Hey cons: if your solution to the min wage issue is to tell those people...

[Asclepias]

For Oakland city counsel considering raising the MW. Didnt you read your own link?

"Hundreds of Wal-Mart employees fasted this past November in protest for a $15 minimum wage, arguing that Wal-Mart employees do not make enough money to put food on the table.

Oakland Mayor Libby Schaaf, a Democrat, has been leading statewide efforts to raise the minimum wage to $15."

And the point is......what? Why did they choose to work somewhere that they didn't make enough money to put food on their table? If everyone left, then Walmart would have no choice but to raise their pay rates to attract labor. That's the beauty of the free market. The people working their were clearly happy with their employment as they not only agreed to work for that much but chose to stay there.

The point is that they retaliated like I pointed out from your own link. How did you lose sight of my point?

People don't cut off their nose to spite their face when it comes to money and successful businesses. You view everything like an immature 6th grader. Walmart shut down their business because the minimum wage made it unsustainable. How is it "retaliation" to close the doors of a successful business?

How can the specific store being doing great but the wage was unsustainable? Its retaliation because it takes that tax revenue out of the city that raised the minimum wage. Why dont you have someone explain how cities get their revenue in regards to businesses.

It was doing great and then they announced that there would be a wage increase. Walmart crunched the numbers, realized it was unsustainable, and closed their doors.

You may believe that but i dont. Thats why your link lacks any credibility.

 

[The Rabbi]

Here agains we show the diffidence between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives just claim it wont work and never try anything. Liberals believe in implementing a solution and making it work through a process of refinement. Further proof you would still be grunting to communicate if not for liberals.

We can raise the minimum wage conditionally to see what happens. If its not a good thing then we can repeal the law or place a time limit on it.

Spot on.
Conservatives have been using the same talking points against MW for decades. If they held any water at all, they would have been easily proven already. It's just the usual noise.

It's been proven over and over. Look at the rate of teen unemployment. In the 1960s it tracked very closely with the general rate. Today it is three times the general rate. That isnt by accident.

It's never been proven that MW increases have any significant or long term affects on unemployment. Please post up the graph that shows the correlated increase in unemployment for every time the MW has been raised.

OK what do I win?

Hardly cause and effect. The rate is all over the place. What factors contribute to teenage unemployment? Only MW?

DENY!

 

[The Rabbi]

Your chart seems to show unemployment dropping when MW is higher and rising when in decline.

I suppose it could seem like that if you're dyslexic.

So you're going to post a graph and then try and lie about what it shows?
Look at 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000 and right before the crash. All showing low unemployment when the value of MW is higher. Conversely the declines in value correspond to increasing unemployment.

I already posted the right graph. Since min wage jobs are a small percentage of overall jobs the increase wont show up in the general market. Look at populations that largely have min wage jobs and you'll find their UE rates have skyrocketed.

The right graph? No, you posted a graph only showing teens who don't need to work at all.

Carpe diem blog?
At least Taz had the BLS stats.

Quibble quibble deny deny.
There is no graph or article that would persuade you of what is obvious to everyone but you.

 

[Asclepias]

Which is kinda shitty considering they can write off their wages as a tax deduction.

Once again, you're lack of understanding on economics, finance, business, etc. is remarkable. The tax deductions do not cover the full cost of the salary. It's a very small percentage. If the tax deduction covered the entire salary, then business owners would have no labor costs. The federal government would be providing labor for them. That's simply not how it works.

Youre too dumb for words son. It doesnt say you can write off "very little". Can you tell us what this means to you?

Publication 535 (2015), Business Expenses


"You can generally deduct the amount you pay your employees for the services they perform. The pay may be in cash, property, or services. It may include wages, salaries, bonuses, commissions, or other non-cash compensation such as vacation allowances and fringe benefits. For information about deducting employment taxes, see chapter 5."

Yes...you can deduct from the taxes. The result of that doesn't cover the labor costs.

In all seriousness - at what grade did you drop out of school?

Doesnt matter where you deduct it from son. The point is you can deduct it.

So??? A deduction means less taxes to pay. It still doesn't cover the labor costs. You want to pretend like having deductions means it eliminates labor costs..

Are you going to tell us what grade you dropped out of school or not?

I am going to assume here youve never heard of a tax refund?

 

[Asclepias]

Your chart seems to show unemployment dropping when MW is higher and rising when in decline.

I suppose it could seem like that if you're dyslexic.

So you're going to post a graph and then try and lie about what it shows?
Look at 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000 and right before the crash. All showing low unemployment when the value of MW is higher. Conversely the declines in value correspond to increasing unemployment.

I already posted the right graph. Since min wage jobs are a small percentage of overall jobs the increase wont show up in the general market. Look at populations that largely have min wage jobs and you'll find their UE rates have skyrocketed.

The right graph? No, you posted a graph only showing teens who don't need to work at all.

Carpe diem blog?
At least Taz had the BLS stats.

Quibble quibble deny deny.
There is no graph or article that would persuade you of what is obvious to everyone but you.

Actually I just wanted a link instead of a meme.

 

[paulitician]

Greedy white Republican dude wants all poor folks to be disappeared. In his warped greedy little brain, he views the poor as unwashed 'Untouchables.' They shouldn't be allowed to exist. These are the kind of greedy bastids you're dealing with. So don't spend too much time trying to reason with them. They'll never get it.

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Spot on.
Conservatives have been using the same talking points against MW for decades. If they held any water at all, they would have been easily proven already. It's just the usual noise.

It's been proven over and over. Look at the rate of teen unemployment. In the 1960s it tracked very closely with the general rate. Today it is three times the general rate. That isnt by accident.

It's never been proven that MW increases have any significant or long term affects on unemployment. Please post up the graph that shows the correlated increase in unemployment for every time the MW has been raised.

OK what do I win?

Hardly cause and effect. The rate is all over the place. What factors contribute to teenage unemployment? Only MW?

DENY!

I'll use you compadre's chart since it at least is sourced properly. You'll find that the unemployment rate for teens rises and falls right along with the overall rate.
So far no one has shown me the chart that shows the effects you all predict. 80 years of MW an no one has compiled the data to show MW as a direct cause for increased unemployment?

 

[Hutch Starskey]

Your chart seems to show unemployment dropping when MW is higher and rising when in decline.

I suppose it could seem like that if you're dyslexic.

So you're going to post a graph and then try and lie about what it shows?
Look at 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000 and right before the crash. All showing low unemployment when the value of MW is higher. Conversely the declines in value correspond to increasing unemployment.

I already posted the right graph. Since min wage jobs are a small percentage of overall jobs the increase wont show up in the general market. Look at populations that largely have min wage jobs and you'll find their UE rates have skyrocketed.

The right graph? No, you posted a graph only showing teens who don't need to work at all.

Carpe diem blog?
At least Taz had the BLS stats.

Quibble quibble deny deny.
There is no graph or article that would persuade you of what is obvious to everyone but you.

It's so obvious to the gullible.

 

[Arizona Willie]

..."Go to school! Learn new skills, you lazy asses!"

...then who would replace them to work in the service industry? How could those industries survive if so many of the workers make minimum wage?

Keep in mind we are including state minimum wages here - not just the federal one. Right now anyone making a state minimum wage is living in poverty. Working up to 40 hours a week Is not enough for these people to live financially stable lives.

42% of American workers make less than $15 per hour. What is your solution to helping these people out of poverty?

You people are full of bitching but you have no real solutions.

========
Republicans / Conservatives < never > have any solutions to problems other than " cut taxes and then cut taxes some more "

They love to underfund government agencies and then complain when the agency fails to do a good job and then they want to Privatize that agencies function(s) so some billionaire can make more money.

Republicans preach " fiscal responsibility " but then refuse to pay any taxes to pay the bills for the wars they start and things they do ( Medicare Prescription benefit ) all while telling poor people " get a job and pay your bills ".

 

[The Rabbi]

It's been proven over and over. Look at the rate of teen unemployment. In the 1960s it tracked very closely with the general rate. Today it is three times the general rate. That isnt by accident.

It's never been proven that MW increases have any significant or long term affects on unemployment. Please post up the graph that shows the correlated increase in unemployment for every time the MW has been raised.

OK what do I win?

Hardly cause and effect. The rate is all over the place. What factors contribute to teenage unemployment? Only MW?

DENY!

I'll use you compadre's chart since it at least is sourced properly. You'll find that the unemployment rate for teens rises and falls right along with the overall rate.
So far no one has shown me the chart that shows the effects you all predict. 80 years of MW an no one has compiled the data to show MW as a direct cause for increased unemployment?

View attachment 75205

I am not responsible for that chart and I argue it's methodolog is unsound to look at "real" mw.

 

[The Rabbi]

I suppose it could seem like that if you're dyslexic.

So you're going to post a graph and then try and lie about what it shows?
Look at 1970, 1980, 1990, 2000 and right before the crash. All showing low unemployment when the value of MW is higher. Conversely the declines in value correspond to increasing unemployment.

I already posted the right graph. Since min wage jobs are a small percentage of overall jobs the increase wont show up in the general market. Look at populations that largely have min wage jobs and you'll find their UE rates have skyrocketed.

The right graph? No, you posted a graph only showing teens who don't need to work at all.

Carpe diem blog?
At least Taz had the BLS stats.

Quibble quibble deny deny.
There is no graph or article that would persuade you of what is obvious to everyone but you.

It's so obvious to the gullible.

It's obvious to the informed: you raise the price of something you sell less of it.

 

[easyt65]

It's obvious to the informed: you raise the price of something you sell less of it.

If you force businesses to pay more for full-time worker health care the business is not going to 'eat' the cost - they will drop worker health care, fire a certain number of full-time workers, and / or convert a certain number of full-time jobs to part-time jobs.

If you force businesses to increase their minimum wage the businesses will not 'eat' the additional cost - they will raise prices and/or fire a few workers to pay for the increased salaries of the others.

Liberals seem to think that if you raise the operating costs of the business owners / CEOs then the kind-hearted, generous business owners/CEOs will lower their own salaries, cut their profit margins, eat the higher costs without passing it on to the customers and / or effecting employee jobs (cutting benefits, cutting hours, firing them)....isn't that cute...and naïve?!

 

[Arizona Willie]

It's obvious to the informed: you raise the price of something you sell less of it.

If you force businesses to pay more for full-time worker health care the business is not going to 'eat' the cost - they will drop worker health care, fire a certain number of full-time workers, and / or convert a certain number of full-time jobs to part-time jobs.

If you force businesses to increase their minimum wage the businesses will not 'eat' the additional cost - they will raise prices and/or fire a few workers to pay for the increased salaries of the others.

Liberals seem to think that if you raise the operating costs of the business owners / CEOs then the kind-hearted, generous business owners/CEOs will lower their own salaries, cut their profit margins, eat the higher costs without passing it on to the customers and / or effecting employee jobs (cutting benefits, cutting hours, firing them)....isn't that cute...and naïve?!

========
I bet you wouldn't turn down a raise for YOURSELF though but you want everyone else to work for starvation wages.

 

[easyt65]

I bet you wouldn't turn down a raise for YOURSELF though but you want everyone else to work for starvation wages.

And you'd lose that bet.
I haven't had a raise in several years. I work overtime but do not get paid for it. I am lucky enough, however, to have a job and to NOT have had a pay cut in those last several years. During those several years your liberal leaders, sharing their part of an 18% job approval rating, enjoying massive perks paid for by the Americans they continue to screw over, have ensured they get a raise every year.

 

[ScienceRocks]

When there's no minimum wage corporations like Apple or a meat packers plant will pay as little as they can get away with. Look at Africa, south Asia and even china to see what corporations do when they get away from our regulations and minimum wage laws. History backs this up too and is why we have such laws.

Oh my word....the next time a liberal displays even the most rudimentary understanding of basic economics will be the first time that it has ever happened. Minimum wage is necessary because of basic supply and demand. The amount of labor exceeds the amount of jobs available and always will. Thus, supply and demand will cause compensation to spiral downwards under normal competition (I'll work for a dollar per day, but you have no job so you'll offer to work for $0.50 per day, and so on and so on). However, once minimum wage is established, jacking it up constantly (as libtards have done) have caused massive inflation.

It's stupid and it's completely unavoidable. Actions do not occur in a vacuum. Business owners do not eat cost. When you raise minimum wage, the business owner raises the costs of their goods and services to cover that increased labor cost. Since every business raised their wages (including even those that don't have minimum wage workers - simply in response to the chain reaction), the minimum wage worker is no further ahead than they were before their increase. But now you've f'ed over the economy royally with mass inflation. Morons.

Here agains we show the diffidence between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives just claim it wont work and never try anything. Liberals believe in implementing a solution and making it work through a process of refinement. Further proof you would still be grunting to communicate if not for liberals.

We can raise the minimum wage conditionally to see what happens. If its not a good thing then we can repeal the law or place a time limit on it.

Spot on.
Conservatives have been using the same talking points against MW for decades. If they held any water at all, they would have been easily proven already. It's just the usual noise.

It's been proven over and over. Look at the rate of teen unemployment. In the 1960s it tracked very closely with the general rate. Today it is three times the general rate. That isnt by accident.

It's never been proven that MW increases have any significant or long term affects on unemployment. Please post up the graph that shows the correlated increase in unemployment for every time the MW has been raised.

Yep, there isn't any evidence for a long term effect..Of course, I'd rather there were a law that forced businesses to dole out the huge surplus to the workers instead to all going to the ceo. That would probably do more to solve the wage problem.

The biggest problem is a few take most of the pie and the workers get fucked even with increased productivity.

 

[P@triot]

Yep, there isn't any evidence for a long term effect..Of course, I'd rather there was a law that forced businesses to dole out the huge surplus to the workers instead to all going to the ceo. That would probably do more to solve the wage problem.

Yeah....because communism has worked sooooo well over the decades all over the world

 

[P@triot]

Yep, there isn't any evidence for a long term effect..Of course, I'd rather there were a law that forced businesses to dole out the huge surplus to the workers instead to all going to the ceo. That would probably do more to solve the wage problem.

The biggest problem is a few take most of the pie and the workers get fucked even with increased productivity.

Um.....what "wage problem"? I never cease to laugh at how liberals set themselves up as the ultimate arbiter of all things in society. I'm not aware of any "wage problem" (and neither is the rest of society). Just curious how it is that you get to decide to all of humanity that one exists?

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

Oh my word....the next time a liberal displays even the most rudimentary understanding of basic economics will be the first time that it has ever happened. Minimum wage is necessary because of basic supply and demand. The amount of labor exceeds the amount of jobs available and always will. Thus, supply and demand will cause compensation to spiral downwards under normal competition (I'll work for a dollar per day, but you have no job so you'll offer to work for $0.50 per day, and so on and so on). However, once minimum wage is established, jacking it up constantly (as libtards have done) have caused massive inflation.

It's stupid and it's completely unavoidable. Actions do not occur in a vacuum. Business owners do not eat cost. When you raise minimum wage, the business owner raises the costs of their goods and services to cover that increased labor cost. Since every business raised their wages (including even those that don't have minimum wage workers - simply in response to the chain reaction), the minimum wage worker is no further ahead than they were before their increase. But now you've f'ed over the economy royally with mass inflation. Morons.

Here agains we show the diffidence between liberals and conservatives. Conservatives just claim it wont work and never try anything. Liberals believe in implementing a solution and making it work through a process of refinement. Further proof you would still be grunting to communicate if not for liberals.

We can raise the minimum wage conditionally to see what happens. If its not a good thing then we can repeal the law or place a time limit on it.

Spot on.
Conservatives have been using the same talking points against MW for decades. If they held any water at all, they would have been easily proven already. It's just the usual noise.

It's been proven over and over. Look at the rate of teen unemployment. In the 1960s it tracked very closely with the general rate. Today it is three times the general rate. That isnt by accident.

It's never been proven that MW increases have any significant or long term affects on unemployment. Please post up the graph that shows the correlated increase in unemployment for every time the MW has been raised.

Yep, there isn't any evidence for a long term effect..Of course, I'd rather there were a law that forced businesses to dole out the huge surplus to the workers instead to all going to the ceo. That would probably do more to solve the wage problem.

The biggest problem is a few take most of the pie and the workers get fucked even with increased productivity.

If that's the way the workers feel, they are free to start their own company and compete with their former employer. They can pay their employees whatever they think is fair. Why do you suppose nobody that complains about wages does that?

Anytime you use the two words "government" and "force" in the same sentence, look out, because you are about to lose more freedom. Our founders didn't design this government to "force" people to do anything. Force is what they came here to get away from.

 

[P@triot]

If that's the way the workers feel, they are free to start their own company and compete with their former employer. They can pay their employees whatever they think is fair. Why do you suppose nobody that complains about wages does that?

Ohh....Ohh....Ohhh....I know! I know! Because that takes effort and liberals refuse to give effort beyond going to a voting booth and pulling a lever!

 

[Ray From Cleveland]

..."Go to school! Learn new skills, you lazy asses!"

...then who would replace them to work in the service industry? How could those industries survive if so many of the workers make minimum wage?

Keep in mind we are including state minimum wages here - not just the federal one. Right now anyone making a state minimum wage is living in poverty. Working up to 40 hours a week Is not enough for these people to live financially stable lives.

42% of American workers make less than $15 per hour. What is your solution to helping these people out of poverty?

You people are full of bitching but you have no real solutions.

========
Republicans / Conservatives < never > have any solutions to problems other than " cut taxes and then cut taxes some more "

They love to underfund government agencies and then complain when the agency fails to do a good job and then they want to Privatize that agencies function(s) so some billionaire can make more money.

Republicans preach " fiscal responsibility " but then refuse to pay any taxes to pay the bills for the wars they start and things they do ( Medicare Prescription benefit ) all while telling poor people " get a job and pay your bills ".

Right, and it's a good thing DumBama has never done that.