Heavy Precipitation Over the US: Has it Increased as Some have Predicted it Should?

[daveman]

You and your two years of pre-geology don't even know what that means. You're just a parrot repeating what you've heard.

Come on, Davey Boy, post your science. Can you do anything other than flapyap?

You don't want science. You want your dogma. You'll accept nothing less.

No, Roxy -- I will not join your cult.

 

[daveman]

Because it's neither. You can tell because of the horrifically bad science used to push it.

What you see in your travels is weather -- not climate.

And yet 50 of the world's leading scientific bodies - representing damn near every country and scientific discipline - all agree that human acitivity is playing a part in climate change.

Not a single recognised scientific body agrees with you.

What I see on my travels is the direct impact of climate change.

There are hundreds of examples of this, but one that I think is interesting is that of Australian farmers ploughing grape vines into the earth.

The reason - climate change and increasing droughts means growing wine in that part of Australia is no longer viable. It has been for 50 years, but not anymore.

You just proved what you said is crap, but you don't even realize it.

So, prior to 50 years ago, grapes would not grow in that area.

Then they did, for 50 years.

What was the climate prior to the period when the grapes would not grow? How did man cause the grapes not to grow, and what did man do to make grapes viable there?

Take your time. I can tell you haven't given this any thought. At all.

 

[Saigon]

Because it's neither. You can tell because of the horrifically bad science used to push it.

What you see in your travels is weather -- not climate.

And yet 50 of the world's leading scientific bodies - representing damn near every country and scientific discipline - all agree that human acitivity is playing a part in climate change.

Not a single recognised scientific body agrees with you.

What I see on my travels is the direct impact of climate change.

There are hundreds of examples of this, but one that I think is interesting is that of Australian farmers ploughing grape vines into the earth.

The reason - climate change and increasing droughts means growing wine in that part of Australia is no longer viable. It has been for 50 years, but not anymore.

You just proved what you said is crap, but you don't even realize it.

So, prior to 50 years ago, grapes would not grow in that area.

Then they did, for 50 years.

What was the climate prior to the period when the grapes would not grow? How did man cause the grapes not to grow, and what did man do to make grapes viable there?

Take your time. I can tell you haven't given this any thought. At all.

Jesus wept.

To answer your question, which apparently you have 'thought through' - grapes were only introduced to Australia by the Europeans in circa 1840. They have grown since then, but only in been farmed in this area for 50 years. Prior to that the area was largely forest. Now it's semi-desert.

 

[Saigon]

You need to realize that "scientific bodies" are not democratically run.. In fact most of the Institutions you're gonna cite for CONSENSUS on Global Warming are highly attached to national politics or state appointed positions. A declaration of Concern or Consensus is not a poll, not a vote, not an expression of Consensus..

Right.

So these 50+ insitututions, representating virtually every developed country in the world, and every relevent area of science relating to climate, are ALL "attached to national politics" and presenting "appointed positions"?

Was the same true of linking HIV to Aids, or cancer to smoking?

Do you really not feel that accusing the entire global scientific community to fraud is more than a little paranoid?

 

[Synthaholic]

Well, one can always expect our local ignoramouses to be denying the obvious. In 2011 we had such an extreme weather pattern that the Mississippi and Missiouri rivers were at flood stage or above from March to September. This year, we have had such a nearly continent wide drought that there is major damage to homes because of soil drying and shrinking in 40 of the 48 states. Damages to private homes that totals to over a billion dollars.

Once more, we are having a year world wide in which extreme precipitation events, too much or a lack of precipitation, are happening at a far higher rate than in the past decades.

Because there was no dust bowl in the 1930s? No massive flood in 1927?

Just wait until enough Arctic ice melts or climate change-fueled hurricanes flood/destroy Miami or NY and too-big-to-fail insurance giants like AIG go belly up and we all have to pick up the tab, and then see our insurance rates go sky high.

 

[Synthaholic]

Daveman -

Again, I am not a "leftist", and I think you are on fairly thin ice to say I see what I want to see when you are the one claiming there is a massive international conspiracy to create global socialist government.

Where is the evidence of this conspiracy?

Surely it must involve thousands upon thousands of people, not one of whom has ever breathed a word.

You must realiss yourself this makes no more sense that faking the Holocaust or the CIA bringing down the Twin Towers.

One guy talking about aid payments to Africa and doesn't add up much.

He needs no evidence. He has Rush Limbaugh.

 

[RollingThunder]

If we didn't have weather, if we had no changes in wind patterns or the jet stream, this would be a dead planet.

We have torrential rains, and droughts, and winds, earthquakes, volcanos and storms just like we have had for millions of years and we will have them for millions more.

Just more of your usual clueless retarded nonsense, Katzhitbrainz. All of your idiotic posts just emphasize the fact that you have no idea what is happening.

Really? We never had weather before?

I'll be darned.

Maybe you'll be darned but you will for sure be severely retarded until you die.

 

[daveman]

And yet 50 of the world's leading scientific bodies - representing damn near every country and scientific discipline - all agree that human acitivity is playing a part in climate change.

Not a single recognised scientific body agrees with you.

What I see on my travels is the direct impact of climate change.

There are hundreds of examples of this, but one that I think is interesting is that of Australian farmers ploughing grape vines into the earth.

The reason - climate change and increasing droughts means growing wine in that part of Australia is no longer viable. It has been for 50 years, but not anymore.

You just proved what you said is crap, but you don't even realize it.

So, prior to 50 years ago, grapes would not grow in that area.

Then they did, for 50 years.

What was the climate prior to the period when the grapes would not grow? How did man cause the grapes not to grow, and what did man do to make grapes viable there?

Take your time. I can tell you haven't given this any thought. At all.

Jesus wept.

To answer your question, which apparently you have 'thought through' - grapes were only introduced to Australia by the Europeans in circa 1840. They have grown since then, but only in been farmed in this area for 50 years. Prior to that the area was largely forest. Now it's semi-desert.

Uh huh. I guess you didn't read flacaltenn's link from the wine industry showing you your claim is crap.

Ignoring it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

 

[Old Rocks]

Precipitation issues with crops, too much or too little.

Europe

Crop Losses

Drought and hail caused almost 3 billion euros ($3.8 billion) in crop damage in Italy this year, farming union Coldiretti said yesterday. Corn yields in Romania, Bulgaria and Hungary may be more than 35 percent smaller than a year earlier because of “very dry soil conditions,” while Spain’s wheat yields may drop 29 percent, the EU’s Monitoring Agricultural Resources unit said Aug. 27.

The USDA estimates that drought may cut the corn harvest in top exporter U.S. to 10.78 billion bushels, a six-year low. In June the agency projected output would surge to a record 14.79 billion bushels this year.

Russian Harvest

Russia’s Agriculture Ministry estimates that the wheat harvest may be smaller than in 2010, when the worst drought in half a century spurred the country to ban grain exports for 10 months.

“From the Black Sea, Bulgaria, Romania, into Ukraine and Russia and further east into Kazakhstan, none of those countries had a good year,” said London-based Dan Hofstad, an INTL FCStone Inc. risk-management consultant for the Commonwealth of Independent States/Black Sea region. “It’s playing into the whole global supply issues we’re seeing. The grain markets remain bullish.”

 

[Katzndogz]

Precipitation issues with crops, too much or too little.

Europe

Crop Losses

Drought and hail caused almost 3 billion euros ($3.8 billion) in crop damage in Italy this year, farming union Coldiretti said yesterday. Corn yields in Romania, Bulgaria and Hungary may be more than 35 percent smaller than a year earlier because of “very dry soil conditions,” while Spain’s wheat yields may drop 29 percent, the EU’s Monitoring Agricultural Resources unit said Aug. 27.

The USDA estimates that drought may cut the corn harvest in top exporter U.S. to 10.78 billion bushels, a six-year low. In June the agency projected output would surge to a record 14.79 billion bushels this year.

Russian Harvest

Russia’s Agriculture Ministry estimates that the wheat harvest may be smaller than in 2010, when the worst drought in half a century spurred the country to ban grain exports for 10 months.

“From the Black Sea, Bulgaria, Romania, into Ukraine and Russia and further east into Kazakhstan, none of those countries had a good year,” said London-based Dan Hofstad, an INTL FCStone Inc. risk-management consultant for the Commonwealth of Independent States/Black Sea region. “It’s playing into the whole global supply issues we’re seeing. The grain markets remain bullish.”

All of which proves that the climate in Europe is not changing. Droughts in Europe happen in 5 and 50 year cycles. Sometimes a drought will last for months, sometimes for several years.
http://www.geographyinthenews.rgs.o... History of Drought in Europe - Factsheet.pdf

Droughts in Europe are not rare. Whilst a severe water shortage at specific location is expected once every 50 years, scarcely 5 years go by without a shortage across at least some part of Europe and some of these events can last for several years.

So you cite the performance of normal climate as evidence of climate change. No it won't work.

 

[Katzndogz]

Cyclical drought in the United States, with an obligatory mention of global warming just to get the article to make print.

Plains Drought Cycle Has Long History, Ominous Future

Cyclical droughts have ravaged the United States' northern Great Plains for thousands of years, a new study says. Scientists expect the potentially devastating events to continue—perhaps with a boost from global warming.

"These drought cycles have gone on pretty consistently throughout the last 4,500 years," said Jim Clark, an ecologist at Duke University's Nicholas School of the Environment and Earth Sciences in Durham, North Carolina. "They are pretty severe, so they have a large impact on the full set of ecosystem processes.

Again, normal climate behavior is classified as climate change.

 

[flacaltenn]

Daveman -

Again, I am not a "leftist", and I think you are on fairly thin ice to say I see what I want to see when you are the one claiming there is a massive international conspiracy to create global socialist government.

Where is the evidence of this conspiracy?

Surely it must involve thousands upon thousands of people, not one of whom has ever breathed a word.

You must realiss yourself this makes no more sense that faking the Holocaust or the CIA bringing down the Twin Towers.

One guy talking about aid payments to Africa and doesn't add up much.

He needs no evidence. He has Rush Limbaugh.

Silly leftists.. The evidence is in watching the past 2 or 3 UN sponsored "climate summits" devolve into a food fight over transfer payments and redistribution of wealth.. NO ONE THERE is concerned about the science or discussing the issues.. THey are there with their hands out to beg and whine...

You want excerpts from these food fights? Do you not know that this a primary reason why nothing gets done at these "summits"?

 

[flacaltenn]

Killer Hurricanes -- Grapes getting ploughed under -- $Bills of crops affected by drought..

NONE OF THIS HAPPENED when the temperature was 0.5degC cooler.. IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT US TO BELIEVE? That half a degree global average rise has CAUSED all this??? From a cause that is supposed to be EQUALLY GLOBALLY distributed?

Listen to this.. Sounds exactly like a Shaman in a primitive tribe trying to get his people to repent and sacrifice to the gods. Shaman KNOWs in advance of eclipses and volcanic eruptions and hurricanes and uses these like theatre props in his show..

All we lack here is a community fire, some fancy grass skirts for OldieRocks, TinkerBelle, Synth and the cast of dancers and some NATURAL psychoactive pharma to complete the show..

 

[Old Rocks]

Daveman -

Again, I am not a "leftist", and I think you are on fairly thin ice to say I see what I want to see when you are the one claiming there is a massive international conspiracy to create global socialist government.

Where is the evidence of this conspiracy?

Surely it must involve thousands upon thousands of people, not one of whom has ever breathed a word.

You must realiss yourself this makes no more sense that faking the Holocaust or the CIA bringing down the Twin Towers.

One guy talking about aid payments to Africa and doesn't add up much.

He needs no evidence. He has Rush Limbaugh.

Silly leftists.. The evidence is in watching the past 2 or 3 UN sponsored "climate summits" devolve into a food fight over transfer payments and redistribution of wealth.. NO ONE THERE is concerned about the science or discussing the issues.. THey are there with their hands out to beg and whine...

You want excerpts from these food fights? Do you not know that this a primary reason why nothing gets done at these "summits"?

Bluntly, nothing is going to be done without catastrophic damage in several localities. As a species we have proven ourselves to be far more interested in short term advantages for ourselves than in long term livability of our world.

The absolute rejection of what scientists from every nation on earth are telling us by people like yourself is a prime example of this. Otherwise intelligent people refusing to accept reality because it does not fit their concept of the "way things ought to be".

 

[flacaltenn]

He needs no evidence. He has Rush Limbaugh.

Silly leftists.. The evidence is in watching the past 2 or 3 UN sponsored "climate summits" devolve into a food fight over transfer payments and redistribution of wealth.. NO ONE THERE is concerned about the science or discussing the issues.. THey are there with their hands out to beg and whine...

You want excerpts from these food fights? Do you not know that this a primary reason why nothing gets done at these "summits"?

Bluntly, nothing is going to be done without catastrophic damage in several localities. As a species we have proven ourselves to be far more interested in short term advantages for ourselves than in long term livability of our world.

The absolute rejection of what scientists from every nation on earth are telling us by people like yourself is a prime example of this. Otherwise intelligent people refusing to accept reality because it does not fit their concept of the "way things ought to be".

I bet you get hard everytime a Tropical Depression forms.. You just can't WAIT for the gods to plunge a fatal lightning bolt into the innocent hearts of baby rabbits and children..

Quite frankly --- praying for doom just might qualify you for analysis...

 

[Katzndogz]

Killer Hurricanes -- Grapes getting ploughed under -- $Bills of crops affected by drought..

NONE OF THIS HAPPENED when the temperature was 0.5degC cooler.. IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT US TO BELIEVE? That half a degree global average rise has CAUSED all this??? From a cause that is supposed to be EQUALLY GLOBALLY distributed?

Listen to this.. Sounds exactly like a Shaman in a primitive tribe trying to get his people to repent and sacrifice to the gods. Shaman KNOWs in advance of eclipses and volcanic eruptions and hurricanes and uses these like theatre props in his show..

All we lack here is a community fire, some fancy grass skirts for OldieRocks, TinkerBelle, Synth and the cast of dancers and some NATURAL psychoactive pharma to complete the show..

Killer hurricane as part of the natural and normal hurricane cycle.

USATODAY.com - Record year for hurricanes part of a natural cycle

Warm ocean water helps fuel storms, and Atlantic water temperatures were 2 to 3 degrees above average this year, he said. There was an absence of winds high in the atmosphere that can tear hurricanes apart. And winds blowing east from Africa steered developing storms toward warmer waters where they incubated into tropical storms and hurricanes.

That combination of factors has occurred periodically through history, Bell said. Meteorologists refer to such an active hurricane cycle as the "multi-decadal signal." It can last for 30 years. The current period began in 1995. A record 26 tropical storms formed this season, which began June 1 and ends today.

"It's not related" to global warming, Bell said. The same conditions occurred in the 1950s and 1960s, the last period of above-normal hurricane activity. Many records set in 2005, including most hurricanes in a season — 13 — surpassed marks set then.

Over and over, normal climate activity is called climate change.

 

[flacaltenn]

Killer Hurricanes -- Grapes getting ploughed under -- $Bills of crops affected by drought..

NONE OF THIS HAPPENED when the temperature was 0.5degC cooler.. IS THAT WHAT YOU WANT US TO BELIEVE? That half a degree global average rise has CAUSED all this??? From a cause that is supposed to be EQUALLY GLOBALLY distributed?

Listen to this.. Sounds exactly like a Shaman in a primitive tribe trying to get his people to repent and sacrifice to the gods. Shaman KNOWs in advance of eclipses and volcanic eruptions and hurricanes and uses these like theatre props in his show..

All we lack here is a community fire, some fancy grass skirts for OldieRocks, TinkerBelle, Synth and the cast of dancers and some NATURAL psychoactive pharma to complete the show..

Killer hurricane as part of the natural and normal hurricane cycle.

USATODAY.com - Record year for hurricanes part of a natural cycle

Warm ocean water helps fuel storms, and Atlantic water temperatures were 2 to 3 degrees above average this year, he said. There was an absence of winds high in the atmosphere that can tear hurricanes apart. And winds blowing east from Africa steered developing storms toward warmer waters where they incubated into tropical storms and hurricanes.

That combination of factors has occurred periodically through history, Bell said. Meteorologists refer to such an active hurricane cycle as the "multi-decadal signal." It can last for 30 years. The current period began in 1995. A record 26 tropical storms formed this season, which began June 1 and ends today.

"It's not related" to global warming, Bell said. The same conditions occurred in the 1950s and 1960s, the last period of above-normal hurricane activity. Many records set in 2005, including most hurricanes in a season — 13 — surpassed marks set then.

Over and over, normal climate activity is called climate change.

The article was from 2005 -- the year of Katrina. And it's been 7 years since and the comments STILL STAND.. I'd love to see the cumulative stats for THIS year. Because there is NO EVIDENCE of intensifying trop storms or actual effects from the 0.5degC rise in our lifetimes.. Yet the natives are still begging the gods for mercy..

 

[Katzndogz]

The aztecs sacrificed virgins believing if they did the rains would come. That's the mentality of the warmists today. Something they can do will bring rain, or stop rain, or make sunspots go away. The level of ignorance is astounding.

 

[RollingThunder]

The aztecs sacrificed virgins believing if they did the rains would come. That's the mentality of the warmists today. Something they can do will bring rain, or stop rain, or make sunspots go away. The level of ignorance is astounding.

Mankind's CO2 emissions have raised atmospheric levels of CO2 by 40% over pre-industrial levels. We can stop burning fossil fuels and adding to the excess CO2 that is warming our planet and changing our climate pattens. It is as simple as that, retards. It has nothing to do with your insane "virgin sacrifice" fantasies, Katzhitbrainz. Although, since you're obviously a virgin, I can see how a retard like you might get worried. Your level of ignorance is indeed absolutely astounding.

 

[Katzndogz]

co2 is warming the planet SUUUURRRE it is.

http://ruby.fgcu.edu/courses/twimberley/EnviroPhilo/CoolingOfAtmosphere.pdf

Traditional anthropogenic theory of currently observed global warming states that release
of carbon dioxide into atmosphere (partially as a result of utilization of fossil fuels) leads
to an increase in atmospheric temperature because the molecules of CO2 (and other
greenhouse gases) absorb the infrared radiation from the Earth’s surface. This statement
is based on the Arrhenius hypothesis, which was never verified (Arrhenius, 1896). The
proponents of this theory take into consideration only one component of heat transfer
in atmosphere, i.e., radiation. Yet, in the dense Earth’s troposphere with the pressure
pa > 0:2 atm, the heat from the Earth’s surface is mostly transferred by convection
(Sorokhtin, 2001a). According to our estimates, convection accounts for 67%, water
vapor condensation in troposphere accounts for 25%, and radiation accounts for about
8% of the total heat transfer from the Earth’s surface to troposphere. Thus, convection
is the dominant process of heat transfer in troposphere, and all the theories of Earth’s
atmospheric heating (or cooling) first of all must consider this process of heat (energy)–
mass redistribution in atmosphere (Sorokhtin, 2001a, 2001b; Khilyuk and Chilingar,
2003, 2004).
When the temperature of a given mass of air increases, it expands, becomes lighter,
and rises. In turn, the denser cooler air of upper layers of troposphere descends and
replaces the warmer air of lower layers. This physical system (multiple cells of air
convection) acts in the Earth’s troposphere like a continuous surface cooler. The cooling
effect by air convection can surpass considerably the warming effect of radiation.
Address correspondence to George Chilingar, Russian Academy of Natural Sciences, USA

Sorry Global Warming Alarmists, The Earth Is Cooling - Forbes

In the late 1970s, the natural cycles turned warm and temperatures rose until the late 1990s, a trend that political and economic interests have tried to milk mercilessly to their advantage. The incorruptible satellite measured global atmospheric temperatures show less warming during this period than the heavily manipulated land surface temperatures.

Archived-Articles: CO2 driven global warming is not supported by the data

CO2 -- many seek to regulate it, legislate it, tax it, capture it, sequester it, cap it, trade it or otherwise control it. And they who do would have us risk nothing less than worldwide economic destruction based on the theory that not doing so will inevitably lead to catastrophic global warming. But one need only study the past two centuries of climate history to conclude that CO2 simply does not drive global warming.

Warmists should give it up, admit they don't have a hell of an idea what's going on and stop taking money.