! Bad/appalling arguments to justify what comes down to ethnic cleansing by Israel. Arguments that as I said are similar to those used as justification for some of the worst acts of nation states in history.

If you truly believe there's no problem for a nation to act towards human beings as you are describing, you shouldn't be surprised that the word fascism falls that often.

 

[Care4all]

Look dummy, I'll only say this once:

1. If I apply for any government program, I must qualify and stay qualified. No one is entitled, including any university.
2. Harvard wants to get public money from the Fed but they don't want to meet the conditions to qualify for it.
3. Now they want all these foreign students but again, won't life a finger to qualify for it.
4. There is no free speech issue here. If they are so up on free speech, why won't they ever let a conservative like Charlie Kirk give a talk there?
5. All Harvard needs to do is show a concerted effort to try to discourage further racist activities threatening and harassing ethnic students, but they won't stop.
6. Your point above only proves the urgency of the matter--- we need to put a stop to this at Harvard, then many other schools as this has gotten way out of hand. And that is just what Trump is going to do.

They did all that....and your story is full of mistaken facts....

 

[Correll]

Then it appears you didn't review the link in the OP.

WW
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View attachment 1114500

That's fine. INdeed, it is another blow to harvard. So.... your point?

 

[Failzero]

Nazis were monsters. Straight out of an HP Lovecraft story. Authoritarian socialists who insisted on capitalist participation and fantasized themselves to be racially pure and superior.

And they did Socialism better than the European Experts did later

 

[dudmuck]

Look dummy, I'll only say this once:

1. If I apply for any government program, I must qualify and stay qualified. No one is entitled, including any university.
2. Harvard wants to get public money from the Fed but they don't want to meet the conditions to qualify for it.
3. Now they want all these foreign students but again, won't life a finger to qualify for it.
4. There is no free speech issue here. If they are so up on free speech, why won't they ever let a conservative like Charlie Kirk give a talk there?
5. All Harvard needs to do is show a concerted effort to try to discourage further racist activities threatening and harassing ethnic students, but they won't stop.
6. Your point above only proves the urgency of the matter--- we need to put a stop to this at Harvard, then many other schools as this has gotten way out of hand. And that is just what Trump is going to do.

 

[scruffy]

And they did Socialism better than the European Experts did later

At the expense of their neighbors and a subpopulation. They were arguably successful temporarily, until the inevitable universal participation mandates kicked in. The end result was the entire world turned against them and we had to bomb the shit out of them and hang the survivors. That's what usually happens to monsters, even in the HP Lovecraft novels.

The Chinese are currently working on the same hybrid model the Nazis used, they just call it something different. All business subsumed to the state, universal participation, no dissent tolerated. Expansionist, at the expense of neighbors who could have been their allies. Only, they're not as rigorous as the Nazis were, their quality control sucks. If we have to bomb the shit out of them it'll get ugly, more Chinese will die than Germans. Just like Hitler, they're trying to ally with the Moslems (Pakistan, most lately). History repeats itself, the Chinese can't win and they'll be forced to stand down. (Or destroyed, one or the other).

 

[struth]

These students at Harvard are NOT HAVING THEIR VISAS REVOKED. Only Harvard is being restricted by Trump and BIG GOVT.

These students are having to transfer to another University...their visas are not revoked. Explain that...

Because Harvard has violated the law they are no longer able to keep their certification in the student exchange and visitors program. Students can either transfer to a school that is still or they get their visas revoked

Schools and Programs

www.ice.gov

Regulating immigration and naturalization is a constitutional requirement of Congress. Saying that’s big govt is a stretch

 

[toobfreak]

Regulating immigration and naturalization is a constitutional requirement of Congress.

To be sure, if the US Govt. were smart, it would treat Harvard the way most other countries might under similar circumstances and shut the college down of all student and educational activity until they comply with the requirements necessary for the untold billions in public tax money they have already taken.

These schools do not operate above the law in some imaginary allodial cloud of special leftwing privilege like a state within the state, they operate purely at the pleasure of the Federal government.

 

[JoeB131]

To be sure, if the US Govt. were smart, it would treat Harvard the way most other countries might under similar circumstances and shut the college down of all student and educational activity until they comply with the requirements necessary for the untold billions in public tax money they have already taken.

These schools do not operate above the law in some imaginary allodial cloud of special leftwing privilege like a state within the state, they operate purely at the pleasure of the Federal government.

That sounds like something a Nazi would say.

You don't seem to get why the government gives money to universities. It gives them money 1) to achieve the research the government needs done and 2) to keep our competitive edge in technical specialists.

A Harvard Degree is an E-Ticket to life if you are lucky enough to get one. It's why racists like Lisa and Hector are very upset that some of those slots are being allocated to black people.

Trump is upset that Obama got into Harvard and he didn't.

 

[WorldWatcher]

To be sure, if the US Govt. were smart, it would treat Harvard the way most other countries might under similar circumstances and shut the college down of all student and educational activity until they comply with the requirements necessary for the untold billions in public tax money they have already taken.

These schools do not operate above the law in some imaginary allodial cloud of special leftwing privilege like a state within the state, they operate purely at the pleasure of the Federal government.

Since we're talking about applying the law.

Just curious, is the "Government" (assuming here you mean the Executive Branch) requires to follow the law during this process that Congress has defined in the law and apply constitutional principals?

Does Harvard get to challenge the Executive Branch actions in a court of law and require the government to prove that it's action comply with the law. For example, let's say that the government demanded provide information about students beyond what is already reported in Student and Exchange Visitor Information System (SEVIS).

Harvard says "no" we are not supplying that without a court order, so come back with a subpoena. How is having the Government show cause for it's actions a bad thing?

On the flip side, the Government CAN show cause. They ALREADY have the data on all the foreign students at Harvard. They could easily email them (or snail mail them) a correspondence that says the DOJ is looking into anti-Semitic activities. If they have knowledge please contact DOJ at XXXXXXXXXX. If specific complaints are then received then those become actionable events that the DOJ as part of an investigation can use to obtain the subpoena.

WW

 

[toobfreak]

Does Harvard get to challenge the Executive Branch actions in a court of law and require the government to prove that it's action comply with the law.

Very odd. If I apply for a federal grant and the fed notifies me I no longer meet the requirements, I meet the requirements or else. I don't get to challenge the ruling (Oh, they will say you can, but you really only get to challenge it with them, with them still making the final decision).

If I apply for public welfare (which is what Harvard is getting) and they find out I already have 50 billion dollars in the bank (what Harvard has), they would cancel the grant and probably sue me for all monies given to be paid back.

Just why does Harvard need anything when they have 50 billion in the bank?

What is the big deal with promoting and policing safety on campus for all students and discouraging antisemitism and support for terrorists? I would think that if I really wanted and needed the public funds, I would just happily meet the requirements. I would have hoped that having found out they have Hamas supporters on campus threatening and beating up fellow students there based purely on their ethnic heritage, that Harvard would have been all over that anyway, with or without any need for an external motivation.

But instead, Harvard is trying to take the POTUS to court to defend their right to continue supporting Hamas and attacking their own students because of their parentage.

 

[JoeB131]

If I apply for public welfare (which is what Harvard is getting) and they find out I already have 50 billion dollars in the bank (what Harvard has), they would cancel the grant and probably sue me for all monies given to be paid back.

Except Harvard isn't getting "Welfare", they are being paid for specific services.

Which is why the courts have ruled against Trump, because he is in violation of those contracts.

 

[WorldWatcher]

If I apply for public welfare (which is what Harvard is getting) and they find out I already have 50 billion dollars in the bank (what Harvard has), they would cancel the grant and probably sue me for all monies given to be paid back.

Harvard isn't getting public welfare. Grants are fee for service. Work performed.

For example...

Harvard, here is a grant for your people to study the development of brain cancer.

Or

Harvard, here is a grant for your people to study the custom gene therapy for breast cancer.

Just why does Harvard need anything when they have 50 billion in the bank?

Under your logic Musk gets corporate welfare for the services he performs.

He's the richest man in the world with around $500 Billion dollars, why does he need money to lauch rockets for NASA?
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HINT: Grants are not welfare, they are for services.

WW

 

[toobfreak]

Harvard isn't getting public welfare.

Grants from public taxpayer funds amounts to welfare, welfare for an institution which hates America, is training subversives, and most of all, already has 50 billion in the bank and doesn't need the money.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Grants from public taxpayer funds amounts to welfare, welfare for an institution which hates America, is training subversives, and most of all, already has 50 billion in the bank and doesn't need the money.

Musk has $500 Billion in the bank and doesn't need to money he gets from corporate welfare. He should do the work for free.

Or shouldn't people be paid for contract services?

So when the government gives a Pell Grant to a student - they don't need to attend school.

So when the government gives a grant to study they changes in the magneto sphere because of sun spot activity - they don't need to do the stated research?

WW

 

[toobfreak]

Have a problem with uncontrollable laughter? If you are trying to disparage my intelligence to win this argument, I can end this conversation with you right here and now by simply putting you on Ignore.

Musk has $500 Billion in the bank and doesn't need to money he gets from corporate welfare. He should do the work for free.

He just worked for DOGE for nearly half a year for free. And the money Musk has in the bank he earned through wealth he created. The money Harvard has in the bank is simply money they took in from tuitions, admissions, and public taxpayer grants.

Or shouldn't people be paid for contract services?

STFU and quit trying to change the subject. The subject here is HARVARD, not Musk, asshole.
Better still, just keep your stupid opinions to yourself. We will agree to simply disagree.
Either way, Trump will be winning this and Harvard will be losing funding for not meeting minimum federal requirements.

Me, I would shut the damned place down.

 

[WorldWatcher]

Have a problem with uncontrollable laughter? If you are trying to disparage my intelligence to win this argument, I can end this conversation with you right here and now by simply putting you on Ignore.


He just worked for DOGE for nearly half a year for free. And the money Musk has in the bank he earned through wealth he created. The money Harvard has in the bank is simply money they took in from tuitions, admissions, and public taxpayer grants.


STFU and quit trying to change the subject. The subject here is HARVARD, not Musk, asshole.
Better still, just keep your stupid opinions to yourself. We will agree to simply disagree.
Either way, Trump will be winning this and Harvard will be losing funding for not meeting minimum federal requirements.

Me, I would shut the damned place down.

The subject is payment for services.

I know YOU want it to be only about Harvard.

But the fact is that there is no difference between payment for services for a Grant to a University to perform work on a specific item such as research and corporate welfare to Musk in paying for contracted services such as launching rockets for NASA.

WW

WW

 

[skews13]

MSN

The Department of Homeland Security on Thursday revoked Harvard University’s certification to admit foreign students, making good on a threat by President Donald Trump and escalating his fight with the Ivy League school.

Homeland Security Secretary Kristi L. Noem ordered the agency to terminate Harvard’s Student and Exchange Visitor Program (SEVP) certification, which allows U.S. universities to admit international students, for allegedly allowing “anti-American, pro-terrorist” foreigners “to harass and physically assault individuals … and obstruct its once-venerable learning environment.” The secretary also accused the university of working with the Chinese Communist Party by hosting and training members of its paramilitary group.

By golly, that's what I voted for!

Columbia also got some federal attention. Columbia and Harvard are two pretty big heads on the wall.

Already blocked by the Supreme Court. The admission of foreign students by Harvard and other universities continues unabated.

 

[toobfreak]

The subject is payment for services.
I know YOU want it to be only about Harvard.

Nope, jackass. Read the title of the thread. Read the OP.
This is all about HARVARD.
I'd shut the school completely down and charge them with sedition.
But since I can't and you are a lemming who continues to troll, deflect and change subjects despite my warnings,
Off to Iggy with you. Bye.