CDZ GOP please vote per deanrd: Do you oppose Education and Health care? or Federalization of them?

[emilynghiem]

deanrd posted in another thread that
GOP oppose Education and Health Care.

If you are GOP will you please vote in the
attached poll, what are you really against?

Education and Health Care?
or
"Federal centralized control" of these
instead of managing choices democratically
by people and states more effectively?

Can we settle this once and for all
what it is that Conservatives/GOP are opposed to?

Thanks!

 

[Natural Citizen]

The federal government has no constitutional authority to be involved with either education or healthcare.

I'm not a GOP guy. I wrote-in Ron Paul in the 2016, even though he didn't run. He still got 1 electoral vote anyway. Ha.

 

[Cellblock2429]

deanrd posted in another thread that
GOP oppose Education and Health Care.

If you are GOP will you please vote in the
attached poll, what are you really against?

Education and Health Care?
or
"Federal centralized control" of these
instead of managing choices democratically
by people and states more effectively?

Can we settle this once and for all
what it is that Conservatives/GOP are opposed to?

Thanks!

/----/ I oppose BAD education and SUPPORT good education. I support QUALITY healthcare, but I'm against SUBSTANDARD healthcare. But deanrd won't make the distinction

Mod Edit: This is the Clean Debate Zone

 

[Oddball]

Anarcho-capitalist.

I support all of those things and more, by fully privatizing them...No involvement by The State in them whatsoever.

 

[Natural Citizen]

Anarcho-capitalist.

I support all of those things and more, by fully privatizing them...No involvement by The State in them whatsoever.

That other thread was a good thread. A lot of truth could have been put out there. Shame the guy who started it didn't understand what he was promoting, huh?

You know the thread I'm talking about, right?

The anti-federalists have been proven right in their predictions time and time again.

 

[The Purge]

 

[Oddball]

Anarcho-capitalist.

I support all of those things and more, by fully privatizing them...No involvement by The State in them whatsoever.

That other thread was a good thread. A lot of truth could have been put out there. Shame the guy who started it didn't understand what he was promoting, huh?

You know the thread I'm talking about, right?

The anti-federalists have been proven right in their predictions time and time again.

yup

 

[emilynghiem]

NOTE: I identify as a Constitutionalist Democrat and last supported Cruz and Trump
because the Democrat candidates don't respect equal beliefs of people of other parties and creeds,
and keep pushing unconstitutional policies forcing their own creeds on the public through govt.
Until Democrats recognize their political beliefs count as faith based creeds, I have trouble
supporting those candidates on a national level. I can support candidates who have consent
of their local constituents to represent those beliefs, but don't believe it is constitutional to impose nationally
unless the public consents to those policies.

I believe in localized democratic representation and management of
Education and Health Care programs to be sustainable and
reflect the standards and needs of the local populations that fun and fund them.

So my opposition to federalizing terms and taxation for such programs
is that it
A. backlogs the federal govt with decisions better made locally
B. violates the Constitutional beliefs of citizens who don't believe
federal govt is authorized to manage or mandate such policies
C. prohibits the free exercise of beliefs and deprives liberty and
free choice of people to fun and run their own programs by their personal
beliefs and preferences
D. causes waste of resources on both bureaucracy and on legal
and legislative FIGHTS over beliefs and policies that federal govt shouldn't be
in charge of making or forcing on individual citizens with rights to their own beliefs

I support the development of sustainable cost effective
Education and Health Care by converting prisons
and mental health/elderly facilities into teaching
hospitals and medical school programs, so that
students can be trained as doctors, nurses and
health care providers as part of earning their education.
This would reduce the waste, abuse and escalating costs
of crime and disease, addictions and disorders by localized
treatment for earlier intervention and prevention. So we would
repurpose the taxes already overspent on prisons
and prosecution and use those resources to support
medical education and services in every district instead.

The model for renovating public housing into
sustainable campus communities, providing education
and services to residents through democratically elected
management, can be applied to reform prisons and VA:
www.campusplan.org

 

[emilynghiem]

deanrd posted in another thread that
GOP oppose Education and Health Care.

If you are GOP will you please vote in the
attached poll, what are you really against?

Education and Health Care?
or
"Federal centralized control" of these
instead of managing choices democratically
by people and states more effectively?

Can we settle this once and for all
what it is that Conservatives/GOP are opposed to?

Thanks!

/----/ I oppose BAD education and SUPPORT good education. I support QUALITY healthcare, but I'm against SUBSTANDARD healthcare. But deanrd won't make the distinction
BTW - great way to call out a libtard on his strawman arguments.

Here deanrd
You have someone responding who isn't just what I said either.
Cellblock2429 spells it out more articulately in
* opposing BAD education and supporting GOOD education
* opposing SUBSTANDARD health care and supporting QUALITY health care

Is this clarification more FAIR as to why
GOP oppose what you call "education and health care"

It's the STANDARDS you are proposing that are
the reason for OPPOSITION.

Please let me know if this is more accurate.
You and GOP members do not agree that the
STANDARDS you propose on Education/Health Care
are justifiable to support. Yes or no?

Thanks Cellblock2429

 

[Marion Morrison]

All I know is that the schools were way better before the Fed started meddling with them.

 

[DandyDonovan]

Anarcho-capitalist.

I support all of those things and more, by fully privatizing them...No involvement by The State in them whatsoever.

Gonna have to disagree with you here my friend.

We the people have a vested interest in the health and education of our fellow citizens.

The PROBLEM is, we have a system that just allows people to do whatever and then the tax payers have to foot the bill for the consequences of those choices.

Take education , for example. How many losers dicked their way through school barely graduating, or maybe not graduating at all and then just kick back and rely on welfare to make up for their stupidity?

You simply can not have a system where people waste the educational opportunity afforded them and then rewards them for failing in school. I mean come on.

 

[DandyDonovan]

I'd support nationalized healthcare if it meant I no longer had to see 400lb people waddling around talking about they have "health issues" as they stuff pallets of ding dongs down their gullet.

 

[emilynghiem]

The federal government has no constitutional authority to be involved with either education or healthcare.

I'm not a GOP guy. I wrote-in Ron Paul in the 2016, even though he didn't run. He still got 1 electoral vote anyway. Ha.

Dear Natural Citizen
Yes and no.
If people BELIEVE that their only way to ensure equal access to uniform education and health care
"is through federalized govt" then they need that for their free exercise of religion and
equal protection and security.

The trick is how do we allow such believers to exercise their creed
WITHOUT IMPOSING ON THOSE WHO BELIEVE THIS IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL
to run it through Federal Govt at all?

I say treat this belief as Catholics enforce their Right to Life beliefs through their
OWN programs, which are local state national and even international.

They can run their programs without imposing those federally on all citizens to pay for.
Why not require Democrats and Socialists to run and fund their own nationalized
health care cooperative collectives through their own bases of members who consent to pay in
and be under those terms?

The same treatment applied to Right to Life and Religious Organizations and Membership
should be applied to Right to Health Care and political beliefs and organizations built on those beliefs.

We don't stop Right to Life from running their programs through their nonprofits and churches.
So instead of fighting to STOP Right to Health Care,
we should ENCOURAGE SUPPORT AND ASSIST
such advocates in setting up their own nationalized health care coops.

Even Sean Hannity preaches on the air on the solutions
to health care through cooperatives. The Greens believe in this as well.

 

[DandyDonovan]

The federal government has no constitutional authority to be involved with either education or healthcare.

I'm not a GOP guy. I wrote-in Ron Paul in the 2016, even though he didn't run. He still got 1 electoral vote anyway. Ha.

Dear Natural Citizen
Yes and no.
If people BELIEVE that their only way to ensure equal access to uniform education and health care
"is through federalized govt" then they need that for their free exercise of religion and
equal protection and security.

The trick is how do we allow such believers to exercise their creed
WITHOUT IMPOSING ON THOSE WHO BELIEVE THIS IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL
to run it through Federal Govt at all?

I say treat this belief as Catholics enforce their Right to Life beliefs through their
OWN programs, which are local state national and even international.

They can run their programs without imposing those federally on all citizens to pay for.
Why not require Democrats and Socialists to run and fund their own nationalized
health care cooperative collectives through their own bases of members who consent to pay in
and be under those terms?

The same treatment applied to Right to Life and Religious Organizations and Membership
should be applied to Right to Health Care and political beliefs and organizations built on those beliefs.

We don't stop Right to Life from running their programs through their nonprofits and churches.
So instead of fighting to STOP Right to Health Care,
we should ENCOURAGE SUPPORT AND ASSIST
such advocates in setting up their own nationalized health care coops.

Even Sean Hannity preaches on the air on the solutions
to health care through cooperatives. The Greens believe in this as well.

See , I don't understand why states don't do this? Are you telling me that a state like say Texas couldn't go to the insurance companies and say "okay we're looking for a health insurance provider for every person in our state who doesn't have a work supplied health care plan, what kind of deal can you give on rates if all of those people within our state are on your plan?" That's a big risk pool right there, so you should be able to mitigate costs for everyone.

 

[emilynghiem]

I'd support nationalized healthcare if it meant I no longer had to see 400lb people waddling around talking about they have "health issues" as they stuff pallets of ding dongs down their gullet.

DandyDonovan
But bans on dingdongs as causing sugar addictions
might get replaced with marijuana use, abuse and addictions that
would be marketed in place of big pharm to make money for schools.

Don't you think people who believe in legalizing and marketing
marijuana should have to pay the health care costs and consequences?
And not charge that to the people who opposed promoting "recreational" use?

Liberals I know prefer to ban sugary drinks and promote marijuana
they believe is less dangerous or addictive. Go figure.

This is why I say to separate health care policies by party,
and let people pick their own poisons!

 

[Wry Catcher]

The federal government has no constitutional authority to be involved with either education or healthcare.

I'm not a GOP guy. I wrote-in Ron Paul in the 2016, even though he didn't run. He still got 1 electoral vote anyway. Ha.

P1 Depends on how one understands COTUS.

Art I, Section 8, clause 1 is worth reading, and suggests that the common Defense and general Welfare may be seen as protecting the United States from an attack by a foreign power or world-wide epidemics, pandemics like the current measles & Opium crisis and preventive measures.

 

[DandyDonovan]

I'd support nationalized healthcare if it meant I no longer had to see 400lb people waddling around talking about they have "health issues" as they stuff pallets of ding dongs down their gullet.

DandyDonovan
But bans on dingdongs as causing sugar addictions
might get replaced with marijuana use, abuse and addictions that
would be marketed in place of big pharm to make money for schools.

Don't you think people who believe in legalizing and marketing
marijuana should have to pay the health care costs and consequences?
And not charge that to the people who opposed promoting "recreational" use?

Liberals I know prefer to ban sugary drinks and promote marijuana
they believe is less dangerous or addictive. Go figure.

This is why I say to separate health care policies by party,
and let people pick their own poisons!

I don't want to ban ding dongs, they're delicious. I want a ban on 400 lb people who overeat. They're disgusting

I'd say the same with let's use what you brought up, marijuana. I think it should be legalized and then if people over indulge and it negatively affects their lives, tough shit, you get no help from the government

 

[DandyDonovan]

The federal government has no constitutional authority to be involved with either education or healthcare.

I'm not a GOP guy. I wrote-in Ron Paul in the 2016, even though he didn't run. He still got 1 electoral vote anyway. Ha.

P1 Depends on how one understands COTUS.

Art I, Section 8, clause 1 is worth reading, and suggests that the common Defense and general Welfare may be seen as protecting the United States from an attack by a foreign power or world-wide epidemics, pandemics like the current measles & Opium crisis and preventive measures.

That's true , but in no case did it mean welfare in the sense that we understand welfare today.

 

[Cellblock2429]

All I know is that the schools were way better before the Fed started meddling with them.

/---/ Today's schools no longer teach script or phonics. They stopped assigning homework because the kids don't bother doing it. The report-card grades are now 1,2,3,4 and if little Johnny doesn't get a 4 across the board the lawn mower parents are in the teacher's face with threats of lawsuits.

 

[DandyDonovan]

All I know is that the schools were way better before the Fed started meddling with them.

/---/ Today's schools no longer teach script or phonics. They stopped assigning homework because the kids don't bother doing it. The report-card grades are now 1,2,3,4 and if little Johnny doesn't get a 4 across the board the lawn mower parts are in the teacher's face with threats of lawsuits.

In many cases classes are simply pass/fail now. You can't have a student feeling bad because they didn't study as hard as another student.