GOP and trump considering Medicare cuts in his second term

[Redfish]

nope, check history on the ACA. Passed by dems only in the dark of night on Christmas eve, no floor debate allowed in the house or senate, no amendments allowed in either house, no time to read the bill allowed before the vote

Bullshit.

The ACA spent a full YEAR in negotiation...very PUBLIC negotiation

Bullshit yourself. the only negotiations were held in locked rooms with dem staffers only. There was never any public floor debate in either house. The ACA bill was written in closed sessions with dem staffers, no GOP allowed. Then the bill was rammed through by Harry Reid using reconciliation rules which had never before been used on something of such magnitude.

You need to get some facts before posting on something you know nothing about.

 

[Redfish]

#1. If you truly believe that you are dumber than I thought. Not everyone is born with the same genetics, born into the same situation, has been able to live the same life lacking zillions of possible emergency situations, etc. etc. etc. Yes, LOTS of unavoidable circumstances. At this point you would be better off admitting to trolling than saying this is a genuine answer.

#2. No, not everyone has a smart phone. I don't own a smart phone and don't want one. I do not want a crutch to walk around like a zombie not actually living life.

#3. Have you even read what I've said to you? Last year was the first in SEVERAL DECADES that US life-spans went DOWN. Just 2.5 more years? Sounds great except:

"The new average life expectancy for Americans is 78.7 years, which puts the U.S. behind other developed nations and 1.5 years lower than the Organisation for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD) average life expectancy of 80.3. The OECD is a group of developed countries that includes Canada, Germany, Mexico, France, Japan, and the U.K."

Why Life Expectancy in the U.S. Dropped Again This Year

So hey! You can retire just about the same time you will die. Hope you enjoyed life!

#4. Ad hominem attack. This doesn't surprise me as it is only like your hundredth logical fallacy in this thread. I must have struck a nerve in you, as I just asked you to support all your B.S., and THIS is your best response?

#1) You're discussing outliers. 95% of people should be able to stay on private insurance and not get fat and unhealthy. We have much more data on health now than we did 50 years ago. Google "eating healthy". Not hard.

#2) You don't own a phone?!?!?!? LMAO! You're old.

#3) It went down to 79. If you retired at 70 you still live nine years. Not bad and it is mostly due to obesity and auto accidents. We drive more than people in those countries.

#4) Dude, you're fat and unhealthy. Just change your life.

As to your #1) If private insurance is forced to cover people longer, do you not realize there will be a corresponding increase in premiums if they are insuring older customers? I'll bet you didn't think of that, did you?

Not to mention, if the ACA is repealed it can go back to people with preexisting conditions may not be put back in... which means ZERO coverage for millions of people, or insurance so high they can't afford it or the meds. Oh, and also a lifetime cap that would mean a child born with a condition may hit that cap before they even become adults.

Some people that are in a fortunate situation get very arrogant and think they can speak for everyone.

Pre existing conditions are tough. Imagine me asking an insurance company to pay for the fire in my house after the fire happened. Insurance is a business and hence healthcare is broken in this country. But there is a dark side. Why should a healthy person A pay for an unhealthy person B? Doesn’t make a lot of sense.

For someone who pretends intelligence...you don't understand the concept of insurance?

Oh...

as much as I hate to say it, you are correct. Health Insurance is a method of spreading the cost over a large population where some will always get more benefits and everyone will pay the same premiums. But unlike car insurance, those who file claims are not charged a higher premium.

 

[debbiedowner]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

 

[Oldstyle]

I don't want what you say to change! You just admitted that in order to have free college, Medicare for all and the Green New Deal that the Middle Class would have to absorb a massive tax increase! As I said earlier...have fun running on that!

I never argued for free anything.

It's the Democratic Party's ONLY argument right now, Pknopp!

I nor Sanders argued for free anything. I do not care what you think of the Democratic party.

Do you even know what platform Sanders is running on? He's not only called for free college .........

I posted his program where his college program is paid for. I really get tired of the ignorance of those like yourself.

Ignorance? You don't even know that Sanders IS promising free college and wants to wipe out existing student loan debt!

 

[debbiedowner]

#1) You're discussing outliers. 95% of people should be able to stay on private insurance and not get fat and unhealthy. We have much more data on health now than we did 50 years ago. Google "eating healthy". Not hard.

#2) You don't own a phone?!?!?!? LMAO! You're old.

#3) It went down to 79. If you retired at 70 you still live nine years. Not bad and it is mostly due to obesity and auto accidents. We drive more than people in those countries.

#4) Dude, you're fat and unhealthy. Just change your life.

As to your #1) If private insurance is forced to cover people longer, do you not realize there will be a corresponding increase in premiums if they are insuring older customers? I'll bet you didn't think of that, did you?

Not to mention, if the ACA is repealed it can go back to people with preexisting conditions may not be put back in... which means ZERO coverage for millions of people, or insurance so high they can't afford it or the meds. Oh, and also a lifetime cap that would mean a child born with a condition may hit that cap before they even become adults.

Some people that are in a fortunate situation get very arrogant and think they can speak for everyone.

That's nasty, vile, and desperate. a

All typical of the far left Progressive mind set.

One of the first requirements of any Republican health insurance plan is to cover pre-existing conditions. One good solution for that problem would be a high risk pool insured by many companies and subsidized by tax-payers.

Something similar could provide long term basic care for the permanently disabled, much as we do today.

As you know, there are many realistic, affordable solutions.

Trump said his new healthcare plan would include preexisting conditions... all for them NOT to be a part of the last attempt the GOP made to put one together. If you haven't noticed by now, you should expect exactly the opposite of what Trump tells you.

You obviously paid zero attention to the plan they were trying to get put together, because they contained all the tings I mentioned.

And I'm far from progressive. It's pretty clear you have never been around a real progressive, or you just think everything is binary and if all people that don't agree with you on every single issue are evil, progressive, socialist boogie men. Out of every single person in the Master's program at my university, I'm about the third most CONSERVATIVE out of them.

Why should I pay for your pre existing condition? That’s what Medicaid is for.

Then you better drop out of your company insurance plan because that's exactly what you're doing.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

 

[Oldstyle]

nope, check history on the ACA. Passed by dems only in the dark of night on Christmas eve, no floor debate allowed in the house or senate, no amendments allowed in either house, no time to read the bill allowed before the vote

Bullshit.

The ACA spent a full YEAR in negotiation...very PUBLIC negotiation

You must be referring to the negotiations with moderate Democrats who didn't want to vote for the ACA because they were quite aware that it was designed to fail? You remember them...don't you, Lesh? Obama, Pelosi and Reid had to bribe Democratic law makers with sweet heart deals in order to get them to vote for the ACA. Care to take a crack at explaining why that was necessary?

 

[debbiedowner]

The constitution limited the federal govt to basically making sure the individual states didn't **** over the citizenry.
Now, American totalitarians want them to control 20 percent of our economy, if not more(healthcare) take our weapons, basically destroy the concept of private property etc. Those people would be rolling in their graves.

What people might want today has nothing to do with what the founders thought about government.

Mostly I've agreed with you, but I disagree with this post. I think you are right that the founders - like Jefferson Adams and Madison - distrusted govt. And those are three different, and esp with Jefferson and Adams, very conflicting views of what our govt should do. I assume, all three were wise enough to even distrust their own views of what govt should do, because the common thread was issues and solutions should be clearly set out and debated, because when a consensus by a sizeable majority was reached, that was the best chance of doing something that posed the best likely outcome.

But they didn't "hate" govt. They realized it was a necessity and pure libertarianism was a sham in terms of being a way to govern, and governing was necessary.

The thread, or at least my link, showed the piss poor place the gop is right now. They avoid any bipartisan approach. THAT is contrary to the founders. Obama actually did try for some bipartisan approach on healthcare, but there was no way for any goper to buy into universal coverage without being primaried, because the gop voters decided mandatory insurance was bad, even though the idea originated with conservatives. So Obama had to choose between covering everyone or accepteing a lesser law. And in the end, Roberts rewrote it to avoid universal coverage. LOL Imo Obama should have accepted a smaller law, but only because bipartisan buy in generally results in more popular support for a law.

its the dems who are refusing to compromise, or even to meet to discuss finding common ground. Have Pelosi and Schumer offered to meet with the republicans to seek compromise solutions? Duh, no

That's true but that is exactly the way the GOP treated Obama. In a way both Obama and Trump has deserved it.

nope, check history on the ACA. Passed by dems only in the dark of night on Christmas eve, no floor debate allowed in the house or senate, no amendments allowed in either house, no time to read the bill allowed before the vote. They rammed it up our collective asses and it was the worst piece of legislation in the history of this nation and it was passed in the most corrupt underhanded way.

No, check your history of the ACA.

PolitiFact: Did Obamacare pass with Republican input?

 

[kyzr]

In the last few days trump has shown himself to be impulsive....ignorant....and an authoritarian. His Tweets should like something from a Dictatorship.....think about it.

He basically called the Chair of the Federal Reserve an enemy....a man HE nominated.

He ORDERED private companies to stop doing business with China.
(I wonder if Ivanka is closing her sweat shops in China)

He insults the intelligence of sane Americans every time he speaks or Tweets.

He is an embarrassment. .

So you want to keep funding China's military buildup?
Whose kids get called to stop China when they start pushing their global agenda?

 

[debbiedowner]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

My last three words "most never happened". Does that refer obama never took some money? No 750 million like you claimed,

 

[bigrebnc1775]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

My last three words "most never happened". Does that refer obama never took some money? No 750 million like you claimed,

Very well how about 716 Billion?
Obama Loots $716 Billion from Medicare

 

[kyzr]

#1) You're discussing outliers. 95% of people should be able to stay on private insurance and not get fat and unhealthy. We have much more data on health now than we did 50 years ago. Google "eating healthy". Not hard.

#2) You don't own a phone?!?!?!? LMAO! You're old.

#3) It went down to 79. If you retired at 70 you still live nine years. Not bad and it is mostly due to obesity and auto accidents. We drive more than people in those countries.

#4) Dude, you're fat and unhealthy. Just change your life.

As to your #1) If private insurance is forced to cover people longer, do you not realize there will be a corresponding increase in premiums if they are insuring older customers? I'll bet you didn't think of that, did you?

Not to mention, if the ACA is repealed it can go back to people with preexisting conditions may not be put back in... which means ZERO coverage for millions of people, or insurance so high they can't afford it or the meds. Oh, and also a lifetime cap that would mean a child born with a condition may hit that cap before they even become adults.

Some people that are in a fortunate situation get very arrogant and think they can speak for everyone.

Pre existing conditions are tough. Imagine me asking an insurance company to pay for the fire in my house after the fire happened. Insurance is a business and hence healthcare is broken in this country. But there is a dark side. Why should a healthy person A pay for an unhealthy person B? Doesn’t make a lot of sense.

For someone who pretends intelligence...you don't understand the concept of insurance?

Oh...

as much as I hate to say it, you are correct. Health Insurance is a method of spreading the cost over a large population where some will always get more benefits and everyone will pay the same premiums. But unlike car insurance, those who file claims are not charged a higher premium.

1. I can see covering those with pre-existing conditions, but IMHO they should pay higher premiums and deductibles than those w/o any pre-existing conditions.
2. I prefer the pre-Obamacare healthcare system, with no deductible instead of the ACA $10,000 deductible. WTF that's extortions not healthcare.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

As to your #1) If private insurance is forced to cover people longer, do you not realize there will be a corresponding increase in premiums if they are insuring older customers? I'll bet you didn't think of that, did you?

Not to mention, if the ACA is repealed it can go back to people with preexisting conditions may not be put back in... which means ZERO coverage for millions of people, or insurance so high they can't afford it or the meds. Oh, and also a lifetime cap that would mean a child born with a condition may hit that cap before they even become adults.

Some people that are in a fortunate situation get very arrogant and think they can speak for everyone.

Pre existing conditions are tough. Imagine me asking an insurance company to pay for the fire in my house after the fire happened. Insurance is a business and hence healthcare is broken in this country. But there is a dark side. Why should a healthy person A pay for an unhealthy person B? Doesn’t make a lot of sense.

For someone who pretends intelligence...you don't understand the concept of insurance?

Oh...

as much as I hate to say it, you are correct. Health Insurance is a method of spreading the cost over a large population where some will always get more benefits and everyone will pay the same premiums. But unlike car insurance, those who file claims are not charged a higher premium.

1. I can see covering those with pre-existing conditions, but IMHO they should pay higher premiums and deductibles than those w/o any pre-existing conditions.
2. I prefer the pre-Obamacare healthcare system, with no deductible instead of the ACA $10,000 deductible. WTF that's extortions not healthcare.

I'm on the rail with preexisting condition. If you were born with a health condition you should be covered. but if that health condition was of your making you are on your own.

 

[debbiedowner]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

My last three words "most never happened". Does that refer obama never took some money? No 750 million like you claimed,

Very well how about 716 Billion?
Obama Loots $716 Billion from Medicare

Better do some deeper digging but I will give you this the cuts for most medical services in your list actually at the last minute before happening were actually given a small increase. You also, if you really want to know see what the trump administration has done to certain meds that fall under Part B of Medicare.

 

[Anathema]

Trump Has Told Friends That Gutting Medicare Could Be a Fun “Second-Term Project”

That would teach the old toothless farts that believed every word the Liar says. Maybe instead of a nursing home...they can live under a bridge....

Cut it 100%, along with every other social welfare program, all forms of corporate, disaster, and international aid as well

 

[debbiedowner]

As to your #1) If private insurance is forced to cover people longer, do you not realize there will be a corresponding increase in premiums if they are insuring older customers? I'll bet you didn't think of that, did you?

Not to mention, if the ACA is repealed it can go back to people with preexisting conditions may not be put back in... which means ZERO coverage for millions of people, or insurance so high they can't afford it or the meds. Oh, and also a lifetime cap that would mean a child born with a condition may hit that cap before they even become adults.

Some people that are in a fortunate situation get very arrogant and think they can speak for everyone.

Pre existing conditions are tough. Imagine me asking an insurance company to pay for the fire in my house after the fire happened. Insurance is a business and hence healthcare is broken in this country. But there is a dark side. Why should a healthy person A pay for an unhealthy person B? Doesn’t make a lot of sense.

For someone who pretends intelligence...you don't understand the concept of insurance?

Oh...

as much as I hate to say it, you are correct. Health Insurance is a method of spreading the cost over a large population where some will always get more benefits and everyone will pay the same premiums. But unlike car insurance, those who file claims are not charged a higher premium.

1. I can see covering those with pre-existing conditions, but IMHO they should pay higher premiums and deductibles than those w/o any pre-existing conditions.
2. I prefer the pre-Obamacare healthcare system, with no deductible instead of the ACA $10,000 deductible. WTF that's extortions not healthcare.

There's no individual $10,000 deductible and it's only going to $8150 for 2020.

Pre obamacare those pre x were were either denied coverage or excluded from coverage.

 

[dblack]

What people might want today has nothing to do with what the founders thought about government.

Mostly I've agreed with you, but I disagree with this post. I think you are right that the founders - like Jefferson Adams and Madison - distrusted govt. And those are three different, and esp with Jefferson and Adams, very conflicting views of what our govt should do. I assume, all three were wise enough to even distrust their own views of what govt should do, because the common thread was issues and solutions should be clearly set out and debated, because when a consensus by a sizeable majority was reached, that was the best chance of doing something that posed the best likely outcome.

But they didn't "hate" govt. They realized it was a necessity and pure libertarianism was a sham in terms of being a way to govern, and governing was necessary.

The thread, or at least my link, showed the piss poor place the gop is right now. They avoid any bipartisan approach. THAT is contrary to the founders. Obama actually did try for some bipartisan approach on healthcare, but there was no way for any goper to buy into universal coverage without being primaried, because the gop voters decided mandatory insurance was bad, even though the idea originated with conservatives. So Obama had to choose between covering everyone or accepteing a lesser law. And in the end, Roberts rewrote it to avoid universal coverage. LOL Imo Obama should have accepted a smaller law, but only because bipartisan buy in generally results in more popular support for a law.

its the dems who are refusing to compromise, or even to meet to discuss finding common ground. Have Pelosi and Schumer offered to meet with the republicans to seek compromise solutions? Duh, no

That's true but that is exactly the way the GOP treated Obama. In a way both Obama and Trump has deserved it.

nope, check history on the ACA. Passed by dems only in the dark of night on Christmas eve, no floor debate allowed in the house or senate, no amendments allowed in either house, no time to read the bill allowed before the vote. They rammed it up our collective asses and it was the worst piece of legislation in the history of this nation and it was passed in the most corrupt underhanded way.

No, check your history of the ACA.

PolitiFact: Did Obamacare pass with Republican input?

No Republicans voted for it. The Democrats own ACA, lock, stock and barrel.

 

[bigrebnc1775]

When obama cut 750 million from medicare how did you handle that?

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

My last three words "most never happened". Does that refer obama never took some money? No 750 million like you claimed,

Very well how about 716 Billion?
Obama Loots $716 Billion from Medicare

Better do some deeper digging but I will give you this the cuts for most medical services in your list actually at the last minute before happening were actually given a small increase. You also, if you really want to know see what the trump administration has done to certain meds that fall under Part B of Medicare.

No need for further digging obama took money from medicare so the CBO could score Obamacare that it would be passable in congress

 

[debbiedowner]

Mostly I've agreed with you, but I disagree with this post. I think you are right that the founders - like Jefferson Adams and Madison - distrusted govt. And those are three different, and esp with Jefferson and Adams, very conflicting views of what our govt should do. I assume, all three were wise enough to even distrust their own views of what govt should do, because the common thread was issues and solutions should be clearly set out and debated, because when a consensus by a sizeable majority was reached, that was the best chance of doing something that posed the best likely outcome.

But they didn't "hate" govt. They realized it was a necessity and pure libertarianism was a sham in terms of being a way to govern, and governing was necessary.

The thread, or at least my link, showed the piss poor place the gop is right now. They avoid any bipartisan approach. THAT is contrary to the founders. Obama actually did try for some bipartisan approach on healthcare, but there was no way for any goper to buy into universal coverage without being primaried, because the gop voters decided mandatory insurance was bad, even though the idea originated with conservatives. So Obama had to choose between covering everyone or accepteing a lesser law. And in the end, Roberts rewrote it to avoid universal coverage. LOL Imo Obama should have accepted a smaller law, but only because bipartisan buy in generally results in more popular support for a law.

its the dems who are refusing to compromise, or even to meet to discuss finding common ground. Have Pelosi and Schumer offered to meet with the republicans to seek compromise solutions? Duh, no

That's true but that is exactly the way the GOP treated Obama. In a way both Obama and Trump has deserved it.

nope, check history on the ACA. Passed by dems only in the dark of night on Christmas eve, no floor debate allowed in the house or senate, no amendments allowed in either house, no time to read the bill allowed before the vote. They rammed it up our collective asses and it was the worst piece of legislation in the history of this nation and it was passed in the most corrupt underhanded way.

No, check your history of the ACA.


PolitiFact: Did Obamacare pass with Republican input?

No Republicans voted for it. The Democrats own ACA, lock, stock and barrel.

No and you're not paying attention a reading responses and I never said any republican's voted for it, he said they had no amendments, the article disputes that.

 

[debbiedowner]

You have not been paying attention over the years, most never happened.

Is it your position that obama did not take money from medicare?

My last three words "most never happened". Does that refer obama never took some money? No 750 million like you claimed,

Very well how about 716 Billion?
Obama Loots $716 Billion from Medicare

Better do some deeper digging but I will give you this the cuts for most medical services in your list actually at the last minute before happening were actually given a small increase. You also, if you really want to know see what the trump administration has done to certain meds that fall under Part B of Medicare.

No need for further digging obama took money from medicare so the CBO could score Obamacare that it would be passable in congress

You know it really doesn't matter 9 years later, what matters is what goes forward. But it seems if you are on Medicare it would concern you that taking away the way Part B drugs are paid and sticking them under Part D will cost one quite a bit more money. Part B drugs are normally administered in hospital or in a Doctor's office.